Fasting/The juice diet Questions
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kyukiyoshida wrote: »... I also have 2 highly sensitive teeth top and towards the front, they've been getting ground down to nearly half their length since I was a kid, not sure why. But it's because of those teeth that makes biting into fruit and vegetables extremely painful. Especially ones with skins like apples. I'm assuming acidity is what's making it painful to eat citrus and berries. So if juicing would be a nice way to help increase the intake of them, I'd try it. But I've definitely been persuaded from the juice diet.
You could be grinding your teeth at night. I'm really annoyed it took so long for a dentist to point out to me that I do this. I now wear a guard at night.
You could also have a cracked tooth or a cracked filling. I just started having pain in a new area and found out at my cleaning Monday that I have a cracked filling and am getting that fixed next week. Sure, going to the dentist sucks, but you don't want to ignore it and end up like my dad with almost no teeth of his own.
I bring an MP3 player with me to the dentist to distract me from what's happening.
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kyukiyoshida wrote: »I never said that people who eat meat do not eat veggies. And some people cannot eat potatoes. Especially those with diabetes. None of those links were blog posts. The were written by people with PhDs on the subject. Or are you going to claim you know more than a Harvard university professor and doctor? I've kept my end pretty straight forward. But the lot of you seen to be dancing around the subject, making assumptions and putting words in my mouth. Along with just completely ignoring factual information to fit your own belief system. You're also acting like bullies. Simply over my dietary choices and questions. And because apparently we can only talk about things within your guidelines. Despite the fact I have explained 100 times you continue to nitpick and make accusatory comments about me. I'm not going to sit here and argue with children who enjoy setting up strawman debates. About things that I have studied for years, when you have done clearly no research. Accusing me of being closed minded and stating opinions as fact when you guys are just as guilty. Dancing around evidence and acting superior does not make you right. You should learn to not mirror your negative traits on to others. Until you can learn to have an actual conversation without resulting to bullying tactics and harassment, I have nothing more to say to you.
without sounding rude, the years of studies doesnt show.0 -
Therealobi1 wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »Processed food is anything that is not a whole food. Something that has been mixed with other ingredients and marketed in boxes cans or bags, for buyer conveniences. Tyson bagged chicken nuggets is a processed food. Fresh cut chicken from the deli or butcher is not. McDonald's hamburgers are a highly processed junk food, in fact they are not even real meat. Their "meat" is also sprayed with ammonia to kill bacteria and their French fries contain traces of extremely toxic and carcinogenic chemical compounds. Fast food can have a serious health impact. Sure you can probably have a burger from there every now and then. But why would you want to?
you are really killing the joy of eating food.
am going to start hand raring chickens, and cows in my tiny back garden,
Haven't you been paying attention? Meat is the devil. Keep up.
Better.and grow all my own veg apart from pototoes. i will eat the fruit but make sure it never dries.
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kyukiyoshida wrote: »I never said that people who eat meat do not eat veggies. And some people cannot eat potatoes. Especially those with diabetes.
LOLWUT?
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I guess my 20 years of experience over you of actually living a healthy lifestyle count for nothing. Ok, you're right, I'm wrong. Go on your 60 day juice fast because you obviously have it all figured out. Let me know how that works out for you...kyukiyoshida wrote: »I never said that people who eat meat do not eat veggies. And some people cannot eat potatoes. Especially those with diabetes. None of those links were blog posts. The were written by people with PhDs on the subject. Or are you going to claim you know more than a Harvard university professor and doctor? I've kept my end pretty straight forward. But the lot of you seen to be dancing around the subject, making assumptions and putting words in my mouth. Along with just completely ignoring factual information to fit your own belief system. You're also acting like bullies. Simply over my dietary choices and questions. And because apparently we can only talk about things within your guidelines. Despite the fact I have explained 100 times you continue to nitpick and make accusatory comments about me. I'm not going to sit here and argue with children who enjoy setting up strawman debates. About things that I have studied for years, when you have done clearly no research. Accusing me of being closed minded and stating opinions as fact when you guys are just as guilty. Dancing around evidence and acting superior does not make you right. You should learn to not mirror your negative traits on to others. Until you can learn to have an actual conversation without resulting to bullying tactics and harassment, I have nothing more to say to you.
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I really can't wait till my kid gets into his late teens/early twenties, just saying...0
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But they did not prove anything. Just a lot of correlation. Those studies are observational at best and typically prove nothing...kyukiyoshida wrote: »None of those links were blog posts. The were written by people with PhDs on the subject.
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I watched that movie. And the 2nd one where they all got fat again and had to do the juicing again and then got fat again when they quit and had to do the juicing again and the cycle just goes on and on. That to me proves it isn't a sustainable diet, doesn't work and just puts you in an endless cycle of yoyo dieting.0
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kyukiyoshida wrote: »And some people cannot eat potatoes.
