Occasional middle back pain - feels like cramp?

maryjaquiss

Maybe a bit of a long shot, but has anyone had any experiences of cramp-like middle back pain (it's on the right hand side if that makes a difference)? It's quite painful when it comes on but is only lasting for maximum about two seconds at a time. I feel like it must be a result of exercise but I've not noticed anything specifically aggravating it (I run, I'm doing the You Are Your Own Gym bodyweight routine and occasionally a bit of yoga when I feel like I need a stretch). I get that I should probably see a doctor but it doesn't seem worth it given it's not that frequent and lasting for such a short amount of time.

Lizarking

i get it constantly. usually after a lot of rowing type work. lacrosse ball SMR seems to help.

macgurlnet

Might be worth seeing a physical therapist - I have a tight spot in my back that's partially caused by a tight piriformis on the right along with a tight right pec. I'm sure there's other things contributing too. We're working on loosening up those muscles, and my overall pain has decreased a lot in the last couple months.

Do you stretch and/or foam roll after exercise?

~Lyssa

AliNouveau

I get something similar and I attribute it to an unhealed rib injury because if I poke around my ribs will hurt. Or it's gall bladder cancer cause that's what Dr. Google tells me. (I'm joking about the cancer...both my dad and father in law had that and had different symptoms)

maryjaquiss

@macgurlnet I have to admit, I'm pretty bad at stretching if I need to rush off and do something else... need to look into foam rolling, I've been meaning to for a while!

@AliNouveau and this is why I have avoided googling!! It feels like it's kind of in the rib region but beneath the ribs?

I'm wondering if it may be caused by posture (full-time desk job) or picking up an increasingly heavy toddler without thinking about how to lift him properly...

macgurlnet

maryjaquiss wrote: »

@macgurlnet I have to admit, I'm pretty bad at stretching if I need to rush off and do something else... need to look into foam rolling, I've been meaning to for a while!

@AliNouveau and this is why I have avoided googling!! It feels like it's kind of in the rib region but beneath the ribs?

I'm wondering if it may be caused by posture (full-time desk job) or picking up an increasingly heavy toddler without thinking about how to lift him properly...

That sounds like me...I lifted my backpack wrong, tweaked my shoulder, work a desk job and upped my activity without properly stretching. And now, here I am!!

This video shows the stretch I do for my pec - I really, really recommend seeing a PT if possible so they can help, as it'll be much easier to give advice if they can see how you move, check the muscles themselves, etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRY9-4VTCcw

Here's some post-run stretches - I don't do all of them, but I do stretch those muscles. https://www.runnersworld.co.uk/health/the-rw-complete-guide-to-stretching-for-runners

~Lyssa

maryjaquiss

I can get money towards physio through my work so no excuse really, is there?!

macgurlnet

maryjaquiss wrote: »

I can get money towards physio through my work so no excuse really, is there?!

Nope!! Once I realized that seeing a PT would only be $65/visit for me, I made sure I got in and plan to keep going until I'm pain free.

Best wishes

~Lyssa

DebLaBounty

A visit or two to the PT is well worth it. I was able to go twice or three times, and the PT gave me exercises to do that I can do on my own at home. It was a very helpful education.

Spliner1969

maryjaquiss wrote: »

Maybe a bit of a long shot, but has anyone had any experiences of cramp-like middle back pain (it's on the right hand side if that makes a difference)? It's quite painful when it comes on but is only lasting for maximum about two seconds at a time. I feel like it must be a result of exercise but I've not noticed anything specifically aggravating it (I run, I'm doing the You Are Your Own Gym bodyweight routine and occasionally a bit of yoga when I feel like I need a stretch). I get that I should probably see a doctor but it doesn't seem worth it given it's not that frequent and lasting for such a short amount of time.

I get this from time to time but I do a LOT of pushups and rows, as well as inverted rows during my routine. It stresses the muscles in the upper and mid-back. It's likely just a cramp or fatigue. If it was re-occuring dead center or left side you might need to talk to your doctor (IE: heart issues), but on the right it's likely a rib pull/muscle cramp/etc. Take an extra rest day, increase water intake, and consider increasing Zinc, Magnesium. I take a supplement called ZMA for this reason (can be found on Amazon pretty easily), or will simply take extra Magnesium and Zinc to help support muscles. A multivitamin may have enough, but they typically push me too far over what I'm comfortable with for Vitamin C so I skip those and simply take Zinc and Magnesium (or ZMA) along with my Glucosamine MSM supplement (which has plenty of Vitamin C in it).

stanmann571

Define mid back?

