Keto Keto Keto!!
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For most people going over 50-60 grams of carbs will not allow ketosis so the percentage equation doesn’t always work. Macros should always be presented in grams and not percentages.Here’s the resource for that % I included
There is this misconception that ketosis is an automatic entry into stored fat. Yes the body learns to burn fat however it burns recently ingested fat first. There is just no way of getting past CICO no matter how you choose to eat if Fatloss is your goal.
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There’s 2 Keto questions that perplex me
1. Why does it matter if you’re in ketosis if you’re satiated and in a calorie deficit? (This applies to weight loss only)?
2. Why cut out something you enjoy if you follow the recommended macros stated above and get results? Have you tried and tracked it to know whether you will still feel starving?
A lot of dieters feel like something is wrong with them when really they have a totally normal macro variance as much as everyone else 🙁
I'm sure people respond as their time and mood permits
As to your questions
1. would matter if you're determined to do keto. if your goal is to eat in a satiating manner you can adjust your macros as you see fit. But people have many beliefs about keto. And it is also a remarkable treatment for childhood epilepsy.
Looking at my first 3.5 years of more detailed and analysed logging (after I started on MFP), I lost the majority of my weight eating 10% less carbs, 5% more fat, and a good 3% more protein.
Except that this both gives you and doesn't give you a true picture. Because yes, my carbs did increase by about 100g but my protein also increased by 5g and my fats did decrease by about 5g after my first year. My TDEE also dropped by 250 + 50 Cal together with the 72.5 + 11.1 lbs I dropped in the first two years I logged on MFP.
2. My eye caught something further up and I wonder if this is what has caused some of your questions.The Keto diet I saw the most was “eat 5%-10% carbs via veggies”. That could be up to 210g for a large man. I was like, Nice! Well, that’s basically the same thing as people eating an “ordinary” diet, right?
How does one know “normal dieting” doesn’t work if you’ve never tracked your “up to” 2g/kg protein + 30% fat + veggies/carbs? I’m kind of stuck here.
I'm going to make the assumption that you are thinking "large man 2100 Calories", 10% in carbs = 210... but that's CALORIES NOT GRAMS. <- 210 Cal = 52.5 grams of carbs. The 210g which you suggest would be non keto levels of carb consumption and would come closer to 840 Cal, or 30% of a 2500 Cal intake which is where I would place a typical male maintenance level.
BTW Tom has identified a typical keto "head-scratcher": but you burn such a high percentage of fat when on keto, obviously it is the only way to burn fat then (or similar logic). So yes, you do burn a higher amount and percentage of fat both. Which is great. But that's because all your intake is coming from fat and protein. But, in terms of weight loss, the only thing that actually matters is how much of your STORED fat you end up burning. Not the fact that you're burning extra freshly incoming fat. And remarkably regardless of macros if you're eating less calories than you're burning you will end up depleting some of your stored fat!1 -
Good post and thank you for mentioning the epilepsy factor which is why KETO was actually derived back in the 1920’s. People think it was derived as a fat loss tool.There’s 2 Keto questions that perplex me
1. Why does it matter if you’re in ketosis if you’re satiated and in a calorie deficit? (This applies to weight loss only)?
2. Why cut out something you enjoy if you follow the recommended macros stated above and get results? Have you tried and tracked it to know whether you will still feel starving?
A lot of dieters feel like something is wrong with them when really they have a totally normal macro variance as much as everyone else 🙁
I'm sure people respond as their time and mood permits As to your questions
1. would matter if you're determined to do keto. if your goal is to eat in a satiating manner you can adjust your macros as you see fit. But people have many beliefs about keto. And it is also a remarkable treatment for childhood epilepsy.
Looking at my first 3.5 years of more detailed and analysed logging (after I started on MFP), I lost the majority of my weight eating 10% less carbs, 5% more fat, and a good 3% more protein.
Except that this both gives you and doesn't give you a true picture. Because yes, my carbs did increase by about 100g but my protein also increased by 5g and my fats did decrease by about 5g after my first year. My TDEE also dropped by 250 + 50 Cal together with the 72.5 + 11.1 lbs I dropped in the first two years I logged on MFP.
2. My eye caught something further up and I wonder if this is what has caused some of your questions.The Keto diet I saw the most was “eat 5%-10% carbs via veggies”. That could be up to 210g for a large man. I was like, Nice! Well, that’s basically the same thing as people eating an “ordinary” diet, right?
How does one know “normal dieting” doesn’t work if you’ve never tracked your “up to” 2g/kg protein + 30% fat + veggies/carbs? I’m kind of stuck here.
