Counting Calories as an Eating Disorder?
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Christine_72 wrote: »susan100df wrote: »I recently was having lunch with a group. They decided to go to Five Guys. I love that place! However, I did not have the calories available and Chipotle was next door. A couple of people remarked that I shouldn't be on a diet that doesn't allow for splurges. I did explain that I agreed but needed to be choosy about when the splurge happens. I don't think that's disordered.
Hmmmm, this term "obesogenic enviroment" stopped me in my tracks.vivmom2014 wrote: »SingingSingleTracker wrote: »The term “obesogenic environment” refers to “an environment that promotes gaining weight and one that is not conducive to weight loss” within the home or workplace (Swinburn, et al., 1999). In other words, the obesogenic environment refers to an environment that helps, or contributes to, obesity.
Oh, so everyone is being force fed and forbidden to exercise in our society? Nope. Not buying it.
While United States is not force feeding or preventing exercise, our society, big business and politics does not promote that healthy of a life style. We moved to Northern Italy in May and difference in our societies is amazing. We frequently see 70 and 80's out for bike rides and walks everyday. Everyone in my small town goes to the farmer market once or twice a week for fresh vegetables, fruits, seafood, cheese and meats. The lattisere has fresh milk and yogurt...not chocked full of preservatives. There is not one fast food place in town except on American base. Pizza and pasta place make everything fresh. Gelato has much less sugar than ice-cream. There are miles of walking and hiking trails in our city. From 1-4pm is Riposa. Shops are closed as Italians workers go home for a cooked meal and nap. Then they walk back to work. You can set your clock by it.
In United States there is so much cheap, non- nutritious food all around plus so many convinces. This is from the NIH:
"More than two-thirds (68.8 percent) of adults are considered to be overweight or obese. More than one-third (35.7 percent) of adults are considered to be obese. More than 1 in 20 (6.3 percent) have extreme obesity. Almost 3 in 4 men (74 percent) are considered to be overweight or obese."
High fructose corn syrup, aspartame and trans fats should have all been outlawed if our society cared enough about health. There would not be so much resistance for healthier food plans at schools if our society has a high value on nutritious foods for our children. The goal of a lot of diets is to lose weight quickly to look better not to be healthier.
While we are each personally responsible for our food intake and exercise there is a lot of pressure in our society to eat foods that are not healthy and to observe athletes rather than be one.
I wonder if restaurants in other countries advertise "unlimited" or bottomless baskets of french fries like Applebees and Red Robin. Another ad I noticed this summer was for Pizza Hut - pizza with hotdogs in a blanket outside of the crust. The commercials have really made me think about the obesity rate in the US. If I went to these places and took advantage of having 5 baskets of fries, it's on me definitely. I think it's interesting that it's available. These restaurants are only doing what the market and law allows.
No, I think that's definitely an American thing. I am often taken aback at the portion sizes,cheap prices and fries with EVERYTHING they have in America. We used to have the "all you can eat" pizza huts here, but they all closed down years ago.
Yes, the all you can eat pizza huts died off years ago in Australia. And even when they existed it was hardly all you can eat. It was a ton of different salads and only 2 types of pizza which they were very slow with refilling and I think soft serve was on offer.
Even the buffet style places are rare now. I remember when I was in Uni and Sizzler was all the rage, there use to be lines out the street and around the corner but that was many years ago.0 -
I got this sort of response for individuals - though I have NEVER measured in front of people (I tend to eye ball, even low ball my guess and track). The way I look at it is this; Either way - I have disordered eating. I am either going to eat to damn much and get fat. Or I am going to measure and track my food and stay at a healthy weight.
Ill continue to track.0 -
Christine_72 wrote: »susan100df wrote: »I recently was having lunch with a group. They decided to go to Five Guys. I love that place! However, I did not have the calories available and Chipotle was next door. A couple of people remarked that I shouldn't be on a diet that doesn't allow for splurges. I did explain that I agreed but needed to be choosy about when the splurge happens. I don't think that's disordered.
Hmmmm, this term "obesogenic enviroment" stopped me in my tracks.vivmom2014 wrote: »SingingSingleTracker wrote: »The term “obesogenic environment” refers to “an environment that promotes gaining weight and one that is not conducive to weight loss” within the home or workplace (Swinburn, et al., 1999). In other words, the obesogenic environment refers to an environment that helps, or contributes to, obesity.
