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Self-control is a limited resource, and what this means for your diet
ugofatcat
Posts: 385 Member
in Debate Club
If you have 5 minutes, please watch this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaNt-tcnm6Q
My takeaway is that you only get so much self-control for the day, and once you use it up, it is easy to fall back into old bad habits. When you try to change a bunch of things in your life, it is easy to get discouraged easily and give up because you run out of self-control quickly.
On the other hand, if you pick one thing to change and just focus on that, you won’t deplete your self-control as quickly, and it will be easier to maintain this change. Once this change becomes a habit and it no longer takes self-control, add another change.
Agree or disagree? Has this been your experience with weight loss? Did you change things gradually, or make a whole bunch of changes overnight?
Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaNt-tcnm6QMy takeaway is that you only get so much self-control for the day, and once you use it up, it is easy to fall back into old bad habits. When you try to change a bunch of things in your life, it is easy to get discouraged easily and give up because you run out of self-control quickly.
On the other hand, if you pick one thing to change and just focus on that, you won’t deplete your self-control as quickly, and it will be easier to maintain this change. Once this change becomes a habit and it no longer takes self-control, add another change.
Agree or disagree? Has this been your experience with weight loss? Did you change things gradually, or make a whole bunch of changes overnight?
Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts.
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Replies
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I pretty much made small, incremental changes to my habits...chipping away at bad ones and incorporating better ones.
I don't think I've ever seen anyone make whole sale, 180* changes overnight and have any kind of long term success with anything. It also fosters an all or nothing mentality which will ultimately be detrimental to long term success.20 -
Of course I agree. I stopped buying sweets etc and then try to control myself around it at home. I can resist temptation for five minutes twice a week, not 24/7.
This time around I started out like I always did, by replacing junk food with oatmeal and salads and lean protein - and I would have fallen back to the junk if I hadn't discovered MFP. An amazing evolution happened (and is still happening). Now I'm eating quite like when I was growing up - regular meals, home cooked food, ordinary food for ordinary days, special food for special occasions - but portions and meal times are much more in line with my appetite, and of course I get to decide what's on the menu myself, every day
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kommodevaran wrote: »Of course I agree. I stopped buying sweets etc and then try to control myself around it at home. I can resist temptation for five minutes twice a week, not 24/7.
I hear you! I can ignore all the sweets in the grocery store without a second thought. But having them at home in the cabinet? I can't stop thinking about them and I will end up eating the whole package. I have just learned I can't be trusted and I cannot keep anything I will binge eat.
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I agree. When I finally decided I was ready to lose weight and keep it off, I began with a series of small changes. A walk during my lunch break. Getting seven hours of sleep per night. Eating five servings of fresh vegetables per day. Then I discovered calorie counting and logging and adopted them.
I would focus on each of these until they became automatic and then I picked something new to add. I never felt like my life really *changed* although on the surface a lot about my life has changed since 2014.
If I miss a habit one day, like getting five hours sleep instead of seven because I stayed up watching a movie with my husband, then I'm back on it the next day because now it's just a habit. It's the way I live my life, not an endless series of resolutions that I'm having to force myself to keep. When you have true patterns in your life, the exceptions are never going to matter than much.
I'm still picking things and trying them out. Some make me feel better and I keep them. Other potential habits are discarded after a few weeks because I don't notice them adding anything to my quality of life.
I have habits now I never could have *dreamed* would be automatic for me in 2014. I virtually always am asleep by 10 PM. I regularly exercise before work. I prepare dinner at home six nights a week.18 -
I'm pretty sure all of my self-control goes towards getting out of the bed before 7 am. I'm screwed.32
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I changed everything in the same week.
Started counting calories, just a shaving of portion sizes- very little in dietary modifications (ie:after my first tasty pint of micro brewed ale I would switch to a light beer, sob).
Started exercising for the first time in my life. Aquafit 60x3 a week at 6pm. (Never got to love any exercise, just the benefits in real life activities.)
Did this for a year to lose the weight and aquire a reasonable fitness level not deviating.
Almost 8 years on these are still my basics, but I deviate now. Will almost always (except on vacation, sick, planned break, etc) do my 3 days at 6 pm of whatever routine is my main focus, but now tend to do 3 alternating days of secondary routines. Light beer may make it on the table; might not.