I'm going to make the assumption that you are thinking "large man 2100 Calories", 10% in carbs = 210... but that's CALORIES NOT GRAMS. <- 210 Cal = 52.5 grams of carbs. The 210g which you suggest would be non keto levels of carb consumption and would come closer to 840 Cal, or 30% of a 2500 Cal intake which is where I would place a typical male maintenance level.
BTW Tom has identified a typical keto "head-scratcher": but you burn such a high percentage of fat when on keto, obviously it is the only way to burn fat then (or similar logic). So yes, you do burn a higher amount and percentage of fat both. Which is great. But that's because all your intake is coming from fat and protein. But, in terms of weight loss, the only thing that actually matters is how much of your STORED fat you end up burning. Not the fact that you're burning extra freshly incoming fat. And remarkably regardless of macros if you're eating less calories that you're burning you will end up depleting some of your stored fat!
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Sorry for the tardiness. I haven't been very good at keeping up with the forum posts lately.Hi there! I was the one who asked you the question although you didn’t respond to me (which is okay). Thanks for your response!
I track offsite on a spreadsheet I created. I didn't start tracking though until I had been lurking here on the forums for a couple of months. I keep track of calories, fat grams, % of calories from fat, saturated fat grams, sodium , carbohydrate grams, fiber grams, net carbohydrate grams, % of calories from carbohydrates, protein grams, and % of calories from protein. Using the data from the USDA, I built another spreadsheet of 336 separate food items/ingredients that I repeat over and over. If I eat out I try to do it at a place that has the nutritional values of their menu items available online then add that data too. While it took some time to gather the information, now it is just a quick cut and paste to add items to my food log. I still weigh or measure almost everything.How did you track your fat and protein and calories during this time eating a “normal diet” for a lack of a better word?
For 25 years I was prescribed a satin, two blood pressure meds and told to eat less and exercise more. I failed at every diet and exercise routine while getting fatter after each attempt. Well into morbid obesity, I turned to online classes and tried to understand food and fat metabolism. It wasn't until I googled, "Why am I always hungry?" and "Why am I hungrier after eating?" that I got some information that actually helped me. I don't think the different doctors I went to had ever heard of metabolic syndrome or insulin resistance. They sure didn't address the core of my problem.Were you diagnosed with anything by a doctor or is this personal experience with eating carbs that you feel out of control?
In January of '22 I went Keto but still ate as much as I wanted of anything without carbs. It took less than a week to realize I wasn't hungry all the time anymore and I was losing some weight. After watching some influencer's video about fasting I did a 40 hr water only fast the first week of February '22. I experienced a very, very low grade hunger. Easy to ignore. It was nothing like the intense need I had always assumed was hunger. It was an epiphany that has let this old man (66 y.o.) lose weight for the first time ever. I only did keto for a couple of months as my tolerance of carbs slowly got better. Today, I can usually handle 100g or less of net carbs a day without going off the rails stuffing chips and cookies down my throat. I plan to eat this way for the rest of my life. I'm down over 100 pounds so far with more to go.
At a little under 200lbs, my daily personal goals averages are 125g of protein, 50% of calories from healthy fats, less than 100g of net carbs on 2000 calories daily intake. I adjust these macro goals as needed to fit my current activity level and desired weight loss rate. This works for me. You'll want to figure out what works for you and your desired results. And, how well you tolerate carbs.ETA: I just looked this up but it says UP TO 2 gm/kg of protein and 30% of your calories from Fat. Where does that put your protein intake and fat intake in relation to carbs? Did you try this amount and if so were you still starving? I looked at mine just now and it puts my carbs at just 110g per day using that calculation, just enough for plenty of veggies. Do you have to cut out veggies on a Keto diet?
As for starving, I never felt like I was once I cut my carb intake. Most of the time I would make myself eat even though I wasn't hungry. We all should eat plenty of vegetables. There is plenty of information out there on which vegetables are best for you. Daily, I eat some avocado, broccoli, tomatoes, onion, cauliflower, mushrooms and spinach because they are good for me and don't set off my carb cravings.
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tomcustombuilder wrote: »
Good post and thank you for mentioning the epilepsy factor which is why KETO was actually derived back in the 1920’s. People think it was derived as a fat loss tool.There’s 2 Keto questions that perplex me
1. Why does it matter if you’re in ketosis if you’re satiated and in a calorie deficit? (This applies to weight loss only)?
2. Why cut out something you enjoy if you follow the recommended macros stated above and get results? Have you tried and tracked it to know whether you will still feel starving?
A lot of dieters feel like something is wrong with them when really they have a totally normal macro variance as much as everyone else 🙁
I'm sure people respond as their time and mood permits As to your questions
1. would matter if you're determined to do keto. if your goal is to eat in a satiating manner you can adjust your macros as you see fit. But people have many beliefs about keto. And it is also a remarkable treatment for childhood epilepsy.
