Not exercising worse for your health than smoking, diabetes and heart disease, study reveals
NorthCascades
Posts: 10,968 Member
"Being unfit on a treadmill or in an exercise stress test has a worse prognosis, as far as death, than being hypertensive, being diabetic or being a current smoker," Jaber told CNN. "We've never seen something as pronounced as this and as objective as this."
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Researchers retrospectively studied 122,007 patients who underwent exercise treadmill testing at Cleveland Clinic between January 1, 1991 and December 31, 2014 to measure all-cause mortality relating to the benefits of exercise and fitness.
...
What made the study so unique, beyond the sheer number of people studied, he said was that researchers weren't relying on patients self-reporting their exercise. "This is not the patients telling us what they do," Jaber said. "This is us testing them and figuring out objectively the real measure of what they do."
https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/19/health/study-not-exercising-worse-than-smoking/index.html
...
Researchers retrospectively studied 122,007 patients who underwent exercise treadmill testing at Cleveland Clinic between January 1, 1991 and December 31, 2014 to measure all-cause mortality relating to the benefits of exercise and fitness.
...
What made the study so unique, beyond the sheer number of people studied, he said was that researchers weren't relying on patients self-reporting their exercise. "This is not the patients telling us what they do," Jaber said. "This is us testing them and figuring out objectively the real measure of what they do."
https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/19/health/study-not-exercising-worse-than-smoking/index.html
14
Replies
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But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.15
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But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.16 -
I am with kashama.
I don't really care that much about a longer life.
But I have seen many times that those who are active have a much better quality of life up until they go!15 -
I wholeheartedly agree with the premise that not exercising is worse than all of those. I mean think of the evolution of man the last 100 years. More and more people don't do any sort of physical labor and even those that do some sort of physical labor, machines do the majority of work. We as humans are not built to sit around all day long.6
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well lets take my grandparents and parents for example. my grandpa(my moms dad) was always active, he died when he was like 82, my grandma(moms mom) wasnt as active although not sedentary and died around 84. now my dads dad was active and died in his 60s but his mom was active but was limited to what she could do because of her asthma. she was 84 when she died.
my mom was always on the move,she couldnt sit for long at all (she was a nurses aide for awhile)and she only made it to age 68 (but she had COPD from smoking),same with my dad he was always active and always doing something he was 62 when he died now all of them but my moms mom had health issues, none of them did exercise in the sense of workouts or anything but they cleaned house,moved furniture.my dad worked different jobs over the years which a lot of them included walking, my dad would play with us kids and chase us around as kids and so on. of course my dad and his mom had heart issues and asthma,
my moms dad had parkinsons, her mom as far as we know never had any health issues until she got dementia. my aunt(dads sister) also died but she was in her 80s when she died and my aunt (on moms side) is still living and in her late 70s. shes developed health issues and type 2. so I dont think she will be with us long but she was active as she gave birth to 18 living children(YES,I said 18 she was pregnant 24+ times altogether) so you know she was active chasing and taking care of all those kids(she had 1 per year most years)1 -
I think there are other correlations that affect it; people who exercise regularly are more likely to be people who also have a reasonably healthy diet and don't smoke. So I don't think it is just exercise alone that makes such a huge difference. I am exercising regularly, BTW. This not me being defensive, just making an observation.21
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It stands to reason that a smoker is also not likely to get on a treadmill.19
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kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
This is a huge part of why I lift.
We all lose muscle as we age, it's better to start with more of it, and to keep as much as you can. I volunteered at a nursing home, a lot of the people there couldn't get off the toilet without help. I don't mind doing squats if it helps me love independently when I'm 80. I've known people who threw their back out, and went through terrible pain; I do lots of core strength exercises to protect my spine.
Fred Beckey was still climbing mountains and camping in places he wasn't supposed to in his 90s. So why should I have to give up the things I love when I get old?15 -
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NorthCascades wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
This is a huge part of why I lift.