I think it depends on how much one has to change. The exercise was a killer for me, not the food. I couldn't take a day off working out at first or I would never have gone back- now it is habit, like cleaning the toilets.
Cheers, h.8 -
It is proven by science that self-control, or will-power is a limited and diminishing resource. I began my weight loss journey either vaguely aware or completely ignorant of that. After a few events of my having tried to practice self-control in some area, not just food, only to discover a failure and an excess when that failed, I tried to find ways of changing my approach to each issue so that self-control was not involved. That worked. Later I read the academic research on the topic and it served as confirmation bias. There are ways to structure your habits and plans which meet all your calorie and activity goals without depleting your will-power. You just have to find the unique ways that work for you.8
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To me, what this experiment (and by experiment I mean these things that psychologists and other soft scientists conduct on college students, then dress up with a lot of turgid terminology, and publish in journals reviewed by other soft scientists, that are later proven to be absolutely wrong) says is that radishes are the worst and suck out your will to live. While cookies, on the other hand, give you a great dopamine boost and get you all jacked up with energy so you can do an awesome job at whatever task you are facing.
I don't think it's so much self-control as, why would you even want to do a good job for these manipulative punks that put cookies in front of you and don't let you eat them? Screw those punks! 14 -
French_Peasant wrote: »To me, what this experiment (and by experiment I mean these things that psychologists and other soft scientists conduct on college students, then dress up with a lot of turgid terminology, and publish in journals reviewed by other soft scientists, that are later proven to be absolutely wrong) says is that radishes are the worst and suck out your will to live. While cookies, on the other hand, give you a great dopamine boost and get you all jacked up with energy so you can do an awesome job at whatever task you are facing.
I don't think it's so much self-control as, why would you even want to do a good job for these manipulative punks that put cookies in front of you and don't let you eat them? Screw those punks!
On their own? Yes.
But, put them on top of some vanilla soft serve? Oh, Canada, that's F'ing good.
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French_Peasant wrote: »To me, what this experiment (and by experiment I mean these things that psychologists and other soft scientists conduct on college students, then dress up with a lot of turgid terminology, and publish in journals reviewed by other soft scientists, that are later proven to be absolutely wrong) says is that radishes are the worst and suck out your will to live. While cookies, on the other hand, give you a great dopamine boost and get you all jacked up with energy so you can do an awesome job at whatever task you are facing.
I don't think it's so much self-control as, why would you even want to do a good job for these manipulative punks that put cookies in front of you and don't let you eat them? Screw those punks!
On their own? Yes.
But, put them on top of some vanilla soft serve? Oh, Canada, that's F'ing good.
Wait, you're talking about putting the cookies on the soft serve, right?
I grow these beautiful heirloom radishes, and every spring enjoy a few with a light dusting of freshly cracked sea salt and black pepper....then I'm like, screw that! Hope they enjoy them at the food bank, because they get a lot from me! (Kale too! Another plant that would lead to bitterness and rage if presented side by side with chocolate chips!)
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French_Peasant wrote: »To me, what this experiment (and by experiment I mean these things that psychologists and other soft scientists conduct on college students, then dress up with a lot of turgid terminology, and publish in journals reviewed by other soft scientists, that are later proven to be absolutely wrong) says is that radishes are the worst and suck out your will to live. While cookies, on the other hand, give you a great dopamine boost and get you all jacked up with energy so you can do an awesome job at whatever task you are facing.
I don't think it's so much self-control as, why would you even want to do a good job for these manipulative punks that put cookies in front of you and don't let you eat them? Screw those punks!
On their own? Yes.
But, put them on top of some vanilla soft serve? Oh, Canada, that's F'ing good.
Radishes on ice cream?
Canadians.
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Huh. Good thing my eating habits are borderline robotic.2
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Gallowmere1984 wrote: »Huh. Good thing my eating habits are borderline robotic.
Mine too. I eat the same subset of foods day in and day out. It's how I've always eaten and it does become robotic.
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Self control is fatiguing. I don't "fit it what I want everyday" like so many MFP members go on and on about. I eat my dang veg, protein, enjoy a choclately protein bar and that's that. When I want to indulge in something I go all out.9
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See this video discusses the same experiment.If you have
My takeaway is that you only get so much self-control for the day, and once you use it up, it is easy to fall back into old bad habits. When you try to change a bunch of things in your life, it is easy to get discouraged easily and give up because you run out of self-control quickly.
