Are fat people just lazy and make excuses?

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  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
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    oph296 wrote: »
    False. Check Ted talk from Peter Attia

    does he propose it's because of carbohydrates and insulin?

  • oph296
    oph296 Posts: 12 Member
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    SideSteel wrote: »
    oph296 wrote: »
    False. Check Ted talk from Peter Attia

    does he propose it's because of carbohydrates and insulin?

    Yes, with competent explanation. Old formula calories in calories out doesn't explain everything today.
    Another one I like https://youtu.be/dBnniua6-oM
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    edited May 2016
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    oph296 wrote: »
    SideSteel wrote: »
    oph296 wrote: »
    False. Check Ted talk from Peter Attia

    does he propose it's because of carbohydrates and insulin?

    Yes, with competent explanation. Old formula calories in calories out doesn't explain everything today.
    Another one I like https://youtu.be/dBnniua6-oM

    While I absolutely hate the idea that "fat people must just be lazy", I disagree with Attia and Lustig.

    Alan Aragon basically destroyed Lustig and Taubes (I mention him because he's one of the main promoters of the insulin hypothesis, like Attia), and the recent study that Taubes partially funded built a pretty strong case against the insulin hypothesis (Krieger and Guyenet have also done a great job dismantling the insulin hypothesis).

    If you have any interest in reading those rebuttals let me know and I'll post them.

  • oph296
    oph296 Posts: 12 Member
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    Sure, send me the links, I'll check them.
    Thank you!
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
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    oph296 wrote: »
    Sure, send me the links, I'll check them.
    Thank you!

    Regarding Lustig: http://www.alanaragonblog.com/2010/01/29/the-bitter-truth-about-fructose-alarmism/
    Regarding the insulin hypothesis of obesity:
    weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=319
    http://weightology.net/gary-taubes/good-calories-bad-calories-the-mythology-of-obesity-or-the-mythology-of-gary-taubes.html/
    http://weightology.net/gary-taubes/gary-taubes-bad-calories-or-bad-research.html/
    http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/09/hyperinsulinemia-cause-or-effect-of.html

    And while the following is a youtube video it's very informative. The person interviewing is Dr Yoni Freedhoff, an obesity researcher, and he's interviewing Kevin Hall who was one of the researchers in a very well designed study funded in part by Taubes to test the insulin hypothesis. The video is an explanation of the study and it's findings:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atfBiEsxG5o
  • ALG775
    ALG775 Posts: 246 Member
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    DearestWinter wrote: »
    No. That is, not any more lazy than the general population. You may have some people who just aren't interested in losing weight but are productive in other areas of life. I wouldn't call them lazy. Then there are some people who are trying to lose weight but haven't figured out their formula to do so. (Hint: it's CICO, but we've all got to identify the techniques that work for us).

    It's easy for people to look back after they succeed and say "well, obviously it was foolish to eat infinite low-fat foods" or "gosh, I can't believe I just let all of those midnight snack runs slide", thus "people who don't know everything I know now must be lazy". But before someone has that knowledge they can feel that they are doing everything possible and I don't think that's lazy.

    I have seen so many people (on the forums and in real life) try to implement some 1,000 calorie restrictive "no gluten, no sugar, low carb, only eat red foods on Wednesdays, etc." diet. They go out to the store and spend a fortune on groceries. They come home and they spend hours prepping snacks and making meals. They wake up at 4am each day to go on a 5 mile run. They eat their pitiful and unsatisfying food. They get through an entire week (or two or a month) and aren't seeing the 5 lbs/week loss they were guaranteed. They're starving and frustrated and angry with themselves. They quit. I don't think that's remotely lazy. I'm shocked at their stamina in making it through 4 hours of that. Just thinking about some of the things people do makes me want to take a nap.

    They just haven't figured out what works for them. For some people it takes time to figure out what will really work. And there's so much information and misinformation that even contemplating weight loss is a task in itself. Then there's the trial and error when you put it into practice.

    I'm not sure why formerly fat people try to diminish their own efforts by pointing to overweight/obese people and saying "they're just lazy". Many of us had to go through a mental process to get to the point where we could start losing weight. That takes effort.