It could be a shoulder or neck injury.

I have a partially dislocated shoulder from working a desk for 20+ years.

It manifests as a cramp sensation below my right shoulder blade.

lorrpb

I've always got a cramp or spasm somewhere. One spot works itself out and something pops up in another spot. I don't think my whole body can be happy at the same time for very long.

lovetolose17

I get this nearly daily. A chiropractic adjustment helps, as does lying on a foam roller and moving my arms like making snow angels. I also use a tennis ball to hit the specific spot. It's definitely muscular for me (though I have self diagnosed several cancers). One chiro told me my ribs move out of where they are supposed to be. A sports medicine doctor called it costochondritis, but another doc said that would only be on the front of my chest. Whatever.

lorrpb

lovetolose17 wrote: »

I get this nearly daily. A chiropractic adjustment helps, as does lying on a foam roller and moving my arms like making snow angels. I also use a tennis ball to hit the specific spot. It's definitely muscular for me (though I have self diagnosed several cancers). One chiro told me my ribs move out of where they are supposed to be. A sports medicine doctor called it costochondritis, but another doc said that would only be on the front of my chest. Whatever.

Doctors (and most health professionals) are not that great with ill-defined muscle issues. An acute sprain, tear, herniated disc, etc, yes, but not most aches and pains. Unfortunately. I'm not putting down any one who is highly trained in many areas, but this is not one of them. Even when a professional does specialize, even a phys therapist, etc., you often end up with a person's perspective and not necessarily something that helps YOU. If you don't fit a preconceived mold, SOL. Voice of experience speaking.

maryjaquiss

@stanmann571 It's below my shoulder blade, 'behind' my ribs, just to the right of my spine!

@Spliner1969 I have been doing more push ups and inverted rows, so they may well be the culprit! Though interestingly I tried a bodyweight workout last night with the aim of stopping if my back complained, and it completely got rid of it for the whole of the rest of the day until I got back to my desk... so maybe it's a desk thing!

maryjaquiss

Thank you everyone else for your advice and comments

stanmann571

maryjaquiss wrote: »

@stanmann571 It's below my shoulder blade, 'behind' my ribs, just to the right of my spine!

@Spliner1969 I have been doing more push ups and inverted rows, so they may well be the culprit! Though interestingly I tried a bodyweight workout last night with the aim of stopping if my back complained, and it completely got rid of it for the whole of the rest of the day until I got back to my desk... so maybe it's a desk thing!

What do you mean "behind" your ribs?

But yeah, that sounds about right.

If you're doing Pushups/rows without "packing your shoulder" You can definitely make it worse.

maryjaquiss

@stanmann571 Sorry, it's hard to explain! I mean it feels to me like cramp in an internal muscle, not right at the surface like a bruise and not deep inside like internal organs! Maybe the muscles between the ribs?

stanmann571

maryjaquiss wrote: »

@stanmann571 Sorry, it's hard to explain! I mean it feels to me like cramp in an internal muscle, not right at the surface like a bruise and not deep inside like internal organs! Maybe the muscles between the ribs?

Like one of the muscles that ties the ribs to the shoulder blade? or lower and deeper?

maryjaquiss

stanmann571 wrote: »

maryjaquiss wrote: »

@stanmann571 Sorry, it's hard to explain! I mean it feels to me like cramp in an internal muscle, not right at the surface like a bruise and not deep inside like internal organs! Maybe the muscles between the ribs?

Like one of the muscles that ties the ribs to the shoulder blade? or lower and deeper?

If it comes on again, I'll circle approximately on a diagram! Can't remember exactly at the moment

stanmann571

maryjaquiss wrote: »

stanmann571 wrote: »

maryjaquiss wrote: »

@stanmann571 Sorry, it's hard to explain! I mean it feels to me like cramp in an internal muscle, not right at the surface like a bruise and not deep inside like internal organs! Maybe the muscles between the ribs?

Like one of the muscles that ties the ribs to the shoulder blade? or lower and deeper?

