Bodyweight exercise vs. Weightlifting
dws00
Posts: 159 Member
What are your opinions on an all body weight workout program vs. lifting weights in a gym.
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Replies
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Agh, body weight exercises! The availability of them!3
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I think they each have their place depending on someone's goals.4
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bodyweight is great if you don't have weights, there is a whole lot you can do. And if you do have weights, you should still have some bodyweight exercises in your routine.2
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I have been told bodyweight exercises are less likely to cause injury because you work within your natural limits and range of motion. Weightlifting is especially hard on the shoulders, particularly the muscles that comprise the rotator cuff. I'm not qualified to declare these statements truth but I do trust the who have said these things to me--my chiropractor, my massage therapist, my physiotherapist and my trainer. YMMV1
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born_of_fire74 wrote: »I have been told bodyweight exercises are less likely to cause injury because you work within your natural limits and range of motion. Weightlifting is especially hard on the shoulders, particularly the muscles that comprise the rotator cuff. I'm not qualified to declare these statements truth but I do trust the who have said these things to me--my chiropractor, my massage therapist, my physiotherapist and my trainer. YMMV
none of that is true. you can hurt yourself with body weight just as easily as with weights. poor form among other things causes injuries.7 -
born_of_fire74 wrote: »I have been told bodyweight exercises are less likely to cause injury because you work within your natural limits and range of motion. Weightlifting is especially hard on the shoulders, particularly the muscles that comprise the rotator cuff. I'm not qualified to declare these statements truth but I do trust the who have said these things to me--my chiropractor, my massage therapist, my physiotherapist and my trainer. YMMV
I've only hurt myself when I smashed fingers with weights. If you use bad form or if you ego lift you can hurt yourself with weights. If you use bad form or don't take into consideration variety and volume while using body weight you can develop imbalances and hurt yourself in the long run.1 -
Effect of an exercise will depend largely on the resistance. You cannot characterize all "body weight" exercises vs all "weight lifting" exercise without addressing relative resistance. A pushup that represents an 8RM level of resistance, for example, will have similar muscle activation as an 8 RM bench press with a barbell. (There is research to support this).
It's always unfortunate when health professionals make general blanket statements about exercise. There is very little about exercise training that is black and white.4 -
Effect of an exercise will depend largely on the resistance. You cannot characterize all "body weight" exercises vs all "weight lifting" exercise without addressing relative resistance. A pushup that represents an 8RM level of resistance, for example, will have similar muscle activation as an 8 RM bench press with a barbell. (There is research to support this).
It's always unfortunate when health professionals make general blanket statements about exercise. There is very little about exercise training that is black and white.
It is very possible that they said things in regards to me only due to my past injuries, fitness level, form, posture etc. rather than regarding all people in general. I qualified my statements quite carefully so as not to mislead the OP.
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Body weight workout is very important to build a strong foundation. Eventually you would need resistance (weights) as you progress. Sadly some look down on Bodyweight exercises.1
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I work out at home with light (up to 10lb) dumbbells as well as bodyweight (and in some cases, one progresses to the other. For example, I've gone from 2 sets of forward lunges, 10 reps each with no weights to 2 sets of 12 with 5lb dumbbells). My core workout (bicycle crunches, bird dogs, and planks) are all bodyweight. I also do half push-ups, bracing on a cardio step.
They're part of my routine, just like the dumbbells and I don't believe either is superior/inferior to the other.0 -
I dunno, I enjoy doing both. I'm liking the results I'm getting, so there's that. I believe it depends on what all you're doing, what you're aiming for, etc.2
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I incorporate both. I can develop sore muscles from either.3
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I used to do weights but when I started doing Insanity Max30 I actually hurt myself twice trying to do both. Max30 incorporates a lot of bodyweight exercises. Interestingly enough, I never saw results lifting the way I do with the bodyweight routines.0
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The best body weight exercises are compound exercises that work multiple muscle groups.
For the upper body, those are pushups, pullups and dips. You easily can increase the difficulty of these exercises by wearing a weighted vest. I incorporate these as a regular part supplement to my lifting program.
I prefer a weighted vest to other devices because it is more comfortable and rasily adaptable to different exercises and body positions.
