What are your feelings on calorie counting?

Protranser

I don't mind weighing & logging food & exercise. I do plan on having a week or two sometime in the near future to see how well i can manage my weight without using mfp or my fitbit, and "intuitively eating." if i see too much weight creeping up after the two weeks, I'm logging back into my metrics tools.

OldAssDude

rankinsect wrote: »

bcalvanese wrote: »

I think it is necessary for people who are trying to lose or maintain weight by diet alone because they need to squeeze every calorie into their diet.

I also think that people who are trying to lose or maintain weight through exercise and diet should only log food until they learn how to eat without logging.

I kind of think it's a bad habit, and people should be able to keep themselves accountable without it.

JMO though.

I don't know, I definitely do both diet and exercise, but even when I was very active in college I was never able to maintain a healthy weight without calorie counting. My hunger and satiety are always out of whack with what they should be.

I think it's a very easy thing to count for a lifetime - it takes me less time to plan and log the next day's meals than it does to brush my teeth in the evenings, and it gives benefits other than weight loss, like making dinner prep easy because all the decisions are already made.

I know what you mean, and some people enjoy logging. It's kind of like a hobby to many people, and that's fine. Whatever it takes to get the job done.

When I was young and very fit (I could do 70 pushups in 2 minutes, 70 situps in 2 minutes, and run 2 miles in 14 minutes), I never had to worry about my weight or what I ate. I always ate good foods (some junk food but not a whole lot) and could eat pretty much any time I wanted. My weight problem came when I got a desk job and ate the same for 20+ years.

I became obese and so out of shape I was pathetic. I am now in the process of reversing what I have done by getting back in shape and eating smarter. I've lost 55 lbs. so far mainly from power walking every single day. I ball parked my calories and still stayed under because I had plenty left over.

Now that I am within 20 lbs. of my goal I am training myself to eat smart without having to log my food at all. So far I have gained 2 lbs., lost 2 lbs., and gained 2 lbs. I blame most of that on the holidays, but I will continue to put myself in check until I can lose without even thinking about it, and that to me is developing a good habit of eating smartly all by myself.

Plus I'm lazy...

85Cardinals

You don't have to necessarily count them, but you sure can't discount them!

whaddupw8loss

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count? Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick? Actually, now you're allowed to submit diaries at 900- 1000(depending on your original calorie target, I'm thinking it's 200 calories less than you are targeted to eat), which is below healthy calorie intake. Of course, anything used how it was designed would probably work. Me overgeneralizing the fail rate of MFP is no better than you overgeneralizing the success rate in which MFP users are able to count calories, and stay in a deficit, a healthy deficit.

lemurcat12

HappyCampr1 wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

Calorie counting only teaches the counter to have a relationship with food on a basis of calorie intake. Meaning, they'd opt for unhealthy choices with low calories instead of healthy choices that will essentially fill them up longer. When I counted calories, I would consume the same old crap that made me gain weight in the first place. Junk food almost ALWAYS has one serving to be an okay amount of calories, but the serving does nothing nutritional in the body, and then you want more...cause you're still hungry. I think calorie counting should ONLY come after the person knows about nutrition. And, I honestly don't care about the "ALL IT IS IS CICO, NOTHING ELSE" people, because lets face it...a body full of nutrition works with you, and your weight loss. A body full of crap, works against you, and your weight loss. So, yes, calorie counting is beneficial when used with nutritious foods. But sites like MFP are taking advantage of the user by saying "eat anything, as long as it's in your calorie range, you'll lose weight." Except when the user pigs out on 500 calories worth of junk, feels hungry for the rest of the day, continues to pig out, and goes way over calorie goal. Then what? "I'll shrug it off and start again tomorrow...and again the next day...and so on." I only use MFP to read community posts, and log my weight. I'm losing weight MUCH faster than I ever did about obsessing over calories, and just eating healthier.

Wow. This does not even remotely resemble my experience with MFP and calorie counting over the past two years. My nutrition has gotten much better over time with MFP. I never cut anything out of my diet, but that doesn't mean I haven't added more nutrient dense foods.

You mention the user who eats 500 calories of junk and is still hungry and then what? Well, in my experience that user then learns that eating that way leaves them hungry and they change their eating habits.

I'm sorry you've had such a bitter experience.