Oh, so everyone is being force fed and forbidden to exercise in our society? Nope. Not buying it.
While United States is not force feeding or preventing exercise, our society, big business and politics does not promote that healthy of a life style. We moved to Northern Italy in May and difference in our societies is amazing. We frequently see 70 and 80's out for bike rides and walks everyday. Everyone in my small town goes to the farmer market once or twice a week for fresh vegetables, fruits, seafood, cheese and meats. The lattisere has fresh milk and yogurt...not chocked full of preservatives. There is not one fast food place in town except on American base. Pizza and pasta place make everything fresh. Gelato has much less sugar than ice-cream. There are miles of walking and hiking trails in our city. From 1-4pm is Riposa. Shops are closed as Italians workers go home for a cooked meal and nap. Then they walk back to work. You can set your clock by it.
In United States there is so much cheap, non- nutritious food all around plus so many convinces. This is from the NIH:
"More than two-thirds (68.8 percent) of adults are considered to be overweight or obese. More than one-third (35.7 percent) of adults are considered to be obese. More than 1 in 20 (6.3 percent) have extreme obesity. Almost 3 in 4 men (74 percent) are considered to be overweight or obese."
High fructose corn syrup, aspartame and trans fats should have all been outlawed if our society cared enough about health. There would not be so much resistance for healthier food plans at schools if our society has a high value on nutritious foods for our children. The goal of a lot of diets is to lose weight quickly to look better not to be healthier.
While we are each personally responsible for our food intake and exercise there is a lot of pressure in our society to eat foods that are not healthy and to observe athletes rather than be one.
I wonder if restaurants in other countries advertise "unlimited" or bottomless baskets of french fries like Applebees and Red Robin. Another ad I noticed this summer was for Pizza Hut - pizza with hotdogs in a blanket outside of the crust. The commercials have really made me think about the obesity rate in the US. If I went to these places and took advantage of having 5 baskets of fries, it's on me definitely. I think it's interesting that it's available. These restaurants are only doing what the market and law allows.
No, I think that's definitely an American thing. I am often taken aback at the portion sizes,cheap prices and fries with EVERYTHING they have in America. We used to have the "all you can eat" pizza huts here, but they all closed down years ago.
Yes, the all you can eat pizza huts died off years ago in Australia. And even when they existed it was hardly all you can eat. It was a ton of different salads and only 2 types of pizza which they were very slow with refilling and I think soft serve was on offer.
Even the buffet style places are rare now. I remember when I was in Uni and Sizzler was all the rage, there use to be lines out the street and around the corner but that was many years ago.
Aah Sizzler, how I miss thee
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I'm not here to diagnose people. The way I measure how healthful or unhealthful my relationship with my food journey is at any given time, is whether I feel free, or trapped. Whether I feel self hate, or self love. Whether I feel that my relationship from food prevents me from having the social relationships that I want, or doesn't affect them.
Yes, there are times when I want something but I don't have it, times where I am annoyed with myself, or times where I choose not to go out to eat with someone or go to a friends party early in the night because I'd rather have my own meal, but those instances aren't ALL the time, they don't rule my life, and I still am able to have close friendships.
When I was really isolating myself, keeping secrets, feeling trapped and unhappy, thats when I knew I had an ED. I think you can be very deliberate and intentional with your diet without having an ED, but where you are on that spectrum has to come from within.0 -
You absolutely do not have an eating disorder. If you calculate your caloric needs, meet them every day, and have a stable weight, you are the definition of healthy. And you state explicitly that there's no orthorexia involved here, that you eat treats as long as they fit your macros.
People have deeply superstitious attitudes about food, connecting it on some subliminal-reptilian level with survival and the threat of scarcity, and are threatened by the idea that it might be necessary in some cases to control the amount of food one eats. They don't want you to accomplish anything unless you accomplish it by upholding the exact same beliefs and values that they do.
You worked hard to lose your weight, and you shouldn't let the thoughtlessness of other people jeopardize your accomplishments. If someone tells you that you have an eating disorder, walk them through your TDEE calculation and ask them to tell you where you went wrong.0 -
I wouldn't go so far as to state categorically that you do or don't have an eating disorder.
