what's wrong with cardio ?
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I've seen this work a lot and I can tell you the difference between the Women that jog for an hour on the treadmill vs the women hitting the weights and the women hitting the weights to me look way better than those just on the treadmill, same for guys too. Look at a sprinter vs a marathon runner, the marathon runner looks almost sickly and the sprinter looks fit and healthy.
What if you do both?0 -
Nothing is wrong with cardio. People have different goals/preferences.
Cardio is great for heart health, yes; but also for endurance and depending on what cardio at what rate could be prime activity for achieving maximum calorie deficits for weight loss.
Strength training/resistance training also adds value but doesn't necessarily void out the benefits of cardio.
Ideally, one should do both along with a healthy diet for optimum results.0 -
kiddiebqueen17 wrote: »I read some posts and it seemed people were not too keen on cardio. Just wondering if it was something they did not enjoy or an issue when trying to lose weight. I just started my weight loss mission and going on the elyptical a few times a week was going to be my exercise of choice.
So, as you've already seen you're going to get a lot of ONE TRUE WAY(tm) nonsense when you ask this question. A quick review of the forums for the wights or cardio discussions will show you that you're going to get a spread, selecting from:- Cardio is dull - If you're talking about doing it on a machine in a gym then I wouldn't disagree, but there are lots of ways to do CV work that don't involve paying through the nose to stay inside a room.
- Weights are superior because you get to burn MILLIONS OF CALORIES for days - Unmitigated nonsense
- High Intensity Interval Training is where it's at as it's magic and you'll burn millions of calories in ten minutes - Also unmitigated nonsense.
- Cardio burns up muscle - Just look at the pictures upthread for an example of that
What you'll spot is that the most credible people will advocate a balance of CV and resistance work, picking some form of either that you'll stick to.
To me, an elliptical would be hell, but I'll comfortably go out and run in the woods and trails for 2-3 hours at a time. Other people walk, some play tennis, or squash, swim or cycle. Find something that interests you.
As far as resistance training is concerned, I find gyms very dull and the process of lifting to be very tedious. I do bodyweight work as it suits my needs. Again, find something that works for you.0 -
kiddiebqueen17 wrote: »I read some posts and it seemed people were not too keen on cardio. Just wondering if it was something they did not enjoy or an issue when trying to lose weight. I just started my weight loss mission and going on the elyptical a few times a week was going to be my exercise of choice.
The best exercise - IMO, especially when first starting out - is the one you'll actually *do*, and (ideally) *enjoy*.
The things that (some) people are saying here are true, about different forms of exercise having different benefits. Over time, if you become more active generally, you'll probably find you want to branch out and try some different things for variety, or that you start understanding your body & its fitness better, and want some of the other exercises' benefits. Worry about the "perfect" exercise regime then.
For now, just start being more active in healthful way(s) you enjoy. That will help you on your way.0 -
SingingSingleTracker wrote: »SingingSingleTracker wrote: »
You need to run faster if you think weight lifting is superior in terms of burning calories. ;-)
Take it up to HR Zone 4 with a few dabbles in HR Zone 5 for an hour and see what the burn is.
Weight lifting (and I mean serious weight lifting not 20 reps stuff) is superior in terms of calories burned. You are thinking of calories burned through the duration of the exercise. A heavy lifting session will let your body in a recovery state and increased metabolism for around 2-3 days.
Let's say for the sake of your argument that a heavy lifting session "increases your metabolism" for 2-3 days. Are you saying that running or cycling at a race pace (Zone 4/5) wouldn't do the same?
Pretty much yes. As few people can sustain zone 5 or 4 for longer periods of time. Ignoring the fact that they develop different adaptations. If you are talking about interval training that is another talk
Anybody who is racing (and racing is filled with a lot of "average people" including me) sure can sustain Zone 4/5 for a race duration. Obviously, the longer the duration, the pace and Zones taper down to high end 3 all the way up to Zone 5.
I will just take data from one race I did last summer (out of many races). This race was actually rather short compared to others that I did.
The red line in that chart depicts my HR was pegged from the start all the way to the end.
This chart shows you that in a bike race I spent the majority of time in my Zone 5 with a solid 30 minutes in my Zone 4 as well....
Again - I'm an "average guy" on a bike when it comes to racing. Sure, I train, but so does everyone else that races.
The final chart shows the calorie burn, miles, speed, training stress, and HR info.
Throw in a typical 45 minute warm-up before the race that targets all the HR Zones, and a good 20 minute cool down ride - all makes for a 2000 kcal burn day on the bike.
I do lift weights as well - especially in the off season. Even lifting heavy (which I do during my periodization), I never burn the amount of calories I do during a bike race.
