Paleo to fix health issues??
Replies
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I thought the cartoon was funnny. People on paleo facebook groups post stuff like that all the time. MFPers, it's okay to have a sense of humor. Laughing = decreasing stress = totally paleo.2
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Just here for the measured portion of frosted layer cake.2
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janejellyroll wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
"Scientifically or anecdotally"?
Yeah. That's what I said.
What does that mean? I would understand what you meant if you wrote "scientifically and anecdotally," but are you saying that you don't even know whether or not the evidence for mental and physical health improvement is based in scientific evidence or anecdotes?0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
"Scientifically or anecdotally"?
Yeah. That's what I said.
What does that mean? I would understand what you meant if you wrote "scientifically and anecdotally," but are you saying that you don't even know whether or not the evidence for mental and physical health improvement is based in scientific evidence or anecdotes?
Really what it means is that I'm not digging for double blind, academically published, peer reviewed studies from an international medical research journal and posting the links to support my position like I'm co-starring as an ADA in a courtroom scene from an episode of CSI.
You know how it is around here and all that malarkey JelleyRoll Janey. With all the smart alecks yelling out "HEY, that study better have been done on HUMANS and not RODENTS!" and the cross examinations and such
But anyone who's interested in the efficacy of Paleo could buy THIS wonderful paleo book from Amazon.com
https://www.amazon.com/Paleo-Miracle-Stories-Health-Transformation/dp/1480286346/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1480526035&sr=1-1&keywords=The+Paleo+Miracle+50+Real+stories
Nothing fancy Jellyroll. Just real stories from real people who did Paleo and were better off for it - and rather dramatically so
Is there a reason why you address me as "JelleyRoll Janey" and "Jellyroll"? You seem annoyed with me and I'm not sure why. I was curious to know what you mean by "scientifically or anecdotally" and if you don't want to address the question, you can simply ignore it. Altering my screenname like that, well, it feels kinda hostile and demeaning.
I think I understand what you mean -- that you believe that there is scientific evidence demonstrating that the Paleo diet results in improved physical and mental health but you don't want to locate the studies to post them here and instead will refer me to a published collection of anecdotes. Thank you for taking the time to explain.1 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
"Scientifically or anecdotally"?
Yeah. That's what I said.
What does that mean? I would understand what you meant if you wrote "scientifically and anecdotally," but are you saying that you don't even know whether or not the evidence for mental and physical health improvement is based in scientific evidence or anecdotes?
Really what it means is that I'm not digging for double blind, academically published, peer reviewed studies from an international medical research journal and posting the links to support my position like I'm co-starring as an ADA in a courtroom scene from an episode of CSI.
You know how it is around here and all that malarkey JelleyRoll Janey. With all the smart alecks yelling out "HEY, that study better have been done on HUMANS and not RODENTS!" and the cross examinations and such
But anyone who's interested in the efficacy of Paleo could buy THIS wonderful paleo book from Amazon.com
https://www.amazon.com/Paleo-Miracle-Stories-Health-Transformation/dp/1480286346/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1480526035&sr=1-1&keywords=The+Paleo+Miracle+50+Real+stories
Nothing fancy Jellyroll. Just real stories from real people who did Paleo and were better off for it - and rather dramatically so
Hmmm, maybe I should write a book titled 'Paleo Nightmare: 50 Real Stories of People Who had Adverse Health Reactions to Paleo Eating.' I know there's quite a few of us who used to hang out over at MDA, who've had bad experiences with it. My husband would be so excited that I was finally using my writing degree for something other than hanging out on MFP
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The fervor in the item description for the book is a bit off-putting to me: "We are all born again, and are excited to share our secret with you."
Can people feel good on a Paleo diet? I have no doubt that many people do -- I know some of them myself. But that doesn't mean that grains and potatoes are "poison" (as the promotional material for the book claims) or that people can't also feel good while including beans or oats or potatoes in their diet.