On the other hand, if you pick one thing to change and just focus on that, you won’t deplete your self-control as quickly, and it will be easier to maintain this change. Once this change becomes a habit and it no longer takes self-control, add another change.
Agree or disagree? Has this been your experience with weight loss? Did you change things gradually, or make a whole bunch of changes overnight?
Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2MDNvKXdLEM 6 -
Self control is fatiguing. I don't "fit it what I want everyday" like so many MFP members go on and on about. I eat my dang veg, protein, enjoy a choclately protein bar and that's that. When I want to indulge in something I go all out.
This. As I have said before, I don't eat some pizza; I eat all of the pizza. This is limited to intentional overfeeds though, I stick to a medium "all of the everything" toppings, and I only bother if a bulk stalls.2 -
Two points (both very cliche, but I find them true):
1. self-control is a muscle, it gets stronger the more you use it.
2. building new habits takes self-control out of the picture.
When I first started losing, the only thing I did was track my intake. I didn't try to eat healthier, I just tried to stay within my calories. When that felt easy (was a new habit so I did it automatically), I started to pay more attention to my macros, mainly protein. I slightly adjusted the foods I was eating so that I could hit that goal. When that seemed easy (built a new habit), I started paying more attention to fiber. and so on and so on.
It doesn't take me any measure of self control to only eat one serving of ice cream or only 2 slices of pizza any more. It's just what I do. I don't even think "Oh I wish I could have more". I've been weighing out one serving of ice cream for so long that it doesn't even cross my mind that I should want more. Habits are strong and its completely possible to create new ones to replace the old.
I highly recommend reading "The Power of Habit" by Charles Duhigg. Boring title, really interesting book.17 -
I think some people just have more selfcontrol than others do. Some cave right away, and some never give in once they've made up their minds.4
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@SingRunTing I will have to add that to my reading list. I am the opposite of you. I can't stop with just one serving of ice cream, I will eat it until it is gone. I don't trust myself so I just don't keep it in the house.
My fiancé got a whole bunch of mini snickers for Valentine's day. I told him he needs to bring them to work or throw them away, I cannot stop myself once I start. I envy your ability to stop.4 -
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My experience and observation of weight loss-
It is easier to be successful long term when you work with your preferences and habits rather than trying to completely change your lifestyle.
You decide to go on the radish diet. The rest of your world does not change the minute you decide to lose weight. You may try to eat only radishes even though you love sweets or pizza. You get up at 4 AM to exercise for 2 hours. Your family still bakes cookies rather than radishes and wants to watch tv rather than go to the gym. Your co-workers bring in food that doesn't fit the radish diet. The friends who like to eat out or drink still want to do that. . You resent people and feel like they are sabotaging you. If you go into super-restrictive-change-everything diet mode you will lose some weight but it is hard work all day, every day. You will wear down, drop the radish diet, eat whole pizzas and eventually regain. You didn't really learn how to live and eat like a smaller version of you in your world.
You might instead make smaller changes like sticking to a reasonable calorie goal, moderate exercise, walking more places, getting enough protein, putting more vegetables on your plate, drinking coffee without sugar or cream, decide you can have a burger with a salad instead of fries or 2 cookies instead of 12. You might make several of these small changes at once but not feel stressed about it. It will be easier to sustain.
Self control is easier/greater when you are mostly doing what you already want and like to do.
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See this video discusses the same experiment.If you have
My takeaway is that you only get so much self-control for the day, and once you use it up, it is easy to fall back into old bad habits. When you try to change a bunch of things in your life, it is easy to get discouraged easily and give up because you run out of self-control quickly.
On the other hand, if you pick one thing to change and just focus on that, you won’t deplete your self-control as quickly, and it will be easier to maintain this change. Once this change becomes a habit and it no longer takes self-control, add another change.
Agree or disagree? Has this been your experience with weight loss? Did you change things gradually, or make a whole bunch of changes overnight?
Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts.https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2MDNvKXdLEM
I did watch the video. My take away was not to jump to conclusions based on a single study.3 -
Change is very hard for me. I'm a creature of extreme routine, to the point that I have been called robotic. Alteration of the routine is not something that I handle really well, and will virtually never do on my own.