We all lose muscle as we age, it's better to start with more of it, and to keep as much as you can. I volunteered at a nursing home, a lot of the people there couldn't get off the toilet without help. I don't mind doing squats if it helps me love independently when I'm 80. I've known people who threw their back out, and went through terrible pain; I do lots of core strength exercises to protect my spine.
Fred Beckey was still climbing mountains and camping in places he wasn't supposed to in his 90s. So why should I have to give up the things I love when I get old?
I agree Im going to keep working out and walking until I cant anymore. my neighbor is close to 90 and he still does things and gets around pretty darn good. he makes cabinets and other things since hes retired from the railroad. I know many in their 80s and 90s whom you would not think were that old and they eat what they want. now none of them smoke. 1 drank and he had to quit but they are all active and kicking and doing pretty good.5 -
NorthCascades wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
This is a huge part of why I lift.
We all lose muscle as we age, it's better to start with more of it, and to keep as much as you can. I volunteered at a nursing home, a lot of the people there couldn't get off the toilet without help. I don't mind doing squats if it helps me love independently when I'm 80. I've known people who threw their back out, and went through terrible pain; I do lots of core strength exercises to protect my spine.
Fred Beckey was still climbing mountains and camping in places he wasn't supposed to in his 90s. So why should I have to give up the things I love when I get old?
I'd be fine with dying in my mid 90's while on the deadlift platform on in the squat rack at my gym.9 -
NorthCascades wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
This is a huge part of why I lift.
We all lose muscle as we age, it's better to start with more of it, and to keep as much as you can. I volunteered at a nursing home, a lot of the people there couldn't get off the toilet without help. I don't mind doing squats if it helps me live independently when I'm 80. I've known people who threw their back out, and went through terrible pain; I do lots of core strength exercises to protect my spine.
Fred Beckey was still climbing mountains and camping in places he wasn't supposed to in his 90s. So why should I have to give up the things I love when I get old?
Yes, my OH's sedentary mother had to go into a nursing home when she could no longer get on and off the toilet unassisted. The electric lift chair she had prior to that sure didn't do her any favors. Use it or lose it.3 -
NorthCascades wrote: »"Being unfit on a treadmill or in an exercise stress test has a worse prognosis, as far as death, than being hypertensive, being diabetic or being a current smoker," Jaber told CNN. "We've never seen something as pronounced as this and as objective as this."
...
Researchers retrospectively studied 122,007 patients who underwent exercise treadmill testing at Cleveland Clinic between January 1, 1991 and December 31, 2014 to measure all-cause mortality relating to the benefits of exercise and fitness.
...
What made the study so unique, beyond the sheer number of people studied, he said was that researchers weren't relying on patients self-reporting their exercise. "This is not the patients telling us what they do," Jaber said. "This is us testing them and figuring out objectively the real measure of what they do."
https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/19/health/study-not-exercising-worse-than-smoking/index.html
Well, no. It's researchers testing people and making an assumption about what the stress test results indicated about their exercise. The CNN headline and some of the quotes from the researchers assume that stress test results are accurate indicators of ... how much people exercise?? How hard they exercise?? It's not really clear. Somebody needs to study what kind of exercise, in what amounts (duration and frequency), and at what intensity best improves your results on a stress test.6 -
CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »
Lots of conflicting anecdata out there. One of the things that makes this study stand out is that it is 122,000 patients across 14 years. The people who weren't fit were roughly 4 times as likely to die during the study period compared to the ones that were fit. It would be interesting to know how they measured fitness and what the cutoff is to say whether or not someone is fit. It would also be interesting to know how many died.7 -
My mum is 91, lives independently In her own flat. Makes my sisters lunch daily and delivers it to her work. Does a flight of stairs each time she goes out and has a short steep hill to get to the shops.
She shops at least 2x a day because she is now limiting her shopping bags to around 5lbs.
She has never worked out, but most of her work was manual labour, house cleaning, factory work etc.
She takes no meds except one for indigestion.
Is a healthy weight.
Had a hip replaced at 65, but then became my nephew's primary care giver from birth until starting school. She was into her mid 70's by then.
