Eating Clean
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I treat the subject with caution because I've noticed discussions about clean eating founder on its basic definition. Nutrition is a complex system in which the human subject represents a rather large set of variables. There are people using ideology and emotion to feel superior or talk past each other, and on occasion the subject is muddled by trolls or perhaps a person who probably should be treated for OCD (Obsessive Compulsive Disorder). As such, finding reliable information is a challenge.1
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Methinks your doctor will be satisfied if less than 10% of your daily calories come from factory food with long ingredient lists sold in individual plastic packages. Doc will also be pleased if you chew all your calories.2
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HealthierMeforlife2016 wrote: »I didn't mean to start a fight I was just wondering because my doctor said to eat clean and was trying to see if anyone else does for ideas. Again sorry.
It's not you. There are a few around here who feel the need to mock certain ways of eating. Clean eating, plaeo and LCHF are usually targets. Ignore them. Usually posting in the specific MFP groups, like the Clean Eating group, will get you better responses.
I've read Tosca Reno's books and followed her advice with great success. I lost almost 40 lbs a few years ago following her program, and then taking it one step further: if tthefood was not in recognizable as it's source (a whole food) I skipped it. I ate veggies, meats, eggs, nuts and seeds, and fruit only. For grains, I ate steel cut oats, corn and (wild) rice. I felt great. In hindsight, I was eating a lower carb diet too.
And then I tried reintroducing "normal" foods back into my diet. It started with a blueberry muffin. I can't regulate a "normal" diet. I stopped eating clean and regained my weight.
I again use many of her Eat Clean principles but I eat lower carb and higher fat to address the insulin issues I developed a few years ago.
I think Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet is a healthy diet plan to follow. IMO, cutting out highly processed foods, and foods high in sugar, can only benefit people's health.
Good luck.3 -
OP didn't mention Reno, which is not the only "clean eating" that exists.
OP's way of eating wasn't mocked -- indeed, we don't even know her way of eating. Personally, I told her my way of eating and asked if that was the kind of thing of interest to her.
LCHF has nothing to do with this thread, and the truth is that the arguments about LCHF are pretty much always between those who insist that it's the best and only healthy way to eat vs. those who say it's one of many perfectly good ways to eat and not necessary if you don't want to do it. I'm getting rather tired of people claiming that disagreeing with an assertion that LCHF is superior = an attack on LCHF. It's not.6 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »OP didn't mention Reno, which is not the only "clean eating" that exists.
OP's way of eating wasn't mocked -- indeed, we don't even know her way of eating. Personally, I told her my way of eating and asked if that was the kind of thing of interest to her.
LCHF has nothing to do with this thread, and the truth is that the arguments about LCHF are pretty much always between those who insist that it's the best and only healthy way to eat vs. those who say it's one of many perfectly good ways to eat and not necessary if you don't want to do it. I'm getting rather tired of people claiming that disagreeing with an assertion that LCHF is superior = an attack on LCHF. It's not.
You shared your experiences. I shared mine.
The OP asked if others were trying to eat clean. I follow most of those principles but I eat more fat than Tosca Reno's Eat Claen plan (I referenced which plan I followed since there are many definitions of clean eating).
I'm getting rather tired of people jumping all over any references made to a lower carb diet, without any superior claims ever being made.
ETA I think the OP was mocked with at least one "I wash my food" sort of comments. Of course I will retract that if the people who wrote that honestly believed that a clean eating diet is about washing their food.2 -
WinoGelato wrote: »sunnybeaches105 wrote: »This is where someone argues that clean eating without a calorie deficit will still cause you to lose weight. Then someone else talks about washing their food. And we spend pages arguing the definition. And then someone else tells everyone to avoid eating any white foods. And another guy says that he eats everything. And I post pics of donuts. And another dude tells people they need more self discipline. Are we done yet?
Stay at a calorie deficit. Eat nutrient dense food. And, put down the damned donuts unless you really have room and your diet is dialed in. Oh, and shut off the lights when you're finished going back and forth for 30 pages.
You forgot "shop the perimeter of the grocery store" and "only eat foods with ingredients you can pronounce".