Looking at my first 3.5 years of more detailed and analysed logging (after I started on MFP), I lost the majority of my weight eating 10% less carbs, 5% more fat, and a good 3% more protein.
Except that this both gives you and doesn't give you a true picture. Because yes, my carbs did increase by about 100g but my protein also increased by 5g and my fats did decrease by about 5g after my first year. My TDEE also dropped by 250 + 50 Cal together with the 72.5 + 11.1 lbs I dropped in the first two years I logged on MFP.
2. My eye caught something further up and I wonder if this is what has caused some of your questions.The Keto diet I saw the most was “eat 5%-10% carbs via veggies”. That could be up to 210g for a large man. I was like, Nice! Well, that’s basically the same thing as people eating an “ordinary” diet, right?
How does one know “normal dieting” doesn’t work if you’ve never tracked your “up to” 2g/kg protein + 30% fat + veggies/carbs? I’m kind of stuck here.
I'm going to make the assumption that you are thinking "large man 2100 Calories", 10% in carbs = 210... but that's CALORIES NOT GRAMS. <- 210 Cal = 52.5 grams of carbs. The 210g which you suggest would be non keto levels of carb consumption and would come closer to 840 Cal, or 30% of a 2500 Cal intake which is where I would place a typical male maintenance level.
BTW Tom has identified a typical keto "head-scratcher": but you burn such a high percentage of fat when on keto, obviously it is the only way to burn fat then (or similar logic). So yes, you do burn a higher amount and percentage of fat both. Which is great. But that's because all your intake is coming from fat and protein. But, in terms of weight loss, the only thing that actually matters is how much of your STORED fat you end up burning. Not the fact that you're burning extra freshly incoming fat. And remarkably regardless of macros if you're eating less calories that you're burning you will end up depleting some of your stored fat!
Tom's right most people think it's some kind of fat lose diet, but it's not any different or better for fat loss than any other diet. However it wasn't derived for epilepsy but it was used in conjunction with epilepsy and subsequently
coined the "ketogenic diet" for epilepsy therapy.
Fasting has been used for epilepsy for centuries as well for other chronic diseases and the discovery of acetone and beta-hydroxybutyric acid which are basic byproducts of fasting or starvation and when carbs were very low and fat was very high this mimicked those byproducts which are the basic foundation of ketones. That observation then led to the benefits of fasting through ketonemia (ketones) and then suggested that it should be used for children with epilepsy because of the history of fasting therapy for epilepsy and the rest was history.
Anyway, we either use glucose as a primary energy source or we use ketones and to dip into body fat for energy we still need to be in a deficit, plain and simple and considering most people know pretty much nothing about nutrition, the notion that a keto diet is some kind silver bullet isn't surprising considering the misinformation that abounds in the interweb.1 -
Sorry for the tardiness. I haven't been very good at keeping up with the forum posts lately.Hi there! I was the one who asked you the question although you didn’t respond to me (which is okay). Thanks for your response!
I track offsite on a spreadsheet I created. I didn't start tracking though until I had been lurking here on the forums for a couple of months. I keep track of calories, fat grams, % of calories from fat, saturated fat grams, sodium , carbohydrate grams, fiber grams, net carbohydrate grams, % of calories from carbohydrates, protein grams, and % of calories from protein. Using the data from the USDA, I built another spreadsheet of 336 separate food items/ingredients that I repeat over and over. If I eat out I try to do it at a place that has the nutritional values of their menu items available online then add that data too. While it took some time to gather the information, now it is just a quick cut and paste to add items to my food log. I still weigh or measure almost everything.How did you track your fat and protein and calories during this time eating a “normal diet” for a lack of a better word?
For 25 years I was prescribed a satin, two blood pressure meds and told to eat less and exercise more. I failed at every diet and exercise routine while getting fatter after each attempt. Well into morbid obesity, I turned to online classes and tried to understand food and fat metabolism. It wasn't until I googled, "Why am I always hungry?" and "Why am I hungrier after eating?" that I got some information that actually helped me. I don't think the different doctors I went to had ever heard of metabolic syndrome or insulin resistance. They sure didn't address the core of my problem.Were you diagnosed with anything by a doctor or is this personal experience with eating carbs that you feel out of control?
