What your opinion on the keto diet?
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TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.1 -
kiracookie wrote: »I found it easier to stick to the strictness of Keto than I do just trying to calorie control. I lost a stone in 3 weeks but then completely stalled and couldn’t lose any more (even over 3 months). Iv come off it now and gone back to eating a normal diet but trying to stick to calories with exercise.
If you weren't controlling calories as well, than it's probably why you didn't lose weight. Initial weight losses were from glycogen depletion and water storage associated with insulin.0 -
kiracookie wrote: »I found it easier to stick to the strictness of Keto than I do just trying to calorie control. I lost a stone in 3 weeks but then completely stalled and couldn’t lose any more (even over 3 months). Iv come off it now and gone back to eating a normal diet but trying to stick to calories with exercise.
If you weren't controlling calories as well, than it's probably why you didn't lose weight. Initial weight losses were from glycogen depletion and water storage associated with insulin.
I was watching calories. I weighed everything I ate and logged it.
According to the weight analysis machine in my gym 10lb of the weight loss was fat. And Iv not gained any weight back since stopping.
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TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.1 -
TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Why? There are a wide variety of grains and health benefits to eating them as psulemon mentioned. Are you pretty much against all of them? For what reason?3 -
You want my opinion?
I think it needlessly complicates CICO for the vast majority of people.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, some people who've been doing it a short time SAY they can do it for life. Funny how there's just a handful who've done it barely 2 years (see my first point).
/IMHO
This could be. I have only been doing it for about 14 months. I am not only doing it for weight loss. I am a T2D, and it keeps my glucose levels low. I brought my A1C down to 5.5, and my doctor reduced my metformin dose. Lipid panels improved and I am off my statin. BP is teetering on the edge of my doctor taking me off my BP med. Liver enzymes are at the low end of the normal range after 20 years of being too high. It has worked well for me. So far it has looked pretty sustainable, and the results have encouraged me to stick with it. Maybe all that will change, but I don't think so.
Most of the long term keto/LC folks on MFP are in the low carb forum.
I think people with your health issues are one of the key groups that can benefit from keto. That being said, in many cases, IR can be addressed by low carb without having to go full potato with the restrictions of keto. For some not.
Glad you are addressing the T2D. You didn't mention it but have you also lost body fat and undertaken a vigorous exercise program? Doing these things can also be key elements in reducing T2D.2 -
I do better on a low starch diet. Even with buckwheat, quinoa, and amaranth which are probably the healthiest grains, I didn't really feel well after eating. Low carb I feel great most of the time.TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Why? There are a wide variety of grains and health benefits to eating them as psulemon mentioned. Are you pretty much against all of them? For what reason?
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I started this way of eating in July of this year. Aside from a pretty good weight loss so far, I have stabilized my blood glucose levels, and the burning in my feet at night has stopped. I have more energy and I am able to handle brain things better such as my monthly requirement to change all my passwords at work. Over all it has helped me. Basically this is the diet prescribed for me after having weight loss surgery in 2008. I had gained half of the weight I had lost back as of May of this year. And I was experiencing return of Type II Diabetes symptoms. The last thing I want at 60 years of age is Type II. So my opinion is that it is working for me and all I am giving up is symptoms and sugar and grains etc.3
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Keto can work really well for some. Those that stick with it tend to be people whose health improved on the diet (T2D, PCOS, NAFLD, Alzheimer's, CAD and high cholesterol, or a complimentary cancer therapy) or found they finally have control over their eating. Keto can help with weight loss but from what I have seen, those who stop doing it tend to regain the weight. Those who stay with what worked seem to have it continue to work.
I started keto for health reasons, weight loss was a happy side effect, and I stick with mostly keto for the continued benefits. I do not count calories but when I do increase carbs, that is when I tend to overeat and regain. If I keep carbs low I have no desire or drive to overeat.dwilliamca wrote: »Working in a hospital all my life, I have a hard time supporting something as unnatural as purposely putting oneself in a state of ketosis. I'll feed my brain glucose not ketones. Besides I found it very hard to reduce my carbs low enough to even stay on a very low carb diet for long, and the high fats raised my already elevated lipids to extremely high levels. On the other hand, I guess it works for some, and apparently there are no long term health affects identified.
Ketones and hyperbaric oxygen is the latest focus in brain therapy (injuries, cancer, epilepsy, Alzheimer's) because it tends to be HEALTHIER for the brain than glucose in those situations. Healing us improved, and it may even be preventative.
I think you may be confusing a ketogenic diet with diabetic ketoacidosis (dka) - a more commonly seen ( in hospitals) life threatening condition.Keto=good way to increase the cholesterol, including the one that you don't want high.
This is wrong. Unless one has familial hyper cholesterolemia, Cholesterol tends to improve on a low carb or ketogenic diet. HDL goes up,triglycerides go down, and LDL particles tend to improve in density and size.
High levels of (refined) carbs and low fat is a common way to raise triglycerides and lower HDL.6 -
I think people with your health issues are one of the key groups that can benefit from keto. That being said, in many cases, IR can be addressed by low carb without having to go full potato with the restrictions of keto. For some not.
Glad you are addressing the T2D. You didn't mention it but have you also lost body fat and undertaken a vigorous exercise program? Doing these things can also be key elements in reducing T2D.
I followed the doctor's recommended diet very closely, and glucose numbers were very high even with the metformin. I decided to try low carb and discovered that the lower I kept my carbs, the lower the average glucose numbers and the smaller the range. I was checking glucose a lot trying to get a feel for what different foods were doing to me. I reduced the carbs to 20 per day, and have not looked back. I have actually never even checked keto sticks or whatever. I monitor the glucose and am interested in the impact there.
I have lost 105 lbs so far. According to my fancy scales, all but about 10 lbs of that has been body fat. I increased protein when I saw that I had lost some lean body mass, and the lean body mass has been steady since the increase in protein.
I am reasonably active in my work, and I walk to the PO to get mail, etc. I had a step counter for a while, but it was boring. I averaged about 10K steps a day without doing anything special. That is really it for physical activity.
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TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.
What people find satiating varies.
I love leafy greens and eat a lot of them daily because I enjoy them and think they are nutritionally important. I mostly don't find them especially filling (which is not surprising, because they are so low cal). The exceptions would be something like collard greens, and even then more if I eat them with some fat and starch (like rice or injera) or if course protein. Most other kinds of vegetables, like broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts, winter squash, summer squash, cabbage, turnips, carrots, asparagus (and on and on) DO fill me up very well, but I know this is not the case for everyone.
I find many starches quite satisfying and filling/satiating, especially potatoes and sweet potatoes, but also oats and rice and wild rice (I'm not a huge fan of plain white rice so don't eat it a lot, but find it filling and weirdly have been finding myself having more of a taste for it). I don't find bread filling, regardless of the fiber, but that's me, others have different experiences.
I don't really find berries filling at all, but I eat them because I enjoy them and they are low cal. An apple or peach or banana are more filling, despite the fact that they have less fiber. I think it's psychological somehow.1 -
TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.
I eat most of those things on top of bread, starches (this has the biggest impact on my satiety), fruits and veggies; I don't like nor will ever eat kale and walnuts. So while restriction as worked for you, limiting my ability to get nutrient dense foods would be a mistake. My diet is unlimited anything, which allows me to get the most nutrients possible.1 -
I think people with your health issues are one of the key groups that can benefit from keto. That being said, in many cases, IR can be addressed by low carb without having to go full potato with the restrictions of keto. For some not.
Glad you are addressing the T2D. You didn't mention it but have you also lost body fat and undertaken a vigorous exercise program? Doing these things can also be key elements in reducing T2D.
I followed the doctor's recommended diet very closely, and glucose numbers were very high even with the metformin. I decided to try low carb and discovered that the lower I kept my carbs, the lower the average glucose numbers and the smaller the range. I was checking glucose a lot trying to get a feel for what different foods were doing to me. I reduced the carbs to 20 per day, and have not looked back. I have actually never even checked keto sticks or whatever. I monitor the glucose and am interested in the impact there.
I have lost 105 lbs so far. According to my fancy scales, all but about 10 lbs of that has been body fat. I increased protein when I saw that I had lost some lean body mass, and the lean body mass has been steady since the increase in protein.
I am reasonably active in my work, and I walk to the PO to get mail, etc. I had a step counter for a while, but it was boring. I averaged about 10K steps a day without doing anything special. That is really it for physical activity.
Dont' stress too much about the loss of lean body mass. When you went keto, you depleted glycogen and water store (two things that make up lean body mass). It doesn't mean you lost muscle, even though it's possible you did. Outside of increased protein, you will want to incorporate progressive resistance training. Those are the two components that will increase muscle retention and/or stimulate growth. But that latter is just as important as protein.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.
What people find satiating varies.
I love leafy greens and eat a lot of them daily because I enjoy them and think they are nutritionally important. I mostly don't find them especially filling (which is not surprising, because they are so low cal). The exceptions would be something like collard greens, and even then more if I eat them with some fat and starch (like rice or injera) or if course protein. Most other kinds of vegetables, like broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts, winter squash, summer squash, cabbage, turnips, carrots, asparagus (and on and on) DO fill me up very well, but I know this is not the case for everyone.
I find many starches quite satisfying and filling/satiating, especially potatoes and sweet potatoes, but also oats and rice and wild rice (I'm not a huge fan of plain white rice so don't eat it a lot, but find it filling and weirdly have been finding myself having more of a taste for it). I don't find bread filling, regardless of the fiber, but that's me, others have different experiences.
I don't really find berries filling at all, but I eat them because I enjoy them and they are low cal. An apple or peach or banana are more filling, despite the fact that they have less fiber. I think it's psychological somehow.
I guess greens aren't really filling in small quantities but I make large amounts of lettuce, kale, and fruit smoothies and that can fill me up for a while. I see that you like a lot of cruciferous veggies, I'm trying to get more of those in my diet. My filling foods are peanut butter, eggs, fish, and beef off the top of my head. How do you prepare turnips so they are filling? I've had them raw and they were good but it's a starchy vegetable.0 -
TheDevastator wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.
What people find satiating varies.
I love leafy greens and eat a lot of them daily because I enjoy them and think they are nutritionally important. I mostly don't find them especially filling (which is not surprising, because they are so low cal). The exceptions would be something like collard greens, and even then more if I eat them with some fat and starch (like rice or injera) or if course protein. Most other kinds of vegetables, like broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts, winter squash, summer squash, cabbage, turnips, carrots, asparagus (and on and on) DO fill me up very well, but I know this is not the case for everyone.
I find many starches quite satisfying and filling/satiating, especially potatoes and sweet potatoes, but also oats and rice and wild rice (I'm not a huge fan of plain white rice so don't eat it a lot, but find it filling and weirdly have been finding myself having more of a taste for it). I don't find bread filling, regardless of the fiber, but that's me, others have different experiences.
I don't really find berries filling at all, but I eat them because I enjoy them and they are low cal. An apple or peach or banana are more filling, despite the fact that they have less fiber. I think it's psychological somehow.
I guess greens aren't really filling in small quantities but I make large amounts of lettuce, kale, and fruit smoothies and that can fill me up for a while.
Even large amounts aren't for me. A huge salad is, but that's because there's a lot more on it than just greens. I doubt eating a bag of spinach would do much for me (I like kale, but couldn't just eat it plain on its own).
For example, I made a smoothie (turned out delicious -- I am always experimenting with new combinations) yesterday morning with about half an avocado, a third of an acorn squash (pre-roasted), around 130 g of frozen spinach, some almonds (basically I made my own almond milk), a small banana, and some vegan protein powder. It was super filling. I actually had to save some of it for lunch. But I think it would have been equally filling without the spinach.I see that you like a lot of cruciferous veggies, I'm trying to get more of those in my diet. My filling foods are peanut butter, eggs, fish, and beef off the top of my head. How do you prepare turnips so they are filling? I've had them raw and they were good but it's a starchy vegetable.
I like them raw, but even more often I roast them. I have no issues with starchy veg, but they are way less carbs than a potato if you are concerned about that -- more similar to a radish, probably. I typically do a mix of roasted root veg as a side dish (they are good in stews too).0 -
Kale is the 3rd most nutrient dense food there is according to Healthaliciousness.com. I know some people say they would rather die than eat it though. I think the main grain foods I would be missing out on are rice bran and wheat germ that are nutrient dense.TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.
I eat most of those things on top of bread, starches (this has the biggest impact on my satiety), fruits and veggies; I don't like nor will ever eat kale and walnuts. So while restriction as worked for you, limiting my ability to get nutrient dense foods would be a mistake. My diet is unlimited anything, which allows me to get the most nutrients possible.
https://healthaliciousness.com/articles/most-nutrient-dense-foods.php
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I feel it is extreme and likely not how anyone plans on living the rest of their lives eating. What that means is that even if you are successful losing the weight you haven't really been practicing how you need to eat for maintenance so when you eventually do transition into a more balanced diet you won't have had the months or years of practice eating appropriately with that diet that someone who lost with a balanced diet would have. As a result you'd likely struggle with maintenance.
My general philosophy us eat like you want to eat for the rest of your life, just restrict calories. Picture how you want to eat to maintain at your goal weight and then eat that or a minor varients of that. Don't plan some extreme diet that will have no resemblance whatsoever to how you will be living your life at maintenance near your goal weight after or it is unlikely to work.
Carbs are part of a natural diet, they aren't evil things to be avoided at all costs. Forcing your body into some alternate metabolic pathway that is basically in place for starvation just doesn't strike me as long term sustainable or like a good thing to do.
Finally why pick the harder option. I struggle to believe that it is easier to restrict yourself to a diet of almost entirely fat, next to no carbs and little protein where you still have to calorie restrict relative to just caloric restriction with a normal diet.5 -
I've been eating lacinato kale by itself. It's bitter but I sort of like it.lemurcat12 wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I'd recommend low carbs. I like fruit too much to go full keto. Grains are unnecessary for everyday foods. Fruits, veggies, grass fed meat, eggs, cheese, fish, seafood, nuts, seeds, seaweeds, and mushrooms are most of the foods I eat. Exercise is very important as well, like walking and weightlifting.
Just to point out, no specific food is necessary for everyday foods.
I guess that's true. I'm pretty much against grains most of the time but I do eat them when traveling.
Fair enough. I eat them daily because the fiber helps satiate me and good for GI health.
Lettuce, kale, and other greens also avocados, berries, walnuts, and sunflower seeds all have fiber as well and they are very satiating especially lots of greens. They can take some time getting used to though.
What people find satiating varies.
I love leafy greens and eat a lot of them daily because I enjoy them and think they are nutritionally important. I mostly don't find them especially filling (which is not surprising, because they are so low cal). The exceptions would be something like collard greens, and even then more if I eat them with some fat and starch (like rice or injera) or if course protein. Most other kinds of vegetables, like broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts, winter squash, summer squash, cabbage, turnips, carrots, asparagus (and on and on) DO fill me up very well, but I know this is not the case for everyone.
I find many starches quite satisfying and filling/satiating, especially potatoes and sweet potatoes, but also oats and rice and wild rice (I'm not a huge fan of plain white rice so don't eat it a lot, but find it filling and weirdly have been finding myself having more of a taste for it). I don't find bread filling, regardless of the fiber, but that's me, others have different experiences.
I don't really find berries filling at all, but I eat them because I enjoy them and they are low cal. An apple or peach or banana are more filling, despite the fact that they have less fiber. I think it's psychological somehow.
I guess greens aren't really filling in small quantities but I make large amounts of lettuce, kale, and fruit smoothies and that can fill me up for a while.
Even large amounts aren't for me. A huge salad is, but that's because there's a lot more on it than just greens. I doubt eating a bag of spinach would do much for me (I like kale, but couldn't just eat it plain on its own).
For example, I made a smoothie (turned out delicious -- I am always experimenting with new combinations) yesterday morning with about half an avocado, a third of an acorn squash (pre-roasted), around 130 g of frozen spinach, some almonds (basically I made my own almond milk), a small banana, and some vegan protein powder. It was super filling. I actually had to save some of it for lunch. But I think it would have been equally filling without the spinach.lemurcat12 wrote: »TheDevastator wrote: »I see that you like a lot of cruciferous veggies, I'm trying to get more of those in my diet. My filling foods are peanut butter, eggs, fish, and beef off the top of my head. How do you prepare turnips so they are filling? I've had them raw and they were good but it's a starchy vegetable.
I like them raw, but even more often I roast them. I have no issues with starchy veg, but they are way less carbs than a potato if you are concerned about that -- more similar to a radish, probably. I typically do a mix of roasted root veg as a side dish (they are good in stews too).
I think I like turnips because they are close to radishes which I love.1 -
Generally I think people should just stick to eating all food groups in moderation not go on a restrictive diet plan. It isn't necessary for weight loss to follow a special diet.
If you like following a keto diet then do it. If you have trouble following it long term then don't.4 -
I like it. It works for me and my life. Hubby likes it too. Our doctors are happy and we are content with it.
I think restrictive is a relative term. It is not restrictive to ME to eliminate something from my diet that holds no value for ME. I am starving within an hour of eating a bowl of oatmeal or rice. So I just ate calories for nothing. Someone else will be great with that and feel full and move on with their day.
Anyway OP ... you do you!5
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