Yes,that's what any halfway intelligent person would do. I assume people are capable of it, because to do otherwise would be insulting.

riffraff2112

not a huge fan of counting but it is was a necessary evil in my weight loss. After a few years I seem to have this figured out and only log occasionally to keep track of macros or when I have little mini goals I am chasing.

lemurcat12

bcalvanese wrote: »

I think it is necessary for people who are trying to lose or maintain weight by diet alone because they need to squeeze every calorie into their diet.

I also think that people who are trying to lose or maintain weight through exercise and diet should only log food until they learn how to eat without logging.

I kind of think it's a bad habit, and people should be able to keep themselves accountable without it.

JMO though.

I can maintain my weight without calorie counting, but I like to do both sometimes and lose better when I count (despite some heavy training).

I think it's weird you've appointed yourself speaker for those who exercise when all you do is walk a bit.

lemurcat12

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count?

In theory I agree, but most don't care to, and MFP is an incentive to do so.

Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick?

Yeah, agreed, but it doesn't anymore.

whaddupw8loss

lemurcat12 wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count?

In theory I agree, but most don't care to, and MFP is an incentive to do so.

Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick?

Yeah, agreed, but it doesn't anymore.

I fully agree that some users are able to learn nutrition through MFP. But, not all. But heres the thing, some people may come into MFP with an unhealthy diet which includes very little nutrition, so they eat large quantities of the food. Now, those people trying to calorie count and have a deficit, it's going to drive them insane. Which, leads a lot of people to quit. If they simply learned nutrition prior to, it wouldn't be such a leap to cut back on food.

I'm not saying that MFP doesn't work, I'm not saying that it only works if you eat healthy. I'm saying if you aren't use to calorie counting, and your not use to eating foods that will allow you to stay in a deficit, then it's going to feel like you're losing at every angle.

I'm happy that there are success stories, I'm happy that MFP is working for people. But, I'm annoyed by those who have success in it, think there is literally no downside to it. Or that the people will just learn. When in reality, a lot of people give up.

cwagar123

I love calorie counting... I was one of those people who never understood WHY I was gaining weight... thought that "i barely eat anything... how am I gaining???"... and then I started tracking and realized how MUCH I was actually consuming... and how poor my nutrition was. Almost 80 lbs later it has CHANGED my life.

100df

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count? Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick? Actually, now you're allowed to submit diaries at 900- 1000(depending on your original calorie target, I'm thinking it's 200 calories less than you are targeted to eat), which is below healthy calorie intake. Of course, anything used how it was designed would probably work. Me overgeneralizing the fail rate of MFP is no better than you overgeneralizing the success rate in which MFP users are able to count calories, and stay in a deficit, a healthy deficit.

We have to start somewhere. MFP makes it very easy to see the nutritional information for the foods we eat. People are capable of taking in both nutritional info and calorie amounts. MFP is a tool. People get what they put into it.

All overweight people are not ignorant about how to lose weight and nutrition.

allaboutthecake

with me it's a necessary evil. Sometimes i hate it> Like right now Other times its like "meh whatevs"

daniwilford

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

lemurcat12 wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count?

In theory I agree, but most don't care to, and MFP is an incentive to do so.

Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick?

Yeah, agreed, but it doesn't anymore.

I fully agree that some users are able to learn nutrition through MFP. But, not all. But heres the thing, some people may come into MFP with an unhealthy diet which includes very little nutrition, so they eat large quantities of the food. Now, those people trying to calorie count and have a deficit, it's going to drive them insane. Which, leads a lot of people to quit. If they simply learned nutrition prior to, it wouldn't be such a leap to cut back on food.

I'm not saying that MFP doesn't work, I'm not saying that it only works if you eat healthy. I'm saying if you aren't use to calorie counting, and your not use to eating foods that will allow you to stay in a deficit, then it's going to feel like you're losing at every angle.

I'm happy that there are success stories, I'm happy that MFP is working for people. But, I'm annoyed by those who have success in it, think there is literally no downside to it. Or that the people will just learn. When in reality, a lot of people give up.

How is trying and giving up on calorie counting more harmful than not trying to count calories? If you eat it or don't eat it, and don't count it, you are still eating or not eating a thing. An app isn't going to change your health, what you are eating will change your health.

whaddupw8loss

daniwilford wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

lemurcat12 wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count?

In theory I agree, but most don't care to, and MFP is an incentive to do so.

Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick?

Yeah, agreed, but it doesn't anymore.

I fully agree that some users are able to learn nutrition through MFP. But, not all. But heres the thing, some people may come into MFP with an unhealthy diet which includes very little nutrition, so they eat large quantities of the food. Now, those people trying to calorie count and have a deficit, it's going to drive them insane. Which, leads a lot of people to quit. If they simply learned nutrition prior to, it wouldn't be such a leap to cut back on food.