For the lower body, the best exercises that come to mind are squats, stair climbing snd lunges, which can also be done with a weighted vest but for squats you really won't get the maximum benefit unkess you use a much heavier barbell.
Not sure if it's qualifies as a body weight exercise but farmer's walks with dumbells or farmer's handles is also an excellent total body exercise. It's just walking with weights but to much harder and more demanding.2 -
The best body weight exercises are compound exercises that work multiple muscle groups.
For the upper body, those are pushups, pullups and dips. You easily can increase the difficulty of these exercises by wearing a weighted vest. I incorporate these as a regular part supplement to my lifting program.
I prefer a weighted vest to other devices because it is more comfortable and rasily adaptable to different exercises and body positions.
For the lower body, the best exercises that come to mind are squats, stair climbing snd lunges, which can also be done with a weighted vest but for squats you really won't get the maximum benefit unkess you use a much heavier barbell.
Not sure if it's qualifies as a body weight exercise but farmer's walks with dumbells or farmer's handles is also an excellent total body exercise. It's just walking with weights but to much harder and more demanding.
For farmers walks to qualify as "bodyweight" exercise, I think you would have to carry two actual bodies.
At least that's what I've read.
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Both are excellent forms of resistance training. Calisthenics can provide nearly as excellent (IMO) aesthetic results as weights can and both can provide excellent strength adaptations, balance, and help keep strong bones/muscle mass. That being said, if you're main goal is to be as strong as physically possible (i.e. powerlifting or olympic lifting) weight have an advantage. If you want to perform certain skills on bars, rings, etc. then calisthenics has an advantage.
So... both are excellent and can be incorporated with success in anyone's overall routine.2 -
You can be "hard" on your body just doing body weight exercises. People get injured all the time just running, jumping, pulling themselves up, etc.born_of_fire74 wrote: »I have been told bodyweight exercises are less likely to cause injury because you work within your natural limits and range of motion. Weightlifting is especially hard on the shoulders, particularly the muscles that comprise the rotator cuff. I'm not qualified to declare these statements truth but I do trust the who have said these things to me--my chiropractor, my massage therapist, my physiotherapist and my trainer. YMMV
Where people get hurt weight lifting is usually due to bad form, bad execution, lack of focus and using more resistance than they can actual handle.
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Effect of an exercise will depend largely on the resistance. You cannot characterize all "body weight" exercises vs all "weight lifting" exercise without addressing relative resistance. A pushup that represents an 8RM level of resistance, for example, will have similar muscle activation as an 8 RM bench press with a barbell. (There is research to support this).
It's always unfortunate when health professionals make general blanket statements about exercise. There is very little about exercise training that is black and white.
Very insightful. A muscle can't tell if resistance is applied to it using bodyweight, a medicine ball, a dumbbell, exercise band or a rock.
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bodyweight is great if you don't have weights, there is a whole lot you can do. And if you do have weights, you should still have some bodyweight exercises in your routine.
Pretty much this. You can get really far and never need to lift an external weight if that's your choice. But if your primary focus is lifting weights, there is still a ton of value to incorporating at least a few bodyweight movements. One is not more or less inferior to the other.0 -
Any exercise is better than none. Bodyweight exercises are a great way to start off and later can be used for speed and endurance work.
Still some things I feel get glossed over and many feel that given the choice bodyweight is all that is needed. Let me ask this question given 3 people who would have easier time doing the below tasks? The 3 people are the same except the amount they lift. Person one can only squat and deadlift themselves with no extra weight. Person two can lift themselves and 50% of their bodyweight. Person 3 can lift themselves and 125% their bodyweight.- Lift a 5 year old child
- Lift a large full suitcase and backpack
- Move furniture
- Change tire
- Move cement bags for home improvement
- Move a larger color printer
IMHO person one likely doesn't do any exercise and would struggle quite a bit on any of these. Person 2 would likely do bodyweight exercises and could accomplish any of these goals but not as easily as person 3. Person 3 likely had to do some form of strength training with additional resistance. Once again personal opinion, strength makes everyday life easier. Every item you lift is a much lower percentage of your max.