I think the truth is between the anti-Paleo and the "Paleo miracle" camps. There are going to be people who find Paleo to be a good fit for their lifestyle and food preferences. Although I personally think they restrict some foods needlessly, it's certainly possible to be healthy without eating those foods. For some people, going Paleo may result in better health if it results in them meeting more of their nutritional needs or eliminating foods that don't make them feel their best. But is Paleo *required* for health? No. It's possible to feel great and meet your nutritional needs while eating foods that Paleo eliminates. (Assuming, of course, that one isn't eating foods that provoke an allergy/intolerance).3 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
"Scientifically or anecdotally"?
Yeah. That's what I said.
What does that mean? I would understand what you meant if you wrote "scientifically and anecdotally," but are you saying that you don't even know whether or not the evidence for mental and physical health improvement is based in scientific evidence or anecdotes?
Really what it means is that I'm not digging for double blind, academically published, peer reviewed studies from an international medical research journal and posting the links to support my position like I'm co-starring as an ADA in a courtroom scene from an episode of CSI.
You know how it is around here and all that malarkey JelleyRoll Janey. With all the smart alecks yelling out "HEY, that study better have been done on HUMANS and not RODENTS!" and the cross examinations and such
But anyone who's interested in the efficacy of Paleo could buy THIS wonderful paleo book from Amazon.com
https://www.amazon.com/Paleo-Miracle-Stories-Health-Transformation/dp/1480286346/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1480526035&sr=1-1&keywords=The+Paleo+Miracle+50+Real+stories
Nothing fancy Jellyroll. Just real stories from real people who did Paleo and were better off for it - and rather dramatically so
Is there a reason why you address me as "JelleyRoll Janey" and "Jellyroll"? You seem annoyed with me and I'm not sure why. I was curious to know what you mean by "scientifically or anecdotally" and if you don't want to address the question, you can simply ignore it. Altering my screenname like that, well, it feels kinda hostile and demeaning.
I think I understand what you mean -- that you believe that there is scientific evidence demonstrating that the Paleo diet results in improved physical and mental health but you don't want to locate the studies to post them here and instead will refer me to a published collection of anecdotes. Thank you for taking the time to explain.
You and I have corresponded on MFP before. Always in a civil fashion if my memory serves me correctly. I did post once that in the 9th grade that a boy who had a crush on me started calling me Jellyroll in my Consumer Economics class after I wore a pair of tight tan chinos with a slit back pocket. So maybe you thought I was making fun of you. And maybe I was just a smidgen but not with any significant hostility or with a true desire to demean you.
Jellyrolls are actually one of my favorite desserts but they aren't Paleo. And when I stop eating them, this pesky rash on my forehead and on the little strip of skin between my eyebrows goes away. Medical science has offered me no satisfying explanation for it and nothing more than a completely ineffectual topical cream to treat the condition. Paleo cures it although it takes two months of back to back adherence. Just sayin'.
But was your question rhetorical given the divided and back and forth nature of the thread? Or were you sincerely interested, in a protective or tutorial way, whether I had any actual scientific understanding of the effects of Paleo or if anecdotal accounts were enough for me?
Oh, I remember you telling me that.
My question was based in sincere interest as to what you meant by that phrase. I wasn't involved in the thread before that point and I'm not evaluating your scientific understanding. I was trying to fully understand what you were communicating, not judge what was enough for you.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »The fervor in the item description for the book is a bit off-putting to me: "We are all born again, and are excited to share our secret with you."
Can people feel good on a Paleo diet? I have no doubt that many people do -- I know some of them myself. But that doesn't mean that grains and potatoes are "poison" (as the promotional material for the book claims) or that people can't also feel good while including beans or oats or potatoes in their diet.
I think the truth is between the anti-Paleo and the "Paleo miracle" camps. There are going to be people who find Paleo to be a good fit for their lifestyle and food preferences. Although I personally think they restrict some foods needlessly, it's certainly possible to be healthy without eating those foods. For some people, going Paleo may result in better health if it results in them meeting more of their nutritional needs or eliminating foods that don't make them feel their best. But is Paleo *required* for health? No. It's possible to feel great and meet your nutritional needs while eating foods that Paleo eliminates. (Assuming, of course, that one isn't eating foods that provoke an allergy/intolerance).