I am willing to believe that there are potato allergies, sure.Especially those with diabetes.
Lots of people with under control diabetes (or diabetes in remission) eat potatoes and did when putting their diabetes in remission. Also, you didn't limit your prior comments to people with diabetes.But the lot of you seen to be dancing around the subject, making assumptions and putting words in my mouth.
No, I've been trying to discuss the subject, but you seem to be avoiding it.Simply over my dietary choices and questions.
No one cares what you eat. We are simply correcting misinformation (like that dried fruit and all grains and potatoes are "bad carbs").I'm not going to sit here and argue with children who enjoy setting up strawman debates.
The only person who has argued against a strawman is you, as you seem to be arguing against the idea that diet doesn't matter, when obviously no one said that.
Also, no one is bullying. I invited you to discuss the nutritional principles of putting together a sensible balanced diet vs. black and white (and over simplified and thus inaccurate) rules that would lump the majority of foods (even whole foods and nutrient dense and non caloric processed foods) as "bad."
I happen to agree that eating fruits and vegetables is good -- I eat lots and lots of vegetables and some fruit too. I also think it can be reasonable (if one has ethical issues especially) to cut out meat or cut it down to a small amount. If you have PCOS eating moderate or lower carb makes sense and I'd also start by cutting down on refined carbs (not all grains, etc.), especially if I ate lots of them (I don't, though, so see no reason to cut down). But you seem confused about how to construct a caloric appropriate, sustainable, balanced diet, and that's what people were trying to help with, by opening a discussion of how to do that.0 -
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kyukiyoshida wrote: »I never said that people who eat meat do not eat veggies. And some people cannot eat potatoes. Especially those with diabetes. None of those links were blog posts. The were written by people with PhDs on the subject. Or are you going to claim you know more than a Harvard university professor and doctor? I've kept my end pretty straight forward. But the lot of you seen to be dancing around the subject, making assumptions and putting words in my mouth. Along with just completely ignoring factual information to fit your own belief system. You're also acting like bullies. Simply over my dietary choices and questions. And because apparently we can only talk about things within your guidelines. Despite the fact I have explained 100 times you continue to nitpick and make accusatory comments about me. I'm not going to sit here and argue with children who enjoy setting up strawman debates. About things that I have studied for years, when you have done clearly no research. Accusing me of being closed minded and stating opinions as fact when you guys are just as guilty. Dancing around evidence and acting superior does not make you right. You should learn to not mirror your negative traits on to others. Until you can learn to have an actual conversation without resulting to bullying tactics and harassment, I have nothing more to say to you.
You've studied these things for years? Earlier in the thread you said you didn't know anything about these concepts and that is why you were asking about it... You even said:kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not too sure what carbs are. But I learned that there are healthy and unhealthy carbs.
And:kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it. I simply have a list I got from the doctor last week about various kinds of diets, carbs, fats etc. the carb information is on there. I googled it and it said it was right so I don't know what's going on. Someone asked me what they were so I answered.
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WinoGelato wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I never said that people who eat meat do not eat veggies. And some people cannot eat potatoes. Especially those with diabetes. None of those links were blog posts. The were written by people with PhDs on the subject. Or are you going to claim you know more than a Harvard university professor and doctor? I've kept my end pretty straight forward. But the lot of you seen to be dancing around the subject, making assumptions and putting words in my mouth. Along with just completely ignoring factual information to fit your own belief system. You're also acting like bullies. Simply over my dietary choices and questions. And because apparently we can only talk about things within your guidelines. Despite the fact I have explained 100 times you continue to nitpick and make accusatory comments about me. I'm not going to sit here and argue with children who enjoy setting up strawman debates. About things that I have studied for years, when you have done clearly no research. Accusing me of being closed minded and stating opinions as fact when you guys are just as guilty. Dancing around evidence and acting superior does not make you right. You should learn to not mirror your negative traits on to others. Until you can learn to have an actual conversation without resulting to bullying tactics and harassment, I have nothing more to say to you.
You've studied these things for years? Earlier in the thread you said you didn't know anything about these concepts and that is why you were asking about it... You even said:kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not too sure what carbs are. But I learned that there are healthy and unhealthy carbs.
And:kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it. I simply have a list I got from the doctor last week about various kinds of diets, carbs, fats etc. the carb information is on there. I googled it and it said it was right so I don't know what's going on. Someone asked me what they were so I answered.
Years, minutes.