If it comes on again, I'll circle approximately on a diagram! Can't remember exactly at the moment

Thanks. Mine[which is mostly caused by my shoulder, but also by some deficiencies in my chest(pec)] runs from "under" my shoulder blade to about 4 inches below and feels like a fairly constant cramp.

Spliner1969

maryjaquiss wrote: »

@stanmann571 It's below my shoulder blade, 'behind' my ribs, just to the right of my spine!

@Spliner1969 I have been doing more push ups and inverted rows, so they may well be the culprit! Though interestingly I tried a bodyweight workout last night with the aim of stopping if my back complained, and it completely got rid of it for the whole of the rest of the day until I got back to my desk... so maybe it's a desk thing!

I hear you. I have a desk job as well, and it's generally when I'll also feel it the most. However, lately I have incorporated some stretches/yoga into the middle of my circuit training routine which helped a lot. Matter of fact I have not had the issue in a few weeks since starting it. I'll generally do body weight circuit training for 30-40 minutes, then do a mile run, then a mile walk/run home, then go back and do another 45 minutes of circuit training. Mid-way through that last set of circuits I'll stop, do some yoga stretches for my neck and shoulders then my back and then finish the workout. It's helped a bunch. As a matter of fact it got so bad for a while that I was also starting to have pain shooting down my right shoulder and into my right arm with it. The yoga has eliminated that as well as the mid-back muscle spasms. Food for thought.

maryjaquiss

OK so I circled approximately where it is on this lovely vintage anatomy diagram!

Right well this isn't working...

maryjaquiss

Trying again in a different browser!

stanmann571

maryjaquiss wrote: »

Trying again in a different browser!

Yup... that's about the spot. Probably shoulder or neck related. Especially since it's unilateral and I believe you suggested it's on your dominant side.

Monkey_Business

From your diagram, you can pretty much rule out any disk, or vertebra, or root nerves coming out from the spinal column damage (YEA). You really should stretch before exercise (even if it is supply simple).

maryjaquiss

Monkey_Business wrote: »

From your diagram, you can pretty much rule out any disk, or vertebra, or root nerves coming out from the spinal column damage (YEA). You really should stretch before exercise (even if it is supply simple).

I've always been told not to stretch before exercise? I do always warm up but it tends to be light cardio rather than stretching.

maryjaquiss

PS I am not particularly attached to this type of warm-up! Just wondering

stanmann571

maryjaquiss wrote: »

PS I am not particularly attached to this type of warm-up! Just wondering

Avoid static stretching, but strength/mobility "limbering" exercises/activities can help...

Before lifting I go through a serious of strength mobility exercises that help wake up my shoulder and pull it into the socket a bit more tightly.

Very similar to the series below.

http://www.orthop.washington.edu/?q=patient-care/articles/shoulder/home-exercises-for-the-unstable-shoulder.html

Spliner1969

maryjaquiss wrote: »

I've always been told not to stretch before exercise? I do always warm up but it tends to be light cardio rather than stretching.

I have spinal stenosis, previous lamenectomy (L4/L5), previous herniated discs L4/L5, L3/L4, and L2/L3. If I don't stretch in the morning I can barely brush my teeth. Leaning over the sink hurts that much. But once I stretch out the shoulders, neck, lower back using some yoga poses (takes very little time) I'm fine the rest of the day. So working out without stretching is not an option for me. Personally I think all the 'don't stretch before exercise' is silly, I've always done it.

canadianlbs

is it under the shoulderblade? diagnosing strangers online in this way is pretty iffy, but fwiw i had something in that zone (constant tenderness, not cramp) and i resolved it with a combination of releasing my pec minor and levator scapula muscles, and learning to activate (and strengthen) my lower traps.

basically, in my case my lower scapular stabilizers were not nearly strong enough for the situations that i was putting them in, so my shoulderblade itself was sort of trying to crawl up and over my collarbone thanks to the higher muscles just taking over. that left the lower edges of it just waving around and everything that has anything to do with that part of my body got really pissed off about it. learning to release and properly settle my shoulderblades changed a lot of things in my life.

if you haven't heard of trigger points, you might find it useful to buy a lacrosse ball and then google them. tons of anatomy lessons and maps to those particular points per muscle online. i also personally loooooooooove those little inch-wide super-bounce balls you can buy in the party favours section of loonie stores. could be bigger people don't need them, but i find there ain't nothing like them for getting into the little muscle crannies of someone my size.