Yeah okay. I feel the same way about veganism. Some people feel terrific on a vegan diet. I feel awful going vegan and I've tried it many times, for months at a stretch over the years. Too bad. Because for ethical reasons, I think it's of the highest order and I'd love to not have to be even indirectly responsible for the killing of any animal. But, for selfish reason concerning my own feelings of optimal physical wellbeing, I'll be eating meat and I've made my peace with it.
But you don't see me going into vegan and vegetarian threads telling everyone that eating vegan and vegetarian isn't necessary for one reason or another.
If someone claimed that meat was "poison" or that avoiding meat or dairy was a requirement for good health, I would think it would be completely appropriate (and accurate) for a non-vegan to note that it wasn't true. I would expect a thread here called "Vegan to fix health issues" to include some back-and-forth similar to what we have seen in this thread.
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I did Paleo, years ago, when I had what we thought at the time was fibromyalgia (it was a misdiagnosis that was later found out to be psoriatic arthritis).
It really did nothing for me.
At the time, it was a good fit because it eliminated a lot of foods that I needed to from my breastmilk for my sensitive, colicky infant. Other than that, there was no benefit to it.1 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »The fervor in the item description for the book is a bit off-putting to me: "We are all born again, and are excited to share our secret with you."
Can people feel good on a Paleo diet? I have no doubt that many people do -- I know some of them myself. But that doesn't mean that grains and potatoes are "poison" (as the promotional material for the book claims) or that people can't also feel good while including beans or oats or potatoes in their diet.
I think the truth is between the anti-Paleo and the "Paleo miracle" camps. There are going to be people who find Paleo to be a good fit for their lifestyle and food preferences. Although I personally think they restrict some foods needlessly, it's certainly possible to be healthy without eating those foods. For some people, going Paleo may result in better health if it results in them meeting more of their nutritional needs or eliminating foods that don't make them feel their best. But is Paleo *required* for health? No. It's possible to feel great and meet your nutritional needs while eating foods that Paleo eliminates. (Assuming, of course, that one isn't eating foods that provoke an allergy/intolerance).
Yeah okay. I feel the same way about veganism. Some people feel terrific on a vegan diet. I feel awful going vegan and I've tried it many times, for months at a stretch over the years. Too bad. Because for ethical reasons, I think it's of the highest order and I'd love to not have to be even indirectly responsible for the killing of any animal. But, for selfish reason concerning my own feelings of optimal physical wellbeing, I'll be eating meat and I've made my peace with it.
But you don't see me going into vegan and vegetarian threads telling everyone that eating vegan and vegetarian isn't necessary for one reason or another.
If someone claimed that meat was "poison" or that avoiding meat or dairy was a requirement for good health, I would think it would be completely appropriate (and accurate) for a non-vegan to note that it wasn't true. I would expect a thread here called "Vegan to fix health issues" to include some back-and-forth similar to what we have seen in this thread.
The OP of this thread said nothing about poison nor did she claim that Paleo was a cure all for all people or all ailments. She specifically asked for responses from people who adhered to Paleo and noticed an improvement of a health ailment or an overall feeling of improved health. For God's sake.
I wasn't referring to the OP -- I was referring to the claims in the book.
That said, if someone said that veganism seemed like the only way to feel healthy (similar to what was in the OP), I wouldn't be surprised to see someone question that and I wouldn't necessarily find it inappropriate.
I think I understand your irritation overall, but I am not sure why it is directed at me right now. If I've upset you, I am not sure how but I do want to apologize.1 -
I vote for primal paleo. It has changed our lives and we've never felt better. However, even on the plan, you have to find what works for you. I realized I needed a piece of fruit in the afternoon while my BF did not. So still listen to your body but huge fan of primal paleo. I've had to buy all new clothes - twice!