The bakery counter and wine is usually on the perimeter of our supermarkets
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It's never diet type that will cause weight loss, but calories in/calorie out. You just have to find the way of eating that works best for you. As for me, I can eat anything and regulate my intake becaue that's where the magic is--kowning how to moderate.
As for clean eating, that's all in the perception. In conversations like this, I find it useful if people asking the question define what clean eating is to them because it then provides clarity for the discussion.
My concept of clean eating is restriction of food type more than restriction of calories, which does nothing for me.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »OP didn't mention Reno, which is not the only "clean eating" that exists.
OP's way of eating wasn't mocked -- indeed, we don't even know her way of eating. Personally, I told her my way of eating and asked if that was the kind of thing of interest to her.
LCHF has nothing to do with this thread, and the truth is that the arguments about LCHF are pretty much always between those who insist that it's the best and only healthy way to eat vs. those who say it's one of many perfectly good ways to eat and not necessary if you don't want to do it. I'm getting rather tired of people claiming that disagreeing with an assertion that LCHF is superior = an attack on LCHF. It's not.
You shared your experiences. I shared mine.
The OP asked if others were trying to eat clean. I follow most of those principles but I eat more fat than Tosca Reno's Eat Claen plan (I referenced which plan I followed since there are many definitions of clean eating).
That just shows how meaningless "clean eating" can be, as normally it at least means a lot of vegetables, and not a lot of processed meat.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »OP didn't mention Reno, which is not the only "clean eating" that exists.
OP's way of eating wasn't mocked -- indeed, we don't even know her way of eating. Personally, I told her my way of eating and asked if that was the kind of thing of interest to her.
LCHF has nothing to do with this thread, and the truth is that the arguments about LCHF are pretty much always between those who insist that it's the best and only healthy way to eat vs. those who say it's one of many perfectly good ways to eat and not necessary if you don't want to do it. I'm getting rather tired of people claiming that disagreeing with an assertion that LCHF is superior = an attack on LCHF. It's not.
You shared your experiences. I shared mine.
The OP asked if others were trying to eat clean. I follow most of those principles but I eat more fat than Tosca Reno's Eat Claen plan (I referenced which plan I followed since there are many definitions of clean eating).
That just shows how meaningless "clean eating" can be, as normally it at least means a lot of vegetables, and not a lot of processed meat.
What? Processed meats? Please clarify.0 -
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lemurcat12 wrote: »
Still not sure what you are getting at. My most processed meat this week was ground beef and some homemade bratwurst. That would fit with Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet except that the meat was not lean. As I said, I eat more fat than she advises.
Yesterday I ate an English cucumber, a bell pepper, a lot of celery, and a couple of tablespoons of refried beans. It may not be as veggie heavy as some but it would mostly fit Reno's Eat Clean Diet. Well, maybe not the refried beans.
This is just my interpretation of using some of Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet ideas.... I think it fits the OP. I see no problem. If the vagaries of clean eating posts bother you, just skip the post.
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I sense a past rivalry? The whole "clean" thing does tend to get absurdly pedantic.
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Gianfranco_R wrote: »
Smoked food is certainly processed, yeah. That I eat it is one (of many) reasons that I don't "eat clean."
Since I never claimed to "eat clean," not exactly sure what your point is.2 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »
Still not sure what you are getting at. My most processed meat this week was ground beef and some homemade bratwurst. That would fit with Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet except that the meat was not lean. As I said, I eat more fat than she advises.
Yesterday I ate an English cucumber, a bell pepper, a lot of celery, and a couple of tablespoons of refried beans. It may not be as veggie heavy as some but it would mostly fit Reno's Eat Clean Diet. Well, maybe not the refried beans.
This is just my interpretation of using some of Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet ideas.... I think it fits the OP. I see no problem. If the vagaries of clean eating posts bother you, just skip the post.
Your diary and your eating recommendations used to reflect a LOT of processed meat (I recall pepperoni being a favorite) and almost no vegetables. I wouldn't mention that, except that you also would put that up as an ideal of a healthful diet (claiming that your diet was much healthier than people who eat a higher carb percentage) and argue that vegetables aren't important, fruit is basically to be avoided, and that making a diet healthier usually involves adding more sat fat. I don't believe the average doctor would agree or mean that (or eating mostly fat, lots of sat fat and processed meat, and few vegetables) when telling someone to "eat clean."
