Heavy lifting while half marathon training - foolish?

Chieflrg

GiddyupTim wrote: »

rybo wrote: »

Yes you can. People do it all the time. Rest becomes more important, nutrition becomes more important, and scheduling. I assume you are just looking to finish & not set a blazing speed?

No,
You are going to find it really hard to get in the running mileage you need if you are trying to lift heavy three -- even just two -- times per week. You won't have enough time for recovery.
You can try it for a couple of weeks if you want. I think you'll see. Those runs the day after you lift will be really hard, really slow, and really miserable. And, after a couple of weeks, you will stop progressing in one activity or the other. Maybe both.
PS See the other comments above. Almost every one says: 'Yeah, I've done it. But I cut way back on my lifting' or 'Sure, but I stopped doing legs while I was training for my race.'

I've done it many times with running two halfs on the same weekend back to back days on more than one occasion.
It certainly possible with proper training including rest, conditioning, and nutrition.

It doesn't mean one will excell optimally at either, but nonetheless it's possible.

curlsintherack

if its foolish to do it before a half then I certainly should't be doing it on my training for a full. oops. Was deadlift day and I couldn't miss that.

hanlonsk

I am a turtle pace runner. I trained for my first half this spring. Gains were much slower on lifts, but they were still there. I had to face the fact that calories can only go so many places at once, and while training for the half, I made running the priority. If I didn't feel I had the energy for both, running happened and lifting didn't. I am also with others in that my legs were taking enough of a beating, and so leg work definitely took a back seat. I lowered weight and focused on form corrections.

Currently on a running ban from a running injury this summer. And my lifting is LOVING the focus and attention.

You can definitely do both. I think you just need to decide for a period which activity is your priority. It lets you know which one takes a back seat if you are short on time or fuel. If running is the priority, be prepared for terribly slow lifting gains. They still happen, just not as quickly.

KarenSmith2018

I CrossFit 4 days a week and run for 2. One shorter between 5 and 10km and the other longer between 10km and 10miles. It isn't my first half and I have been a runner for approx 5 years and have a good base running ability now. I have got a lot faster due to my strength gains in CrossFit. My CrossFit also hasn't suffered as during training as I have recently PB'd my squat and deadlift. I program to make sure I don't do heavy squats after a running day. Proper nutrition, good sleep and an understanding of what your body needs and wants is important.

Sounds like you run plenty already to me.

TavistockToad

lsutton484 wrote: »

if its foolish to do it before a half then I certainly should't be doing it on my training for a full. oops. Was deadlift day and I couldn't miss that.

Your mileage at the moment probably isn't any higher than OPs though...

curlsintherack

TavistockToad wrote: »

lsutton484 wrote: »

if its foolish to do it before a half then I certainly should't be doing it on my training for a full. oops. Was deadlift day and I couldn't miss that.

Your mileage at the moment probably isn't any higher than OPs though...

this is very true and a fact that I'm going to start regretting very soon.

GiddyupTim

Chieflrg wrote: »

GiddyupTim wrote: »

rybo wrote: »

Yes you can. People do it all the time. Rest becomes more important, nutrition becomes more important, and scheduling. I assume you are just looking to finish & not set a blazing speed?

No,
You are going to find it really hard to get in the running mileage you need if you are trying to lift heavy three -- even just two -- times per week. You won't have enough time for recovery.
You can try it for a couple of weeks if you want. I think you'll see. Those runs the day after you lift will be really hard, really slow, and really miserable. And, after a couple of weeks, you will stop progressing in one activity or the other. Maybe both.
PS See the other comments above. Almost every one says: 'Yeah, I've done it. But I cut way back on my lifting' or 'Sure, but I stopped doing legs while I was training for my race.'

I've done it many times with running two halfs on the same weekend back to back days on more than one occasion.
It certainly possible with proper training including rest, conditioning, and nutrition.

It doesn't mean one will excell optimally at either, but nonetheless it's possible.

Of course you can do it.
Shoot, we all want to be fast. We all want to be strong. We all want to be agile and attractive.
Many of us want to work hard and are not averse to suffering.
I lift. I do Crossfit. I run. I play tennis and bike. I ski. I used to play soccer.
But I would be foolish to think there aren't trade-offs for every thing I do.
Because tennis is competitive, I can tell you that, without a doubt, I do not play as well as I can the day after an 8-mile run.
Are you going to tell me that, the day after a heavy leg day in the gym, with squats and deadlifts, that your legs are not going to be tired the next day? Perhaps for two days, in you went really hard? (The scientific evidence actually shows it is two days or more.)
Or tell me that the day after, when your legs are tired, you are not going to be a slower runner?
We all need recovery. It is a fact.
I stand by what I said. Go back and read all the posts. Many of them say: "Yes, you can do both. I do." But, most of those also say: "Er....Well, I cut back on my lifting when my biking season ramps up" or "Actually, I don't do legs much during the race season" or "I do both, but I don't squat the day after a long run."
We want it all. Doesn't mean we can have it all.