Being active both mentally and physically have really helped her have a long and fulfilling life.
I'm hoping to be as full of life when I am her age.
Cheers, h.15 -
NorthCascades wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
This is a huge part of why I lift.
We all lose muscle as we age, it's better to start with more of it, and to keep as much as you can. I volunteered at a nursing home, a lot of the people there couldn't get off the toilet without help. I don't mind doing squats if it helps me love independently when I'm 80. I've known people who threw their back out, and went through terrible pain; I do lots of core strength exercises to protect my spine.
Fred Beckey was still climbing mountains and camping in places he wasn't supposed to in his 90s. So why should I have to give up the things I love when I get old?
Me, too. Also: bone density. Lifting helps counteract osteoporosis.7 -
I tried pretty hard to convince myself that being quite active and reasonably fit made it OK that I was obese - I was that semi-rare, semi-fictional fat but kinda fit person (RHR around 50, decent endurance, pretty strong). For sure, it was better to be kinda fit and obese, than seriously not fit and obese (some of my friends are the latter, so I have a standard of comparison) I found quite a bit of research that helped me nurture the illusion that fitness would counterbalance obesity, healthwise.
Finally, rationality won out. Fitness was not enough. I started eating less, and I'm clearly and significantly healthier now. But my RHR, endurance, best rowing machine split, etc., haven't much changed. My rowing shell got faster, but mostly because I'm lighter, I think. What improved was my cholesterol, triglycerides, blood pressure, pain level (from OA and some other junk), etc. Healthier, for sure.
My long-time fit, healthy-weight friends at 70+ y/o are living much higher quality lives** on average than my 60+ y/o friends who are inactive. In fact, the fit/healthy-weight are mostly living higher quality lives than my 40+ friends who are both obese and inactive. Fit-ish but overweight 60-somethings of my acquaintence seem typically to be doing about as well as the fit/healthy-weight 70-somethings.
Long term, IME, both body weight and fitness are seriously important. I don't doubt that fitness has more benefits that the average person gives it credit for, based on my experience.
** By "higher quality life", I mean fewer illnesses; fewer surgeries; much quicker recoveries with fewer complications from any surgeries that are needed; more independent in terms of doing home chores; more discretionary income because of lower OTC, prescription, co-pay health costs; less frequent and shorter minor illnesses; taking fewer pills and experiencing fewer complicated interaction side effects; more able to eat whatever treats/splurges they want occasionally (vs. restricted from foods because of diabetes, gout, medication interactions, etc.); more able to do wide range of fun things that involve walking, stairs, and the like, such as stadium events, art/music festivals, tourism, etc.; and more.
To the extent that I've seen friends die - pretty common at my age (62) - the fit/healthy-weight people are more likely to have a short/sharp decline or very sudden death, and the out-of-shape/obese people are more likely to die younger and suffer long, lingering, painful stuff. No guarantees on this front, because it matters what gets ya, and that's a crapshoot.11 -
Regular exercise is a lot more important than most people think, in not only maintaining a healthy body weight, but for total health. And that includes joint, bone, muscles, heart, lungs, skin, all other organs, and even brain health.
Just look at the world around us.
The medical, care giver, and mental health industries are thriving.
We are slowly becoming fat, lazy, and helpless.6 -
My husband had an accident in March. In the early days, the doctors thought he would end up in a full-care nursing home. He was in Post Traumatic Amnesia so long, his brain injury was classified as "extremely severe".
But he has amazed everyone. He is not fully recovered, but he has recovered a lot more than expected. And we're out walking and cycling (a little bit) again.
There were a lot of people praying for him from all over the world.
But he also had health and fitness in his favour.- I was told that if he had been a smoker, he would have likely died or been in a vegetative state. But he had quit smoking over 20 years ago.
