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U.S. FDA orders antibacterials removed from consumer soaps
NorthCascades
Posts: 10,968 Member
"Companies will no longer be able to market antibacterial washes with these ingredients because manufacturers did not demonstrate that the ingredients are both safe for long-term daily use and more effective than plain soap and water in preventing illness and the spread of certain infections," the FDA said in a statement.
http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/fda-orders-antibacterials-removed-consumer-soaps-n642036
http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/fda-orders-antibacterials-removed-consumer-soaps-n642036
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Good because some of the antibacterials are similar to pesticides, plus they contribute to the growth of super-bacteria like MRSA, which is rampant in US hospitals. The action of rubbing your hands together with plain soap is just as effective.4
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The FDA started asking about triclosan in 1978. Environmental groups and some members of Congress have been calling for limits on the use of triclosan. The Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) sued and the FDA agreed to do something about triclosan by 2016.
38 years! It's things like these that make people so leery of FDA approval of anything.7 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »The FDA started asking about triclosan in 1978. Environmental groups and some members of Congress have been calling for limits on the use of triclosan. The Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) sued and the FDA agreed to do something about triclosan by 2016.
38 years! It's things like these that make people so leery of FDA approval of anything.
FDA approval means nothing to me, i don't think it takes much to get that stamp of approval..PennWalker wrote: »Good because some of the antibacterials are similar to pesticides, plus they contribute to the growth of super-bacteria like MRSA, which is rampant in US hospitals. The action of rubbing your hands together with plain soap is just as effective.
Look at all the people that go into hospital but never make it out due to picking up deadly infections in there. Hospitals would have to be the number 1 user of antibacterials.4 -
Great!
Now if only we could stop doctors from prescribing antibiotics for the common cold...13 -
This is primarily response to anti-chemical activist pressure. The "antibacterial" label when triclosan was added was pure marketing. The REAL purpose is as an antimycotic. The stuff prevents molds from growing in consumer products, and banning the entire class of compounds will have the direct effect of significantly reducing shelf life.6
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As long as they dont get rid of hibiclens and such medicinal wound cleaners we are good. I am on antibiotics for a skin infection and need this stuff to make sure i dont infect anyone else.1
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I don't know about other healthcare systems, but the one I work for has forbidden their use by nurses, etc, for years.
The strictly alcohol/antibacterial cleansers fail to get your hands clean, leaving foreign material to later get into wounds, eyes, etc.
The soaps with antibacterials do the job with cleaning, but like the alcohol/antibacterial cleansers they're more likely to dry out your skin, compromising a primary immune barrier and leaving you more susceptible to infection. Probably not much of an issue with the general public, but when you're washing your hands a million times a day, it makes a difference.2 -
As always - FDA about 10-20 years behind the times.3
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It looks like this only effects its use in consumer antibacterial soaps, where it didn't have any merit anyway.This is primarily response to anti-chemical activist pressure. The "antibacterial" label when triclosan was added was pure marketing. The REAL purpose is as an antimycotic. The stuff prevents molds from growing in consumer products, and banning the entire class of compounds will have the direct effect of significantly reducing shelf life.1 -
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I'm glad to read this.1
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My dad was a PhD Chemist who worked in pharmaceuticals. He never allowed antibacterial soaps in our house, and was especially adamant against Triclosan in toothpaste and mouthwash, since even though you spit it out, a bit remains and gets absorbed or swallowed. He suspected it was even a carcinogen. He would periodically raid my sister and my bathroom when we were teenagers, and inspect all the labels on all the products and makeup, throwing out anything with ingredients he new to be harmful. I'm glad of this news.9
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The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.0
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You don't get penicillin or methicillin or other drug-related antibiotic resistance from triclosan exposure. These are entirely different compounds worth different mechanisms of action and different targets.2
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The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Not pointless.
Selective pressure is required for a high rate of retention for most of those genes over multiple generations. Remove the selective pressure and the percentage of bacteria resistant to that pressure should drop.3 -
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The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Not pointless.