I was reading another thread someone posted with a link to an article on orthorexia. There was a quote in it that struck me as very true -- "There's a very fine line between success and obsess."
Only you can really know whether or not you've crossed that line. And my personal experience with an ED is that we're prone to lying to ourselves (and others -- in real life and on message boards) about whether we've crossed that line or not. So you have to be brutally honest with yourself to know.0 -
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Lots of good comments already but all I can say is I don't think it's unhealthy at all. You seem to have a very good relationship with food, recognizing it for the nutrition and fuel that it is, instead of some kind of reward or coping mechanism. I do think it can become obsessive but it doesn't sound like this is the case. You worked hard to become healthy and it takes hard work to keep that up when we have the terrible habits ingrained that got us to where we had to lose weight in the first place. If you were seriously underweight, I can see where it might be a problem, as well, but, again, that's not the case. Keep up the great work and ignore those ridiculous comments. I'm sure if you asked a doctor, psychiatrist, and nutritionist what they thought, the words "eating disorder" would never come up.0
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TrailNurse wrote: »Your friend is the one with the eating disorder....not you!
Not sure how you reached that conclusion, given OP said friend is naturally slim and does intuitive eating without
Counting or logging.
Nothing wrong with that - it works for her.
Nothing wrong with counting/logging either if that works for OP.
Someone else said people who are overweight and don't count are also those who have massive credit card debt.
Really??
Can't say my finances are any different when I was overweight and not counting to how they are now. I doubt most people's are.
I agree OP's friend probably jumped in too quickly with amateur diagnosing of eating disorders - but some equally amateur statements made on here too.
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Nonsense.0
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I think people use the word 'obsessive' when they see something being done in a passionate, organised and successful way. I'm glad I've been this way in my lifestyle and business. It's certainly paid off. Not everyone has the drive and ambition, it makes them sad and uncomfortable so they put a negative spin on it.
If your way is making you depressed, very anxious and unhappy then it needs reassessing. It doesn't sound remotely like that to me!
I counted calories for about two years straight, learned how to fuel and sustain my body composition and am now returning after a year of intuitive eating. I only gained 3lb and that was xmas in California!
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Anything can be a “disorder” if it has negative physical and/or psychological effects on you. Does counting calories make you extremely anxious and unhappy? Then perhaps it is a disorder. I have been logging calories for almost 1,000 days, and it is such an integral part of my daily routine that it doesn’t have any noticeable impact on my mental state, it is just another task I need to do every day like brushing my teeth, showering, shaving, etc.0
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I've been told by several people on MFP that I have an ED because I weigh my take-out food/take a travel food scale to a restaurant. These are also the same people who tell you to weigh and measure everything you eat to be accurate in your counting.0
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If you are abusing laxatives, puking up meals, beating yourself up over eating a strawberry, etc. then it's a disorder. Being organized and focused is not.
Sometimes others are bothered by a person becoming successful with nutrition and fitness and their insecurities surface in that way. Usually when I've been successful, these types of people show up with unhealthy food to offer.0 -
I consider eating too much to be an eating disorder, more than being careful what is eaten. That being said, I do think that MFP and "logging" food can become an unhealthy obsession. It doesn't sound, to me (I'm no expert), like the OP has an eating disorder.0
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As a 59 year old trying to lose weight again, I think it is wonderful that you have figured out what works for you and put in place a system that works for you. Having your notebook to go back to and get refocused if/when things get out of balance and tracking what you eat is a good thing. Don't let anyone shame you into putting your health and well-being on the back burner. I wish that I had been that self-disciplined years ago. Finding MFP has made a huge difference for me even though I always essentially knew CICO was the basis of weight control, I found it very difficult to log food with paper and pencil and so it was easy to give up on losing weight. I will probably have to log for the rest of my life to maintain any weight loss I achieve. You keep doing what works for you. Don't become a 59 year old wishing she'd had the self-discipline to follow this path at 25!0
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I've been told by several people on MFP that I have an ED because I weigh my take-out food/take a travel food scale to a restaurant. These are also the same people who tell you to weigh and measure everything you eat to be accurate in your counting.
