Stretching
lindabarrettoburns
Posts: 3 Member
I do a lot of cardio, and I think genetically tight muscles runs in my family. I do Yoga twice a week, and find it boring, and frustrating. I can't do what the instructor wants me to do, I can't even sit cross legged because my hips are so tight.
I have started the 30 minute daily Classical Stretching & Strengthening by Miranda Esmond-White at 7:30 am on PBS in US and 6am in Canada. Looking for company as I try to lengthen my tight muscles, and to keep me motivated. Perhaps there are videos someone can suggest that is gentle but will increase my range of motion. I am interested in proper form, so lots of verbal and detailed cues are helpful.
This is my first foray into message boards, so if you have time, please help or join me and we can try and figure this out together.
I have started the 30 minute daily Classical Stretching & Strengthening by Miranda Esmond-White at 7:30 am on PBS in US and 6am in Canada. Looking for company as I try to lengthen my tight muscles, and to keep me motivated. Perhaps there are videos someone can suggest that is gentle but will increase my range of motion. I am interested in proper form, so lots of verbal and detailed cues are helpful.
This is my first foray into message boards, so if you have time, please help or join me and we can try and figure this out together.
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Replies
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www.fitnessblender.com they have tons of videos, you can search for exactly what you are looking for, and they have flexibility videos as well. they even have a 4-week flexibility program where they schedule the correct workouts for you. they are fantastic for any and all types of workout vids.1
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I have the same problem. I've mountain biked and skied for years and I have incredibly tight hips. I've been doing yoga for years (although not as frequently as I should) and I still don't have half the flexibility of others in the classes. I find that Bikram yoga helps - I think the heat helps my muscles to relax and stretch a bit more but it's painfully boring because it's the same sequence every time. Yin yoga is also good because of the extended holds...but again, the boring problem. Foam rollers and tennis balls can help break of the fascia that restricts muscle movement. Also, don't be afraid to use props - they are not cheating, they really do help. Sitting on a rolled blanket will tilt your hips and help you sit on the cross legged, using blocks and straps will help when you can't touch the floor or reach your toes. Also, one more suggestion, sit on the floor whenever possible. My husband and I sit cross-legged on the floor when watching TV to help open our hips. Good luck!2
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I find yoga insanely boring. I genuinely don't understand the appeal and it doesn't burn that many calories relative to other exercise. I just do a simple stretch routine and a little bit of cardio.3
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I think it's somewhat safe to assume that the vast majority of people globally who do yoga don't do it in an effort to burn calories. I personally like the thought of it for the stretching aspect (I don't enjoy doing yoga in reality, but part of me wishes I did) and I know plenty of people who do it for that reason. There's also the spiritual aspect (which I suspect most people outside of the Indian subcontinent ignore), some people find it meditative, relaxing, useful for core stability, and so on.I find yoga insanely boring. I genuinely don't understand the appeal and it doesn't burn that many calories relative to other exercise. I just do a simple stretch routine and a little bit of cardio.3 -
Classical stretch or Essentrics.com streaming has helped me loosen my hips and improve my posture a lot more then yoga classes.1
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I find it very comforting knowing that I am not the only one that finds yoga boring. Thanks everyone for the feedback. I am glad to hear one other person found Eccentrics helpful. I will check out fitness Blender videos as well. Thanks all.0
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Talk to the yoga instructor about your concerns and ask for modifications for your condition.0
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I like using Yoga with Adriene videos on Youtube, and she has a wide range of videos for beginners to advanced, from meditation to power yoga. There are videos specifically for tight muscles, and during all of her videos she will demonstrate ways to modify for too tight muscles. I like doing yoga at home because it encourages more freedom, and being a little wiggle worm, I like having my space to do as I please. And it's free. Adriene talks a lot, which is good for beginners because the verbal cues and encouragement on what to do and how to really feel it is helpful, but I also use my Nike Training Club app yoga videos for when I want to just be told what pose to go to next without a ton of talking. I also sometimes use the Pocket Yoga app, which has from beginner to advanced level yoga as well. If yoga really isn't your thing though, I also recommend Fitness Blender stretching videos. It takes a lot of time and effort to gain flexibility, but it's worth working on, as it can make your workouts much better. At least, it did for me. It's easier to do many exercises and I feel I gain more from it because I can go into it more and deeper without pain.
