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Sugar addiction like drug abuse, study reveals
Replies
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rileysowner wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rileysowner wrote: »Pleasurable activities activate the pleasure centers of the brain. Drugs and eating sugar are pleasurable, which is why people do them.
So is listening to Mozart, watching a beautiful sunset, or getting a good backrub or a hug from a loved one. I would wager all of these things activate the pleasure circuits in the brain "similar to drugs of abuse." Don't know why this is even surprising or even that interesting.
Unfortunately there are not entire industries, vending machines or supermarket aisles dedicated to selling back rubs, hugs, kittens or winning bingo.
So we should stop selling food?
It would probably reduce obesity.
Unintended consequences might be a kitten, however.
Was this one of those MFP replacements for what they deem inappropriate words? I saw that yesterday and had some laughs searching for it in posts. Some of the situations it makes it worse than if the original word was left in.
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rileysowner wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rileysowner wrote: »Pleasurable activities activate the pleasure centers of the brain. Drugs and eating sugar are pleasurable, which is why people do them.
So is listening to Mozart, watching a beautiful sunset, or getting a good backrub or a hug from a loved one. I would wager all of these things activate the pleasure circuits in the brain "similar to drugs of abuse." Don't know why this is even surprising or even that interesting.
Unfortunately there are not entire industries, vending machines or supermarket aisles dedicated to selling back rubs, hugs, kittens or winning bingo.
So we should stop selling food?
It would probably reduce obesity.
Unintended consequences might be a kitten, however.
Was this one of those MFP replacements for what they deem inappropriate words? I saw that yesterday and had some laughs searching for it in posts. Some of the situations it makes it worse than if the original word was left in.
Heh, I actually just used it as a euphemism, because of the filter.
The worst was the "big kitten diet" or something like that.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Here is the actual study:
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0150270
Thanks for the link to the actual scientific study. While I know in my case my 40 years of craving for carbs faded in a few weeks after I stopped eating sugar and all form of grains but it would still be nice to know why.
But fat has the same effect on the brain, basically. Not surprising, as it's pleasurable too. (Fat+carbs or fat+salt seem to have the strongest effects.)
Yeah, I'm all about fat+salt. I can eat a bite-size Milky Way, or a small serving of ice cream and be happy. But chips, fries, bacon, cheese I could eat until I puke. I love lobster because of the dish of melted salted-butter.
Now I'm hungry...
I'm the complete opposite. I go years without eating fatty salty foods like chips, fries, bacon, cheese, and am not even the slightest bit tempted to eat them (and my boyfriend keeps them all in the house). But chocolate and sugar = constant cravings and I could eat them till I puked every day. Wonder what the science is behind that.0 -
I have been wondering whether people who believe themselves to be "sugar addicts" are actually suffering from binge eating disorder. If no irrationally high consumption is occurring, would someone still think of it as an addiction?3
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rileysowner wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rileysowner wrote: »Pleasurable activities activate the pleasure centers of the brain. Drugs and eating sugar are pleasurable, which is why people do them.
So is listening to Mozart, watching a beautiful sunset, or getting a good backrub or a hug from a loved one. I would wager all of these things activate the pleasure circuits in the brain "similar to drugs of abuse." Don't know why this is even surprising or even that interesting.
Unfortunately there are not entire industries, vending machines or supermarket aisles dedicated to selling back rubs, hugs, kittens or winning bingo.
So we should stop selling food?
It would probably reduce obesity.
Unintended consequences might be a kitten, however.
Was this one of those MFP replacements for what they deem inappropriate words? I saw that yesterday and had some laughs searching for it in posts. Some of the situations it makes it worse than if the original word was left in.
The new and improved prohibited words filter has ** around the kitten.0 -
Or is all food potentially addictive?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22641965
Is it the food that stimulates dopamine release like heroin, or is it the heroin that stimulates dopamine release like food (with the food-dopamine release being a survival mechanism).
My response to this is.....
Take sugar away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
Take heroin away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
I will hypothesize that one of those subgroups is much more likely to need to be hospitalized due to the medical complications of physical detox.
If you have never watched someone in active withdrawal from heroin, please consider yourself lucky.
My response is...
I've had substance abuse issues which I'm not going to cop to here and the food cravings I used to get before I reduced carbs felt exactly the same.6 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Or is all food potentially addictive?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22641965
Is it the food that stimulates dopamine release like heroin, or is it the heroin that stimulates dopamine release like food (with the food-dopamine release being a survival mechanism).