But again, "eat clean" is too vague which is what people were saying -- they weren't making fun of people for trying to improve their diets, which is what you suggested that I found worth objecting to.
If we now agree that eating vegetables is a good thing (except for a very few people who have medical issues with them), that's great!
I do think OP should probably ask her doctor what he/she is recommending rather than rely on the variety of MFP ideas about what "eating clean" is.4 -
HealthierMeforlife2016 wrote: »I didn't mean to start a fight I was just wondering because my doctor said to eat clean and was trying to see if anyone else does for ideas. Again sorry.
My Doctor told me to eat 1200 calories a day after I described to him what my daily activity was. My TDEE is between 3500 and 4000 most days. Sometimes doctors are idiots.
Eat less than you burn. Be consistent and accurate about logging your food. Of course try to make the majority of your food choices healthy and eat lots of veggies. Don't restrict or give up foods you like.
I see no point in following fad diets, restricting anything other than calories and labeling foods as good bad clean and not clean. Food is food. Enjoy what you like. Just less.2 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »
Still not sure what you are getting at. My most processed meat this week was ground beef and some homemade bratwurst. That would fit with Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet except that the meat was not lean. As I said, I eat more fat than she advises.
Yesterday I ate an English cucumber, a bell pepper, a lot of celery, and a couple of tablespoons of refried beans. It may not be as veggie heavy as some but it would mostly fit Reno's Eat Clean Diet. Well, maybe not the refried beans.
This is just my interpretation of using some of Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet ideas.... I think it fits the OP. I see no problem. If the vagaries of clean eating posts bother you, just skip the post.
Your diary and your eating recommendations used to reflect a LOT of processed meat (I recall pepperoni being a favorite) and almost no vegetables. I wouldn't mention that, except that you also would put that up as an ideal of a healthful diet (claiming that your diet was much healthier than people who eat a higher carb percentage) and argue that vegetables aren't important, fruit is basically to be avoided, and that making a diet healthier usually involves adding more sat fat. I don't believe the average doctor would agree or mean that (or eating mostly fat, lots of sat fat and processed meat, and few vegetables) when telling someone to "eat clean."
But again, "eat clean" is too vague which is what people were saying -- they weren't making fun of people for trying to improve their diets, which is what you suggested that I found worth objecting to.
If we now agree that eating vegetables is a good thing (except for a very few people who have medical issues with them), that's great!
I do think OP should probably ask her doctor what he/she is recommending rather than rely on the variety of MFP ideas about what "eating clean" is.
I do love pepperoni... I ran out a couple of weeks ago and haven't bought more. It is a favorite snack of mine. I happily have a stick per day. True. It's not exactly "clean" unless I buy the highest quality sticks, or eat homemade stuff. But that goes with "mostly" following the Eat Clean Diet. I am not a believer in following other people's diets to a T. You probably agree that a diet has to fit an individual's needs/lifestyle/health issues and sometimes that requires a few alterations within the spirit/guidelines/idea of the diet.
I don't believe I made any claims in this thread, nor were any arguments made against veggies or their nutritional importance. Staying on the OP's topic works best, IMO. Trying to remember what was in my diary (which has been closed for almost a year and unsused for 8 months).
And my doctor advised me to eat Atkins, induction phase (although I altered it o include some dairy). At my last visit, he called me one of his greatest success stories and joked he should put my picture up on a wall of fame.
I do agree that more info from the OP's doctor could be helpful.0 -
I've always defined eating clean as eating things with ingredients that I could pronounce, for the most part. No chemicals, atificial colors. No preservatives. Little bleaching or processing that strips out nutrients. That sort of thing. It's certainly not a bad way to go. But I know very few folks who are fanatic about it for long. Just make small healthy changes that work for you. You'll know if it's working by the scale, if you are content and satisfied , and by how you feel physically . And the occasional brownie never harmed a soul.0
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I've always defined eating clean as eating things with ingredients that I could pronounce, for the most part. No chemicals, atificial colors. No preservatives. Little bleaching or processing that strips out nutrients. That sort of thing. It's certainly not a bad way to go. But I know very few folks who are fanatic about it for long. Just make small healthy changes that work for you. You'll know if it's working by the scale, if you are content and satisfied , and by how you feel physically . And the occasional brownie never harmed a soul.
