No wonder people are confused about the causes of obesity......
thebuz
Posts: 221 Member
This article is ridiculous.
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/growing-list-of-obesity-causes
At what point do we have to take responsibility for own choices?
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/growing-list-of-obesity-causes
At what point do we have to take responsibility for own choices?
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Replies
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Celebrity chefs made me fat!!0
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Aliens. Aliens made me fat. Clearly it's not my fault.0
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Well... the causes of obesity are complex, and a lot of what contributes to obesity is not within our control. It is the job of researchers not to assume or oversimplify, but to come up with hypotheses and test them. However, that doesn't mean that we don't have responsibility in our own lives. If you want to be healthy, you are the only person who can make the daily choices necessary to live in a healthy way.
I think of it like this - the reasons I got so overweight are likely numerous and not even super well understood - but for various reasons I regularly took in more calories than I burned over the course of many years. I can educate myself on how to reverse this, and it is up to me to set up my life in such ways that facilitate changing the energy equation long-term. For me, this means building activity into my day, getting immersed in an active hobby (dance), planning meals, following a calorie deficit, and sustaining motivation by focusing on my long-term goals and practicing the psychological skills I have.0 -
Good grief. So, "Eating too much (calories) for one's activity/lifestyle level" is not on the list? Because that's the only reason I got fat (and everyone else I know).0
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I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????0 -
I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.0 -
williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.0 -
girlviernes wrote: »williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
That's easy. It's because food has been engineered to taste good, and since it's pleasurable, people have associated providing food with love.0 -
galgenstrick wrote: »girlviernes wrote: »williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
That's easy. It's because food has been engineered to taste good, and since it's pleasurable, people have associated providing food with love.
Good hypothesis.0 -
We know the cause of pregnancy too, yet unplanned pregnancy happens all the time too. As a parent of teenagers, I am interested in things that may cause a teen to engage in risky sexual behavior.
I think the same is true of obesity. As I became obese, I knew what caused it, how to prevent it and how to reverse it. I didn't have the will to prevent or reverse it, because of a multitude of things on that list. I had to take care of some of those before finding the will to eat less and move more.0 -
girlviernes wrote: »williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
I think that research is interesting, and that it's helpful to separate out the population as a whole from the individual. That is, I got fat (and lost the weight) due to calories in and out being a certain way. There are reasons this occurred personal to me that I can work on/change/be sensitive to or mindful of in the future. But that I think everyone has control over their own body weight doesn't mean that the broader question of why the population is getting fatter has been answered. I don't think we just all started being more lazy or have less self-control.
That said, I really do think the main answers are pretty obvious:
Food is around all the time and easily available and cheap (including the time needed to prepare it). (I think this is the main effect of all the highly processed foods, not that they are harder to resist than more traditional foods. They are not.)
We have culturally lost any restrictions that controlled how much and what we eat. We used to eat at meals and certain other times and not otherwise, and now food may be consumed at all times and increasing even nutrition types push eating many times a day. Similarly, meals used to be culturally expected to take certain forms (include vegetables and other traditionally "healthy" foods). Now, it's just personal choice/taste. This kind of individualist change vs. cultural restrictions is usually earlier/more pronounced in the US (especially since we lack a strong food culture), so not surprising that the US leads the way. (Arguably, BigFood plays a role in this too, since they had an incentive to convince us that we need/want to snack all the time.)
People do not have to be nearly as active on a regular basis (and again this is especially pronounced in the US with our car culture and some suburbs without even sidewalks or stores that you can reasonably walk to, as well as some urban areas with neighborhoods too unsafe to play in).
People are often strapped for time due to work commitments that are relatively sedentary (the rising rate of single parent households, one of the things on the list, might be somewhat related to this), so the easily available (in terms of time) food options can be especially appealing, especially if there is no strong social message that would counter this. (I do think social/cultural messages are important. My mother hates to cook and basically doesn't now, but when we were kids she cooked healthy meals in addition to working because not to would have been frowned upon, she would have considered herself a bad mother, just as if the house had not been cleaned, etc. I see the same thing in the subculture I live in with my friends, who think it's important to have their kids eat vegetables, not drink mostly soda, have a sensible diet, participate in active activities. For them there would still be a social stigma to not doing this. I don't think that's always the case.)0 -
This list almost reads like something from The Onion. I thought it was satire at first.0
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[quote=
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating. [/quote]
I don't consider that flippant at all. I agree that it's important to learn the causes of overeating. I know I have changed immensely on my 50lb weight loss journey. I had learned nothing about nutrition in school and at home and just carried on until one day I was over 200lbs and knew I had to make a change.
I do think though that a list like this is scary for the people who read it without a true understanding of how calories in/calories out works and the importance of exercise for your health. There are things on this list that could be read as "get out of jail free cards". I.E. I lived in China with my grandparents therefore it's not my fault I'm overweight or I married later in life so therefore I was predisposed to being fat.
Perhaps the article should have been titled "Possible reasons that contributed to your weight gain" instead.
