Running question
_MissBrie
Posts: 114 Member
So I have been doing interval training on the treadmill, 30"/30" and I usually have it set at about an 8. The other day, I decided to just jog for 15 minutes at the end of a workout because I had some time to kill and the energy to do it, and a few minutes in, I noticed my legs and especially my knees were killing me! I never have this problem with the intervals, so any idea as to why I would have knee pain jogging at a 5.5? The next day was painful to walk as well.
I was thinking that I may not have as good of form while jogging, or maybe there is greater impact? I'm not really sure, I'm pretty new to the world of running. Any idea on what could possibly cause this? I do have good running shoes, I was fitted for at a running store, but they are a little old..
Any help would be much appreciated!
I was thinking that I may not have as good of form while jogging, or maybe there is greater impact? I'm not really sure, I'm pretty new to the world of running. Any idea on what could possibly cause this? I do have good running shoes, I was fitted for at a running store, but they are a little old..
Any help would be much appreciated!
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Replies
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Sometimes knee problems come from bad form. If it keeps up make an appointment with a physiotherapist and they'll help.0
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Concrete. Its harder than treadmill, so the impact is harder. Try some grass or dirt road next or go to a stadium. And take it easy when running outdoors. Its harder but less boring and I prefer it. Put some ice on those knees
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Hi! I'm no expert but i've always been told to slowly increase my running time to make sure the body gets use to it and I don't hurt myself. The body as to get use to running for 'a long period' 30 sec to 15min is a huge increase. So you would have to work up slowly to a 15 min run. There's a lot of programs available online to help you with that (C25K for exemple).0
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NikolaosKey wrote: »Concrete. Its harder than treadmill, so the impact is harder. Try some grass or dirt road next or go to a stadium. And take it easy when running outdoors. Its harder but less boring and I prefer it. Put some ice on those knees
I don't actually run outdoors though.. maybe I am misunderstanding? Are you telling me to go run outdoors?0 -
jbirtch1995 wrote: »Sometimes knee problems come from bad form. If it keeps up make an appointment with a physiotherapist and they'll help.
I figured it was probably my form
It's just weird to me that it hurts when I jog, but not when I am sprinting0 -
Could be a number of things. Was the total running session longer than normal? My issue with knee pain is with IT band tightness. Put your hand on the outside of your knee and see if there's something that feels like it's clicking or slipping as the knee flexes. If you're super flexible then this is likely not the issue. Another thing to try on a steady jog is counting right footed steps. You want to aim for around 180 steps / minute or about 90 right footed steps. Anything above 75/80 is okay. If you're getting less than that, you're likely getting too much vertical in your stride. It wastes energy but also creates more impact. Lastly, consider a shoe fitting if you haven't before. Go to a good running store and they should watch your stride and help fit you with something based on whether you pronate, supinate, etc.0
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I don't actually run outdoors though.. maybe I am misunderstanding? Are you telling me to go run outdoors?[/quote]
Excuse me I got it wrong. I thought you ran outdoor when you used to run on a treadmill.
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DrifterBear wrote: »Could be a number of things. Was the total running session longer than normal? My issue with knee pain is with IT band tightness. Put your hand on the outside of your knee and see if there's something that feels like it's clicking or slipping as the knee flexes. If you're super flexible then this is likely not the issue. Another thing to try on a steady jog is counting right footed steps. You want to aim for around 180 steps / minute or about 90 right footed steps. Anything above 75/80 is okay. If you're getting less than that, you're likely getting too much vertical in your stride. It wastes energy but also creates more impact. Lastly, consider a shoe fitting if you haven't before. Go to a good running store and they should watch your stride and help fit you with something based on whether you pronate, supinate, etc.
Usually, when I am doing intervals, I am doing about 15 min of running total. But I am running a lot faster. I just decided to jog 15 minutes straight this time.. come to think of it, I did feel super awkward running that slow, so I wonder if I was just off because of that? I think I may need to up the pace0 -
Running is such a high risk activity if you're unfit or heavier than what's good for the joints.
Can you find something else?0 -
Springfield1970 wrote: »Running is such a high risk activity if you're unfit or heavier than what's good for the joints.
Can you find something else?
Lol I am by no means unfit, or heavy. I am used to running. I just was having some knee pain while jogging. I don't think being 118 is too heavy for my joints
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Sounds like a case of Runner's Knee. It's usually caused by poor form starting at the hip/core. While you may have felt like you had the energy to keep going, your core area might not have been. Plus you are changing your stride/gait pretty significantly going from an 8 to a 5.5. Both of those probably factored into it. Personally I think my form is trash on the treadmill and only use it when it's an absolute must (like I need to get miles in when it's sub zero temperatures outside). I see you said you don't run outside. I would suggest making the switch. If the shoe fitting didn't help, try focusing on some hip exercises and maybe look into a patella band for under your knee.0
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Sounds like a case of Runner's Knee. It's usually caused by poor form starting at the hip/core. While you may have felt like you had the energy to keep going, your core area might not have been. Plus you are changing your stride/gait pretty significantly going from an 8 to a 5.5. Both of those probably factored into it. Personally I think my form is trash on the treadmill and only use it when it's an absolute must (like I need to get miles in when it's sub zero temperatures outside). I see you said you don't run outside. I would suggest making the switch. If the shoe fitting didn't help, try focusing on some hip exercises and maybe look into a patella band for under your knee.