I really like primal paleo. I've done it for about 3.5 years and life has never been better!0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »The fervor in the item description for the book is a bit off-putting to me: "We are all born again, and are excited to share our secret with you."
Can people feel good on a Paleo diet? I have no doubt that many people do -- I know some of them myself. But that doesn't mean that grains and potatoes are "poison" (as the promotional material for the book claims) or that people can't also feel good while including beans or oats or potatoes in their diet.
I think the truth is between the anti-Paleo and the "Paleo miracle" camps. There are going to be people who find Paleo to be a good fit for their lifestyle and food preferences. Although I personally think they restrict some foods needlessly, it's certainly possible to be healthy without eating those foods. For some people, going Paleo may result in better health if it results in them meeting more of their nutritional needs or eliminating foods that don't make them feel their best. But is Paleo *required* for health? No. It's possible to feel great and meet your nutritional needs while eating foods that Paleo eliminates. (Assuming, of course, that one isn't eating foods that provoke an allergy/intolerance).
Yeah okay. I feel the same way about veganism. Some people feel terrific on a vegan diet. I feel awful going vegan and I've tried it many times, for months at a stretch over the years. Too bad. Because for ethical reasons, I think it's of the highest order and I'd love to not have to be even indirectly responsible for the killing of any animal. But, for selfish reason concerning my own feelings of optimal physical wellbeing, I'll be eating meat and I've made my peace with it.
But you don't see me going into vegan and vegetarian threads telling everyone that eating vegan and vegetarian isn't necessary for one reason or another.
If someone claimed that meat was "poison" or that avoiding meat or dairy was a requirement for good health, I would think it would be completely appropriate (and accurate) for a non-vegan to note that it wasn't true. I would expect a thread here called "Vegan to fix health issues" to include some back-and-forth similar to what we have seen in this thread.
The OP of this thread said nothing about poison nor did she claim that Paleo was a cure all for all people or all ailments. She specifically asked for responses from people who adhered to Paleo and noticed an improvement of a health ailment or an overall feeling of improved health. For God's sake.
I wasn't referring to the OP -- I was referring to the claims in the book.
That said, if someone said that veganism seemed like the only way to feel healthy (similar to what was in the OP), I wouldn't be surprised to see someone question that and I wouldn't necessarily find it inappropriate.
I think I understand your irritation overall, but I am not sure why it is directed at me right now. If I've upset you, I am not sure how but I do want to apologize.
Nah, it's not you. I've restarted paleo this week and I'm cranky. I miss mashed potatoes and gravy but, for esthetic reasons, I really want my forehead rash to go away so I can stop wearing makeup.
Glad to hear it wasn't me. Good luck with your cravings.0 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
You see, the thing is...you can have a very healthy diet that includes a lot of whole foods and whatnot...and you don't need some weird name to go by and you don't have to demonize and eliminate certain whole foods which are also perfectly healthy and good for you...
And actually, there are some legit medical concerns with Paleo and the amount of meat they eat...my BIL has been paleo for years...he's still overweight and has some major cholesterol issues...anecdotally...
but sigh...carry on.
Yeah. Sigh. If I was concerned about demonizing I'd call an exorcist. Although I hear the viability of such a phenomena is actually anecdotal and Stephen Hawking might stifle a giggle if he were to be told about it. But you don't have to tell your scientist friends. Why are all you outspoken Paleo critics so concerned about demons?
Demonizing sugar, demonizing meatball sandwiches, demonizing donuts, demonizing pizza. You're always going on about demonizing this or that for God's sake. Stop by a Catholic church. The Holy Water is in the lobby and it's free of charge. There's usually a parking lot too.
Paleo adherents can get their protein from nut and soy sources. They can eat as much or as little meat as they want. And if they want to count calories and reap the benefits of doing so they can and they do. And if they want to eat Paleo to reap the benefits of an anti-inflammatory effect, not count calories and remain fat, they can do that too. What's the prob?