Po-tay-to, Po-tah-to.0 -
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snickerscharlie wrote: »
Oh to be 23 again and know everything that I've forgotten since...0 -
kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it. I simply have a list I got from the doctor last week about various kinds of diets, carbs, fats etc. the carb information is on there. I googled it and it said it was right so I don't know what's going on. Someone asked me what they were so I answered. I wasn't looking for snooty comments about the fact I asked about the juice diet, anvilhead. I also never said that eating those made you overweight so I'm not sure why people are saying "I eat those and I'm not overweight". I think dried fruits have to do mostly with the fact that these days, they are heavily processed, filled with sugars and chemical preservatives. And whether people admit it or not, while they may not cause weight gain, refined, bleached, processed and preservative filled flours, sugars, pastas, meats etc. are bad for your health. And I'm in this to increase my overall health permanently and alter my old lifestyle choices. Which is why I will not increase my meat or white flour intake. I'm not sure why people are feeling personally attacked. But I'm sorry if anyone thought I was offending their lifestyle.
eating processed foods and sugar does not make one unhealthy, you can incorporate those foods and still have an overall healthy diet.
I eat ice cream, cookies, pasta, bagels etc, but I also make sure that I am eating rice, vegetables, fish, fruit, etc. Are you saying that I am unhealthy, because I eat the foods on your banned list?
If a Dr told you that there bad cars, then I suggest you get a new Dr, as you have a bad DR.0 -
brianpperkins wrote: »FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
While I don't agree with your comment to the OP I did find it rather amusing that someone even dare to make that comment to someone!
There is a difference between being an expert in a subject and not understanding it at all.
If you are going to state your opinions as fact with no room for a change of stance then yes...FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Of course. But that can only happen when you are open to the opinions of others...Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
I went back and read all of her posts. Other than her opinions on good/bad carbs she mostly asked questions or expressed her confusion.
Well...as much as I might enjoy this type of conversations...I suppose it is off-topic so...thank you for responding and I will just move on.
I guess you missed the part about a juice cleanse, chemicals, sugar, processed foods, etc...?0 -
Therealobi1 wrote: »FunkyTobias wrote: »
oh yes thats true. i am in trouble.
you are already dead..0 -
@kyukiyoshidaReady2Rock206 wrote: »I watched that movie. And the 2nd one where they all got fat again and had to do the juicing again and then got fat again when they quit and had to do the juicing again and the cycle just goes on and on. That to me proves it isn't a sustainable diet, doesn't work and just puts you in an endless cycle of yoyo dieting.
The above was something I wasn't aware of until recently, when she posted this information on another thread. The second "documentary" seems to have much more balance, though it does still twist some facts. I'd encourage you to watch it, and pay attention to what the professionals (a nutritionist and psychologist) have to say vs the rest of the show.
In the end, a fast is a fast. Though juicing would provide some nutrition it would be very limited in nature. If you combined the overall calorie count of juicing and broke it down into vitamins and micro nutrients, carbs, fat, and protein you will find that in most cases it is severely lacking in fat and protein. You could accomplish the same weight loss through eating another diet with the same numbers for the various nutrition.
As for whole vs processed foods, science states that it really doesn't matter. If you think of it in context of the entire process, your body will process and combine the foods regardless. So essentially if you ate whole unprocessed foods, say some grains, some fruit, and some natural meats, your stomach begins the process of combining all the various things and the body absorbs all the nutrition regardless.
I would caution anyone against going on any diet that is very low calorie and grossly limited in certain nutrients. But the only way to determine that is to take a good look at what your plan is and speak with a doctor regarding your choices. I've personally never opted to use any type of fasting, other than briefly during some military survival type training. But a short fast is probably not the end of the world either, and only someone more qualified could give solid advice on how to approach it.
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kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it. I simply have a list I got from the doctor last week about various kinds of diets, carbs, fats etc. the carb information is on there. I googled it and it said it was right so I don't know what's going on. Someone asked me what they were so I answered. I wasn't looking for snooty comments about the fact I asked about the juice diet, anvilhead. I also never said that eating those made you overweight so I'm not sure why people are saying "I eat those and I'm not overweight". I think dried fruits have to do mostly with the fact that these days, they are heavily processed, filled with sugars and chemical preservatives. And whether people admit it or not, while they may not cause weight gain, refined, bleached, processed and preservative filled flours, sugars, pastas, meats etc. are bad for your health. And I'm in this to increase my overall health permanently and alter my old lifestyle choices. Which is why I will not increase my meat or white flour intake. I'm not sure why people are feeling personally attacked. But I'm sorry if anyone thought I was offending their lifestyle.
eating processed foods and sugar does not make one unhealthy, you can incorporate those foods and still have an overall healthy diet.
I eat ice cream, cookies, pasta, bagels etc, but I also make sure that I am eating rice, vegetables, fish, fruit, etc. Are you saying that I am unhealthy, because I eat the foods on your banned list?
If a Dr told you that there bad cars, then I suggest you get a new Dr, as you have a bad DR.