The added benefit of higher strength is during awkward lifts you can be more out of perfect form and not injure yourself. Form is still paramount but sometimes it's hard to achieve say with a crying child. The added strength in your whole body including core from strength training acts as an insulator when dealing with weights that is a small percentage of your max. Not to say it will compensate if the lift was dumb just you can take a small shift in it better.
I am sorry but doing bodyweight squats is not going to give enough stress to encourage strength gains to compare with loading up the bar with 270lbs for me. I highly doubt it would for anyone at any weight. Most things I have read put optimal strength gains in the 3-6 rep range. You can gain strength at higher ranges but not nearly as quick. Hypertrophy, muscle gains, are in the 6-10 range and endurance is more in the 12-20 range if I remember right.
Once you reach a certain point bodyweight exercises will have diminishing returns on strength and muscle growth but increased returns on endurance. It's not that one is less than the other it's that there comes a time when they train different goals.1 -
born_of_fire74 wrote: »Effect of an exercise will depend largely on the resistance. You cannot characterize all "body weight" exercises vs all "weight lifting" exercise without addressing relative resistance. A pushup that represents an 8RM level of resistance, for example, will have similar muscle activation as an 8 RM bench press with a barbell. (There is research to support this).
It's always unfortunate when health professionals make general blanket statements about exercise. There is very little about exercise training that is black and white.
It is very possible that they said things in regards to me only due to my past injuries, fitness level, form, posture etc. rather than regarding all people in general. I qualified my statements quite carefully so as not to mislead the OP.
Also, the whole thing is a sliding scale, isn't it? I can tell you from experience that it's possible to injure yourself switching positions while laying on your couch binge watching Breaking Bad. But I would venture to guess that this activity is measurably safer than squatting your own body weight.4 -
i want to add that there are some body weight exercises you may never progress from , like conventional squats. you can easily max that out on your first squat and DL is pretty much impossible to do a body weight DL that will make a difference. But things like pullups and pushups, or handstand pushups, plank variations, All those can have lots of progression and some people may get very strong and still not be able to do a pullup because it is so hard. Do a bunch or burpees, do jump squats and do plyo stuff and you will progress in that. Using something like a TRX adds a new element into body weight exercises that takes it to a whole new level that you can continue progressing. Even jogging is a bw exercise2
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Body weight exercise is too hard for me. I hate it. It's terrible. Give me a barbell.
People who are good at it and run a program look great though.1 -
For farmers walks to qualify as "bodyweight" exercise, I think you would have to carry two actual bodies.
as you get stronger you can progress to carrying bodies of different sizes in each hand too.
to the actual question: i personally do the compound lifts/barbell thing. and i personally feel like i personally am copping out just a tiny bit doing it. note all the 'personally's in that to deflect another high holy war over something i don't hold any strong opinions about when it's other folks doing or not doing it.
i've gotten pretty good at dealing with a non-me weight like a barbell, but from everything i've seen (and tried), i'm pretty sure that bodyweight-only calls for a degree of isometic control and a type of strength it would take me a whole brand-new noob phase to learn. it was pretty enlightening to see the rest of my barbell club (and me) try to master the turkish getup, to take just one example i am kind of attached to out of the 'bodyweight' world.0 -
I love bodyweight exercises. I also like lifting. Both are fairly different for me. Lifting is a bit repetitive, but more of a zen moment as concentrate on my whole body I could hurt myself quite badly if I did a big lift incorrectly. I do love the variability of bodyweights though. In the past I did some intervals consisting of variations of pushups, squats, lunges and core exercises. About 50 seconds for each, with 10 seconds break to change position and come up with a new variation that I'd not used before. My record is about 16 variations each (left and right counts as two though). It's much more playful for me. I certainly get muscular, and just doing bodyweights at the moment has inproved my posture again and my abs are starting to show. I do build muscles quite easily though, being a woman in her 40s. Guess I'm lucky
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The best exercise routine is the one you actually do.
If you cannot do a weight routine then a bodyweight routine is the best one available.
When traveling unless the hotel has a gym (a good one not just one or two old residential quality machines well past their prime.) then it is a body weight routine for me. Hotel gyms sometimes have stupid hours as well, not always open early enough for my schedule.
