Can't keep up with my clean calorie intake
DrummerGavin
Posts: 31 Member
Is it just me or is it tough eating enough clean calories?? I can almost never hit my daily goal of about 3000. E Here it is almost 9:00pm and I'm still 1200 calories short! Even if I have another double shake (400 calories) before bed I'm still way short. I know I'm making gains and losing fat but I can't seem to dial it in. I feel like I'm not feeding my muscles right and that I could have even better gains. Thoughts??
I'm down from 207 to 191 in about 10 weeks. I lift 3 days a week and work in construction 5 days a week. I'm 6'2" and want to get to a men's physique and not more. I'm making gains and losing fat but I feel like I could be doing better. I take creatine, vitamins and protein shakes but feel like I'm still running short on nourishment and better gains. Any advice??
I'm down from 207 to 191 in about 10 weeks. I lift 3 days a week and work in construction 5 days a week. I'm 6'2" and want to get to a men's physique and not more. I'm making gains and losing fat but I feel like I could be doing better. I take creatine, vitamins and protein shakes but feel like I'm still running short on nourishment and better gains. Any advice??
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I guess a clean calorie would be lean meats, healthy carbs (brown rice, etc) and plenty of nuts, avocados, and healthy fats and veggies. Protein shakes and 400 calorie replacement meals. I feel like I'm eating all day (every 2-3 hours and I can't keep up with my recommended 3000. And that's just a maintain goal. Gaining would put me closer to 3500!!0
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So why do you have to eat "clean"? Why do you want to feel full all the time? Especially if you have to work out or do any cardio? What evidence is there to show that having "dirty" food is going to deter you from meeting any goals? Also, once you've met your RDA values, you DON'T get extra credit for eating any "cleaner". At that point, only calories really matter.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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So I guess I don't have to. I thought that was how proper nutrition works. I've cut out most sugars and salt and stopped eating fast food. I've only had a few meals like a cheese burger or fried foods rarely in the last few months. Are you saying that I can have more of those types of meals if I'm hitting my numbers?? I've been about 207-210 for the last few years but wasn't working out and eating anything. Since I cut those things out I've lost a lot of fat in my midsection so I'm good with that. I'd like to get down to at least 12-14% body fat and thought clean eating was the only way to get there (along with lifting 3 days a week)0
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Nope. As mentioned, eat in a calorie deficit and you'll lose body fat.DrummerGavin wrote: »So I guess I don't have to. I thought that was how proper nutrition works. I've cut out most sugars and salt and stopped eating fast food. I've only had a few meals like a cheese burger or fried foods rarely in the last few months. Are you saying that I can have more of those types of meals if I'm hitting my numbers?? I've been about 207-210 for the last few years but wasn't working out and eating anything. Since I cut those things out I've lost a lot of fat in my midsection so I'm good with that. I'd like to get down to at least 12-14% body fat and thought clean eating was the only way to get there (along with lifting 3 days a week)
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Calories are units of energy. Nothing more, nothing less. Where your body derives calories from doesn't matter.5
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Ask yourself why is lean meat clean but fatty cuts of meats not clean?
Why is the colour of your rice important?
Why are highly processed items like Protein powder and meal replacements OK (they are..) but a burger isn't?
A burger in a bun is just an item made from meat and wheat - a combination of protein, fat and carbs.
You might find this article interesting...
http://www.simplyshredded.com/research-review-the-dirt-on-clean-eating-written-by-nutrition-expert-alan-aragon.html8 -
DrummerGavin wrote: »So I guess I don't have to. I thought that was how proper nutrition works. I've cut out most sugars and salt and stopped eating fast food. I've only had a few meals like a cheese burger or fried foods rarely in the last few months. Are you saying that I can have more of those types of meals if I'm hitting my numbers?? I've been about 207-210 for the last few years but wasn't working out and eating anything. Since I cut those things out I've lost a lot of fat in my midsection so I'm good with that. I'd like to get down to at least 12-14% body fat and thought clean eating was the only way to get there (along with lifting 3 days a week)
eating a burger or a doughnut doesn't negate the nutrition in the broccoli or nuts or apple you also ate that day...3 -
I'm slightly confused as to your goal....
You've lost 16lbs in 10 weeks, but you're making gains? It's likely your "gains" are due to getting leaner and your muscles becoming more defined, not that you're putting any muscle on.4 -
TavistockToad wrote: »DrummerGavin wrote: »So I guess I don't have to. I thought that was how proper nutrition works. I've cut out most sugars and salt and stopped eating fast food. I've only had a few meals like a cheese burger or fried foods rarely in the last few months. Are you saying that I can have more of those types of meals if I'm hitting my numbers?? I've been about 207-210 for the last few years but wasn't working out and eating anything. Since I cut those things out I've lost a lot of fat in my midsection so I'm good with that. I'd like to get down to at least 12-14% body fat and thought clean eating was the only way to get there (along with lifting 3 days a week)
eating a burger or a doughnut doesn't negate the nutrition in the broccoli or nuts or apple you also ate that day...