In January of '22 I went Keto but still ate as much as I wanted of anything without carbs. It took less than a week to realize I wasn't hungry all the time anymore and I was losing some weight. After watching some influencer's video about fasting I did a 40 hr water only fast the first week of February '22. I experienced a very, very low grade hunger. Easy to ignore. It was nothing like the intense need I had always assumed was hunger. It was an epiphany that has let this old man (66 y.o.) lose weight for the first time ever. I only did keto for a couple of months as my tolerance of carbs slowly got better. Today, I can usually handle 100g or less of net carbs a day without going off the rails stuffing chips and cookies down my throat. I plan to eat this way for the rest of my life. I'm down over 100 pounds so far with more to go.
At a little under 200lbs, my daily personal goals averages are 125g of protein, 50% of calories from healthy fats, less than 100g of net carbs on 2000 calories daily intake. I adjust these macro goals as needed to fit my current activity level and desired weight loss rate. This works for me. You'll want to figure out what works for you and your desired results. And, how well you tolerate carbs.ETA: I just looked this up but it says UP TO 2 gm/kg of protein and 30% of your calories from Fat. Where does that put your protein intake and fat intake in relation to carbs? Did you try this amount and if so were you still starving? I looked at mine just now and it puts my carbs at just 110g per day using that calculation, just enough for plenty of veggies. Do you have to cut out veggies on a Keto diet?
As for starving, I never felt like I was once I cut my carb intake. Most of the time I would make myself eat even though I wasn't hungry. We all should eat plenty of vegetables. There is plenty of information out there on which vegetables are best for you. Daily, I eat some avocado, broccoli, tomatoes, onion, cauliflower, mushrooms and spinach because they are good for me and don't set off my carb cravings.
Not tardy at all, it’s my fault and Pavv is right, you’ll respond when you have the ability to 😊
You clarified a lot and I’m truly so happy that you found that perfect balance for you! You couldn’t have been more clear and I can see the full picture now. Congrats on all your success!1 -
This was my first group experience on MyFitnessPal. Some of you are kind and supportive. I wish I could filter by kindness. Others…Wow! Some of you are just mean!
Why are you judging anyone’s WOE? If you have nothing kind to say, say nothing! You have no idea what others are going through, or what kind of impact your words can have for someone struggling.
Sadly, this is my first and last community experience. This is hard enough without having to contend with unkind people judging me. I already do that to myself. I’m looking for support, and I would gladly give it in return.
For the kind folks, thank you. For the others, I have no words1 -
This was my first group experience on MyFitnessPal. Some of you are kind and supportive. I wish I could filter by kindness. Others…Wow! Some of you are just mean!
Why are you judging anyone’s WOE? If you have nothing kind to say, say nothing! You have no idea what others are going through, or what kind of impact your words can have for someone struggling.
Sadly, this is my first and last community experience. This is hard enough without having to contend with unkind people judging me. I already do that to myself. I’m looking for support, and I would gladly give it in return.
For the kind folks, thank you. For the others, I have no words
Are you sure you meant to post on this? This is a thread from 4 months ago.1 -
15 lbs in 15 days (the beginning days) may be partly water loss. Perhaps you're not giving it time enough. Or try a 36 or 48 hr. fast. Plateaus are frustrating.0
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I don't do Keto. I have friends who do different versions of Keto. Full Keto works for many people, but not everyone can do it long-term. It just depends on genetics and the person. If you end up struggling with full Keto, you can always try a modified keto diet. It's more flexible.
I hope which ever one you are doing works for you.
- Full Keto
- Modified Keto
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MargaretYakoda wrote: »KickinATakinNames wrote: »Hi! I'm not new to Keto, but I've been on it 15 days now and am 15lbs down. I am kind of stuck at a plateau right now. I follow a very strict keto and I feel like I'm stuck. How do I get out of this plateau? Any advice would be appreciate
Hey. I don’t do keto.
That said? There’s a good keto group here, do a search for it and I’m sure it will turn up.
@Lietchi is right. A stall of a couple weeks - definitely frustrating - but not a plateau.
Plateau is five weeks at least.
Weight loss is not linear. And female bodies are especially not linear when it comes to weight loss.
Why have you chosen keto?
Really, any method that restricts calories will lead to weight loss. Myself? I am eating whatever I want. I’m just choosing to eat reasonable portions.
Almost 70 pounds down since February.
Proof that keto isn’t the only way to go.
If someone is diabetic or pre-diabetic, Keto or Modified Keto can sometimes help manage blood sugar. Several new medical studies show that it works better for diabetics than the Heart Healthy Diet usually prescribed. But each person is different and has to find what works for them.
Diabetics often like modified keto because it helps them need less insulin and have fewer spikes in blood sugar.
Others like keto because it fits the types of foods they enjoy and simplifies things.
People do forget though--that even though you are doing Keto or Modified Keto, you still need to watch the total calories eaten.0
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