I think the myth of the furnace burning for 2-3 days needs to be backed up with real data which led to why I posted a response to your post in the first place. I think the residual burn - in terms of beyond the actual exercise time - is very minimal whether it is a big burn from cardio or weight lifting according to all of the data I have read. I certainly haven't read anything that confirms a 2-3 day burn based on a big effort (cardio or weights) session.0 -
A question that needs to be asked is, how old are you? I'm a senior citizen so in addition to keeping fat off, sarcopenia and mobility maintenance are issues that cardio does not address. Strength training and even a bit of hypertrophy does a better job of addressing that and is essential for quality of life as we age.0
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Nothing wrong with cardio. Personally I skip it, but my TDEE is low. It's a choice I was willing to make because I hate it so much.0
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Depends on your goals. Is your goal body transformation or simply to lose fat? If its body transformation than I really think weight lifting is the best way for anyone to be lean and fit looking, couple that with a proper diet and some High interval cardio training (like sprinting, calisthenics), etc..you'll see a huge transformation in time.
I've seen this work a lot and I can tell you the difference between the Women that jog for an hour on the treadmill vs the women hitting the weights and the women hitting the weights to me look way better than those just on the treadmill, same for guys too. Look at a sprinter vs a marathon runner, the marathon runner looks almost sickly and the sprinter looks fit and healthy.
Maybe if you are looking at the elite level. Marathon running does not make that type of marathon body alone. At the elite level, having less weight is advantageous so you get the extreme end of that. There are plenty of marathon runners who don't look like that, especially at the non-elite level.
As for the "I can tell the difference". Bull. In extreme cases on either end, sure. But for your average person, I doubt it.
OP - as others have said, nothing is wrong with it. It comes down to preference. And, mix of cardio and weight training is a good thing too.0 -
IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.0
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schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?0 -
Look I never said I hate cardio. But in my point of view you'd make a mistake to not do both. I love to run also but I can't run too much cause that would impede with my lifting progress and I would stall at both. If we're to chose only one I would chose lifting cause it was more beneficial to me that cardio ever was. It fixes my posture, improved my strength and endurance and it felt really easy to get into running. The reason I said 2 days is because it takes around 72 hours for a muscle to recover. That is for an average person. The more advanced and closer to your natural limit you are the longer it takes. That's why beginners can do a full body workout every other day. Another thing why I said that lifting is better was because of the impact and adaptation it causes. And for me strength training carries to endurance and cardio more that otherwise.SingingSingleTracker wrote: »snip0 -
I prefer to do cardio as I want to lose fat. Also I have joint and pain issues, and unfortunately anything with weights exacerbates it, so it's better for me to walk/run/jog.0
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arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.0 -
If you're just starting out I think it's more important to do something you enjoy. Cardio has been my favorite, low impact jogging or walking really makes me feel great. I started worrying about all the lifting, bulking, cutting stuff and really got discouraged and then uninterested after a short while. Ellipticals are fun and make me feel awesome, so I usually look forward to it. Maybe someday I'll worry about the other stuff later in my journey.0
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3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.0 -
Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss. But that would occur on extreme diets with little to no protein0 -
Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss
Then lift to save it. You're going to lose muscle in a deficit regardless.0 -
I ❤️ cardio so much. I'm a distance runner, and suck up those endorphins. Nothing makes me feel as badass as running 7-9 miles every day. And running outside is far from boring.0
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arditarose wrote: »Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss
Then lift to save it. You're going to lose muscle in a deficit regardless.
I was just a answering the question. Which was if you go in a cut with severe deficit and do cardio0 -
arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
Admittedly I made some assumptions when I said that. Here's what I was thinking: the reason that some people advise against cardio for body recomposition is that it alters your endocrine state dramatically. E.g. men who engage in endurance training can expect to see a 20%-30% drop in testosterone levels. Additionally, cortisol will be raised (the study I linked to is talking about baseline cortisol levels, not immediately following exercise, and these athletes are eating for recovery). This is not in itself an argument against cardio, because cardio has tons of benefits that probably outweigh the costs. For example massively increased production of neurotrophic factors and neurotransmitters, improved blood flow especially to the brain, resulting in better mood, better cognition, etc. And then of course there is the calorie burn. Which is why I personally do cardio every day.
This tradeoff is fine as long as you're eating enough calories, specifically carbohydrates and fat, to support healthy hormone production. On a cut, however, carbohydrates and fat tend to suffer the most. No one cuts protein to lose weight, for good reason. With a really mild or even moderate cut, this isn't a huge problem. But if someone is cutting aggressively, they're dealing a terrible one-two punch to their endocrine health.
After a few weeks or months of heavy aerobic training at a deficit, you run the risk of burning out your adrenals. This makes losing weight about a thousand times harder than it is already.
It also depends on the intensity of the cardio. If you're working out really hard, the effect will be more acute.0 -
arditarose wrote: »Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss
Then lift to save it. You're going to lose muscle in a deficit regardless.
I was just a answering the question. Which was if you go in a cut with severe deficit and do cardio
The poster said if you DON'T do cardio, you won't recover. Not if you DO it. I still would like to know what he meant.
ETA: Sorry I see he was suggesting you don't do it. I misread.0 -
arditarose wrote: »Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss
Then lift to save it. You're going to lose muscle in a deficit regardless.
I was just a answering the question. Which was if you go in a cut with severe deficit and do cardio
Who asked about a severe cut?