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lemurcat12 wrote: »girlviernes wrote: »williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
I think that research is interesting, and that it's helpful to separate out the population as a whole from the individual. That is, I got fat (and lost the weight) due to calories in and out being a certain way. There are reasons this occurred personal to me that I can work on/change/be sensitive to or mindful of in the future. But that I think everyone has control over their own body weight doesn't mean that the broader question of why the population is getting fatter has been answered. I don't think we just all started being more lazy or have less self-control.
That said, I really do think the main answers are pretty obvious:
Food is around all the time and easily available and cheap (including the time needed to prepare it). (I think this is the main effect of all the highly processed foods, not that they are harder to resist than more traditional foods. They are not.)
We have culturally lost any restrictions that controlled how much and what we eat. We used to eat at meals and certain other times and not otherwise, and now food may be consumed at all times and increasing even nutrition types push eating many times a day. Similarly, meals used to be culturally expected to take certain forms (include vegetables and other traditionally "healthy" foods). Now, it's just personal choice/taste. This kind of individualist change vs. cultural restrictions is usually earlier/more pronounced in the US (especially since we lack a strong food culture), so not surprising that the US leads the way. (Arguably, BigFood plays a role in this too, since they had an incentive to convince us that we need/want to snack all the time.)
People do not have to be nearly as active on a regular basis (and again this is especially pronounced in the US with our car culture and some suburbs without even sidewalks or stores that you can reasonably walk to, as well as some urban areas with neighborhoods too unsafe to play in).
People are often strapped for time due to work commitments that are relatively sedentary (the rising rate of single parent households, one of the things on the list, might be somewhat related to this), so the easily available (in terms of time) food options can be especially appealing, especially if there is no strong social message that would counter this. (I do think social/cultural messages are important. My mother hates to cook and basically doesn't now, but when we were kids she cooked healthy meals in addition to working because not to would have been frowned upon, she would have considered herself a bad mother, just as if the house had not been cleaned, etc. I see the same thing in the subculture I live in with my friends, who think it's important to have their kids eat vegetables, not drink mostly soda, have a sensible diet, participate in active activities. For them there would still be a social stigma to not doing this. I don't think that's always the case.)
I would tend to agree, with the addition that there is also a genetic component which varies the extent to which we are vulnerable to these factors and also makes it much easier for some people to gain weight (much less drive to compensate through decreased hunger, decreased interest in food, and increased activity) and vice versa.0 -
girlviernes wrote: »williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
There is a difference in causes and contributing factors. The cause is overeating, there are many contributing factors that encourage overeating.0 -
I blame Canada.
I honestly thought this was satire as well.0 -
This is one of those instances where it helps to look at the source material: http://www.downeyobesityreport.com/2015/10/the-putative-104-causes-of-obesity-update/
Here's the text, the bolded section gives a bit more insight to the list and considerations:What causes obesity? The question has profound implications for individuals and policy makers. So, it is natural to turn to research published in peer-reviewed journals to find the answer. So, we have updated the list of “putative” causes first published on February 28, 2013 and updated on September 1, 2013. We have moved from 82 putative causes to 104.
The number of putative causes raises several questions. First, is there some problem with the research methodology that so many and diverse potential causes are identified? Second, are a number of named putative causes symptoms or manifestations of underlying, deeper causes? And what are those? Third, to what extent are identified putative causes reflections of local, regional, ethnic or cultural factors. Finally, many of these studies point out that the “energy-in-energy-out” formulation for the cause of obesity which most of the public and health professionals believe to be the cause.
New items on the list include too much homework, insufficient body heat, imagining the smell of food, components of dust, living with grandparents, thermogenic adipocytes, estrogens and starting college.
Here’s the most current list. If I am missing any, please let me know. (The links are not meant to be definitive or best study but merely a demonstration of the interest in the particular cause.)
- See more at: http://www.downeyobesityreport.com/2015/10/the-putative-104-causes-of-obesity-update/#sthash.q4TQ2wJo.dpuf0 -
[quote=
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
I don't consider that flippant at all. I agree that it's important to learn the causes of overeating. I know I have changed immensely on my 50lb weight loss journey. I had learned nothing about nutrition in school and at home and just carried on until one day I was over 200lbs and knew I had to make a change.
I do think though that a list like this is scary for the people who read it without a true understanding of how calories in/calories out works and the importance of exercise for your health. There are things on this list that could be read as "get out of jail free cards". I.E. I lived in China with my grandparents therefore it's not my fault I'm overweight or I married later in life so therefore I was predisposed to being fat.
Perhaps the article should have been titled "Possible reasons that contributed to your weight gain" instead.
[/quote]
I think the problem with the article is that it doesn't really make any distinction of level of evidence we have to support these as contributing factors, I would guess that many of these things are correlations that were found and any evidence of causality is weak at best. Many of these factors may also have fairly small effects, when a few will be the main factors contributing to obesity. So, like you said, very hard to contextualize and potentially adding more noise, which is already a big problem for people trying to take control of their weight.
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cerise_noir wrote: »I blame Canada.
I honestly thought this was satire as well.
That only work if you live in South Park.0 -
To me this reads more like a list of "excuses" than causes. Only 261 more, and you can have a new excuse each day! (You're on your own during leap years). I note 'individual responsibility' isn't on that list.