My response to this is.....
Take sugar away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
Take heroin away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
I will hypothesize that one of those subgroups is much more likely to need to be hospitalized due to the medical complications of physical detox.
If you have never watched someone in active withdrawal from heroin, please consider yourself lucky.
My response is...
I've had substance abuse issues which I'm not going to cop to here and the food cravings I used to get before I reduced carbs felt exactly the same.
I have also had substance abuse issues, and have never once had a food cravings that was anything near what I went through with my substances of choice. Not even close.6 -
ClosetBayesian wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »Or is all food potentially addictive?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22641965
Is it the food that stimulates dopamine release like heroin, or is it the heroin that stimulates dopamine release like food (with the food-dopamine release being a survival mechanism).
My response to this is.....
Take sugar away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
Take heroin away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
I will hypothesize that one of those subgroups is much more likely to need to be hospitalized due to the medical complications of physical detox.
If you have never watched someone in active withdrawal from heroin, please consider yourself lucky.
My response is...
I've had substance abuse issues which I'm not going to cop to here and the food cravings I used to get before I reduced carbs felt exactly the same.
I have also had substance abuse issues, and have never once had a food cravings that was anything near what I went through with my substances of choice. Not even close.
Ditto this. I would rather kill myself then go through that hell again...2 -
Christine_72 wrote: »ClosetBayesian wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »Or is all food potentially addictive?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22641965
Is it the food that stimulates dopamine release like heroin, or is it the heroin that stimulates dopamine release like food (with the food-dopamine release being a survival mechanism).
My response to this is.....
Take sugar away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
Take heroin away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
I will hypothesize that one of those subgroups is much more likely to need to be hospitalized due to the medical complications of physical detox.
If you have never watched someone in active withdrawal from heroin, please consider yourself lucky.
My response is...
I've had substance abuse issues which I'm not going to cop to here and the food cravings I used to get before I reduced carbs felt exactly the same.
I have also had substance abuse issues, and have never once had a food cravings that was anything near what I went through with my substances of choice. Not even close.
Ditto this. I would rather kill myself then go through that hell again...
My experience as well.1 -
ClosetBayesian wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »Or is all food potentially addictive?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22641965
Is it the food that stimulates dopamine release like heroin, or is it the heroin that stimulates dopamine release like food (with the food-dopamine release being a survival mechanism).
My response to this is.....
Take sugar away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
Take heroin away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
I will hypothesize that one of those subgroups is much more likely to need to be hospitalized due to the medical complications of physical detox.
If you have never watched someone in active withdrawal from heroin, please consider yourself lucky.
My response is...
I've had substance abuse issues which I'm not going to cop to here and the food cravings I used to get before I reduced carbs felt exactly the same.
I have also had substance abuse issues, and have never once had a food cravings that was anything near what I went through with my substances of choice. Not even close.
Adding on. The two feelings, for me at least, are on entirely different planes.2 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/13/sugar-addiction-like-drug-abuse-study-reveals/
Is the science strong enough to settle this debate one day?
Why does it matter? Even if it were proven true beyond a shadow of a doubt, what should/could we as a general population do about it? We are not going to make sugar illegal. It's a personal problem that must be dealt with personally. I doubt having the addiction publicly validated will make the struggle any easier.5 -
What animal in life looks to get high on drugs rather then look to just eat? Only that I can think of. Of COURSE the rats went for the sugar.............it's food. That's the NORMAL reaction of any animal.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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rileysowner wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rileysowner wrote: »Pleasurable activities activate the pleasure centers of the brain. Drugs and eating sugar are pleasurable, which is why people do them.
So is listening to Mozart, watching a beautiful sunset, or getting a good backrub or a hug from a loved one. I would wager all of these things activate the pleasure circuits in the brain "similar to drugs of abuse." Don't know why this is even surprising or even that interesting.
Unfortunately there are not entire industries, vending machines or supermarket aisles dedicated to selling back rubs, hugs, kittens or winning bingo.
So we should stop selling food?
It would probably reduce obesity.
Unintended consequences might be a kitten, however.
Was this one of those MFP replacements for what they deem inappropriate words? I saw that yesterday and had some laughs searching for it in posts. Some of the situations it makes it worse than if the original word was left in.
Very true. The first time I saw it a word that could mean kitten or a female body part would have fit the sentence perfectly. I thought the user had typed kitten on purpose to prevent getting the word removed.0 -
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/13/sugar-addiction-like-drug-abuse-study-reveals/
Is the science strong enough to settle this debate one day?