MobyCarp

Keira08 wrote: »

So I've been doing really well with my lifting lately and getting pretty strong, I think. This weeks lifts have been 8 reps 80kg squats & 92.5kg deadlifts.
I've just been persuaded to sign up for a half marathon with a friend (for disclosure I've ran half and full marathons before but not those distanced for the last 3 years).
Can I realistically continue with progressive overload in my strength training while I increase my running mileage or will I have to put it on the backburner until after the race?

@Keira08 - I'm going to weigh in on the same side as @GiddyupTim but hopefully a bit gentler.

It is possible to lift and run. The open question is, how close to your limit do you push each activity? If you are lifting as much as you possibly can, you won't run as well as you possibly can. If you run as well as you possibly can, you won't lift as much as you possibly can. If you try to have both, you are likely to have a learning experience, i.e. injury.

At one time, I could deadlift a bit more than you are doing, for 3 sets of 6. I could squat not quite as much as you are doing, for 3 sets of 10. And then I became a runner. And I ran myself into injury several times, but that's not the point here.

As I learned how to run and not injure myself, a couple things became apparent: I could not lift heavy and run high volume; but I needed to do some strength training to help prevent running injury. The compromises I made included giving up deadlifts entirely and reducing my squats to less than half the weight I had been doing. For long distance running, *consistency* with the weights is more important than *intensity* of the weights.

That having been said, I've made the choice to focus on running. I am, when uninjured, very competitive in my age group locally and middle of the pack in my age group for USATF national events.

So if I wanted to be able to deadlift 92.5 kg and squat 80 kg, what would that mean for my running? I have to run fewer miles, but maybe not too few to support a half marathon. I'd have to do a lot less speed work for running. And I'd have to accept slower half marathon times. Instead of running a routine half marathon in 1:30 to 1:33, maybe I'd have to run it in 1:39 to 1:45. That's a *guess*, because I haven't actually tried it; but I know how much heavy lower body lifting beat me up and what kind of recovery I needed. That would cut into my quality running time, which would mean I wouldn't be prepared to properly *race* a half marathon.

That having been said, I have long maintained that someone who runs 30 miles per week including a long run of at least 10 miles once a week can pretty much enter any half marathon that looks interesting and complete it. They might not have their fastest time, but finishing it would not be in question.

So you make your choices. Do you want to lift heavy and just try to finish a half marathon, without necessarily having a very good time? Or do you want to have a good-for-you finishing time in the half marathon, and back off the lifting? Neither choice is right or wrong. What you do depends on your goals and priorities.

If you were talking about a full marathon instead of a half, I'd say you had a serious risk of failure to complete the marathon by training while lifting heavy; but it seems to me that it should be possible to complete a half (with reduced performance) while still lifting heavy. The wild card is, if you've never run the distance you don't yet know how your body will react to distance running stress and lifting stress in the same time frame. So maybe you're okay, and maybe you're not. You don't know till you try.

Disclosure: At my peak of lifting, I could routinely deadlift 225 lbs. and squat 165 lbs. (102 kg and 75 kg, respectively) Right now I'm on the couch with an annoying ankle problem; but when uninjured I don't do deadlifts and I routinely squat 75 lbs. (34 kg). The squats do not make me sore the next day, but they are sufficient to support my running habit. Then again, when I was primarily a weight lifter I did single leg calf raises on a step with a maximum of 15 lbs. (6.5 kg); as a distance runner, I was doing them with 50 lbs. (22kg) The calf raises are more important to my running than deadlifts are.

antennachick

I trained for a ultra half (14.5 miles) while doing crossfit and running 25-40 miles 6 days per week. I believe the crossfit and weight lifting helped alot...especially since it was a trail run and was all hills at a higher elevation then I was use to. You might want to look into what is more important to you...on days of longer runs, I did lighter weight or if I was sore/tired from running I did lighter weight. I actually see alot of running plans including cross training on days you don't run.

RoxieDawn

tl;dr

I have done it with 2 halfs completed this year one month a part. It all boils down to balancing your nutrition, your running and lifting. How I train will not be the same for another, how much recovery you need determines many aspects, I am also older I am sure (pushing 49 in a few weeks).

nowine4me

I know from first-hand experience it's possible. You need to eat properly and you need to rest properly. I lifted M/W/F and did my longest training runs on Saturday. Sunday REST!!

TerrysRunning

I know this conversation is a few months old, but I just stumbled onto it.
I run 100 mile ultramarathons in the mountains. And I deadlift over 400 lbs. I'm 46, and I have never used a drug in my life. I'd be faster if I didn't lift so much, and I'd be stronger if I didn't run so much. But you can absolutely do both.