My point is that whole foods are pretty good for you...I really don't understand saying these whole foods are fine...but legumes are bad...lentils are bad...potatoes are bad...nightshade plants like tomatoes are bad, etc...it seems stupid and completely illogical and the "science" behind it is completely misguided.
No wonder people don't know what's actually good and healthy for them...they have some stupid *kitten* diet coming at them from every direction telling them what's good and bad based on absolutely nothing...3 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
You see, the thing is...you can have a very healthy diet that includes a lot of whole foods and whatnot...and you don't need some weird name to go by and you don't have to demonize and eliminate certain whole foods which are also perfectly healthy and good for you...
And actually, there are some legit medical concerns with Paleo and the amount of meat they eat...my BIL has been paleo for years...he's still overweight and has some major cholesterol issues...anecdotally...
but sigh...carry on.
Yeah. Sigh. If I was concerned about demonizing I'd call an exorcist. Although I hear the viability of such a phenomena is actually anecdotal and Stephen Hawking might stifle a giggle if he were to be told about it. But you don't have to tell your scientist friends. Why are all you outspoken Paleo critics so concerned about demons?
Demonizing sugar, demonizing meatball sandwiches, demonizing donuts, demonizing pizza. You're always going on about demonizing this or that for God's sake. Stop by a Catholic church. The Holy Water is in the lobby and it's free of charge. There's usually a parking lot too.
Paleo adherents can get their protein from nut and soy sources. They can eat as much or as little meat as they want. And if they want to count calories and reap the benefits of doing so they can and they do. And if they want to eat Paleo to reap the benefits of an anti-inflammatory effect, not count calories and remain fat, they can do that too. What's the prob?
My point is that whole foods are pretty good for you...I really don't understand saying these whole foods are fine...but legumes are bad...lentils are bad...potatoes are bad...nightshade plants like tomatoes are bad, etc...it seems stupid and completely illogical and the "science" behind it is completely misguided.
No wonder people don't know what's actually good and healthy for them...they have some stupid *kitten* diet coming at them from every direction telling them what's good and bad based on absolutely nothing...
Well, wolfman they can rest assured that they have you to point out the error of their ways and to point out their ignorance of scientific fact. I know, I know. Everyone should eat legumes and potatoes and nightshades and yummy brown rice and whole wheat french toast with organic maple syrup and butter bought at a local farm like you do because it works out well for you. What is WRONG with these people? Poor sods being brainwashed by the likes of some caveman gifs and Sisson blogs.
I don't eat french toast or maple syrup.
I don't see the point of confusing people who are already confused and making them now think that certain whole foods are bad...I don't get it.
There's nothing wrong with these people...it's the diet that is absurd and the people are misguided. People can do whatever they want...I don't care...but let's face it, the paleo crowd is about as crusader religious as they come...so I don't see why I can't point out flaws in their religion.3 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
You see, the thing is...you can have a very healthy diet that includes a lot of whole foods and whatnot...and you don't need some weird name to go by and you don't have to demonize and eliminate certain whole foods which are also perfectly healthy and good for you...
And actually, there are some legit medical concerns with Paleo and the amount of meat they eat...my BIL has been paleo for years...he's still overweight and has some major cholesterol issues...anecdotally...
but sigh...carry on.
Yeah. Sigh. If I was concerned about demonizing I'd call an exorcist. Although I hear the viability of such a phenomena is actually anecdotal and Stephen Hawking might stifle a giggle if he were to be told about it. But you don't have to tell your scientist friends. Why are all you outspoken Paleo critics so concerned about demons?
Demonizing sugar, demonizing meatball sandwiches, demonizing donuts, demonizing pizza. You're always going on about demonizing this or that for God's sake. Stop by a Catholic church. The Holy Water is in the lobby and it's free of charge. There's usually a parking lot too.
Paleo adherents can get their protein from nut and soy sources. They can eat as much or as little meat as they want. And if they want to count calories and reap the benefits of doing so they can and they do. And if they want to eat Paleo to reap the benefits of an anti-inflammatory effect, not count calories and remain fat, they can do that too. What's the prob?