Selective pressure is required for a high rate of retention for most of those genes over multiple generations. Remove the selective pressure and the percentage of bacteria resistant to that pressure should drop.
Perhaps for the environmental microbial populations at large; however for the clinically significant pathogens - pointless.0 -
The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Not pointless.
Selective pressure is required for a high rate of retention for most of those genes over multiple generations. Remove the selective pressure and the percentage of bacteria resistant to that pressure should drop.
Perhaps for the environmental microbial populations at large; however for the clinically significant pathogens - pointless.
If you mean eliminating the specific antibiotics in soap is basically meaningless for clinically significant pathogens, then I'd agree.
If you mean that eliminating any antibiotic is pointless to reduce populations of clinically significant pathogens once the resistance is out there, then I'd disagree. Populations of pathogens such as MTB have been followed when this or that antibiotic falls out of favor. When it does, over time the percentage of cases that are resistant to that particular antibiotic decrease.2 -
The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
I will avoid taking antibiotics unless it's a life or death situation. Taking them usually gives me worse problems than the actual condition they are trying to treat!3 -
Christine_72 wrote: »The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
I will avoid taking antibiotics unless it's a life or death situation. Taking them usually gives me worse problems than the actual condition they are trying to treat!
Me too0 -
The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Not pointless.
Selective pressure is required for a high rate of retention for most of those genes over multiple generations. Remove the selective pressure and the percentage of bacteria resistant to that pressure should drop.
Perhaps for the environmental microbial populations at large; however for the clinically significant pathogens - pointless.
If you mean eliminating the specific antibiotics in soap is basically meaningless for clinically significant pathogens, then I'd agree.
If you mean that eliminating any antibiotic is pointless to reduce populations of clinically significant pathogens once the resistance is out there, then I'd disagree. Populations of pathogens such as MTB have been followed when this or that antibiotic falls out of favor. When it does, over time the percentage of cases that are resistant to that particular antibiotic decrease.
We're on the same page here. I'm not one of the fact denying purists who demonizes all use of antibiotics. Antibiotics are a very necessary tool in treatment; however the overuse in everyday items - soap, animal feed, etc. has forced resistance for thousands of years potentially.
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Christine_72 wrote: »The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
I will avoid taking antibiotics unless it's a life or death situation. Taking them usually gives me worse problems than the actual condition they are trying to treat!
It would be wonderful if everyone took this attitude and stayed home when sick so they would not spread infections. Unfortunately all managers and businesses are not so understanding. This is a very necessary cultural change that needs to happen.5 -
Christine_72 wrote: »
Look at all the people that go into hospital but never make it out due to picking up deadly infections in there. Hospitals would have to be the number 1 user of antibacterials.
Incorrect. Hospitals don't train their staff on industrial cleanliness nor personal cleanliness (to the degree they need to). Most doctors only take 1 course the entire time they are in school about cleanliness. Plus doctors and staff don't always take the proper precautions for a variety of reasons, like they are busy or forget.2 -
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The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Not pointless.
Selective pressure is required for a high rate of retention for most of those genes over multiple generations. Remove the selective pressure and the percentage of bacteria resistant to that pressure should drop.
Perhaps for the environmental microbial populations at large; however for the clinically significant pathogens - pointless.
If you mean eliminating the specific antibiotics in soap is basically meaningless for clinically significant pathogens, then I'd agree.
If you mean that eliminating any antibiotic is pointless to reduce populations of clinically significant pathogens once the resistance is out there, then I'd disagree. Populations of pathogens such as MTB have been followed when this or that antibiotic falls out of favor. When it does, over time the percentage of cases that are resistant to that particular antibiotic decrease.
We're on the same page here. I'm not one of the fact denying purists who demonizes all use of antibiotics. Antibiotics are a very necessary tool in treatment; however the overuse in everyday items - soap, animal feed, etc. has forced resistance for thousands of years potentially.