Why does it matter? Even if it were proven true beyond a shadow of a doubt, what should/could we as a general population do about it? We are not going to make sugar illegal. It's a personal problem that must be dealt with personally. I doubt having the addiction publicly validated will make the struggle any easier.
I agree, and the same is true coming from the opposite perspective. Even if the substance is not found to be definitively addictive, it does not mean that the behavior of eating it can't become addictive in and of itself. In either case much of the treatment will be the same. If one feels they are addicted, they can recover from the addiction using similar methodologies as employed to address other addictions.0 -
What animal in life looks to get high on drugs rather then look to just eat? Only that I can think of. Of COURSE the rats went for the sugar.............it's food. That's the NORMAL reaction of any animal.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
These monkeys like to drink alcohol
https://youtu.be/pSm7BcQHWXk 0 -
Christine_72 wrote: »ClosetBayesian wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »Or is all food potentially addictive?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22641965
Is it the food that stimulates dopamine release like heroin, or is it the heroin that stimulates dopamine release like food (with the food-dopamine release being a survival mechanism).
My response to this is.....
Take sugar away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
Take heroin away from someone who has been taking moderate amounts of it daily. Observe.
I will hypothesize that one of those subgroups is much more likely to need to be hospitalized due to the medical complications of physical detox.
If you have never watched someone in active withdrawal from heroin, please consider yourself lucky.
My response is...
I've had substance abuse issues which I'm not going to cop to here and the food cravings I used to get before I reduced carbs felt exactly the same.
I have also had substance abuse issues, and have never once had a food cravings that was anything near what I went through with my substances of choice. Not even close.
Ditto this. I would rather kill myself then go through that hell again...
Spent months not sleeping coming down from legal benzos. Somehow sugar doesn't have the ability to keep me up all night long for one day let alone 90.1 -
What animal in life looks to get high on drugs rather then look to just eat? Only that I can think of. Of COURSE the rats went for the sugar.............it's food. That's the NORMAL reaction of any animal.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
These monkeys like to drink alcoholhttps://youtu.be/pSm7BcQHWXk
Alcohol has calories additionally to being a drug.
Cocaine doesn't as far as I'm aware. Unless your dealer has been cheating you with flour.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/13/sugar-addiction-like-drug-abuse-study-reveals/
Is the science strong enough to settle this debate one day?
Why does it matter? Even if it were proven true beyond a shadow of a doubt, what should/could we as a general population do about it? We are not going to make sugar illegal. It's a personal problem that must be dealt with personally. I doubt having the addiction publicly validated will make the struggle any easier.
It matters here because it's hard to talk about when most of the conversations about it turn to "yes it is" "not it is not".
People need to do whatever works for them to solve their issues with overeating sugary foods. It really doesn't matter whether it is addictive or not to solve it. People here who say it is addictive have been successful and people who say it isn't addictive have been successful. That tells me it doesn't matter in the grand scheme.1 -
Pleasurable activities activate the pleasure centers of the brain. Drugs and eating sugar are pleasurable, which is why people do them.
So is listening to Mozart, watching a beautiful sunset, or getting a good backrub or a hug from a loved one. I would wager all of these things activate the pleasure circuits in the brain "similar to drugs of abuse." Don't know why this is even surprising or even that interesting.
Unfortunately there are not entire industries, vending machines or supermarket aisles dedicated to selling back rubs, hugs, kittens or winning bingo.
Have you been to Vegas? They'd supply all of that, and probably only raise an eyebrow at the kittens.
You obviously haven't been to Vegas because there is a HUGE population of animal rights activists here that would have *kitten* fits to find kittens in vending machines.
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lithezebra wrote: »
I have no problem with animal studies. They are an absolute necessity. Where would get that idea? I have a problem with GoogleU researchers who misrepresent animal studies to suit their ideology. I have a problem with animal studies being extrapolated to humans.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »What animal in life looks to get high on drugs rather then look to just eat? Only that I can think of. Of COURSE the rats went for the sugar.............it's food. That's the NORMAL reaction of any animal.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
These monkeys like to drink alcoholhttps://youtu.be/pSm7BcQHWXk
Alcohol has calories additionally to being a drug.
Cocaine doesn't as far as I'm aware. Unless your dealer has been cheating you with flour.