My point is that whole foods are pretty good for you...I really don't understand saying these whole foods are fine...but legumes are bad...lentils are bad...potatoes are bad...nightshade plants like tomatoes are bad, etc...it seems stupid and completely illogical and the "science" behind it is completely misguided.
No wonder people don't know what's actually good and healthy for them...they have some stupid *kitten* diet coming at them from every direction telling them what's good and bad based on absolutely nothing...
Well, wolfman they can rest assured that they have you to point out the error of their ways and to point out their ignorance of scientific fact. I know, I know. Everyone should eat legumes and potatoes and nightshades and yummy brown rice and whole wheat french toast with organic maple syrup and butter bought at a local farm like you do because it works out well for you. What is WRONG with these people? Poor sods being brainwashed by the likes of some caveman gifs and Sisson blogs.
I don't eat french toast or maple syrup.
I don't see the point of confusing people who are already confused and making them now think that certain whole foods are bad...I don't get it.
There's nothing wrong with these people...it's the diet that is absurd and the people are misguided. People can do whatever they want...I don't care...but let's face it, the paleo crowd is about as crusader religious as they come...so I don't see why I can't point out flaws in their religion.
Just my 0.02$
Crusading, bad. Zealotry, bad. Dietary evalgelism, bad. I think we all agree on that. But it's the PEOPLE that carry out these behaviors, not the diet. So it seems contradictory to say that there's nothing wrong with these people.
Calling a diet "absurd" and the people "misguided" seems to carry connotations of reverse crusading, reverse zealotry and reverse evangelism.
Regardless of what we choose as our own diet or regardless of what diet we see others choose, it seems to me that acceptance of results in one's own experience while at the same time accepting the experience of others is way more constructive all around.
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geneticexpectations wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
You see, the thing is...you can have a very healthy diet that includes a lot of whole foods and whatnot...and you don't need some weird name to go by and you don't have to demonize and eliminate certain whole foods which are also perfectly healthy and good for you...
And actually, there are some legit medical concerns with Paleo and the amount of meat they eat...my BIL has been paleo for years...he's still overweight and has some major cholesterol issues...anecdotally...
but sigh...carry on.
Yeah. Sigh. If I was concerned about demonizing I'd call an exorcist. Although I hear the viability of such a phenomena is actually anecdotal and Stephen Hawking might stifle a giggle if he were to be told about it. But you don't have to tell your scientist friends. Why are all you outspoken Paleo critics so concerned about demons?
Demonizing sugar, demonizing meatball sandwiches, demonizing donuts, demonizing pizza. You're always going on about demonizing this or that for God's sake. Stop by a Catholic church. The Holy Water is in the lobby and it's free of charge. There's usually a parking lot too.
Paleo adherents can get their protein from nut and soy sources. They can eat as much or as little meat as they want. And if they want to count calories and reap the benefits of doing so they can and they do. And if they want to eat Paleo to reap the benefits of an anti-inflammatory effect, not count calories and remain fat, they can do that too. What's the prob?
My point is that whole foods are pretty good for you...I really don't understand saying these whole foods are fine...but legumes are bad...lentils are bad...potatoes are bad...nightshade plants like tomatoes are bad, etc...it seems stupid and completely illogical and the "science" behind it is completely misguided.
No wonder people don't know what's actually good and healthy for them...they have some stupid *kitten* diet coming at them from every direction telling them what's good and bad based on absolutely nothing...
Well, wolfman they can rest assured that they have you to point out the error of their ways and to point out their ignorance of scientific fact. I know, I know. Everyone should eat legumes and potatoes and nightshades and yummy brown rice and whole wheat french toast with organic maple syrup and butter bought at a local farm like you do because it works out well for you. What is WRONG with these people? Poor sods being brainwashed by the likes of some caveman gifs and Sisson blogs.
I don't eat french toast or maple syrup.