Oh, there are definitely bad cars. Haven't you read Christine? ;-)
I also say this as someone who once rented a Fiat and drove it around Turkey. Among the many delightful aspects of the car was that the trunk decided to get stuck so that it could not be used. (That was not the most exciting or terrifying part of the trip, though.)0 -
kyukiyoshida wrote: »I also find it sad that you do not know the health concerns about people eating processed and fast foods. I guess the obesity crises and all these people getting diabetes. Is just happening, and your health is totally not related to the kinds of food you eat. http://www.news-medical.net/health/Obesity-and-Fast-Food.aspx. http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesity-causes/.
How about some actual scientific research that goes beyond correlation, hype and junk science?: bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/hormonal-responses-fast-food-meal.html/0 -
brianpperkins wrote: »FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
While I don't agree with your comment to the OP I did find it rather amusing that someone even dare to make that comment to someone!
There is a difference between being an expert in a subject and not understanding it at all.
If you are going to state your opinions as fact with no room for a change of stance then yes...FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Of course. But that can only happen when you are open to the opinions of others...Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
I went back and read all of her posts. Other than her opinions on good/bad carbs she mostly asked questions or expressed her confusion.
Well...as much as I might enjoy this type of conversations...I suppose it is off-topic so...thank you for responding and I will just move on.
I guess you missed the part about a juice cleanse, chemicals, sugar, processed foods, etc...?
Here is her opening post...notice the bolded...she was asking if there were negative side affects...she sounded confused to me.
OP...Has anyone here tried the juice diet yet? I'm watching a documentary called fat, sick & nearly dead. And this guy goes on a juice fast and cleanse for 60 days. So far he's lost 50 pounds by day 31. I guess the general idea is that by juicing you can get in twice as many fruits and vegetables, and you absorb the nutrients twice as fast. So you're packing your body with potent nutrients, and helping it heal and use fat that's been stored. I wanted to know if anyone has had experience with this particular diet and what the results were and if there were any negative mental/health implications or side effects.0 -
brianpperkins wrote: »FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
While I don't agree with your comment to the OP I did find it rather amusing that someone even dare to make that comment to someone!
There is a difference between being an expert in a subject and not understanding it at all.
If you are going to state your opinions as fact with no room for a change of stance then yes...FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Of course. But that can only happen when you are open to the opinions of others...Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
I went back and read all of her posts. Other than her opinions on good/bad carbs she mostly asked questions or expressed her confusion.
Well...as much as I might enjoy this type of conversations...I suppose it is off-topic so...thank you for responding and I will just move on.
I guess you missed the part about a juice cleanse, chemicals, sugar, processed foods, etc...?
Here is her second post...again she was asking for advice...notice the bolded.
OP...I know you can get many proteins and essential fats from dark vegetables and beans and healthy oils like virgin coconut oil. This is where I get mine from as meat consists for less than 10% of my calorie intake. So do you guys think that drinking homemade, natural fruit and vegetable juices maybe once or twice a day to help stay full on top of healthy low calorie meals would work just as well but be more beneficial? I guess I could say I'm looking for ways to help me eat less while getting more nutrients.0 -
brianpperkins wrote: »FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
While I don't agree with your comment to the OP I did find it rather amusing that someone even dare to make that comment to someone!
There is a difference between being an expert in a subject and not understanding it at all.
If you are going to state your opinions as fact with no room for a change of stance then yes...FunkyTobias wrote: »kyukiyoshida wrote: »I'm not the one that knows all the medical terms or the science behind it.
Then you should probably stop talking about things you don't understand
Really???
We should limit our conversations to only things that we are experts on? Is this the rule for MFP or does it apply to life in general?
Of course. But that can only happen when you are open to the opinions of others...Surely somewhere along the way you have discussed subjects...at least once...that you were not an expert in.
I went back and read all of her posts. Other than her opinions on good/bad carbs she mostly asked questions or expressed her confusion.
Well...as much as I might enjoy this type of conversations...I suppose it is off-topic so...thank you for responding and I will just move on.
I guess you missed the part about a juice cleanse, chemicals, sugar, processed foods, etc...?
I acknowledge her opinions on good/bad carbs.
As far as the cleanse...after reading the responses she stated that she wouldn't be doing the juicing.
I think she is young...maybe not as experienced as some MFP members...she was given some bad advice from her doctor. I have not watched the documentary that she referred to but from what I have read here on MFP there have been many people that have been frightened and confused by it.
Anything that she wrote after my post was not reflected in my comments.0 -
For me eating potatoes and bread is way healthier than eating veggies or a salad. For me veggies and fruits are "bad" carbs as they would cause an extreme amount of pain, mess up my GI system and I don't even really digest them. I think food should only be labelled good and bad or safe and trigger IF it is for valid medical reasons not some weird pseudo science
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I am partial to my homemade canned tomato juice because I make it with garlic, other veggies, ground celery seed, and a bunch of Worcestershire sauce. All it needs is the vodka and a celery stick to stir it.0
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