I weigh take out as often as I can! If the food database lists a serving of large fries as having xxx calories per xxx grams, that is just an ideal portion, as the fast food guy scooping them out is not practicing any sort of precision when he tosses them in the container! Not weighing them will definitely give you an erroneous calorie count.0 -
funny how when you were overweight no one mentioned eating disorders. But now you monitor your calorie intake, put thought and care into your food preparation, make healthy choices, workout and are leaner and fitter than before....all of a sudden people are talking eating disorders ???
"obsessed is the word lazy people use to describe the dedicated"0 -
Well you're fitting in popcorn, chocolate and treats.... so your friend is just inexperienced. She doesn't understand this field like you do.
You should always do what makes YOU feel good. I personally like planning out my meals for the weekend, seeing what I can fit into my allowance. I love to plan recipes, count the calories in each ingredient and see what can be achieved.
I just think you're being extremely intelligent, you understand that calories is not a diet, but a measure of energy. You're making smart decisions here and it's paying off.
My only suggestion is, you should eat at restaurants. You can find calorie information online and guestimate things fairly well. No reason to avoid it.0 -
I don't think you have a eating disorder. I think it's just discipline and knowing what you want dude!
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I have also been accused of having an eating disorder because I track my calories and macros. I respond by comparing it to a bank account: you need to know how much you are depositing and withdrawing, right? It is not good to just *hope* that the deposits and the withdrawals cancel each other out...
I also point out that I am a very petite person, and thus there is not a big margin for error. 5 lbs. gain or loss on me is very, very noticeable. Larger people obviously have more margin for error; I have a friend who is 5'9" and she can gain 15 lbs. without it really affecting how she looks or how her clothes fit. But a 5 lb gain on me and I would have to buy all new jeans.0 -
Context matters and, even if you provided enough information, it would be difficult for anyone on here (even if actually qualified) to diagnose you over the internet. Put another way, washing your hands often is simply good hygiene but do it enough and someone might suggest you have OCD. Professional bodybuilders often count calories and macros, and then again professional bodybuilding is full of people with eating disorders. If you're really concerned then see a shrink.0
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That's much more detailed than I would ever go into, but it seems to work well for you, so yay! ^_^ Counting calories might could lead to an eating disorder, but if you're healthy and getting the nutrients you need, and since you exercise, you're keeping in shape, I wouldn't say you have one. I count calories too, though it's more guesstimate than it used to be, and I'll pull out my phone to log in a restaurant. I don't plan my meals ahead, though, I'm rather too lazy for that! XD0
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Nah, if anything, it's a tool to maintain order with regards to your eating habits and health when used prudently.0
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I don't think you have an eating disorder. I get that a lot because I am not overweight. I am getting close to the overweight line, so I'm trying to back to the size I was when I liked the way I looked and never even thought about scales. It's not easy when your being critized by well meaning friends.0
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counting calories in and of itself does not mean eating disorder. compulsion, guilt, anxiety, etc can be indicative of a disorder0
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I was eating disordered as a young woman (5'9", 95lb, did not ever try to go lower just could not face the triple digits) and for me the line is drawn at "how do I FEEL about food? How do I feel about my body?" Back then, I remember never putting anything in my mouth without feeling bad about it, food would make me fat. I had dread around eating, controlled my weight tightly by never feeling OK about eating anything. Ever. I wasn't focused on nutrition at all. Diet coke all day? Fine, no calories.
Now I try to stay north of 125 and south of 135 pounds, that has kept me healthy for years. I recently hit the 135 and want to go down to 130; so I am dieting but there is a stark difference in how eating feels - I am more careful to eat nourishing foods, I want nutrition, I want my body to be well fed and function well. A couple years back I got stressed and dropped below the 125, so went on a diet to gain weight, instead of spiraling down lower and lower just because I could. I am not really worried that I'll fall into anorexia because my life is so different now and because my relationship with my body is much better. I do sometimes have to track calories to gain or lose, probably because I broke my natural response to hunger. I am not going to ever be able to just not pay attention, because that's not the way I'm wired, but I can use the attention to a positive end.
I think some people can be kind of obsessive about diet and be healthier for it, and that isn't disordered eating. When it starts to impact your life, your psyche, or your body in a negative way, it is disordered. When you panic if you go over your calories, that's disordered.0
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