I don't see the point of confusing people who are already confused and making them now think that certain whole foods are bad...I don't get it.
There's nothing wrong with these people...it's the diet that is absurd and the people are misguided. People can do whatever they want...I don't care...but let's face it, the paleo crowd is about as crusader religious as they come...so I don't see why I can't point out flaws in their religion.
Just my 0.02$
Crusading, bad. Zealotry, bad. Dietary evalgelism, bad. I think we all agree on that. But it's the PEOPLE that carry out these behaviors, not the diet. So it seems contradictory to say that there's nothing wrong with these people.
Calling a diet "absurd" and the people "misguided" seems to carry connotations of reverse crusading, reverse zealotry and reverse evangelism.
Regardless of what we choose as our own diet or regardless of what diet we see others choose, it seems to me that acceptance of results in one's own experience while at the same time accepting the experience of others is way more constructive all around.
There are a handful of diets that I think are pretty solid...paleo isn't really one of them. I think it's absurd because it says that certain whole foods are "bad"...sorry, but there are no "bad" whole foods...that in and of itself qualifies as absurd...whole foods are chalk full of nutrition...I will call any diet that says these certain whole foods are bad absurd.
I say misguided because there are truly people out there who actually think that these particular whole foods are bad...not because they know anything about nutrition...but because they've bought into something...beans are "bad" is misguided plain and simple...that's not reverse crusading or zealotry...they simply aren't coming with anything factually solid...
4 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »geneticexpectations wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »Did you folks know that humans ate plant foods thousands of years ago?
Yes, we know. Which is why classic "Paleo" encourages the eating of plenty of non-starchy plant foods.
And yes, yes, we know that calling the diet "Paleo" was a bit shortsighted and unfortunate. Which encourages the posting of hilarious cartoons featuring cavemen chasing warthogs with targets painted on their asss. To innocently lighten up the mood of course.
Paleo is just a poorly named elimination diet which, scientifically or anecdotally, improves the mental and physical health of the vast majority of its loyal adherents. Sigh. But carry on with the thread.
You see, the thing is...you can have a very healthy diet that includes a lot of whole foods and whatnot...and you don't need some weird name to go by and you don't have to demonize and eliminate certain whole foods which are also perfectly healthy and good for you...
And actually, there are some legit medical concerns with Paleo and the amount of meat they eat...my BIL has been paleo for years...he's still overweight and has some major cholesterol issues...anecdotally...
but sigh...carry on.
Yeah. Sigh. If I was concerned about demonizing I'd call an exorcist. Although I hear the viability of such a phenomena is actually anecdotal and Stephen Hawking might stifle a giggle if he were to be told about it. But you don't have to tell your scientist friends. Why are all you outspoken Paleo critics so concerned about demons?
Demonizing sugar, demonizing meatball sandwiches, demonizing donuts, demonizing pizza. You're always going on about demonizing this or that for God's sake. Stop by a Catholic church. The Holy Water is in the lobby and it's free of charge. There's usually a parking lot too.
Paleo adherents can get their protein from nut and soy sources. They can eat as much or as little meat as they want. And if they want to count calories and reap the benefits of doing so they can and they do. And if they want to eat Paleo to reap the benefits of an anti-inflammatory effect, not count calories and remain fat, they can do that too. What's the prob?
My point is that whole foods are pretty good for you...I really don't understand saying these whole foods are fine...but legumes are bad...lentils are bad...potatoes are bad...nightshade plants like tomatoes are bad, etc...it seems stupid and completely illogical and the "science" behind it is completely misguided.
No wonder people don't know what's actually good and healthy for them...they have some stupid *kitten* diet coming at them from every direction telling them what's good and bad based on absolutely nothing...
Well, wolfman they can rest assured that they have you to point out the error of their ways and to point out their ignorance of scientific fact. I know, I know. Everyone should eat legumes and potatoes and nightshades and yummy brown rice and whole wheat french toast with organic maple syrup and butter bought at a local farm like you do because it works out well for you. What is WRONG with these people? Poor sods being brainwashed by the likes of some caveman gifs and Sisson blogs.