Losing weight for me, changing that, I changed everything at once and then decided the old me was dead and there was an alternate, new me who never lived that life before. For me it's like skydiving. Once you're out of the plane, you can't get back in. You have no choice but to stay on that ride until it ends.
Well, that's how I view my new life. Completely different from the old, and the only way it changes is if I die.3 -
Self control is like a muscle. The more you use it, the stronger it gets. Certainly there are limits, but you'll notice a HUGE disparity in levels of self control between individuals that seems to coincide suspiciously with how frequently they apply self-control in their lives.
Just my 2c.3 -
On the video, there is the assumption that everybody likes chocolate chip cookies. I will personally fail the experiment because I don’t like cookies of any kind, especially chocolate chip, and even more if they are just baked. The smell is nauseating to me and eating them will give me a stomach ache. On the other hand, I love radishes.
On the second experiment, I will also fail because I think that the little white bear was adorable and it would be very difficult to take him/her out of my mind but it would not exhaust me mentally.
In my opinion, the bottom line is that we can’t make general assumptions about self-control or temptations because we are all different and what for some people may be hard to resist for others is not a big deal.
Now I want radishes…
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I totally agree with the idea of self-control fatigue. My work is mentally exhausting, and when I am tired and hungry at the end of the day I tend to make poor food choices, avoid exercise, etc. I am trying to limit the amount of time spent making decisions about food and trying to make decisions on nutrition when I am not hungry.
I have started doing intermittent fasting (I have a 4-8 hour eating window depending on my schedule). I skip breakfast and instead have 2-3 glasses of water and coffee and then fast in the AM when my willpower is at its highest. I am not as hungry in the morning as I would have expected. Then I eat a packed lunch so that I don't have to make decisions at a cafeteria when I am really hungry (I tend to buy bigger portions or more unhealthy food if I choose when I am hungry). Then I eat a dinner that I have prepped in advance or that is super quick to cook as soon as I get home from work. I tend to do meal prep after I eat dinner and I make a meal with about 4 portions and eat them over the next 2-3 days.
I have found that intermittent fasting and meal prepping a few meals in advance has cut down on the amount of time I spend thinking about what to eat and how much....and cuts down on the amount of willpower required. I feel much less focused on food. I also like having larger meals which works well for IF. I also don't need to calorie count with IF if I am eating healthy food and divide it into reasonable portions in advance. I plugged the last few days into MFP out of curiosity and I have been eating 1500 cal - and it doesn't feel like I am dieting. I've lost about 15lb so far and it has been the simplest/most effortless weight loss that I have ever done.1 -
I think it's an interesting video. The controls were poorly thought out so all I could really take away is that there is such a thing as mental fatigue ( which I know is true from experience) and that mental fatigue affects self control. In the experiments there may have been other things at play...eating cookies gives you instant energy so the group that ate cookies and then worked longer probably did because of added energy, not because they had expended less thought about eating. Too, the point that the group not allowed to eat cookies where some may be disgruntled and therefore unmotivated to really try the tasks could have contributed to their shorter times...and not mental fatigue already made in this thread I agree with. Seemed to be a lot of assumptions going on. On the white bear experiment...same thing..I would have been like s c r e w you thought police and been daydreaming about polar bears while simultaneously writing an essay. There is no way of knowing what the groups were thinking.
I think self control and mental energy are more complex than what these experiments have assumed. I also didn't agree that self control is linked to persistence in the face of failure like the video is saying. Isn't there a quote about doing the same thing but expecting different results being the definition of madness? Yeah, well persistence in the face of failure sounds an awful lot like that. Self control...well every second you are in control of yourself is a success...so I don't see self control as an exercise in experiencing failure.2 -
Steve Kamb? Komb? from Nerd Fitness did this article/blog/whatever about 6-7 years ago.
It's been hugely implemental for myself and for others I speak with on being kind do themselves on making small changes.
It takes time to get good at anything. And discipline isn't unending- and not something people just *have*- so I think it's a good jumping off point for people.0 -
If you want an entirely different take which leaves the idea of self-control out of the equation, check out Abraham Hicks. Not for everyone but can be life-changing.0
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