And let's not forget perfectly appropriate prescriptions where the patients don't complete the protocol. That's been a major contributor as well. No idea how to improve that one other than repeatedly emphasizing the importance of continuing to take the medicine even after the patient feels better/normal and praying that they'll actually listen.4 -
Christine_72 wrote: »
Look at all the people that go into hospital but never make it out due to picking up deadly infections in there. Hospitals would have to be the number 1 user of antibacterials.
Incorrect. Hospitals don't train their staff on industrial cleanliness nor personal cleanliness (to the degree they need to). Most doctors only take 1 course the entire time they are in school about cleanliness. Plus doctors and staff don't always take the proper precautions for a variety of reasons, like they are busy or forget.
You must be going to some miserable hospitals.
I work for a major health care system. I do not work with patients, my office is not even in a building where patients would be, but even I have required yearly classes on proper sterile technique in the clinical setting. That's apart from the required classes I take for proper sterile technique (and radiation and biohazard handling) in the laboratory setting. Which are more rigorous, but just as useless for me because I no longer work in a laboratory.
Our doctors and nurses are required to do far more, as well as be evaluated regularly on their knowledge.
Which is not to say there is not laziness, sloppiness, or forgetfulness that causes them to break protocol occasionally. But it is not lack of knowledge.6 -
Christine_72 wrote: »
Look at all the people that go into hospital but never make it out due to picking up deadly infections in there. Hospitals would have to be the number 1 user of antibacterials.
Incorrect. Hospitals don't train their staff on industrial cleanliness nor personal cleanliness (to the degree they need to). Most doctors only take 1 course the entire time they are in school about cleanliness. Plus doctors and staff don't always take the proper precautions for a variety of reasons, like they are busy or forget.
I dunno... My husband had a procedure done a couple weeks ago at our local hospital, and he had to sanitise his hands with a betadine wash before walking from one room to another, I'm surprised he had any skin left on his hands at the end of the day. His experience is what made me comment on this thread.1 -
Around here we hear all the time "don't be afraid to ask your doctor to was their hands when they enter your room". I thought that was rediculous. What doc would not wash his/her hands?! Well, when I was in labour with my last child we arrived at the hospital(after a one hour ride that should have taken 1.5hrs. We were in a bit of a hurry given that I go from labour to delivery extremely fast) but my husband was desperate to stop at the public washrooms on our way up to delivery while I paced in the hall. In walked a name tagged doc behind him and was out in less than 30sec. I asked my husband if the gentleman before him had washed up. "Nope" was the reply. They can train all they want but some people choose to be idiots no matter what their education. My midwife was one of the good ones though!!1
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The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Absolutely NOT pointless. The resistance genes have been out there for a long time. It is the selective pressure that is causing them to increase. If you relieve this pressure, the spread of these genes should go down.
They have actually found these resistance genes in caves in bacteria that supposedly have not been exposed to antibiotics. The overuse of antibiotics have helped put selective pressure on microbial populations to select for resistant strains. It is not too late to stop this trend.
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The issue and danger with overuse of antibiotics is bacterial resistance - while everyone knows this they still insist on using antibiotics. The issue now is that the resistant genes are already out there and being shared by bacteria, so stopping the use now is pointless.
Absolutely NOT pointless. The resistance genes have been out there for a long time. It is the selective pressure that is causing them to increase. If you relieve this pressure, the spread of these genes should go down.
They have actually found these resistance genes in caves in bacteria that supposedly have not been exposed to antibiotics. The overuse of antibiotics have helped put selective pressure on microbial populations to select for resistant strains. It is not too late to stop this trend.
Resistance genes have developed within one line of bacteria to compete against foreign colonies. These resistance genes can be shared locally to any living organism through transposable elements. Once you introduce a broad spectrum antibiotic on a global scale you introduce resistance genes on a global scale. For a very short time any isolated strains may live without these genes, but once they come in contact with another organism carrying the resistance gene these have a chance of becoming resistant. These resistance genes are here to stay for the next thousand years.
The antibiotics in hand sanitizes are so broad spectrum and mild that there is no effectivity, hence the ruling from regulatory authorities.0
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