    Love this.
  • miz_ppyn
    miz_ppyn Posts: 118 Member
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    I will admit i am fat. Fat because i ate to much of my mums yum food. Fat because of a medical condition. But not from been lazy. It is true some get fat from laziness but slim people can be just as lazy if not lazier..its ashame lots of society still think your lazy if your fat.
  • LINIA
    LINIA Posts: 1,046 Member
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    It is often true that people don't see themselves as obese or overweight - so perhaps you might see a "fat" person but that person sees a " curvy" person or " just a few pounds to lose ".

    We have made a major point of Fat Acceptance & once we crossed that threshold , it's a different world. Walmart is selling clothing in size 4x & size 5x --- these ppl aren't considered FAT but just a little bigger.

    There was a time when things were different but now being overweight is socially acceptable.

    Lazy--- I'm not sure where that fits in this equation.
  • Therealobi1
    Therealobi1 Posts: 3,261 Member
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    Francl27 wrote: »
    I don't know, has it occurred to people that maybe those fat people just don't care enough to bother? It's pretty presumptuous to assume that they are lazy and are making excuses... They're not making any excuses if they're happy the way they are, because there are no excuses to make - they just don't care.

    It's presumptuous to assume that just because we care about our weight, others should too. I don't know about you, but when people think I'm 'making excuses' not to do something I just don't want to do, I find it rude. I'm not making any excuse, I just don't want to do it, period.

    I do see where you are coming from, but sometimes the same people ranting that things are not going the way they want it to, are the same people who are saying they dont want to do this or that. SOmetimes people do have to buckle up and get on with it. I see so many posts about people moaning about exercise, either they should do it or not do it. Doesn't have to take all day.
  • Therealobi1
    Therealobi1 Posts: 3,261 Member
    edited May 2016
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    I was fat and got comfortable being fat. I was lazy and for someone who works from home had plenty of opportunities to do so but didnt know any other way until I joined MFP. I thought the only way was joining the gym. Also joining MFP made me see that losing weight doesnt have to be tortue.
  • vera_sweet
    vera_sweet Posts: 7 Member
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    I can't speak for anyone but myself so this is purely my take on it. Also, I've never been "fat" (not yet anyway). I've always been thin, ate whatever I wanted (fantastic for my emotional eating trait), and definitely did not want to exercise because I thought I was gonna get big like Arnold. I also hated sweating. It smells, it's uncomfortable, and it just sucks. Was I lazy? Maybe in terms of exercise and discipline, but I was definitely more socially active back then.

    And then, I hit my mid-20s and I started to jiggle where I've never jiggled before. Nothing in my life has changed except I got a little older and I had to start paying bills.

    The funny thing is, I was made fun of for being too skinny and again when I became chubby around the waist. Women commented on my body when I was skinny. Most weren't nice comments even though it was made to sound like a joke. Some of them even dropped a plateful of food in front of me when I'm at a social event (FYI, yes, that is rude, especially for people I only consider acquaintances). Even if it's really just a joke, no one is laughing because it's funny. If anyone laughed, it's because they felt better for making me feel uncomfortable. It's shaming me for someone else's body image issues.

    When I got a little thick around my arms, waist, and thighs --- men commented on my body. I still absolutely hate this one jerk who said, "Oh wow! You got big!" and then tried to take it back with, "No, it looks good on you!" which I was told was probably genuine but I don't give a flying pho.... But it did send me into a wild chase of "losing the thickness". The thing about that is I actually started doing a more well rounded fitness routine of cardio and weights, my butt and thighs got bigger. My arms got a little more meat. I don't know why, but my core also got thicker although not chubby or jiggly. I was definitely not lazy and in fact, worked really hard to feel so strong (physically). And so I stopped doing weights and only did cardio. Successfully atrophied my muscles and feel weak as hell.