I'm not saying that MFP doesn't work, I'm not saying that it only works if you eat healthy. I'm saying if you aren't use to calorie counting, and your not use to eating foods that will allow you to stay in a deficit, then it's going to feel like you're losing at every angle.

I'm happy that there are success stories, I'm happy that MFP is working for people. But, I'm annoyed by those who have success in it, think there is literally no downside to it. Or that the people will just learn. When in reality, a lot of people give up.

How is trying and giving up on calorie counting more harmful than not trying to count calories? If you eat it or don't eat it, and don't count it, you are still eating or not eating a thing. An app isn't going to change your health, what you are eating will change your health.

Not my point at all, it's more harmful for the person to continuously give up on something, then it is for them to actually find a way so they can eat within a certain calorie target, and be healthy. I never said completely neglect health, or weight loss to achieve healthness. I said figure out HOW to be healthy and WHAT to eat that will allow you to be healthy, then add the calorie counting. Calorie counting is a huge leap for a completely unhealthy person. It's more proficient to have several smaller steps that lead you to a healthier life, then going from one way of living to an entirely different way of living..of course that person was bound to fail.

And, yes..actually an APP can change your health. Before they changed the calorie thing so you can't figure out how much you'll lose if you only ate..per say, 400 calories...it became an obsession with me. I began to eat at one point 300 calories, and then 200 a day. BECAUSE this app showed that I would lose weight a hell of a lot quicker then eating healthy. I was underweight an anorexic. Then, I gave up on the app because I saw what it did to me, not entirely, but I wouldn't have sought after the low calorie thing, MFP showed me to it one day when I accidentally clicked on finish diary. Then, six months after gaining weight and becoming healthy, I had managed to stay that way...until once again I joined mfp, and guess what? For every day that I calorie counted, I'd eat waaaay more, and even binge. For every day I didn't I'd eat normal. Too very awful extremes produced by this app. I am not everyone on this app, I'm not using me as the basis of the failure from this app. However, I know for a fact failure comes from not knowing the proper way to eat. Yes, this app can set a calorie goal for you, and yes, it tells you certain foods are better than others, but for a lot of people, it needs to be just more than that.

whaddupw8loss

susan100df wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count? Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick? Actually, now you're allowed to submit diaries at 900- 1000(depending on your original calorie target, I'm thinking it's 200 calories less than you are targeted to eat), which is below healthy calorie intake. Of course, anything used how it was designed would probably work. Me overgeneralizing the fail rate of MFP is no better than you overgeneralizing the success rate in which MFP users are able to count calories, and stay in a deficit, a healthy deficit.

We have to start somewhere. MFP makes it very easy to see the nutritional information for the foods we eat. People are capable of taking in both nutritional info and calorie amounts. MFP is a tool. People get what they put into it.

All overweight people are not ignorant about how to lose weight and nutrition.

I meant applying it. And it's easier to fail doing too many things at once, then doing it in smaller, more achievable steps.

whaddupw8loss

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

susan100df wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count? Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick? Actually, now you're allowed to submit diaries at 900- 1000(depending on your original calorie target, I'm thinking it's 200 calories less than you are targeted to eat), which is below healthy calorie intake. Of course, anything used how it was designed would probably work. Me overgeneralizing the fail rate of MFP is no better than you overgeneralizing the success rate in which MFP users are able to count calories, and stay in a deficit, a healthy deficit.

We have to start somewhere. MFP makes it very easy to see the nutritional information for the foods we eat. People are capable of taking in both nutritional info and calorie amounts. MFP is a tool. People get what they put into it.

All overweight people are not ignorant about how to lose weight and nutrition.

I meant applying it. And it's easier to fail doing too many things at once, then doing it in smaller, more achievable steps.

It's easier for a person to start adding vegetables, and then fruits, and then healthier grains, and so on, to their diets...then it is for them to restrict their diets. (of course, some people don't like fruits and veggies, then that'd be a struggle, but I'm sure of all the vast nutritious foods, they could figure out something to add to their diets.)

PeachyCarol

Calorie counting is the one weight loss method that finally, after 40 years of dieting, clicked for me.