Or as Eric Helms puts it, "Once we've met our nutritional goals for the day, we don't get extra credit for consuming more nutritious food."6 -
Nuts are a good source of fats and calories, have you considered adding them?0
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TavistockToad wrote: »DrummerGavin wrote: »So I guess I don't have to. I thought that was how proper nutrition works. I've cut out most sugars and salt and stopped eating fast food. I've only had a few meals like a cheese burger or fried foods rarely in the last few months. Are you saying that I can have more of those types of meals if I'm hitting my numbers?? I've been about 207-210 for the last few years but wasn't working out and eating anything. Since I cut those things out I've lost a lot of fat in my midsection so I'm good with that. I'd like to get down to at least 12-14% body fat and thought clean eating was the only way to get there (along with lifting 3 days a week)
eating a burger or a doughnut doesn't negate the nutrition in the broccoli or nuts or apple you also ate that day...
Or as Eric Helms puts it, "Once we've met our nutritional goals for the day, we don't get extra credit for consuming more nutritious food."
exactly that!0 -
my daily average is about 2600cal (female, 5'4") - not sure why the focus on clean, but my go-tos (I do a high carb so 300+g most days of the week)
toast on the drive into work
full fat yogurt, banana, farro (with some sour cream and cheese for fat) and some kind lf protein mid-morning
lunch is normally potatos and chicken
Dinner - depends on calories left for the day - last night was a sweet potato and barley dish with shrimp
round the day out with a small bowl of cereal right before bed
my diary is open if you want to take a look (and yes, I had both a cupcake and a cookie yesterday)
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deannalfisher wrote: »
my diary is open if you want to take a look (and yes, I had both a cupcake and a cookie yesterday)
More than one. And chips. And I am just saying that, because I am a little jealous.
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Oh I eat ice cream almost everyday.skymningen wrote: »deannalfisher wrote: »
my diary is open if you want to take a look (and yes, I had both a cupcake and a cookie yesterday)
More than one. And chips. And I am just saying that, because I am a little jealous.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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skymningen wrote: »deannalfisher wrote: »
my diary is open if you want to take a look (and yes, I had both a cupcake and a cookie yesterday)
More than one. And chips. And I am just saying that, because I am a little jealous.
in my defense they were protein chips and honestly not that good...20g protein, 3 g fat and 5g carbs....0 -
livingleanlivingclean wrote: »I'm slightly confused as to your goal....
You've lost 16lbs in 10 weeks, but you're making gains? It's likely your "gains" are due to getting leaner and your muscles becoming more defined, not that you're putting any muscle on.livingleanlivingclean wrote: »I'm slightly confused as to your goal....
You've lost 16lbs in 10 weeks, but you're making gains? It's likely your "gains" are due to getting leaner and your muscles becoming more defined, not that you're putting any muscle on.
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I know that I am making gains and not just losing fat alone because not only am I starting to bust the sleeves on my t-shirts but I've also doubled my strength in that 10 weeks. I've never really had any fat surrounding muscle except for my ab section and not even there until about 5 years ago. I've always had a very good metabolism my whole life and been very active. I'm 49 now but it wasn't until I hit my 40's that it slowed down and started hitting my belly. I want to be able to have a "men's physique" type body. I've never focused on my body intensely because I never had to. Now I want to see what I'm capable of if I put all my focus and energy into it.3
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DrummerGavin wrote: »I know that I am making gains and not just losing fat alone because not only am I starting to bust the sleeves on my t-shirts but I've also doubled my strength in that 10 weeks. I've never really had any fat surrounding muscle except for my ab section and not even there until about 5 years ago. I've always had a very good metabolism my whole life and been very active. I'm 49 now but it wasn't until I hit my 40's that it slowed down and started hitting my belly. I want to be able to have a "men's physique" type body. I've never focused on my body intensely because I never had to. Now I want to see what I'm capable of if I put all my focus and energy into it.
You may have gotten some newbie gains if you just started lifting or came back off a break from training. Maybe a couple of pounds overall. You can't really tell without before and after dexa or hydrostatic testing. That would have been it though if in deficit.
Many mistake getting a pump, muscles filling with fluid for repair from training with actual muscle mass gains. Also, the strength increases can come exclusively from neuromuscular adaptations without having gained any mass. Does it really matter whether the improvements were from adding muscle mass or not? You are losing fat, looking better and are fitter and stronger either way.
You still haven't stated your goal though. Is it to lose weight/ body fat? Recomp? Gain muscle mass? From what you said so far, sounds like recomp, lose a little fat while gaining mass eating at maintenance but I can't really tell.4 -
I am new to this so I'm not even sure myself. I would like to gain muscle mass and lose the little belly fat I have left. I'm not concerned with a weight number per se, but would like to be bigger and stronger and not in a "freshly pumped" kind of way but real strength and real gains. I do know that you get a ton more "gains" when first starting so I've considered that2
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Just reiterating what the others have said (and in case someone pops in here with the calorie vs nutrition).
Hit your macros - protein, fats, carbs
Hit your micros - vitamins, minerals, fiber, blah, blah blah
Since macros and micros are taken care of for physical needs (i.e., nutrition) then:
Whatever higher calorie stuff to meet your calorie needs.