I also travel with a set of bands. Airlines don’t charge as much for those as for as taking dumbbells.
Mix up the routines and not get stuck in one rut is the best. If I don’t travel and get my quota of body weight exercises in then I will do them at home instead of the weight routines as well.
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I think body weight exercises would become easier over time if you kept loosing weight.0
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Any exercise is better than none. Bodyweight exercises are a great way to start off and later can be used for speed and endurance work.
Still some things I feel get glossed over and many feel that given the choice bodyweight is all that is needed. Let me ask this question given 3 people who would have easier time doing the below tasks? The 3 people are the same except the amount they lift. Person one can only squat and deadlift themselves with no extra weight. Person two can lift themselves and 50% of their bodyweight. Person 3 can lift themselves and 125% their bodyweight.- Lift a 5 year old child
- Lift a large full suitcase and backpack
- Move furniture
- Change tire
- Move cement bags for home improvement
- Move a larger color printer
IMHO person one likely doesn't do any exercise and would struggle quite a bit on any of these. Person 2 would likely do bodyweight exercises and could accomplish any of these goals but not as easily as person 3. Person 3 likely had to do some form of strength training with additional resistance. Once again personal opinion, strength makes everyday life easier. Every item you lift is a much lower percentage of your max.
The added benefit of higher strength is during awkward lifts you can be more out of perfect form and not injure yourself. Form is still paramount but sometimes it's hard to achieve say with a crying child. The added strength in your whole body including core from strength training acts as an insulator when dealing with weights that is a small percentage of your max. Not to say it will compensate if the lift was dumb just you can take a small shift in it better.
I am sorry but doing bodyweight squats is not going to give enough stress to encourage strength gains to compare with loading up the bar with 270lbs for me. I highly doubt it would for anyone at any weight. Most things I have read put optimal strength gains in the 3-6 rep range. You can gain strength at higher ranges but not nearly as quick. Hypertrophy, muscle gains, are in the 6-10 range and endurance is more in the 12-20 range if I remember right.
Once you reach a certain point bodyweight exercises will have diminishing returns on strength and muscle growth but increased returns on endurance. It's not that one is less than the other it's that there comes a time when they train different goals.
This isn't a very valid analogy. It's like saying who could run 10 miles in an emergency situation faster. Someone who doesn't run, someone who runs 5k's on occasion or someone who trains for marathons year round.
And there is a LOT more leg exercises beyond BW squats. I can't even begin to count the number of single leg variants that can get very difficult. It's not to say that BW is the end all be all, but for a lot of people, it would more than suffice. People only think pf the basics, when there is a whole world of advanced movements that aren't only upper body related.1 -
I just got back from vacation visiting my brother/sister-in-law in Flagstaff AZ. They are rock climbers; bouldering, mostly. It's bodyweight lifting but it's hard because gravity. My sister-in-law is 40, 5' tall and ripped beyond belief. it was humbling to spend time with them hiking, climbing, creek swimming.1
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This isn't a very valid analogy. It's like saying who could run 10 miles in an emergency situation faster. Someone who doesn't run, someone who runs 5k's on occasion or someone who trains for marathons year round.
And there is a LOT more leg exercises beyond BW squats. I can't even begin to count the number of single leg variants that can get very difficult. It's not to say that BW is the end all be all, but for a lot of people, it would more than suffice. People only think pf the basics, when there is a whole world of advanced movements that aren't only upper body related.
Your comparison is like saying who could pickup a Honda CBR 400 in an emergency. Weight is around 350 dry but you would like not pick it up more shift it. Not a 50lbs child. For your runner example who would have easier time running 1mile? Not faster but easier? Should everyone train for marathons, not likely. But should everyone just walk and never get heart above 60%, once again not likely.
I never said bodyweight training was bad. I in fact said it was good for certain goals. So instead of advocating that something is "good enough", I am advocating that strength makes everyday tasks easier. To increase that strength most people should lift weights at some point to keep progressing.
Just like people should do any cardio few times a week, but at a certain point you'll need to increase volume or intensity to push your cardiovascular fitness.0
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