WinoGelato

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

WinoGelato wrote: »

whaddupw8loss wrote: »

In response to all: I never said that CICO isn't the way to lose weight. I said, there's a lot more to it that would prohibit the weight loss only using the base of CICO. Yes, obviously there is going to be a loss of weight with any calorie deficit. However, there are PLENTY of people who stop calorie counting once they achieve their desired weight and gain it all back. Why? Because they never formed healthy eating, they only formed reducing calories. I'm not saying that anyone has to only eat healthy, of course you should be able to have treats or unhealthy foods in moderation. Now for those of you who have learned better eating habits from MFP, good for you. I never said you couldn't. In fact, there are people who do. But there are plenty more people who don't have that experience. I don't know how many posts I've read where they just yo-yo and yo-yo, because it's hard to maintain eating junk food with no nutrients at a deficit, your body inevitably gets hungry. You eat, and sometimes you eat WAY too much due to this. So, no. Calorie counting is not the devil, it can be VERY beneficial. However, I don't seem to find too many overweight, calorie-counting, avid MFP users who have a well balanced diet, with nutrients. Obviously there is a reason people get obese, or overweight. If it's from junk food, then they cannot continue eating like *kitten*, and expecting life long results. Yes, you can restrict and eat like *kitten*, but how long will that last. Just take a look at how many "I fell off the bandwagon...again" posts you see on this site. So, if this site manages to give you the right tools you need to be healthier, then great. My original post was NOT ABOUT YOU. "If it doesn't apply to you, then don't get insulted by it."

Also, there are other calorie counting sites that don't require you to purchase a "premium" account to enable you to use all of it's offered tools. If you think this site isn't to line the pockets of the creator, then I believe you're misguided. Weight loss is a BIG market for making money, the creators of MFP were well aware of that. There are plenty of sites that give you all the tools for free and came way before MFP. MFP hasn't done anything new or special. You could search on google, find ANY calorie counting site, and you'd have the same results on those as you would MFP, it's about the habits of the user, not the site. If the user is determined to lose weight, they'll do so on any calorie counting platform. Weight Watchers, another popular calorie counting mechanism, has such a poor long term success rate, and guess what? When the user "falls off the bandwagon" because they only learned points, and CICO, they go right back to it. Weight loss websites and companies are in it for the money.

It sounds like you are projecting many of your own choices on the community as a whole. Because you chose to eat mostly junk food, weren't satiated, and then gave up doesn't mean that most people do that or that calorie counting and MFP encourages that. In fact, most of the "I gave up but am now back again" posts come from people who have unrealistic expectations about weight loss, whether it be trying to lose weight too fast, trying to restrict entire groups of food (aka cutting out sugars or "white foods" or only eating "clean"). The people who come to MFP, with reasonable expectations and use the tool the way it is designed, are the ones who have long term, sustainable results. If you aren't seeing people who are using this tool with well balanced, nutrient dense diets, and losing weight in the process, then I think you're not looking in the right place

My exact point in the fact that people should learn nutrition before attempting to calorie count? Remember when MFP would allow you to submit a calorie day under 1200? When you could per say, eat 400 calories, submit your diary and then it'd tell you that if "every day was today...you would be x weight by y day" How isn't that not leading the users into unrealistic expectations, by idk..giving them unhealthy ways to get skinny quick? Actually, now you're allowed to submit diaries at 900- 1000(depending on your original calorie target, I'm thinking it's 200 calories less than you are targeted to eat), which is below healthy calorie intake. Of course, anything used how it was designed would probably work. Me overgeneralizing the fail rate of MFP is no better than you overgeneralizing the success rate in which MFP users are able to count calories, and stay in a deficit, a healthy deficit.

So you keep saying people should "learn nutrition" before they start using MFP or counting calories otherwise they are destined to fail. Where do you propose they learn nutrition? Take college courses? Spend time googling peer reviewed studies about micro and macro nutrient balance? Wouldn't a practical way of learning be what so many of us do, and advise others to do when starting out here? Start with a modest calorie deficit. Eat the foods you normally eat, in smaller portions, logging everything. When you realize that you aren't satisfied with that, you start adding on more nutrient dense foods and leave the calorie dense items as a treat. I really don't see how just starting, and learning as you go by seeing the nutritional info in the database and lurking the forums, can be worse than trying to muddle through extensive nutritional info online without seeing how it applies to your particular dietary choices...

kluvit

It brings great awareness to the impacts of various food choices and has been the key to my success over the past 4 years. Lost 35 pounds and maintained within 3 pounds for 3.5 years and am going back to it to lose a couple of holiday pounds.

lcthatsit