Whatever route you choose, good luck! Stick with it.1 -
I think you can easily do a lot better than Yoga for flexibility, and it doesn't take so dang long. The emergence of yoga in the modern west was sort of an incoherent clusterf*** mess of people not really knowing what they're doing (and an interesting bunch of stories, if you wanna read about it). They stumbled onto a few good moves that will work, surrounded with a bunch of suboptimal stuff.
Anyways, I'd suggest you skip that problematic word and go for "mobility" resources right off the bat and you'll have a better time with it.
I've been doing a couple of little routines from parkour and fitness guys for the past year and a half, in-between fixing my coffee and doing the dishes after I get up. It takes about 5-10 minutes total and I'm never sore since I started. Nothing special.0 -
Flexibility is over-rated.7
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redonkulousd wrote: »
I think he is referring to its really not necessary for strength training and is considered inefficient since the best stretch for lifting is the lift itself. In fact stretching might hinder certain lifts.
Extra stretching outside of the lift itself has no permanent benefit for strength training. That being said, if you like it...have at it.
I'm well over 40 with a nasty progressive joint disease and don't make odd noises when bending over other than the sound of barbells clanging in a squat or deadlift. Well maybe a fart...3 -
I have the same problem. I've mountain biked and skied for years and I have incredibly tight hips. I've been doing yoga for years (although not as frequently as I should) and I still don't have half the flexibility of others in the classes. I find that Bikram yoga helps - I think the heat helps my muscles to relax and stretch a bit more but it's painfully boring because it's the same sequence every time. Yin yoga is also good because of the extended holds...but again, the boring problem. Foam rollers and tennis balls can help break of the fascia that restricts muscle movement. Also, don't be afraid to use props - they are not cheating, they really do help. Sitting on a rolled blanket will tilt your hips and help you sit on the cross legged, using blocks and straps will help when you can't touch the floor or reach your toes. Also, one more suggestion, sit on the floor whenever possible. My husband and I sit cross-legged on the floor when watching TV to help open our hips. Good luck!
I was going to suggest Yin too. I am SUPER inflexible and I can't believe how much range of motion I've been able to increase in my hips with Yin (wish I could do the same with my shoulders). The key is to not push too far and use props if you need them. Just take it the edge and hang out there. As far as the boredom, I do it right before bed and it's very peaceful and meditative and put's me right to sleep afterwards. There are some great youtube videos. Fightmaster yoga is a good one.0 -
redonkulousd wrote: »
I think he is referring to its really not necessary for strength training and is considered inefficient since the best stretch for lifting is the lift itself. In fact stretching might hinder certain lifts.
Extra stretching outside of the lift itself has no permanent benefit for strength training. That being said, if you like it...have at it.
I'm well over 40 with a nasty progressive joint disease and don't make odd noises when bending over other than the sound of barbells clanging in a squat or deadlift. Well maybe a fart...
Exactly.0 -
If you can move through a good range of motion, then you probably don't need more than a dynamic warm-up to get going before a workout. But if you're like the OP in this thread, you probably do need some additional mobility work.
In-terms of benefit to strength-training, no it doesn't add strength. But if you can't move through the correct range of motion for the lift, then you're limiting yourself and potentially setting yourself up for injury. For instance, if you squat and your hips and / or your lower back are so tight that you can get into the "hole" that's not helpful for you. Not to mention if your hips are too tight to flex correctly, your quads may takeover more than they should and over time that can lead to injury or at the very least discomfort.
There is no blanket solution for mobility work in people. Some folks need more than others, some really don't need much if any mobility work. If you can roll out of bed and perform your exercise without mobility work, great. If you wake up stiff and need some mobility work, there's nothing wrong with that.3 -
Just have to get my two cents in here. Ironically, I am extremely flexible. Have done yoga in the past - and I loved it - but perhaps because I AM flexible. But to your point here - I do a lot of running and boxing, some weights, yet I NEVER stretch. I just hope my hubris doesn't catch up to me some day....0
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Stretching is really important! I don't follow a program but I do go sit on a mat and do at least ten minutes legs and back stretching and whatnot after I am done at the gym. It helped almost immediately with my constantly tired quads and lower back. I am also incorporating working on some splits
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I wake up stiff and hurting every morning--OA, so I need to stretch before I start my day. It takes most of the pain away so I can function. When I get to the pool or gym, I'm ready to start my workout. The OP doesn't mention that she's lifting.0
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snowflake954 wrote: »I wake up stiff and hurting every morning--OA, so I need to stretch before I start my day. It takes most of the pain away so I can function. When I get to the pool or gym, I'm ready to start my workout. The OP doesn't mention that she's lifting.