Great advice! Thank you
I didn't think about the fact that my body may not have really had the energy to keep going. I use the treadmill as a convenience thing, since I can do my entire workout in one place. With 3 kids, it's hard to get out and go running outdoors. But I will certainly try to give it a shot! 0 -
Sounds like Runner's Knee. I got that years back when I was running a bunch. There were two culprits: not resting enough between sessions, and over-striding. Taking smaller more frequent steps was a huge change, as well as taking a day off between running sessions.
Also, my IT Bands were soooo tight! I got a foam roller and it was AMAZEBALLS! It would hurt, but feel so much better! Also good for my hammies, quads, calves, etc.0 -
Springfield1970 wrote: »Running is such a high risk activity if you're unfit or heavier than what's good for the joints.
Can you find something else?
Lol I am by no means unfit, or heavy. I am used to running. I just was having some knee pain while jogging. I don't think being 118 is too heavy for my joints
Apologies, let me rephrase. If you aren't used to running and you're inexperienced with form, and noticing injuries quickly, it may be a good idea to get these issues sorted out properly before you do yourself some long term damage.
I love running, but I think there are better things to do for fitness, and if your knees are already playing up it may be worth re assessing.
Don't forget to avoid upping intensity and volume at the same time.
Try and activate glutes, and look up foot strike.
Get your shoes sorted out.
Good luck.
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Don't pay much attention to what you read on the internet until you go see a professional about what the problem could be. There are too many potential problems of what it could be - you don't want to waste your time trying to fix runner's knee when it was really ITB syndrome. Trust me on this!0
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Will_Run_for_Food wrote: »Don't pay much attention to what you read on the internet until you go see a professional about what the problem could be. There are too many potential problems of what it could be - you don't want to waste your time trying to fix runner's knee when it was really ITB syndrome. Trust me on this!
True. But the advice that the OP might not have built up enough strength in muscles/tendons or might be overstriding are perfectly reasonable. Also avoid the "too much too soon" syndrome. Your cardiovascular system will catch up a lot quicker than muscles/tendons, that's the problem most new runners have.0 -
Springfield1970 wrote: »Running is such a high risk activity if you're unfit or heavier than what's good for the joints.
Can you find something else?
Why is it that only in running threads do we have people this kind of nonsensical scaremongering.
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blues4miles wrote: »Will_Run_for_Food wrote: »Don't pay much attention to what you read on the internet until you go see a professional about what the problem could be. There are too many potential problems of what it could be - you don't want to waste your time trying to fix runner's knee when it was really ITB syndrome. Trust me on this!
True. But the advice that the OP might not have built up enough strength in muscles/tendons or might be overstriding are perfectly reasonable. Also avoid the "too much too soon" syndrome. Your cardiovascular system will catch up a lot quicker than muscles/tendons, that's the problem most new runners have.
That makes sense.. I felt like I could keep running, but I stopped because it hurt. I think the Overstride makes sense too. I'll try focusing on smaller steps, maybe upping the pace and running for a shorter amount of time? Since I don't seem to have the pain when I run faster.. I never realized how much went in to running!0 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »Springfield1970 wrote: »Running is such a high risk activity if you're unfit or heavier than what's good for the joints.
Can you find something else?
Why is it that only in running threads do we have people this kind of nonsensical scaremongering.
Because apparently no one should be running unless you are a top notch athlete? Lol I love how it is immediately that I am unfit or too heavy..0 -
Usually, when I am doing intervals, I am doing about 15 min of running total. But I am running a lot faster. I just decided to jog 15 minutes straight this time.. come to think of it, I did feel super awkward running that slow, so I wonder if I was just off because of that? I think I may need to up the pace
So if you've gone from 6-7 minutes of running in a session to a total of c22 minutes of running you've significantly increased your training load in a single session. Couple that with poor form, as you've alluded to, then I'd suggest that a simple overuse injury is the issue rather than anything more esoteric like ITB Syndrome.
Rest it until it goes away, and if you fancy trying to run for longer then build up to it. Do three sets of five minutes with minute walk breaks, rather than one of 15.
