Has anyone had any experience gaining muscle on a Keto diet?
Options
Replies
-
Carb load before a show is a myth and a sign of bad dieting, to a point. This has been a result quite often of poor sodium intake. There are tons of videos out now talking about how badly bodybuilders have dieted in the past. There are tons of body builders that got horrible advice from trainers that did not know what they were talking about, or used OLD knowledge about how things work.
Before you guys continue posting this, go out and watch youtube videos on flexible dieting, keto, etc. There are tons of bodybuilders that talk about how crappy their diets were and what horrible advice they got. I personally don't do keto, but have watch probably over 20 videos on keto and flexible dieting.
While there is tons of good information on Youtube and a lot of very knowledgeable people, I would be careful about using it as your main reference point for your beliefs. Anyone can go make a video and post it on Youtube. That doesn't mean that it is 100% accurate or scientifically proven.
As @sardelsa said, different things are going to work for different people. While it may be possible to bulk on keto, it is not going to be optimal. Diet and getting enough calories is important in bulking, but so is having solid workouts and good programming. I personally do not believe that you are capable of putting as much in to a high intensity workout without carbs as you can with them. Carbs help to fuel your body.9 -
What is optimal? Obviously that is very subjective to an individual. Especially when it comes to performance. All that data can easily be slanted towards a specific outcome. Food fuels the body. Eat enough to fuel your workout and you will either gain, maintain or lose weight depending on your goals. Eat and grind.10
-
Keto_Vampire wrote: »I can't say it's good for bulking or weightlifting performance. Note: most people doing "keto" and weightlifting/bodybuilding use a much higher %kcal from protein (more like 30-35% protein, 60-65% fat). Maintenance and "cutting" are better suited for keto
Lol...Jason Wittrock I believe it was consuming like 4,000 kcal/day for a month stuck @ like 145-150lbs (nice guy, just a bit too naive with pseudoscience advocating keto as superior no matter what)
IMO Jason's 4k results is an edge case. There were other people that did the 4k cal keto diet and gained weight.
0 -
What is optimal? Obviously that is very subjective to an individual. Especially when it comes to performance. All that data can easily be slanted towards a specific outcome. Food fuels the body. Eat enough to fuel your workout and you will either gain, maintain or lose weight depending on your goals. Eat and grind.
This isn't 100% true. Different forms of food do different things for our bodies. It's why people pay attention to macros in the first place. Let's say someone spends a whole day eating 250 calorie protein bars that contain carbs, protein, and fat, and someone else spends a whole day eating 250 calorie rice krispie treats. These people generally perform fairly equally in typical workouts. When it comes to the end of the day, who do you think is going to have the better workout? Not all foods are created equal. Carbs are an energy source for our bodies. If you have none in your system, you're far more likely to crash during a workout or not be able to produce as much work as you would have been able to had your body had a more balanced nutrient breakdown. That is what I mean by optimal.4 -
For the keto person, fat is their primary energy source. So however the body uses its fuel and the calorie surplus is the same, then why does it matter if the primary source is fat or carbs?7
-
When you say bulking, you mean adding FAT from too many carbs?? There are TONS of people doing keto and gaining muscle just fine. protein is king for muscles. Go out and do some research and watch tons of videos on this already.For the keto person, fat is their primary energy source. So however the body uses its fuel and the calorie surplus is the same, then why does it matter if the primary source is fat or carbs?
13 -
For the keto person, fat is their primary energy source. So however the body uses its fuel and the calorie surplus is the same, then why does it matter if the primary source is fat or carbs?
For high intensity level of training, there will be a higher demand for energy.. carbs have more ATP available vs fat and have shown benefits for athletic performance.
(See Alan Aragon link above!
) 12 -
Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.10
-
Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
It doesn't matter what you define as high intensity. The fact remains unchanged that our bodies burn and use carbs differently than they do fat. Someone who is using fat as their primary source of energy is going to gas out faster and recover slower than someone who is using carbs as their source of energy. Plain and simple. This holds true on any given workout, low intensity or high intensity.6 -
Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
Yes but see the meta-analysis above where they look at many studies and discuss definitions and classifications3 -
Can you build muscle on a low carb diet? Yes.
Do you need carbs to build muscle? No.
DUH
need =/= optimization
Sleep well, eat protein-rich foods, and perform resistance exercise = build muscle… but you’d probably build more muscle by swapping out some dietary fat for carbs (assuming isonitrogenous & isocaloric diets). That’s partly why things like the Targeted Ketogenic Diet and Carb Nite were developed.
http://caloriesproper.com/muscle-growth-sans-carbs/4 -
natruallycurious wrote: »Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
It doesn't matter what you define as high intensity. The fact remains unchanged that our bodies burn and use carbs differently than they do fat. Someone who is using fat as their primary source of energy is going to gas out faster and recover slower than someone who is using carbs as their source of energy. Plain and simple. This holds true on any given workout, low intensity or high intensity.