My bad, I took strengthening as lifting since it's the best way to achieve that goal.
Yeah most of my pain is relieved by just moving and lifting, no stretching necessary thankfully.
It's sad when people don't lift, strength training has so many benefits for a longer better quality life.0 -
redonkulousd wrote: »
I think he is referring to its really not necessary for strength training and is considered inefficient since the best stretch for lifting is the lift itself. In fact stretching might hinder certain lifts.
Extra stretching outside of the lift itself has no permanent benefit for strength training. That being said, if you like it...have at it.
I'm well over 40 with a nasty progressive joint disease and don't make odd noises when bending over other than the sound of barbells clanging in a squat or deadlift. Well maybe a fart...
Exactly.
Well conveniently for you no one is forcing you to stretch and the OP didn't mention anything about weight lifting. Meanwhile for various sports, including ones that involve needing a lot of muscular strength (like rock climbing) stretching is far from overrated.1 -
snowflake954 wrote: »I wake up stiff and hurting every morning--OA, so I need to stretch before I start my day. It takes most of the pain away so I can function. When I get to the pool or gym, I'm ready to start my workout. The OP doesn't mention that she's lifting.
My bad, I took strengthening as lifting since it's the best way to achieve that goal.
Yeah most of my pain is relieved by just moving and lifting, no stretching necessary thankfully.
It's sad when people don't lift, strength training has so many benefits for a longer better quality life.
True, but so do stretching and agility drills. I am 46 years old and last spring I realized that I could run a marathon, but I could not jump onto a 12 inch box. I started incorporating strength training, stretching and agility drills into my workout routine and I am proud to say that I can now jump on a 12 inch box with ease and have increased my functional mobility in other areas as well. As I age, I want to continue to do the physical activities that I enjoy without pain, and I feel like a combination of all of these types of exercises (along with my regular cardio workouts) will enable me to do that.7 -
redonkulousd wrote: »
I think he is referring to its really not necessary for strength training and is considered inefficient since the best stretch for lifting is the lift itself. In fact stretching might hinder certain lifts.
Extra stretching outside of the lift itself has no permanent benefit for strength training. That being said, if you like it...have at it.
I'm well over 40 with a nasty progressive joint disease and don't make odd noises when bending over other than the sound of barbells clanging in a squat or deadlift. Well maybe a fart...
Exactly.
Well conveniently for you no one is forcing you to stretch and the OP didn't mention anything about weight lifting. Meanwhile for various sports, including ones that involve needing a lot of muscular strength (like rock climbing) stretching is far from overrated.
No one said anything about rock climbing. I can confirm, in rock climbing, stretching is overrated. Source: rock climbing for 16 years. I've never once thought, "I wish I had done some stretching." I have thought a lot about the muscle imbalances I have though....1 -
lporter229 wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »I wake up stiff and hurting every morning--OA, so I need to stretch before I start my day. It takes most of the pain away so I can function. When I get to the pool or gym, I'm ready to start my workout. The OP doesn't mention that she's lifting.
My bad, I took strengthening as lifting since it's the best way to achieve that goal.
Yeah most of my pain is relieved by just moving and lifting, no stretching necessary thankfully.
It's sad when people don't lift, strength training has so many benefits for a longer better quality life.
True, but so do stretching and agility drills. I am 46 years old and last spring I realized that I could run a marathon, but I could not jump onto a 12 inch box. I started incorporating strength training, stretching and agility drills into my workout routine and I am proud to say that I can now jump on a 12 inch box with ease and have increased my functional mobility in other areas as well. As I age, I want to continue to do the physical activities that I enjoy without pain, and I feel like a combination of all of these types of exercises (along with my regular cardio workouts) will enable me to do that.
Just because you did stretching, doesn't mean that is the reason why you can now jump on a box. That comes from training jumping more than previously.
If you want to get better at anything, you specifically train more of that task.
I hazard that strength training had more to do with your ability to jump better as data shows strength training is beneficial to dailly functions as well as physical tasks or sports, not extra stretching.
To jump farther or higher one must get stronger and be able to transfer that power from a contracted muscle. Stretching teaches a muscle to relax not contract.0 -
Having competed at a regional level and knowing people who do so at an international level, we're going to have to agree to disagree. I agree that no one other than me brought up rock climbing but then again, who brought up weight lifting? It certainly wasn't the OP. They wanted ideas about stretching because they aren't happy with how tight their muscles are.ronocnikral wrote: »No one said anything about rock climbing. I can confirm, in rock climbing, stretching is overrated. Source: rock climbing for 16 years. I've never once thought, "I wish I had done some stretching." I have thought a lot about the muscle imbalances I have though....
Why there is a disdain for stretching or the idea that anyone would want to stretch boggles my mind though. It's just another version of "cardio is a waste of time" or "strength is a waste of time" - both conversations that go nowhere fast. Yes there is a population for which extensive stretching is contradicted, but that isn't most people.2 -
lporter229 wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »I wake up stiff and hurting every morning--OA, so I need to stretch before I start my day. It takes most of the pain away so I can function. When I get to the pool or gym, I'm ready to start my workout. The OP doesn't mention that she's lifting.
My bad, I took strengthening as lifting since it's the best way to achieve that goal.
Yeah most of my pain is relieved by just moving and lifting, no stretching necessary thankfully.
It's sad when people don't lift, strength training has so many benefits for a longer better quality life.
True, but so do stretching and agility drills. I am 46 years old and last spring I realized that I could run a marathon, but I could not jump onto a 12 inch box. I started incorporating strength training, stretching and agility drills into my workout routine and I am proud to say that I can now jump on a 12 inch box with ease and have increased my functional mobility in other areas as well. As I age, I want to continue to do the physical activities that I enjoy without pain, and I feel like a combination of all of these types of exercises (along with my regular cardio workouts) will enable me to do that.
Just because you did stretching, doesn't mean that is the reason why you can now jump on a box. That comes from training jumping more than previously.
If you want to get better at anything, you specifically train more of that task.
I hazard that strength training had more to do with your ability to jump better as data shows strength training is beneficial to dailly functions as well as physical tasks or sports, not extra stretching.
To jump farther or higher one must get stronger and be able to transfer that power from a contracted muscle. Stretching teaches a muscle to relax not contract.
No, stretching / mobility does allow one to improve their VJ or distance that needs to be trained. However, if one is too immobile to execute the jump correctly then it will diminish how high / far they jump and can affect how they land and landing badly is something that can result in an injury.
Again, everybody is going to have different levels of mobility. Some people don't need to do mobility work and others do. It's something that's on a case-by-case basis and to have a blanket statement that somebody does or does not need to do mobility work is just wrong. And even for those that need it, may not need as much of it on some days.2 -
Having competed at a regional level and knowing people who do so at an international level, we're going to have to agree to disagree. I agree that no one other than me brought up rock climbing but then again, who brought up weight lifting? It certainly wasn't the OP. They wanted ideas about stretching because they aren't happy with how tight their muscles are.ronocnikral wrote: »No one said anything about rock climbing. I can confirm, in rock climbing, stretching is overrated. Source: rock climbing for 16 years. I've never once thought, "I wish I had done some stretching." I have thought a lot about the muscle imbalances I have though....
Why there is a disdain for stretching or the idea that anyone would want to stretch boggles my mind though. It's just another version of "cardio is a waste of time" or "strength is a waste of time" - both conversations that go nowhere fast. Yes there is a population for which extensive stretching is contradicted, but that isn't most people.
There is actually a school of people (I happen to be one of them) that think stretching has no benefits for performance, no benefits for injury prevention and can actually cause one to be more injury prone.
https://philmaffetone.com/dangers-of-stretching/The way to avoid Range of Motion (ROM) losses during exercise is habitual prevention outside of the exercise session itself: resolve local power/endurance imbalances in the muscle’s physical structure, as well as neuromuscular imbalances that either cause or are caused by a poor/incomplete proprioceptive/enteroceptive map of the body, or local or global problems with sensation.
If someone can't sit on the floor, my first question would be, why do you want to sit on the floor? Our flexibility or range of motion is conditioned for what our lives demand. for a lot of us fat americans, that means sitting in chairs slouched over. The first part of the quote from Maffetone is what I believe to be the true issue, and that is muscle imbalances. Take the anterior pelvic tilt or duck butt, it is simply a muscle imbalance. Or say one is climbing and is having a hard time nailing their feet, especially when up high (guilty, as charged). I've found the answer isn't trying to stretch out my hammys and glutes, but rather to strengthen my core.
But, the important thing to know is, when you stretch to increase your range of motion, you become more injury prone. And that is why I don't advocate stretching for the sake of stretching. Or, as Edward Abbey said, "growth for the sake of growth, the ideology of cancer." Everything we do in our training plan should have a purpose.
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I realize you're not saying this, but it almost reminds me of the question, "why do you need to learn how to get up from the floor" that was posed after my knee surgery last winter. Let me just say, there are plenty of reasons why one would need to do so (and it's not just, "I fell and I can't get up"). No I don't spend a lot of time sitting on the floor (though if I had a small child or took care of children I'm sure I would), but things like getting out of the a pool (without using the stairs on the side), looking at and getting books from shelves that are inches from the floor, getting things from low deep cabinets, gardening - all things that I do that require getting up from the floor and only one of those is sports related (and even then, just barely).
I am not surprised that there is a school of people that believes that stretching is not necessary and potentially detrimental. When I have time I may do more than just skim the link you provided, but in terms of my current stretching needs, I get my advice from my physical therapists and my orthopedist, all of whom work at a teaching hospital and specialize in sports medicine. These are all people who work with athletes of all levels and nonathletes alike. Additionally, one of them has worked extensively with olympians both at the olympic training center in Colorado Springs and during the olympics in Rio. I don't say that to name drop, but rather to say that it's not like I'm getting my information from people who don't know what they're talking about and don't treat a people with an exceedingly wide variety of needs.
When I was climbing (which is something that I physically can't do right now due to injury) I found stretching very important. That said I was also very strong and, yes, core strength was a big deal. I can come up with a number of sports and other athletic like pursuits where flexibility is important, most (if not all) martial arts, gymnastics, probably fencing, figure skating, probably ski jumping, diving, aerial skiing, ballet (some people wouldn't call ballet a sport, but there is undeniably a lot of athleticism that goes into ballet), some aspects of cycling (getting into and maintaining a very aero position...), and that's just what I can come up with off the top of my head.1 -
My point is practicing jumping would not only make you a better jumper, it would stretch adequately and efficiently no matter what mobility. Extra stetching will not improve the skill it takes to transfer force optimally.JAYxMSxPES wrote: »lporter229 wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »I wake up stiff and hurting every morning--OA, so I need to stretch before I start my day. It takes most of the pain away so I can function. When I get to the pool or gym, I'm ready to start my workout. The OP doesn't mention that she's lifting.
My bad, I took strengthening as lifting since it's the best way to achieve that goal.
Yeah most of my pain is relieved by just moving and lifting, no stretching necessary thankfully.
It's sad when people don't lift, strength training has so many benefits for a longer better quality life.
True, but so do stretching and agility drills. I am 46 years old and last spring I realized that I could run a marathon, but I could not jump onto a 12 inch box. I started incorporating strength training, stretching and agility drills into my workout routine and I am proud to say that I can now jump on a 12 inch box with ease and have increased my functional mobility in other areas as well. As I age, I want to continue to do the physical activities that I enjoy without pain, and I feel like a combination of all of these types of exercises (along with my regular cardio workouts) will enable me to do that.
Just because you did stretching, doesn't mean that is the reason why you can now jump on a box. That comes from training jumping more than previously.
If you want to get better at anything, you specifically train more of that task.
I hazard that strength training had more to do with your ability to jump better as data shows strength training is beneficial to dailly functions as well as physical tasks or sports, not extra stretching.
To jump farther or higher one must get stronger and be able to transfer that power from a contracted muscle. Stretching teaches a muscle to relax not contract.
No, stretching / mobility does allow one to improve their VJ or distance that needs to be trained. However, if one is too immobile to execute the jump correctly then it will diminish how high / far they jump and can affect how they land and landing badly is something that can result in an injury.