- Alcohol really slows brain recovery and causes numerous other problems ... but his alcohol consumption had diminished to just a few drinks a year, and he hasn't had a drink since the accident.
https://msktc.org/tbi/factsheets/Alcohol-Use-After-Traumatic-Brain-Injury - His fitness level was good. Yes, he lost a lot of fitness, but he started at quite a high level. And there's evidence that exercise helps the brain.
https://www.brainline.org/blog/getting-back-bike/what-brain-derived-neurotrophic-factor-and-why-you-should-care
That's enough to give us motivation to continue to lead reasonably healthy active lives.
And for me, through all of this, exercise has sure helped ease some of the stress.29 - I was told that if he had been a smoker, he would have likely died or been in a vegetative state. But he had quit smoking over 20 years ago.
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »"Being unfit on a treadmill or in an exercise stress test has a worse prognosis, as far as death, than being hypertensive, being diabetic or being a current smoker," Jaber told CNN. "We've never seen something as pronounced as this and as objective as this."
...
Researchers retrospectively studied 122,007 patients who underwent exercise treadmill testing at Cleveland Clinic between January 1, 1991 and December 31, 2014 to measure all-cause mortality relating to the benefits of exercise and fitness.
...
What made the study so unique, beyond the sheer number of people studied, he said was that researchers weren't relying on patients self-reporting their exercise. "This is not the patients telling us what they do," Jaber said. "This is us testing them and figuring out objectively the real measure of what they do."
https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/19/health/study-not-exercising-worse-than-smoking/index.html
Well, no. It's researchers testing people and making an assumption about what the stress test results indicated about their exercise. The CNN headline and some of the quotes from the researchers assume that stress test results are accurate indicators of ... how much people exercise?? How hard they exercise?? It's not really clear. Somebody needs to study what kind of exercise, in what amounts (duration and frequency), and at what intensity best improves your results on a stress test.
It sounds like they were performing VO2max tests. That's generally what you get from a stress test on a treadmill or indoor bike. VO2max doesn't tell how much you exercise or at what intensity, but volume and intensity are the two things it takes to raise it. Sedentary people don't have much aerobic capacity. It's a good enough proxy for practical purposes.11 -
OldAssDude wrote: »Regular exercise is a lot more important than most people think, in not only maintaining a healthy body weight, but for total health. And that includes joint, bone, muscles, heart, lungs, skin, all other organs, and even brain health.
Just look at the world around us.
The medical, care giver, and mental health industries are thriving.
We are slowly becoming fat, lazy, and helpless.
If you look at how humans evolved over time, were are actually becoming far, lazy and helpless pretty quickly.3 -
Packerjohn wrote: »OldAssDude wrote: »Regular exercise is a lot more important than most people think, in not only maintaining a healthy body weight, but for total health. And that includes joint, bone, muscles, heart, lungs, skin, all other organs, and even brain health.
Just look at the world around us.
The medical, care giver, and mental health industries are thriving.
We are slowly becoming fat, lazy, and helpless.
If you look at how humans evolved over time, were are actually becoming far, lazy and helpless pretty quickly.
Compared to a couple million years of evolution, yes.
But slowly if you consider the time since man invented the couch and technology.
2 -
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NorthCascades wrote: »"Being unfit on a treadmill or in an exercise stress test has a worse prognosis, as far as death, than being hypertensive, being diabetic or being a current smoker," Jaber told CNN. "We've never seen something as pronounced as this and as objective as this."
...
Researchers retrospectively studied 122,007 patients who underwent exercise treadmill testing at Cleveland Clinic between January 1, 1991 and December 31, 2014 to measure all-cause mortality relating to the benefits of exercise and fitness.
...
What made the study so unique, beyond the sheer number of people studied, he said was that researchers weren't relying on patients self-reporting their exercise. "This is not the patients telling us what they do," Jaber said. "This is us testing them and figuring out objectively the real measure of what they do."
https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/19/health/study-not-exercising-worse-than-smoking/index.html
Nice thing is one can start exercising as long as they are not messed up by the side effects the other listed health issues that often lead to a premature death anyway.2 -
CarvedTones wrote: »I think there are other correlations that affect it; people who exercise regularly are more likely to be people who also have a reasonably healthy diet and don't smoke. So I don't think it is just exercise alone that makes such a huge difference. I am exercising regularly, BTW. This not me being defensive, just making an observation.