    Moral of the story, I think people should focus on themselves instead of focusing on others' appearances (or in my case, stop caring about what people say or think because who the hell are they to me anyway). There's a lot more to a person than the outside. I've been there, I thought sick and fat people were just so lazy and it's their fault. I mean, who else is there to blame, right? But... Being human is complicated for many of us. I'm constantly reminded of things that I don't like about myself, and when I think about it, I judge people to make me feel better about my own image, decisions, and beliefs. My expectations for myself is so tough, it's hard work, that I am pissed when other people don't live up to the same expectations for themselves. Because dang it, I want to eat a dozen donuts too ;)
  • Seffell
    Seffell Posts: 2,222 Member
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    I never thought fat people are lazy. All fat people I know I quite active in fact. I've always thought they were gluttonous though.
    I, on the other hand, am not fat per se (I'm in a healthy BMI range) but I have gained the weight I'm trying to lose at least partially due to laziness. I am quite lazy and I'm trying to change that now. MFP is helping me a lot (I mean the social group of MFP). I'm quite motivated in fact :)
  • LivingtheLeanDream
    LivingtheLeanDream Posts: 13,342 Member
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    I was fat once upon a time and yes, I was lazy. Does it apply to all who are overweight? I can't answer that, I just know for me it was true.

    But heck I'm proof anyone can change, been in maintenance 3+ years and average 20k steps a day. Yep, noone could say I am lazy any more :smiley:
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,268 Member
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    afatpersonwholikesfood wrote: »
    SezxyStef wrote: »
    so I read the rest of the responses and mostly yes...people here who were fat or are currently losing admit it we were lazy and made excuses.

    Lazy being not making the changes required to lose the weight.

    You can work 60-80 hours a week and be lazy
    You can have an immaculate house and be lazy

    Lazy is defined as "unwilling to work or use energy."...

    losing weight requires energy put forth into that area.


    Imagine investing a great deal of time, money, blood, sweat, and tears into a business. You do well and feel on top of the world. You're the most popular place in town for awhile. Time passes, and for reasons that you won't understand until later, that business slowly goes under.

    So, you build again a few years later. Once again, your business reaches a certain status. Maybe you do too well. Maybe you take things for granted. Maybe you blow too much corporate money on blow. For reasons that you somewhat understand, it collapses.

    A few more years pass, and you invest everything that's left. You're wildly successful for a time. You make more money than you ever have despite having more debts than you ever had. A mix of old and new problems surface, and in your frustration, before the business has a chance to properly fail, you set fire to the place in a moment of insanity. Now you're deeper in debt than ever.

    Even your closest friends and family tell you that perhaps you just aren't cut out to be a business owner. They look at you differently. They're a bit horrified by the torching of the last business though most of them have the good sense not to say so. For the first time, they accept you as a penniless fry cook at your local burger joint instead of urging you to follow your dreams - both a relief and a source of great sadness.

    You have no faith in your ability to maintain a business beyond the 2-year mark. Even if you did, you've long since used up all your capital. You spend the next 7 years just being. Things, outside of not being a business owner, actually go amazingly well. Still, you have an insane amount of debt. It weighs on you every second of every day. You know it's going to bury you, but your job at the local burger joint isn't going to cover it.

    It's okay until it's not okay. Secretly, with almost no hope and just a humble desire to make a small dent in that debt, with money that you are quite convinced you will never see again, you begin to build a 4th business. Not enough time has passed to determine whether this business will make it for the rest of your life. You keep going each day, but you're still scared that a future version of you will burn everything to the ground. You do have a kind of grim determination that you've never had before, but you're certainly not going to climb onto any high horses.

    Does "lazy" fit?

    Just for some perspective since I realize that everyone is on MFP for different reasons and from different fitness/BMI backgrounds.

    @afatpersonwholikesfood not sure what this story has to do with what I said. It''s not about weight it's about a persons ability to be success at being a business owner.
  • lakshva
    lakshva Posts: 44 Member
    edited May 2016
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    I gained 14 kg after 8 years of desk job. So I had what 100 Cal extra everyday?
    But I consider myself lazy
    1) For not discovering MFP earlier
    2) For making up excuses and not stopping Wight gain when I gained 5kg or 10 kg
    3) For giving up on gym after 2 months. If only I had stuck with I for bit more longer I would have been wiser earlier
    4) For not gathering enough mental strength when I ate for fun
    But then all these feelings are retrospective.