It's not out of the question that your form when you're running faster isn't really helpful, if you're n ot used to running long then you're potentially overstriding or your upper body posture needs a bit of attention.
fwiw I'm still veering more towards too much change all at once. I did that myself over February when I went from 20miles per week to 40 miles over the course of a week.0 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »
Usually, when I am doing intervals, I am doing about 15 min of running total. But I am running a lot faster. I just decided to jog 15 minutes straight this time.. come to think of it, I did feel super awkward running that slow, so I wonder if I was just off because of that? I think I may need to up the pace
So if you've gone from 6-7 minutes of running in a session to a total of c22 minutes of running you've significantly increased your training load in a single session. Couple that with poor form, as you've alluded to, then I'd suggest that a simple overuse injury is the issue rather than anything more esoteric like ITB Syndrome.
Rest it until it goes away, and if you fancy trying to run for longer then build up to it. Do three sets of five minutes with minute walk breaks, rather than one of 15.
It's not out of the question that your form when you're running faster isn't really helpful, if you're n ot used to running long then you're potentially overstriding or your upper body posture needs a bit of attention.
Thank you I will try the shorter duration. I thought since I didn't have a problem with breathing or anything I could run a measly 15 minutes lol but apparently I still have some building up to do! 0 -
Depends on where exactly the pain is. . . IT is the most likely culprit, I agree.
When I have IT issues, it's a sign I need new shoes.
Little known tip: wall sits can help alleviate chronic IT associated pain. . .0 -
NikolaosKey wrote: »Concrete. Its harder than treadmill, so the impact is harder. Try some grass or dirt road next or go to a stadium. And take it easy when running outdoors. Its harder but less boring and I prefer it. Put some ice on those knees
I don't actually run outdoors though.. maybe I am misunderstanding? Are you telling me to go run outdoors?
I think that poster misunderstood your original post thinking you said you normally are on a treadmill but this time you weren't . . .
In any event the thing I've learned about running and knee/ankle/general joint pain is that knee (or other joint) pain is often the sign of pain, but not the source of pain. So if your hips aren't aligned because they're too tight or you're overpronating or something the pain comes out at the knees. The best bet (and it's helpful if you have benefits) is to go to physio . . . that is if you want to keep running. They can, based on your gait and other factors, narrow down why you're experiencing pain and then work with you to get that pain minimized.
Good luck, and happy running 0 -
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NikolaosKey wrote: »Concrete. Its harder than treadmill, so the impact is harder. Try some grass or dirt road next or go to a stadium. And take it easy when running outdoors. Its harder but less boring and I prefer it. Put some ice on those knees
I don't actually run outdoors though.. maybe I am misunderstanding? Are you telling me to go run outdoors?
It was confusing -- I thought you meant on the treadmill, but understand how it could have been read to mean you ran outside for 30 minutes. Sometimes when people are used to the treadmill they slam their feet down too hard for the concrete.0 -
brian_gunther wrote: »over-striding. Taking smaller more frequent steps was a huge change, as well as taking a day off between running sessions.
This was going to be my guess too.
Really, knee pain could be anything (and in women is very often really due to hip issues -- it was for me).
I'd suggest a few things: Work up to longer runs a bit more gradually. Form seems a likely culprit. What I find on the treadmill is it can be easy to mess up your form by running too fast for the speed (which you may have been doing if used to running faster intervals) and choking up too close to the front. Relax and run more easily (or speed up if you must, but learning to run easy is a good skill).
Another form thing is the overstriding, which I also think is easy to do on the treadmill (although I hurt my knee because of doing it outdoors). People think longer strides are faster (which they aren't if they are too long for your leg -- better to go shorter and quicker as it's smoother). In your case I can see the slower speed on a treadmill resulting in slow long strides. Just think about cadence when running and it might help.
If you have the opportunity the physio isn't a bad idea. As you can see, there are a million things it could be.0 -
It's been mentioned a few times on this thread, but it could be a combination of things. I am currently dealing with "runner's knee" myself, which is ultimately due to a lack of stretching (and getting old). Your situation could be bad form, old shoes, the wrong type of shoe for your gate, IT band, week glutes and hip flexors (which I was surprised to hear for myself).
If you have tension bands, you can use them to strengthen your hip flexors, but also work on your hamstrings and glute muscles. If you have a foam roller, use that on your IT bands as well.
This type of issue is more common than you think.
Good luck!0 -
Thanks everyone for your help!! I will put all of this knowledge to work!0
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I had knee pain about six months in when I started running longer distances at a time (as opposed to intervals on a treadmill like you've been doing). I went to PT and was told to strength my hip flexors (think clam shell exercise-I can't describe it but google it) and hip hikes. And stretching-running can really tighten up your muscles, so stretch, especially the hip flexors. I also went to a free "Good form running clinic" at my local running store-they talked about various aspects of running form to prevent injury, like cadence, foot strike, upper body positioning, arms, etc. If you want to do more of this kind of running, perhaps there are similar classes where you are?0
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