January 2018 Running Challenge

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  • girlinahat
    girlinahat Posts: 2,956 Member
    It’s not the run heartrate I question, it’s the Crossfit workout. Honestly, I felt like I was dying, with fast rowing, kettlebell swings and those blasted burpees, over and over… I am pretty sure it is something to do with how fitbit measures HR, and that it struggles to cope in that sort of situation. According to fitbit my resting heartrate is around 60 bpm, and a brisk walk takes me to 110-114, which is probably fairly accurate. Maybe next week I will put on my tomtom chest strap and log it as a workout to see what happens.

    I’m also starting to think that Kettlebells might be the secret best workout ever. Admittedly I can barely bend my back and I ache at the spot where my traps connect, but aches like that are a good thing right?
  • Starflight00
    Starflight00 Posts: 112 Member
    edited January 2018
    Thank you all for the warm welcome! You are a chatty bunch, I can't keep up with names and races! :)

    Anyone here running every day? Any pros/cons to consider?

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  • _nikkiwolf_
    _nikkiwolf_ Posts: 1,380 Member
    edited January 2018
    girlinahat wrote: »
    It’s not the run heartrate I question, it’s the Crossfit workout. Honestly, I felt like I was dying, with fast rowing, kettlebell swings and those blasted burpees, over and over… I am pretty sure it is something to do with how fitbit measures HR, and that it struggles to cope in that sort of situation. According to fitbit my resting heartrate is around 60 bpm, and a brisk walk takes me to 110-114, which is probably fairly accurate. Maybe next week I will put on my tomtom chest strap and log it as a workout to see what happens.

    I’m also starting to think that Kettlebells might be the secret best workout ever. Admittedly I can barely bend my back and I ache at the spot where my traps connect, but aches like that are a good thing right?
    @girlinahat all optical HR monitors have a problem if the muscles/tendons in your wrists are being flexed. I know that's why they give too low readings while rowing. I guess the same applies to kettle bell swings.
    If you manage to wear your fitbit halfway between wrist and elbow and still get readings, they should be more realistic.
  • girlinahat
    girlinahat Posts: 2,956 Member
    _nikkiwolf_ wrote: »
    girlinahat wrote: »
    It’s not the run heartrate I question, it’s the Crossfit workout. Honestly, I felt like I was dying, with fast rowing, kettlebell swings and those blasted burpees, over and over… I am pretty sure it is something to do with how fitbit measures HR, and that it struggles to cope in that sort of situation. According to fitbit my resting heartrate is around 60 bpm, and a brisk walk takes me to 110-114, which is probably fairly accurate. Maybe next week I will put on my tomtom chest strap and log it as a workout to see what happens.

    I’m also starting to think that Kettlebells might be the secret best workout ever. Admittedly I can barely bend my back and I ache at the spot where my traps connect, but aches like that are a good thing right?
    @girlinahat all optical HR monitors have a problem if the muscles/tendons in your wrists are being flexed. I know that's why they give too low readings while rowing. I guess the same applies to kettle bell swings.
    If you manage to wear your fitbit halfway between wrist and elbow and still get readings, they should be more realistic.

    Thanks
    I do have fairly tendon-y joints so that could be why – it was certainly recording SOMETHING. I’m not sure I can get it to stay further up my wrist but might give it a go. Otherwise it’ll be dig the chest strap out and try that.
  • kgirlhart
    kgirlhart Posts: 5,188 Member
    edited January 2018
    I have been looking at half marathon training plans. I'm trying to find one that has 4 runs per week instead of 5. I have seen a few but they all start with 4 miles for the first long run. Currently I run 4 days per week. Sunday I do a long run. The last few weeks my long run has been 9 miles and yesterday was 9.5. I also run on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday usually between 3-4 miles. I try to run intervals on Tuesdays but I haven't done any lately since I haven't been actively training for anything specific. I see a lot of advice about "following the plan", but most of the plans I am seeing have you starting out at about 12 miles per week. I am currently running about 20 miles per week. Should I cut back and build back up, or should I just go with what I have been doing and gradually increase? Maybe I should switch to 5 days per week. But 4 really works better for my schedule and my personal life. The half marathon I am looking at (but not signed up for yet) is on May 19th. I'm nervous because they have a cutoff time of 3:30. I have run a 10k in training in 1:09 so surely I can run 13.1 in 3:30. Does anyone have any advice? The Hal Higdon Novice 2 plan looks pretty good, but I don't know if I want to cut my long runs back down to 4 miles.
  • girlinahat
    girlinahat Posts: 2,956 Member
    @kgirlhart not sure on training plans but I’m sure there’s a four day out there. Hal Higdon’s Novice Marathon plan is a four day one so it might be looking at those rather than half plans.

    In terms of time – I do 10k in a little over an hour. Can’t remember what my ACTUAL time is. My HM last year, with an evil hill and all off-road with other minor hills came in at just over 3 hours, with me flagging and pretty much walking the last mile. I walked all the hills and ran on the downs. I even stopped and took photos. You’ll be fine with the cut-off.

  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
    kgirlhart wrote: »
    I have been looking at half marathon training plans. I'm trying to find one that has 4 runs per week instead of 5. I have seen a few but they all start with 4 miles for the first long run. Currently I run 4 days per week. Sunday I do a long run. The last few weeks my long run has been 9 miles and yesterday was 9.5. I also run on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday usually between 3-4 miles. I try to run intervals on Tuesdays but I haven't done any lately since I haven't been actively training for anything specific. I see a lot of advice about "following the plan", but most of the plans I am seeing have you starting out at about 12 miles per week. I am currently running about 20 miles per week. Should I cut back and build back up, or should I just go with what I have been doing and gradually increase? Maybe I should switch to 5 days per week. But 4 really works better for my schedule and my personal life. The half marathon I am looking at (but not signed up for yet) is on May 19th. I'm nervous because they have a cutoff time of 3:30. I have run a 10k in training in 1:09 so surely I can run 13.1 in 3:30. Does anyone have any advice? The Hal Higdon Novice 2 plan looks pretty good, but I don't know if I want to cut my long runs back down to 4 miles.

    You could always make your own. This is the general format:
    PastorVincent wrote:
    Run 1 long run at conversational pace per week. This will help you build distance.
    Run 1 "fast" run (tempo, intervals, fartleks, whatever) per week
    Take 1-2 rest days per week
    Do conversational runs a middle distance for rest of the days.

    That will help you build distance and speed. Pay attention to your body, and if that is too much then move the speed to every other week instead, or reduce long run distance, or some combination there of.

    Or get the 80/20 book and build your own using one of his templates:

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  • shanaber
    shanaber Posts: 6,423 Member
    @kgirlhart - my 2 cents... I would say do what works for you and try slowly increasing your long run mostly to improve your endurance to run 13 miles. Chances are though since you are already running 9-9.5 you won't have any issue running 13.1. You don't say what your pace is but know that you could run the HM at a 15 min pace and still complete in the 3:30 cutoff. I have run many and started out just running what worked for me and inching up my long run to 12. At that point one of my friends said 'you're ready to run a HM' and entered me in one with her. I have since tried using a plan as well as doing it myself. I finally settled on taking the plan and adjusting it to my schedule and miles. You might also look at an intermediate plan rather than a beginner plan - I am pretty sure they start out with more than 12 miles per week. I would also recommend including a lower mileage taper week right before. If nothing else it helps you get your mind set for the race too.
  • kgirlhart
    kgirlhart Posts: 5,188 Member
    Thanks @PastorVincent. I am reading the 80/20 book right now. I'm kind of nervous about coming up with my own plan. I have only been running for about 16 months and still feel like a newbie. Your format sounds good though. (I may have asked about this a while back, but it is hard to find stuff in the threads after a few days, much less a couple of months.) I've been thinking about the HM for a while, but now it is time to start thinking about actually training for it.
  • RunsOnEspresso
    RunsOnEspresso Posts: 3,218 Member
    edited January 2018
    @kgirlhart My half marathons came in between 2:30 and 2:45 depending on training and my 10K time was just over an hour.

    As far as plans, I have always liked these https://www.jennyhadfield.com/training-plans/ There are several plans but she also incorporates cross-training and strength training.
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
    kgirlhart wrote: »
    Thanks @PastorVincent. I am reading the 80/20 book right now. I'm kind of nervous about coming up with my own plan. I have only been running for about 16 months and still feel like a newbie. Your format sounds good though. (I may have asked about this a while back, but it is hard to find stuff in the threads after a few days, much less a couple of months.) I've been thinking about the HM for a while, but now it is time to start thinking about actually training for it.