I don't eat french toast or maple syrup.
I don't see the point of confusing people who are already confused and making them now think that certain whole foods are bad...I don't get it.
There's nothing wrong with these people...it's the diet that is absurd and the people are misguided. People can do whatever they want...I don't care...but let's face it, the paleo crowd is about as crusader religious as they come...so I don't see why I can't point out flaws in their religion.
Just my 0.02$
Crusading, bad. Zealotry, bad. Dietary evalgelism, bad. I think we all agree on that. But it's the PEOPLE that carry out these behaviors, not the diet. So it seems contradictory to say that there's nothing wrong with these people.
Calling a diet "absurd" and the people "misguided" seems to carry connotations of reverse crusading, reverse zealotry and reverse evangelism.
Regardless of what we choose as our own diet or regardless of what diet we see others choose, it seems to me that acceptance of results in one's own experience while at the same time accepting the experience of others is way more constructive all around.
There are a handful of diets that I think are pretty solid...paleo isn't really one of them. I think it's absurd because it says that certain whole foods are "bad"...sorry, but there are no "bad" whole foods...that in and of itself qualifies as absurd...whole foods are chalk full of nutrition...I will call any diet that says these certain whole foods are bad absurd.
I say misguided because there are truly people out there who actually think that these particular whole foods are bad...not because they know anything about nutrition...but because they've bought into something...beans are "bad" is misguided plain and simple...that's not reverse crusading or zealotry...they simply aren't coming with anything factually solid...
I understand your sentiment actually. On the surface, I completely agree with calling any whole foods "bad", and that certainly sounds offputting from a common sense perspective, as it doesn't jive with the sentiment of the principles of ancestral eating. There are many nuances, however, and some versions of the diet have much more reasonable appeal because they allow for tailoring of an ancestral diet based on personal trial and error. The more rigid versions, I agree are dogmatic and closed-minded. And that isn't good.0 -
I vote for primal paleo. It has changed our lives and we've never felt better. However, even on the plan, you have to find what works for you. I realized I needed a piece of fruit in the afternoon while my BF did not. So still listen to your body but huge fan of primal paleo. I've had to buy all new clothes - twice!
What is primal peleo?
I ask because it brought this image to mind.....
This isn't funny SLLRunner. Eating right and getting your body in a good place is a very serious topic for people.
Oh please, it's humor to go with the question, which you have no answered.
What IS primal paleo, please?
I looked this up on the google 'Primal' generally refers to Mark Sisson's Primal Blueprint way of eating which is very similar to Paleo, but allows some leeway with certain types of dairy and has fewer restrictions on saturated fat intake. Throughout this book, we use “Paleo” and “Primal” as interchangeable terms.0 -
I vote for primal paleo. It has changed our lives and we've never felt better. However, even on the plan, you have to find what works for you. I realized I needed a piece of fruit in the afternoon while my BF did not. So still listen to your body but huge fan of primal paleo. I've had to buy all new clothes - twice!
What is primal peleo?
I ask because it brought this image to mind.....
This isn't funny SLLRunner. Eating right and getting your body in a good place is a very serious topic for people.
Oh please, it's humor to go with the question, which you have no answered.
What IS primal paleo, please?
I looked this up on the google 'Primal' generally refers to Mark Sisson's Primal Blueprint way of eating which is very similar to Paleo, but allows some leeway with certain types of dairy and has fewer restrictions on saturated fat intake. Throughout this book, we use “Paleo” and “Primal” as interchangeable terms.
Yeah, it's Sisson's Primal that has worked for me. It doesn't just focus on diet however - it's more of an integrative approach.0 -
@newmeadow were you ever tested for celiac? The problems you had before are symptoms of celiac and Paleo you don't eat the gluten which would help you heal. I guess you can't be tested for it now unless you ad gluten back into your diet.0
This discussion has been closed.
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