Seriously though - I'm sure there are some indirect, minor effects due to some of these...but except in very rare instances, we all still have to take responsibility for our own health and wellness. The world isn't going to do it for us.
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girlviernes wrote: »I think the problem with the article is that it doesn't really make any distinction of level of evidence we have to support these as contributing factors, I would guess that many of these things are correlations that were found and any evidence of causality is weak at best. Many of these factors may also have fairly small effects, when a few will be the main factors contributing to obesity. So, like you said, very hard to contextualize and potentially adding more noise, which is already a big problem for people trying to take control of their weight.
Agreed. Confusing correlation and causation is a frequent occurrence when addressing weight loss issues.0 -
My cat ate my homework!
(Was that the right answer??)0 -
Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »
Actually, I lost weight around 1997-98, and in the 2013-2016. Clearly Democratic presidents induce weight loss in their second term.
Thanks Obama.0 -
girlviernes wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »girlviernes wrote: »williams969 wrote: »I know that list is in alphabetical order.. but really "Overeating" is buried in the middle???
And How is "Living with grandparents in China" relevant and on the list???????????
Oops. There it is. The only direct cause of overfat. Everything else on the list *can* cause overeating. But they are not direct causes. In fact, many things (external stressors, mental health, etc) often lead to loss of appetite/undereating.
Not to be flippant, but as an obesity researcher, we are interested in "why" people are overeating.
I think that research is interesting, and that it's helpful to separate out the population as a whole from the individual. That is, I got fat (and lost the weight) due to calories in and out being a certain way. There are reasons this occurred personal to me that I can work on/change/be sensitive to or mindful of in the future. But that I think everyone has control over their own body weight doesn't mean that the broader question of why the population is getting fatter has been answered. I don't think we just all started being more lazy or have less self-control.
That said, I really do think the main answers are pretty obvious:
Food is around all the time and easily available and cheap (including the time needed to prepare it). (I think this is the main effect of all the highly processed foods, not that they are harder to resist than more traditional foods. They are not.)
We have culturally lost any restrictions that controlled how much and what we eat. We used to eat at meals and certain other times and not otherwise, and now food may be consumed at all times and increasing even nutrition types push eating many times a day. Similarly, meals used to be culturally expected to take certain forms (include vegetables and other traditionally "healthy" foods). Now, it's just personal choice/taste. This kind of individualist change vs. cultural restrictions is usually earlier/more pronounced in the US (especially since we lack a strong food culture), so not surprising that the US leads the way. (Arguably, BigFood plays a role in this too, since they had an incentive to convince us that we need/want to snack all the time.)
People do not have to be nearly as active on a regular basis (and again this is especially pronounced in the US with our car culture and some suburbs without even sidewalks or stores that you can reasonably walk to, as well as some urban areas with neighborhoods too unsafe to play in).
People are often strapped for time due to work commitments that are relatively sedentary (the rising rate of single parent households, one of the things on the list, might be somewhat related to this), so the easily available (in terms of time) food options can be especially appealing, especially if there is no strong social message that would counter this. (I do think social/cultural messages are important. My mother hates to cook and basically doesn't now, but when we were kids she cooked healthy meals in addition to working because not to would have been frowned upon, she would have considered herself a bad mother, just as if the house had not been cleaned, etc. I see the same thing in the subculture I live in with my friends, who think it's important to have their kids eat vegetables, not drink mostly soda, have a sensible diet, participate in active activities. For them there would still be a social stigma to not doing this. I don't think that's always the case.)
I would tend to agree, with the addition that there is also a genetic component which varies the extent to which we are vulnerable to these factors and also makes it much easier for some people to gain weight (much less drive to compensate through decreased hunger, decreased interest in food, and increased activity) and vice versa.
Yes, I would agree with that too. I think that's possibly why there's a ceiling on the obesity rate and we started to see a bit of a stabilization or even decline a couple years ago (although I'm not sure if that's held up).0 -
kommodevaran wrote: »My cat ate my homework!
(Was that the right answer??)
No, it's the dog. Cats are way too picky for paper.0 -
Been living well and happy since Obama took office. I am my heaviest, but that will soon end with this next regime!!!!blues4miles wrote: »0 -
OMG - you cant take the national Post seriously for any type of news. But seriously....I think its satire too, everything after the first sentence.0
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http://www.drsharma.ca/100-putative-causes-of-obesity-take-your-pick
Listening to (or reading the bestsellers written by) pundits, one may easily think that the entire obesity problem can be brought down to a couple of factors – sugar-sweetened beverages, fast food, sedentariness, screen-time, – take your pick.
Now, Morgan Downey, former CEO of the Obesity Society on his blog – the Downey Obesity Report – provides an update of previous lists of putative causes of obesity – a list that now included 104 items.
As he is careful to point out,
“The links are not meant to be definitive or best study but merely a demonstration of the interest in the particular cause.”
Given that many of these factors are implicated based largely on observational studies, which by their very nature cannot prove causality, some scepticism is in order.
However, for many factors on this list there is biological plausibility, often backed by findings from animal or experimental studies.
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