Not big on ice cream but love me some fried chicken thighs to meet calorie needs when bulking. Or PBJ sammichs.
Or a couple slices of pizza. Slice of pie is good too. So many ways. Heck a good chunk of beef chuck roast helps hit the protein and fats.
Damn, now I'm hungry!4 -
Lol! Thanks piperdown44! I can definitely do that. I am hitting the micro and macro numbers and damn do I miss a good burger!! *kitten*, now I'm hungry!2
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DrummerGavin wrote: »I know that I am making gains and not just losing fat alone because not only am I starting to bust the sleeves on my t-shirts but I've also doubled my strength in that 10 weeks. I've never really had any fat surrounding muscle except for my ab section and not even there until about 5 years ago. I've always had a very good metabolism my whole life and been very active. I'm 49 now but it wasn't until I hit my 40's that it slowed down and started hitting my belly. I want to be able to have a "men's physique" type body. I've never focused on my body intensely because I never had to. Now I want to see what I'm capable of if I put all my focus and energy into it.
CNS adaptations for a new lifter will add significant strength. Creatine supplementation adds some serious pump during exercise and as much as 4-8 pounds of water retention weight to muscle. Heck, I get a pump just shaking up my protein in the morning because of creatine. You can also gain a temporary couple of pounds after a good hard training session as some people gain water weight in their muscles during the repair/rest cycle. All of these things can make it initially seem like you are gaining true muscle mass - but the truth is that it is extremely unlikely outside of very specific conditions. The good news is that you fit into one of the catagories - newbie lifter - so it is possible to lose fat and gain muscle at the same time... but only for a short while.
edit: mmapags already covered most of what I said.
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So if I continue my lifting routine of 3 days a week (full body push pull push week one and pull push pull for week two) at a high intensity and supplement properly... when is it realistic to expect real growth? I understand that everyone is different and there are countless variables but still.0
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real growth takes time - admitted I'm female and don't lift like I should during the triathlon season - but getting a 1lb lean muscle gain a month is on the higher side of what you can expect - men may be more successful, but its takes time1
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Thank you. I realize this is a life long journey that I want to make and am not in a rush... I just want to be realistic. Thanks for everyone's advice!! Much appreciated!0
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DrummerGavin wrote: »So if I continue my lifting routine of 3 days a week (full body push pull push week one and pull push pull for week two) at a high intensity and supplement properly... when is it realistic to expect real growth? I understand that everyone is different and there are countless variables but still.
It's hard to know as there are so many variables. Age, gender, previous lifting experience, hormone profiles, lifting program etc.
It's a good idea to track weight AND measurements. Reassess after a period of time. 1/2 the year I use powerlifting for reassessment (how much have my lifts increased, during bulk) and the other 1/2ish is scale and measurements when I'm dropping down bodyfat (leaning out).
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deannalfisher wrote: »my daily average is about 2600cal (female, 5'4") - not sure why the focus on clean, but my go-tos (I do a high carb so 300+g most days of the week)
toast on the drive into work
full fat yogurt, banana, farro (with some sour cream and cheese for fat) and some kind lf protein mid-morning
lunch is normally potatos and chicken
Dinner - depends on calories left for the day - last night was a sweet potato and barley dish with shrimp
round the day out with a small bowl of cereal right before bed
my diary is open if you want to take a look (and yes, I had both a cupcake and a cookie yesterday)
I was just reading this. How can i view your diary.
I'm a first time competitor and looking for some help with meals. My cal is 2080
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DrummerGavin wrote: »So if I continue my lifting routine of 3 days a week (full body push pull push week one and pull push pull for week two) at a high intensity and supplement properly... when is it realistic to expect real growth? I understand that everyone is different and there are countless variables but still.
Short answer, yes continue. You have one of 2 choices. Recomp or lean bulk.
Recomp is to eat at maintenance and lift. You will slowly drop fat and gain muscle mass. Maybe a 1/2 pound to a pound per month.
The other, lean bulk, is too eat at a slight surplus, 200-250 cals per day. This maximizes muscle growth and minimizes fat gain. Under optimum conditions, you will gain 1.5 to 2 lbs per month. You may also pick up some fat, so after awhile, you may want to cut to lose it. Done right, fat gain will be minimal.
In either case, the key is hitting an aggressive protein target. Some will disagree but from the data I've seen, when bulking or recomping, I would to 1.2 grams protein per lb of lean body mass. Hit .35 to .4 fats and let carbs fall where they do. Mostly whole foods is great but I personally use an 80/20 rule, whole nutritionally dense foods/ whatever I want.
Some recent research has indicated that rep range has less effect on hypertrophy than previously thought and power lifting rep ranges, 3 to 5, have proven just as effective as hypertrophy range, typically 6-12. I mix 'em up personally. I do pyramid sets adding a little weight to each. So, my first set of any lift is 8 to 12 reps and my last (of 3) is 3-5. I feel like this hits both strength gains and mass growth (or preservation in deficit) Only one of may ways to get there. Hope this helps!2
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