    I have no idea if you have asked it before or not, I just have that little bit of text saved off. Saved it off in a very small fit efficiency where I was thinking of saving the common answers off, but only ever saved that one. :)
  • kgirlhart
    kgirlhart Posts: 5,188 Member
    Thanks @RunsOnEspresso I'll check those out.
  • rheddmobile
    rheddmobile Posts: 6,840 Member
    kgirlhart wrote: »
    I have been looking at half marathon training plans. I'm trying to find one that has 4 runs per week instead of 5. I have seen a few but they all start with 4 miles for the first long run. Currently I run 4 days per week. Sunday I do a long run. The last few weeks my long run has been 9 miles and yesterday was 9.5. I also run on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday usually between 3-4 miles. I try to run intervals on Tuesdays but I haven't done any lately since I haven't been actively training for anything specific. I see a lot of advice about "following the plan", but most of the plans I am seeing have you starting out at about 12 miles per week. I am currently running about 20 miles per week. Should I cut back and build back up, or should I just go with what I have been doing and gradually increase? Maybe I should switch to 5 days per week. But 4 really works better for my schedule and my personal life. The half marathon I am looking at (but not signed up for yet) is on May 19th. I'm nervous because they have a cutoff time of 3:30. I have run a 10k in training in 1:09 so surely I can run 13.1 in 3:30. Does anyone have any advice? The Hal Higdon Novice 2 plan looks pretty good, but I don't know if I want to cut my long runs back down to 4 miles.

    My math is saying a 3:30 half is a 16 minute pace, which is a brisk walk. Most people can walk at 4 mph, which is a 15 minute pace.
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
    rheddmobile wrote: »
    kgirlhart wrote: »
    I have been looking at half marathon training plans. I'm trying to find one that has 4 runs per week instead of 5. I have seen a few but they all start with 4 miles for the first long run. Currently I run 4 days per week. Sunday I do a long run. The last few weeks my long run has been 9 miles and yesterday was 9.5. I also run on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday usually between 3-4 miles. I try to run intervals on Tuesdays but I haven't done any lately since I haven't been actively training for anything specific. I see a lot of advice about "following the plan", but most of the plans I am seeing have you starting out at about 12 miles per week. I am currently running about 20 miles per week. Should I cut back and build back up, or should I just go with what I have been doing and gradually increase? Maybe I should switch to 5 days per week. But 4 really works better for my schedule and my personal life. The half marathon I am looking at (but not signed up for yet) is on May 19th. I'm nervous because they have a cutoff time of 3:30. I have run a 10k in training in 1:09 so surely I can run 13.1 in 3:30. Does anyone have any advice? The Hal Higdon Novice 2 plan looks pretty good, but I don't know if I want to cut my long runs back down to 4 miles.

    My math is saying a 3:30 half is a 16 minute pace, which is a brisk walk. Most people can walk at 4 mph, which is a 15 minute pace.

    @rheddmobile is correct, but for those that are math impaired here is a great chart:

    http://marathonpacechart.com/
  • fitoverfortymom
    fitoverfortymom Posts: 3,452 Member
    kgirlhart wrote: »
    I have been looking at half marathon training plans. I'm trying to find one that has 4 runs per week instead of 5. I have seen a few but they all start with 4 miles for the first long run. Currently I run 4 days per week. Sunday I do a long run. The last few weeks my long run has been 9 miles and yesterday was 9.5. I also run on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday usually between 3-4 miles. I try to run intervals on Tuesdays but I haven't done any lately since I haven't been actively training for anything specific. I see a lot of advice about "following the plan", but most of the plans I am seeing have you starting out at about 12 miles per week. I am currently running about 20 miles per week. Should I cut back and build back up, or should I just go with what I have been doing and gradually increase? Maybe I should switch to 5 days per week. But 4 really works better for my schedule and my personal life. The half marathon I am looking at (but not signed up for yet) is on May 19th. I'm nervous because they have a cutoff time of 3:30. I have run a 10k in training in 1:09 so surely I can run 13.1 in 3:30. Does anyone have any advice? The Hal Higdon Novice 2 plan looks pretty good, but I don't know if I want to cut my long runs back down to 4 miles.

    I love the Hal Higdon plans. Any way you can keep your long runs where you're at until the schedule catches up with you?

    I'm doing the Hal Higdon 10k Intermediate plan, but I've been doing my long runs at 6 miles. I'm doing the plan to 1) Speed up my 10k time and 2) Train for a trail 10k in April. My long runs are on trails, but my weekday runs are not, so that's how I found balance.

    Once the long run on the plan meets/exceeds 6 miles, I'll start adding to my long run.

    I also did the Hal Higdon novice 10k and novice 1 HM with great success on both counts.
  • shanaber
    shanaber Posts: 6,423 Member
    Thanks all for the Strava info. I may just go back to using Map My Run. I really like having the pace feedback when I am running and my Apple watch won't give me that. I like a lot of the fun options and information Strava gives but I don't like how it messes with my distances especially when I keep thinking I should be at 'whatever' mile.