This is nothing new, it's just been given a new name.
It's what my mother called a balanced diet.
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You probably agree that a diet has to fit an individual's needs/lifestyle/health issues and sometimes that requires a few alterations within the spirit/guidelines/idea of the diet.
I do.Staying on the OP's topic works best, IMO.
I agree with this too. It was your injection of the supposed meanness against low carbers that I found objectionable (as well as off-topic), as well as the claim that people were attacking how OP ate (which is not true -- people were mostly trying to understand what OP was specifically asking about). But much as I think it's inaccurate (like I said before, I think what's considered anti LCHF is refusing to bow down and admit that it's the best of all possible diets, as some seem to think) and was an unnecessary comment intended to stir up drama, I should have just ignored it.I do agree that more info from the OP's doctor could be helpful.
We agree on this too.
I think the main question is what OP is really looking for. I imagine lots of us, following somewhat diverse diets, like to think that we are nutrition-conscious and eat healthfully. Not sure if that's what OP is looking for, or if she wants to interact with people who follow (or can give advice on) more specific diets, such as whatever it is her doctor is recommending. If she's just interested in chatting about nutrition and how we try to make sure have a healthful diet, probably both you and I would be interested, even though we have different ideas in some ways about what's actually healthy (and I agree that debating that here is off-topic).2 -
I think "eat clean" is such a buzzword that many (even some doctors) just tend to use it as a synonym with "follow a healthful diet." So that's one reason people ask. Some mean that, some people they mostly cook from whole foods, and some -- probably a minority, but the most prominent use on MFP, I think -- assert that they NEVER eat any "bad" or processed foods ("bad" varies, and processed doesn't seem to have a consistent meaning, as there have been frequent posters who proclaimed that they never ate processed while having diaries full of protein powder and Chipotle or boxed cereal or all sorts of obviously processed foods).
You can see why the confusion! ;-)
Anyway, I think lots more people focus on eating a healthful diet and limit certain kinds of foods than actual self-define as "eating clean," and so far I haven't see any evidence that people who self-define as eating clean actually eat more healthfully. So that's why I always ask what the OP is really seeking.4 -
I'm pretty sure I can pronounce cyanide and strychnine and I think I'll avoid those.1 -
HealthierMeforlife2016 wrote: »I didn't mean to start a fight I was just wondering because my doctor said to eat clean and was trying to see if anyone else does for ideas. Again sorry.
"Eating clean" is too vague. Ask your doctor or a registered dietician for a more specific diet recommendation if you need one.
However, to lose weight you just need a calorie deficit. You can get that while eating any kind of food.
That's the best advice, "clean" means too many things depending on who you ask and often what decade we are in.
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HealthierMeforlife2016 wrote: »I didn't mean to start a fight I was just wondering because my doctor said to eat clean and was trying to see if anyone else does for ideas. Again sorry.
Nothing to apologize for. "Clean eating" is one of those buzzwords that has been overused and so it gets a stronger negative reaction.
There is a certain amount of "one true faithism" when it comes to diet and nutrition, and sometimes people who favor one type of eating get all fired up and want to preach to others about its virtues--even though there is little science behind it.
And, the way some describe it, "clean eating" is an example of the misguided notion that a specific "diet" can lead to weight loss, independent of calorie intake.
Not knowing any of this, you asked a perfectly legitimate question.
I like the expression "no true Scotsman" here because nothing is ever clean enough to some. The question is very valid but unfortunately there is never a good answer if you are looking for simple rules on "good" vs "bad" foods. I recommend to the OP that they look at their diet as a whole and make reasonable choices based on meeting their basic requirements and then having a bit of enjoyment if they so desire.1 -
Gianfranco_R wrote: »
I tried to smoke a salmon but couldn't find the rolling papers.4 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »Gianfranco_R wrote: »
I tried to smoke a salmon but couldn't find the rolling papers.
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I like my food processed and artificially flavored. I'm a rebel, living on the edge. What does clean eating even mean? Just because you eat pure meat with vegetables and fruit doesn't mean you're going to lose weight any faster than someone else who doesn't eat like that. You can pry all of the "junk" from my cold, dead, healthy skinny hands.1
This discussion has been closed.
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