I agree....so many studies never take into account the overall habits of a person. These studies villify a single action (drinking for example) or exhalt another (exercise) without looking at the whole picture.
Yes, if someone exercises on a regualr basis, chances are they care about their diet, take supplements, and pay attention to environmental factors that impact health, and therefore live longer. That's a big surprise?5 -
kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
That's exactly my point. I would rather they'd said morbidity rather than mortality.2 -
kshama2001 wrote: »But... Worse prognosis, as far as death meaning what exactly? We all die at the end anyway.
I assume that means dying younger.
Let's talk about quality of life, though. My extremely active 80 year old mom has a great quality of life, while other people her age I know do not. Also, I met a 92 year old Senior Olympian last year who was truly inspirational.
This notorious octogenarian works out twice per week.
That's exactly my point. I would rather they'd said morbidity rather than mortality.
I may have to go back and reread, but I believe it was people who died during the 14 year study period from any cause.
EDIT - I did reread it. I still believe that's what they mean exactly because they used the word mortality. The mortality rate of a study is determined by deaths during the study period.2 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »NorthCascades wrote: »"Being unfit on a treadmill or in an exercise stress test has a worse prognosis, as far as death, than being hypertensive, being diabetic or being a current smoker," Jaber told CNN. "We've never seen something as pronounced as this and as objective as this."
...
Researchers retrospectively studied 122,007 patients who underwent exercise treadmill testing at Cleveland Clinic between January 1, 1991 and December 31, 2014 to measure all-cause mortality relating to the benefits of exercise and fitness.
...
What made the study so unique, beyond the sheer number of people studied, he said was that researchers weren't relying on patients self-reporting their exercise. "This is not the patients telling us what they do," Jaber said. "This is us testing them and figuring out objectively the real measure of what they do."
https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/19/health/study-not-exercising-worse-than-smoking/index.html
Well, no. It's researchers testing people and making an assumption about what the stress test results indicated about their exercise. The CNN headline and some of the quotes from the researchers assume that stress test results are accurate indicators of ... how much people exercise?? How hard they exercise?? It's not really clear. Somebody needs to study what kind of exercise, in what amounts (duration and frequency), and at what intensity best improves your results on a stress test.
They’re testing aerobic fitness regardless of training regimen. Do you know a way to improve aerobic fitness without appropriate aerobic exercise?6 -
Just thought I'd mention I am 83. I walk the dog daily, mow the grass, garden, run my own home, do my own cooking, I've just made the weekly bread by hand, and I don't drink alcohol or smoke anything. Never take the flu shot - only had flu once, way back in 1957. All my generation of family and friends are now either pushing up daisies or in old folk homes. I did yoga once, but have never been to a gym. Not sure why I'm still around, active and more or less free of arthritis. Think it might be moderation in all things ?20
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The article:
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2707428?resultClick=3
I believe the data was collected from 1991 to 2014 with the average length of time a patient was tracked being about 8 years.
It was interesting. I think they are right in saying fitness helps improve how long you will live, especially in the elderly. For younger people, I'm not sure how much it helps.
I think their conclusions may have been a bit too sweeping though. For instance, does someone have CVD because they don't exercise or do they not exercise due to health issues like CVD, obesity, etc.? There is no information on why someone is not as fit.
I used to be very fit. I could play sports, bench press my weight and ran half marathons on the weekends. A reconstructed knee, spinal injury, a few autoimmune diseases and hip and knee arthritis later, and I am not nearly as fit as I used to be. I can't exercise like I used to due to heath issues. My fitness is limited by my health. It makes me wonder in that study, how many people had their fitness limited by health issues, and not just health (or mortality) limited by their fitness?
Good to see that high levels of exercise do not appear to affect mortality though. That's a nice myth to have die off.8
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