    @girlinahat - I was going to say what @_nikkiwolf_ said. I get really, really high readings from my Apple Watch when I first start a workout if I don't have a HR monitor strap connected and the watch can't find my HR. Sometimes I find turning it so the optical is on the underside of my wrist works well. Also please be careful when you are doing your CF kettlebell swings! You need to not arch your back (use your glutes and core) and also pull your lats down to help support your shoulders. This is one of the reasons I really don't like CF - in my experience they don't give enough form information and people end up getting hurt.

    @skippygirlsmom - That is so awesome for your Skippygirl! Be proud! Be Very Proud!!
    @dreamer12151 - Isn't that so frustrating! I hate technology fails!! Most important thing is you got out and ran though!
  • kevaasen
    kevaasen Posts: 173 Member
    MobyCarp wrote: »
    kgirlhart wrote: »
    Thanks @PastorVincent. I am reading the 80/20 book right now. I'm kind of nervous about coming up with my own plan. I have only been running for about 16 months and still feel like a newbie. Your format sounds good though. (I may have asked about this a while back, but it is hard to find stuff in the threads after a few days, much less a couple of months.) I've been thinking about the HM for a while, but now it is time to start thinking about actually training for it.

    @kgirlhart - Here's my take, use what you find useful and ignore the rest: You are currently running 20 miles per week, with a long run of about 9 miles. You want to get to running 30 to 35 miles per week at peak, with a long run of 13 miles. You need to gradually increase mileage per week and long run distance, perhaps with some optional speed work.

    The only need you have for a canned training program is to supplement your confidence level. You could pick any 4 day a week program you can find, look at the plan for a week that is about at the level you are running now, and start at that point in the plan.

    Alternatively, you could just go without a canned plan using guidelines roughly like @PastorVincent suggested. I have long maintained that anyone who runs 30 to 35 miles per week with a long run of at least 10 miles once per week can run a half marathon any time he or she sees one that looks attractive. You may run a half marathon faster with a more formal training program, but you can get in shape to finish one just by running not all that much more than you are right now.

    There is a lot of time between now and May 19. If it fits with your lifestyle and goals, you could not only train to finish a half marathon in under 3 hours (perhaps significantly under), but train to be able to run 13 miles whenever you feel like it. If the latter is attractive, you might want to build the long run up to 16 miles; that will have the effect of making the 13.1 mile race distance totally non-intimidating. But it's not necessary to run farther than 13 miles on a long run unless you really want to.

    I agree with all of the previous input and especially the above

    - you have to determine what is best for you and can easily complete a HM with only 4 days of running in building from your current mileage base.
    - I personally would not cut back on mileage (just add easy miles to easy days and your long runs) building from 20/wk to the 30's+/wk and getting to a minimum of 10+ mile long run each week
    - my take is "following the plan" is trying to stay consistent with whatever plan you establish and not become inconsistent with your training as that is likely when you place yourself at greater risk for injury if you try to catch up, etc.
    - full confidence that you can do a HM well within the time limits.

    Notes - My 1st HM training plan I chose was via Runkeeper. What I liked about the plan was it had me run beyond the HM distance on my long run. Maybe that is something that would work for you to build your confidence. The extra distance is clearly not needed, however for me it was of huge value to know I could run the distance and that if my easy pace was X time, likely race day could be better, etc. My longest my run prior to a taper was 16 miles, with that building up with a couple 13's, 14 and a 15 .
  • MobyCarp
    MobyCarp Posts: 2,927 Member
    Starflight00 wrote: »
    Thank you all for the warm welcome! You are a chatty bunch, I can't keep up with names and races! :)

    Anyone here running every day? Any pros/cons to consider?

    @Starflight00 - Right now I aspire to run every other day, though I have not achieved that recently. When totally healthy, I have maintained a schedule of running 5 or 6 days a week; I have come to the conclusion that 6 days gives me too high a risk of injury.

    In order to run every day, you can't afford to run hard very often or push for a lot of distance. If you're happy with counting one mile as the minimum, and have the discipline to run that mile so easy that it's like a rest day, it's possible to run for a streak. If you want to work to improve your speed, running every day has a significant risk of injury. If you don't have the discipline to run much slower than you *can* run most of the time, running every day carries a huge risk of injury.

    I'm not the most knowledgeable person about streak running, but I do understand that it is a discipline. It is a different discipline than training for a target race. It is a different discipline than training for a marathon or an ultra. I suspect I could learn it, but I'd have to make it a priority; that would mean giving up training for marathons and giving up training to do well in my age group in national USATF events. Those are things I'm not willing to give up. For my personality, it's easier to avoid injury by not attempting to run every day.
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