When does cut end and bulk begin??

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  • fb47
    fb47 Posts: 1,058 Member
    You look more like skinny fat...that's how I started. Not sure how many years of lifting you have, but if you are new, judging by those photos (unless it's not clear to me), I would suggest you to either recomp or a slow bulk (about 0,5 lbs per week), it's hard to see what your bf % is on the picture, but you seem to be lean with little muscle mass. So I have a feeling you're new to training. Unless you show me a clearer picture, base on what I see, I would do either recomp (eating near maintenance) or a slow bulk, your choice.
  • not_a_runner
    not_a_runner Posts: 1,343 Member
    Davidsdottir wrote: »
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    been going to the gym for years but only started tracking calories and such for several months

    Going to the gym, or doing a structured lifting program? Two different things.

    ^ My thought as well.
    Definitely would not recommend starting a bulk if over fat AND not doing a solid program.
    That's a recipe to just get fatter.
  • djeffreys10
    djeffreys10 Posts: 2,312 Member
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    Lifting, but never really making progress beyond a certain point

    That wasn't the question that was asked. Lifting, or on a structured lifting program? One latter generally equals results, the former tends to equal doing whatever you feel like and spinning your wheels.
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,344 Member
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    I would try to follow various programs. And they would work for a while and then you get to a point where you simply can't progress anymore. When you are cutting, trying to get rid of body fat, should you be increasing the weight each week that you're lifting or should you stay with the same weight that allows you to do a certain number of reps? I just don't really understand what I'm supposed to be doing and nothing seems to actually work for building muscle and losing fat. Now that I've lost about seven pounds I think I need to drop my calories more to continue to lose weight but that seems counter-intuitive if I'm also trying to lift weights in the gym.

    I also just started taking a spin class A couple of times a week to try to shed more fat so we'll see how that goes.

    That's because building muscle and losing fat at the same time is very difficult. It can be done, to some degree, but it's far from optimal and gains will be minimal.

    Here's a post I shared in another thread a couple days ago:

    Timely post by Brad Schoenfeld on Facebook today about recomp. Here's the infographic he posted, along with his initial comments on it:


    "It absolutely is possible to gain muscle while losing body fat; the extent to which this can be achieved depends on several factors"
    m5yt6uqrlbkl.png




    A couple of the comments/questions and his responses:
    Q: How can you lose fat and build muscle at the same time when one thing requires you to be in a calorie deficit and the other requires you to be in a calorie surplus?

    Schoenfeld: Because you don’t need to be in a surplus to gain muscle.



    Q: are you saying here that a proper training stimulus and eating enough protein is enough to build muscle?

    Schoenfeld: Yep; sufficient to build, not to maximize gainz.
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,344 Member
    edited April 2018
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    I would try to follow various programs. And they would work for a while and then you get to a point where you simply can't progress anymore. When you are cutting, trying to get rid of body fat, should you be increasing the weight each week that you're lifting or should you stay with the same weight that allows you to do a certain number of reps? I just don't really understand what I'm supposed to be doing and nothing seems to actually work for building muscle and losing fat. Now that I've lost about seven pounds I think I need to drop my calories more to continue to lose weight but that seems counter-intuitive if I'm also trying to lift weights in the gym. It also feels just wrong eating only 1900 calories or possibly less per day.

    I also just started taking a spin class A couple of times a week to try to shed more fat so we'll see how that goes.

    Use a program which has progression built into it, and take it as far as you can. Some people can continue to progress while on a deficit for quite a while, others will stall sooner - depends on a lot of factors. At the very least, try to maintain intensity (weight on the bar).

    Good read on training here - it's a two-part series and well worth the read: https://bodyrecomposition.com/training/weight-training-for-fat-loss-part-1.html/
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,344 Member
    edited April 2018
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    Thanks, I just read both parts. So it seems I need to keep the weight up, but not necessarily keep trying to progress, and reduce the volume while I am on a caloric deficit. That seems to be the gist of the article.

    Yes. And keep your deficit reasonable and your protein intake at a reasonable level. And use a well designed lifting program.
  • Davidsdottir
    Davidsdottir Posts: 1,285 Member
    edited April 2018
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    Thanks, I just read both parts. So it seems I need to keep the weight up, but not necessarily keep trying to progress, and reduce the volume while I am on a caloric deficit. That seems to be the gist of the article.

    Yes. And keep your deficit reasonable and your protein intake at a reasonable level. And use a well designed lifting program.

    Yup, this is exactly what was on my mind when I asked the OP the original question about going to the gym vs following a program. Great stuff here!
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,876 Member
    edited April 2018
    MDC2957 wrote: »
    Something else doesn't make sense. According to a BMR calculator my BMR is 1898. I also used a cutting calculator and I can't remember what website it was on but it suggests eating around 1911 calories to lose weight. Is it common to eat right around your BMR on a cutting diet? Outside of exercising in the gym, I am pretty sedentary for work.

    This would depend on your activity level. When I first started dieting, I wasn't doing any exercise other than a 20-30 minute walk with my dog most days and I sat behind a desk all day. My calorie target to lose about 1 Lb per week was around 1900 because my estimated maintenance with that activity was around 2400.

    I have become more active over the years in regards to both general activity and regular exercise (both cardio and weigh training) and I can cut about 1 Lb per week eating 2300 - 2500 calories per day as I average about 2800-3000 for maintenance with increased activity and regular exercise.

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