Again, everybody is going to have different levels of mobility. Some people don't need to do mobility work and others do. It's something that's on a case-by-case basis and to have a blanket statement that somebody does or does not need to do mobility work is just wrong. And even for those that need it, may not need as much of it on some days.
Of course everybody is built different, has different levels of fitness that allows the stretch reflex needed it takes to be optimal. Practicing along with strength training makes the skill progress and gives plenty of stetching on its own.
That's like saying a pro basketball player needs to do yoga back bridges to practice slam dunking because it gives them more quad stretching. If they want to jump higher with more force, then they should strength train with specificity to their sport along with practice slam dunking. No amount of yoga poses is going to make them efficiently jumping higher than their skill coupled with strength training.
Example, I have a nasty progressive joint disease. Every morning I literally cannot hold a coffee cup or stand correctly because of swelling/pain. Yet less than a hour later I can deadlift 500 lbs standing correctly locked out. I do zero extra stetching to increase my mobilty of my frozen hands, hips, knees, or feet other than a progressive warmup weights for deadlifts to be able to hold the weight. Why can I do it? Because I practiced it over time. I needed zero extra stretching, zero.
Btw, one practices how to land correctly when they practice jumping. It more efficient than extra stretching because it's part of skill. If a novice jumper and a skilled jumper were to jump the same amount of attempts, I would hazard the novice would be likely hurt first from.landing incorrectly because the lack of practicing the skill of landing, not lack of extra stetches.0 -
I realize you're not saying this, but it almost reminds me of the question, "why do you need to learn how to get up from the floor" that was posed after my knee surgery last winter. Let me just say, there are plenty of reasons why one would need to do so (and it's not just, "I fell and I can't get up"). No I don't spend a lot of time sitting on the floor (though if I had a small child or took care of children I'm sure I would), but things like getting out of the a pool (without using the stairs on the side), looking at and getting books from shelves that are inches from the floor, getting things from low deep cabinets, gardening - all things that I do that require getting up from the floor and only one of those is sports related (and even then, just barely).
I am not surprised that there is a school of people that believes that stretching is not necessary and potentially detrimental. When I have time I may do more than just skim the link you provided, but in terms of my current stretching needs, I get my advice from my physical therapists and my orthopedist, all of whom work at a teaching hospital and specialize in sports medicine. These are all people who work with athletes of all levels and nonathletes alike. Additionally, one of them has worked extensively with olympians both at the olympic training center in Colorado Springs and during the olympics in Rio. I don't say that to name drop, but rather to say that it's not like I'm getting my information from people who don't know what they're talking about and don't treat a people with an exceedingly wide variety of needs.
When I was climbing (which is something that I physically can't do right now due to injury) I found stretching very important. That said I was also very strong and, yes, core strength was a big deal. I can come up with a number of sports and other athletic like pursuits where flexibility is important, most (if not all) martial arts, gymnastics, probably fencing, figure skating, probably ski jumping, diving, aerial skiing, ballet (some people wouldn't call ballet a sport, but there is undeniably a lot of athleticism that goes into ballet), some aspects of cycling (getting into and maintaining a very aero position...), and that's just what I can come up with off the top of my head.
Just to clarify, because I realize it may seem like I am talking out of both sides of my mouth. Not all stretching is bad, if it has a purpose and is needed for a specific activity, I can get behind it. But, we all don't need to be as flexible as a ballerina or a gymnast. When we increase our range of motion, we also become more injury prone in that area since muscles and ligaments arent as tight around the joints in that area. For instance, I have a bad shoulder that used to fall out when sleeping. Lots of pt never once did I stretch it, but I did lots of exercises to strengthen muscles around the joint and maintain range of motion. I dropped the throwing the ball exercises, and I haven't had my shoulder dislocate in 8 year or so. My crampons even blew last weekend and I can hold my entire body weight on my shoulder now. Touches wood. I'll probably never (strong word, I know) stretch that shoulder again.
The idea that stretching is needed before and after a workout just because, is the main way stretching is applied. And it is the most dangerous. And I believe it should be avoided. It's a training myth, like you need to feel a burn to have training gains.2 -
redonkulousd wrote: »
Actually, that's mobility, and has nothing to do with stretching, active or passive... and everything to do with practicing good movement patterns and getting strong in those hard movement areas... Strength training and mobility go hand in hand.2
This discussion has been closed.
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