    So when I see others making same mistake I feel they are heading the lazy road!
    All of it is just our own perspective!
  • critterbug15
    critterbug15 Posts: 55 Member
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    SideSteel wrote: »
    oph296 wrote: »
    Sure, send me the links, I'll check them.
    Thank you!

    Regarding Lustig: http://www.alanaragonblog.com/2010/01/29/the-bitter-truth-about-fructose-alarmism/
    Regarding the insulin hypothesis of obesity:
    weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=319
    http://weightology.net/gary-taubes/good-calories-bad-calories-the-mythology-of-obesity-or-the-mythology-of-gary-taubes.html/
    http://weightology.net/gary-taubes/gary-taubes-bad-calories-or-bad-research.html/
    http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/09/hyperinsulinemia-cause-or-effect-of.html

    And while the following is a youtube video it's very informative. The person interviewing is Dr Yoni Freedhoff, an obesity researcher, and he's interviewing Kevin Hall who was one of the researchers in a very well designed study funded in part by Taubes to test the insulin hypothesis. The video is an explanation of the study and it's findings:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atfBiEsxG5o

    I also quoted Attia earlier. His writing about insulin et al. is very clear and detailed. At any rate, he took issue with Lustig's talk, as well. Rather than focusing on fructose alone, url="http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/sugar-101-how-harmful-is-sugar-part-i"]Attia here[/url suggests that glucose at excess levels call still be a problem, though glucose tolerance is better when fructose is absent. And there are studies that suggest that eating large amounts of fructose can spur the appetite. Will get links if you want. It makes sense that the system that drives this is rooted in insulin and leptin. Does this happen in everyone? No... and nowhere do I see insulinists suggesting that. Lyle McDonald - I see you like him, too - acknowledges that some can tolerate higher carbs and some can't (depending on insulin sensitivity). And some can't tolerate them for a period of time and then can later. Huge variability among individuals...

    Again, for me personally, CICO didn't work for 2 postpartum years. Given, it's a time of hormonal variation especially combined with nursing. I dropped the magical concept of macro percentage perfection about 8 years ago in favor of CICO while ensuring only that I got a base min. of protein every day (ok, maybe I've always subscribed to a protein importance... that's relatively undisputed by everyone I respect in the field) and allowed all other cals to come from wherever I wanted. But in this phase of my life, meeting a min protein intake and getting other cals from wherever I wanted as long as I maintained a deficit has absolutely not worked. I trained for a half marathon thinking there's no way my buddha belly could stick around at the 13th mile after all of that incinerating training (weights, too) and calorie restricting. And I tried to keep sugar in my diet. I tried so hard. But all I wanted was mooooar shooogaaaar. And resisting was Hard. And while my cardio was the best it had ever been and lifts were good, I dropped a total of between 3 and 6 pounds at varying times throughout the two years. Not something you post in BB Misc ("You're miscalculating your calories, bro"). Heh. But surriously, when I started a keto diet, I immediately started dropping weight as you'd expect based on the cals I was eating (so CICO math working again). I don't think that's necessary for everyone, but when the wheels of effort and enthusiasm are spinning without good results, you have to change something. Insanity is trying the same thing over and over despite the same results, right? I don't think everyone has to limit carbs or sugar to get results, but when you do, you do.

    My synthesis of what I've read concludes that carbs are not bad. Carbs are good. However, like protein and fat, carbs are good in moderate amounts and our bodies, after constant subjection to excess carbs, can lose their ability to process them as well as they are designed to, which calls for a time of carb restriction. This makes sense to me logically and resonates with my experience. And rather than Carbs being Bad in themselves, I think we have a Carb Processing problem in packaging. Carbs are available at such dense levels via pasta, bread, cake and all the delightful confections, such that it is way too easy to overeat them. There's plenty of carbs in vegetables, fruits, and legumes that we don't really *need* the processed sources. And they can cause problems for some bodies.



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