What is the difference between maintaining an 800 calorie deficit and maintaining an 800 calorie deficit while doing cardio?
ETA - I thought you were the one who said it, I didn't realize you were answering for him.0 -
3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss
Then lift to save it. You're going to lose muscle in a deficit regardless.
I was just a answering the question. Which was if you go in a cut with severe deficit and do cardio
Who asked about a severe cut?
What is the difference between maintaining an 800 calorie deficit and maintaining an 800 calorie deficit while doing cardio?
ETA - I thought you were the one who said it, I didn't realize you were answering for him.
Because cardio would increase the gap even more. Then suddenly you are at 1500 calorie gap.0 -
The key is the intensity. Walking on a treadmill is practically a bodybuilding tradition and people do it in order to increase their calorie burn while minimizing the risk of overtraining.0
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3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »Forty6and2 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »arditarose wrote: »schibsted750 wrote: »IMO it depends on your caloric balance. If you're sustaining, there is nothing inherently wrong with cardio. If you're trying to lose weight with a cut of 200-300 calories, probably fine. If you're cutting by, say, 800 calories, don't do cardio. You won't recover from it properly and it will have counterproductive effects.
What do you mean by this?
I had the same question.
Also in for this answer.
Muscle loss
Then lift to save it. You're going to lose muscle in a deficit regardless.
I was just a answering the question. Which was if you go in a cut with severe deficit and do cardio
Who asked about a severe cut?
What is the difference between maintaining an 800 calorie deficit and maintaining an 800 calorie deficit while doing cardio?
ETA - I thought you were the one who said it, I didn't realize you were answering for him.
Because cardio would increase the gap even more. Then suddenly you are at 1500 calorie gap.
If you are following MFP then it would not increase the gap. Which is why I said "maintaining" an 800 calorie deficit.
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Look I never said I hate cardio. But in my point of view you'd make a mistake to not do both. I love to run also but I can't run too much cause that would impede with my lifting progress and I would stall at both. If we're to chose only one I would chose lifting cause it was more beneficial to me that cardio ever was. It fixes my posture, improved my strength and endurance and it felt really easy to get into running. The reason I said 2 days is because it takes around 72 hours for a muscle to recover. That is for an average person. The more advanced and closer to your natural limit you are the longer it takes. That's why beginners can do a full body workout every other day. Another thing why I said that lifting is better was because of the impact and adaptation it causes. And for me strength training carries to endurance and cardio more that otherwise.SingingSingleTracker wrote: »snip
One of the points or tenets of MFP is to weed out any BroScience (BS). I just caution that the above paragraph and other things you have said in this thread are filled with a heavy dose of BroScience. BroScience can really confuse OP's, so we all need to be careful to refrain from using it.
The OP was not asking which is better, but wondered if the choice of using the Elliptical a few times a week as the exercise of choice was an "issue when trying to lose weight".
I read some posts and it seemed people were not too keen on cardio. Just wondering if it was something they did not enjoy or an issue when trying to lose weight. I just started my weight loss mission and going on the elyptical a few times a week was going to be my exercise of choice.
No, it is not an issue when trying to lose weight. Running a deficit in the CICO equation is what will cause weight loss. Whatever the exercise is that contributes to the -CO side of the equation doesn't matter. What matters is the daily CICO and weekly CICO calculation will tally up to a deficit to insure weight loss.
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No one is denying that you will lose weight You will absolutely, without a doubt lose weight by doing any kind of exercise to increase caloric deficit. But not all weight loss is created equal. My point is that if you don't recover properly from exercise, you will hurt your body composition more than is necessarily.0
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schibsted750 wrote: »The key is the intensity. Walking on a treadmill is practically a bodybuilding tradition and people do it in order to increase their calorie burn while minimizing the risk of overtraining.
The idea of bodybuilders doing low intensity cardio is to maintain as much muscle mass as possible while burning still burning calories while on what is usually a very drastic cut getting contest ready.
That isn't the same as someone looking to do cardio a few times a week.
And bodybuilders are getting away from that idea as well.
ETA - also, this is a scenerio with a very lean individual trying to get even leaner.0 -
Ideally, you want some of both, with more of whatever you like more.
One big benefit, IME, of lifting is that I look great at a higher weight than if I were just doing cardio, due to a higher amount of muscle/lower body fat. That means I can eat a bit more, especially in maintenance, than if I was doing strictly cardio and not working on muscle mass as well. I'm quite short, so that kind of thing is important to me.
There are many means to the end, of course. I like lifting heavy with a bit of cardio at the end of my workout. Some people prefer more in the cardio side (marathon runners ... that's a lot of cardio training, but some people love it!) and others prefer body weight resistance training. The trick is finding what makes you happy, both in enjoying your workout and in developing the look you want. Since you're just starting out, the elliptical is a great place to start building some CV endurance and getting in the habit of exercising. But I would still suggest trying other things, maybe other machines or classes at your gym, and definitely look into a bit of resistance training along with your cardio (as @arditarose said above, that's the best way to reduce muscle loss, but you'll still lose at least some while eating at a deficit)0
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