So THAT'S why cocaine is addictive. It's dem carbz.1 -
FunkyTobias wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »What animal in life looks to get high on drugs rather then look to just eat? Only that I can think of. Of COURSE the rats went for the sugar.............it's food. That's the NORMAL reaction of any animal.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
These monkeys like to drink alcoholhttps://youtu.be/pSm7BcQHWXk
Alcohol has calories additionally to being a drug.
Cocaine doesn't as far as I'm aware. Unless your dealer has been cheating you with flour.
So THAT'S why cocaine is addictive. It's dem carbz.
That explains a lot. <nods>0 -
http://ca.askmen.com/sports/foodcourt/food-addiction.html
In a 2012 study in Nature Reviews, the authors concluded that although highly palatable food may have addictive-like properties, it does not meet all the criteria of an addictive substance. “The vast majority of overweight individuals have not shown a convincing behavioral or neurobiological profile that resembles addiction,” the authors wrote.
Just because something is pleasurable, like eating sugar or fat, doesn’t mean you can develop an addiction to it.
Despite efforts by some to have food addiction included, the fifth edition of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) did not classify “food” as an addiction. According to Nicole Avena, a research neuroscientist in the fields of diet and addiction at the University of Florida College of Medicine, even though highly palatable food affects the same brain mechanisms that addictive drugs do, there is not enough evidence to warrant a full psychiatric diagnosis for food addiction. “There are a lot of differences between food and drugs,” Avena told me.
“It’s a matter of degree and vulnerability,” said Caroline Davis, a professor at York University in Toronto specializing in the psychobiology of obesity. “When it comes to food, I think it’s a small population that is truly addicted ... ‘Food addiction’ isn’t a good term.”
And now we have a brand new study out of the University of Edinburgh that puts another nail in the coffin of so-called sugar addiction, and supports the research for binge-eating disorder.
You can be addicted to eating, the study asserts, but not to food. Wait, what? What this means is, it is possible (although quite rare) to have a behavioral disorder — the act of insatiable eating, which is part of the larger family of eating disorders — but you can’t develop an addiction to a certain food type.3 -
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[I know this is an old thread but I am loathe to start another sugar thread, so...]
All the sugar/drug/addiction threads have plenty of (very good) subjective reasoning why sugar should not be classed as a drug, but this morning I went looking for something a little more objective. After doing some refresher reading, I have the answer.
Does sugar impact the reward system? Yes. As do all rewarding things, like petting kittens, pursuing a hobby, exercise, etc. and so on. AND drugs.
The more important question is HOW does it impact the reward system.
Foods and every other "healthful" thing that your body wants you to repeat affect the reward system in the "normal" way, with dopamine being released, crossing the synapse, attaching to receptors and sending the reward signal. The transporters re-absorb excess dopamine from the synapse.
Here's where cocaine, specifically, is a whole different animal: It BLOCKS the re-uptake of excess dopamine. This creates the intense euphoria of the high, and then later the crash as the brain attempts to equalize. Long-term use leads to structural changes in the system. Normally pleasurable things are no longer so, and the drug becomes necessary to even feel kinda-sorta "normal." None of this applies to sugar, or any food for that matter.
Long story short: Sugar is just another passenger on the reward system. Drugs hijack the system, mash the accelerator down, and drive it off a cliff.
My opinion is that sugar/food "addictions" are symptomatic of something like depression, trauma, poor self-discipline, or something else. And in that sense at least, it does share some things in common with drug abuse and alcoholism, psychologically anyway.
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/cocaine/how-does-cocaine-produce-its-effects
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Why don't the "sugar is addictive" see the rat study for proof folks ever point to the rat study that bacon & fat is addictive?
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/addicted-to-fat-eating/
Is it a different type of study? Did they handle it different than the sugar study?3 -
leanjogreen18 wrote: »Why don't the "sugar is addictive" see the rat study for proof folks ever point to the rat study that bacon & fat is addictive?
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/addicted-to-fat-eating/
Is it a different type of study? Did they handle it different than the sugar study?
Doesn't fit their agenda. The hallmark of junk scientists is "If the facts don't fit the theory, the facts must be discarded."8 -
leanjogreen18 wrote: »Why don't the "sugar is addictive" see the rat study for proof folks ever point to the rat study that bacon & fat is addictive?
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/addicted-to-fat-eating/
Is it a different type of study? Did they handle it different than the sugar study?
Same reason most conveniently ignore the fact that the foods that people feel they are "addicted" to are largely a hyperpalatable combination of sugar + fat, not just exclusively sugar. But acknowledging that fat is part of the problem would be an issue for many who lean into a LCHF way of eating as a way to address their "sugar addiction".
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