It does matter though. Especially when people want to submit articles/studies stating performance is impacted. Since this thread is specific to working out and gaining muscle, if a keto adapted person does not run out of energy after 60-75 minutes of intense strength training then what is the concern?10 -
natruallycurious wrote: »Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
It doesn't matter what you define as high intensity. The fact remains unchanged that our bodies burn and use carbs differently than they do fat. Someone who is using fat as their primary source of energy is going to gas out faster and recover slower than someone who is using carbs as their source of energy. Plain and simple. This holds true on any given workout, low intensity or high intensity.
It does matter though. Especially when people want to submit articles/studies stating performance is impacted. Since this thread is specific to working out and gaining muscle, if a keto adapted person does not run out of energy after 60-75 minutes of intense strength training then what is the concern?
Do you understand the concept of intra-set ATP resynthesis, and why it matters for strength training?
ATP-CP and aerobic glycolysis are completely different energy pathways and don't have a whole lot to do with one another as regards strength training.13 -
Pulled directly from Lyle's ketogenic diet book:
Regardless of the ultimate cause of fatigue during weight training, glycogen depletion has
the potential to decrease performance through one of several mechanisms. Until more research
is done, we can only speculate as to the exact cause of fatigue. For the purpose of the ketogenic
diet, the exact cause of fatigue is more an academic question than a practical one. It is a basic
physiological fact that Type II fibers require glycogen to function optimally. Therefore, a SKD
will eventually decrease performance as well as inhibit muscle growth. Individuals who wish to
weight train on a ketogenic diet will have to consume carbohydrates at some point.11 -
natruallycurious wrote: »Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
It doesn't matter what you define as high intensity. The fact remains unchanged that our bodies burn and use carbs differently than they do fat. Someone who is using fat as their primary source of energy is going to gas out faster and recover slower than someone who is using carbs as their source of energy. Plain and simple. This holds true on any given workout, low intensity or high intensity.
It does matter though. Especially when people want to submit articles/studies stating performance is impacted. Since this thread is specific to working out and gaining muscle, if a keto adapted person does not run out of energy after 60-75 minutes of intense strength training then what is the concern?
So do you train a different muscle group every set? Then I might see where you are coming from but it would be an odd workout.
Or do you do multiple sets working the same muscle group?
The piece of the jigsaw you seem to be missing is - it's not an hour plus of constant work (like cardio) it's repeated cycles of using up your ATP in your working muscles and replenishing it.
I guess you could compensate with really, really long rests between sets but then your overall volume will suffer.
Compromise = sub-optimal.8 -
natruallycurious wrote: »Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
It doesn't matter what you define as high intensity. The fact remains unchanged that our bodies burn and use carbs differently than they do fat. Someone who is using fat as their primary source of energy is going to gas out faster and recover slower than someone who is using carbs as their source of energy. Plain and simple. This holds true on any given workout, low intensity or high intensity.
It does matter though. Especially when people want to submit articles/studies stating performance is impacted. Since this thread is specific to working out and gaining muscle, if a keto adapted person does not run out of energy after 60-75 minutes of intense strength training then what is the concern?
You can keep on insisting in light of the data that has been posted but that doesn't make what you say right. It's the equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears and saying, "lalalalalalalal".8 -
natruallycurious wrote: »Performance is subjective to the individual and any test or set of tests can be skewed. What exactly is considered high intensity? Above a certain heart rate? And for a certain amount of time? When endurance is considered then at what distances? Or is it strength over time? So many factors that are very specific to the individual.
It doesn't matter what you define as high intensity. The fact remains unchanged that our bodies burn and use carbs differently than they do fat. Someone who is using fat as their primary source of energy is going to gas out faster and recover slower than someone who is using carbs as their source of energy. Plain and simple. This holds true on any given workout, low intensity or high intensity.
It does matter though. Especially when people want to submit articles/studies stating performance is impacted. Since this thread is specific to working out and gaining muscle, if a keto adapted person does not run out of energy after 60-75 minutes of intense strength training then what is the concern?
You can keep on insisting in light of the data that has been posted but that doesn't make what you say right. It's the equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears and saying, "lalalalalalalal".
If by that you mean eat food to fuel your workouts. lalalalal...6 -
...eating popcorn making "gainz" from watching grown ups act like toddlers
4 -
Since I was dinged to the thread earlier, I’ll go ahead and throw my personal experience in:
Keto bulking was *kitten* for me. All I got was fat, tired, and saw minimal increase in strength, even though I was still in what should have been the “noob gains” stage.
I’m sure that some can do fine with it, but I damned sure wasn’t one of them. And before “blah blah fat adapted”, I had been strict keto for six months prior to lose weight from 185-ish to 150 before I started the lifting and suplus.12 -
Keto_Vampire wrote: »...eating popcorn making "gainz" from watching grown ups act like toddlers
Well, we grow when we rest, so that's probably the best version of anabolic timing.
Basically me when adults argue on the internet:
3
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 392.1K Introduce Yourself
- 43.6K Getting Started
- 259.9K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.7K Food and Nutrition
- 47.4K Recipes
- 232.4K Fitness and Exercise
- 403 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.8K Motivation and Support
- 7.9K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.4K MyFitnessPal Information
- 23 News and Announcements
- 982 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.4K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions