Eating for the Orangutans - and me!
Replies
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cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001
- and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)2 -
cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001 - and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)
Where do you get it? Is it something you order online?0 -
@earlnabby, does it have an aroma? I tend to use coconut oil for skin and hair, but I'm open to change.
Wishusdonna, I have one of those cats, too. I've tried the healthy food from the healthy pet store and by prescription from the vet. I even went "raw" for her and she was not having it.1 -
janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001 - and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)
Where do you get it? Is it something you order online?
Yes. I have several sources I buy from, depending on what else I need (I also use argan oil a lot and camellia seed oil in my conditioner)
https://www.camdengrey.com/essential-oils/Carrier-Oils/babassu-oil.html is the lowest price but you need a $25 minimum purchase to order from them. They do have a huge selection of products like essential oils, other carrier oils, and even bases that you just need to add a scent.
Other places are Mountain Rose Herbs, Brambleberry, and even Ebay, Etsy, or Amazon. If you just want to buy the oil. Ebay is often a good source.1 -
cmriverside wrote: »@earlnabby, does it have an aroma? I tend to use coconut oil for skin and hair, but I'm open to change.
Wishusdonna, I have one of those cats, too. I've tried the healthy food from the healthy pet store and by prescription from the vet. I even went "raw" for her and she was not having it.
Not really. Very mild "oily" smell if any can be detected. Like coconut, it is solid at room temp but liquefies at just under 80° (or in your hand)1 -
janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001 - and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)
Where do you get it? Is it something you order online?
Yes. I have several sources I buy from, depending on what else I need (I also use argan oil a lot and camellia seed oil in my conditioner)
https://www.camdengrey.com/essential-oils/Carrier-Oils/babassu-oil.html is the lowest price but you need a $25 minimum purchase to order from them. They do have a huge selection of products like essential oils, other carrier oils, and even bases that you just need to add a scent.
Other places are Mountain Rose Herbs, Brambleberry, and even Ebay, Etsy, or Amazon. If you just want to buy the oil. Ebay is often a good source.
Thank you!0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001 - and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)
Where do you get it? Is it something you order online?
Yes. I have several sources I buy from, depending on what else I need (I also use argan oil a lot and camellia seed oil in my conditioner)
https://www.camdengrey.com/essential-oils/Carrier-Oils/babassu-oil.html is the lowest price but you need a $25 minimum purchase to order from them. They do have a huge selection of products like essential oils, other carrier oils, and even bases that you just need to add a scent.
Other places are Mountain Rose Herbs, Brambleberry, and even Ebay, Etsy, or Amazon. If you just want to buy the oil. Ebay is often a good source.
Thank you!
You are welcome. I never had to deal with this until the big thing became to remove parabens from personal care products. The preservatives they use instead are the ones that release formaldehyde (the technical term is formaldehyde donors). They remove a potential carcinogen and replace it with something that breaks down into a known allergen that is also a potential carcinogen. Go figure. When i first found out about my allergy the only things I had to deal with was avoiding nail polish and pre-washing any clothing or sheets before using. Now, there are a lot of formaldehyde free nail polishes but I still have to wash all fabric items and read shampoo labels1 -
I'd love a good hand cream recipe if you have one. I already do oil cleansing for my face and use argan oil for my moisturizer there, so that's sorted. My hands are an issue. I have dyshidrotic eczema that pops up if I don't use something really emollient on them.0
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janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I think the best solution is just baking all my own baked goods. I then control the ingredients.
It's hard though. I often say, "Sorry, orangs." But then I say sorry to a lot of animals on the regular. I feel like when we know better we really should do better.
"Woo" on this site is used when someone disagrees...I've posted about palm oil quite a bit on this site and I used to get pretty wound up about it - especially when the, "Milk is bad," people get going. All the synthesized nut milks have palm oil - same with the coffee creamers (like International Delight.) The argument seems to be it isn't good to be a milk cow, so drink soy milk or almond milk because it's nicer to animals.
Milk cows are not endangered. Jus' sayin'.
Have I mentioned it's in everything?
I'm not anti dairy, but you can make nut milk at home (I usually do, since I like it for some uses) and there are brands that do not have palm oil. One example is Elmhurst brand (I saw this when shopping last night, so looked), and another is New Barn. (I knew about New Barn since it's what I normally buy if too lazy to make it, as it's more like the kind I'd make at home, containing more of the almonds.)
The huge increase in demand for almonds and the nature of almond farming is another environmental problem, however.
Califia Farms is also palm oil free (at least the almond milks that I've purchased, maybe not their entire product line).
I just ran to read the label on my Califia Farms creamer after reading this thread, and I noticed that is palm oil free... It does contain coconut cream though--aren't coconuts trees in the palm family? What distinguishes palm palm from coconut palm? Does the farming of coconut palms destroy any happy little primates' habitats?0 -
Hi Mitch16. Check the bottom here.
https://www.ethicalconsumer.org/food-drink/shopping-guide/coconut-oil
Looks like Fair Trade is best to make sure farmers are paid properly and there are monoculture issues too.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I think the best solution is just baking all my own baked goods. I then control the ingredients.
It's hard though. I often say, "Sorry, orangs." But then I say sorry to a lot of animals on the regular. I feel like when we know better we really should do better.
"Woo" on this site is used when someone disagrees...I've posted about palm oil quite a bit on this site and I used to get pretty wound up about it - especially when the, "Milk is bad," people get going. All the synthesized nut milks have palm oil - same with the coffee creamers (like International Delight.) The argument seems to be it isn't good to be a milk cow, so drink soy milk or almond milk because it's nicer to animals.
Milk cows are not endangered. Jus' sayin'.
Have I mentioned it's in everything?
I'm not anti dairy, but you can make nut milk at home (I usually do, since I like it for some uses) and there are brands that do not have palm oil. One example is Elmhurst brand (I saw this when shopping last night, so looked), and another is New Barn. (I knew about New Barn since it's what I normally buy if too lazy to make it, as it's more like the kind I'd make at home, containing more of the almonds.)
The huge increase in demand for almonds and the nature of almond farming is another environmental problem, however.
Califia Farms is also palm oil free (at least the almond milks that I've purchased, maybe not their entire product line).
I just ran to read the label on my Califia Farms creamer after reading this thread, and I noticed that is palm oil free... It does contain coconut cream though--aren't coconuts trees in the palm family? What distinguishes palm palm from coconut palm? Does the farming of coconut palms destroy any happy little primates' habitats?
If coconut is a concern for a consumer, there are also coconut-free Califia Farms products.
I'm not aware of any specific overall problems with coconut farming, but my understanding is that some companies are practicing unethical behavior (related to human rights or deforestation). It's one of those things like coffee or chocolate where we may want to choose certain brands that we trust aren't engaging in those behaviors.1 -
Janejellyroll, that's my understanding too.
I'm very tempted to subscribe to the magazine I linked to. If pennies allow...0 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »I'd love a good hand cream recipe if you have one. I already do oil cleansing for my face and use argan oil for my moisturizer there, so that's sorted. My hands are an issue. I have dyshidrotic eczema that pops up if I don't use something really emollient on them.
See your PM's elsewhere1 -
I don't know if you can all see this, might be limited regionally, but I last ate beef a month ago in a burger at a gig and have cut down on other meat as well (some pork-based pate in my sandwiches this week, all other meals from Sunday veggie, and only had that crazy chicken 'curry' last week.)
It's sending my carb-levels crazy though! Oh well, better use that fuel up in the gym, I suppose.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/science-environment-46366551/from-burping-cows-and-food-miles-to-greenhouse-gasses
I'm really struggling with the idea of cutting down on milk though. I love real cheese and real milk, specially in my black tea. Having a lot less of it in my porridge if that helps?
The coffee van at work today is doing a £1 deal on regular hot drinks. Oh the temptations of going down to see if I can get a nice hot chocolate! But that would be milk/soy/palm *rifles through desk drawer* *finds mint tea*
Ah, dependable peppermint! *sobs*1 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001 - and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)
Where do you get it? Is it something you order online?
Yes. I have several sources I buy from, depending on what else I need (I also use argan oil a lot and camellia seed oil in my conditioner)
https://www.camdengrey.com/essential-oils/Carrier-Oils/babassu-oil.html is the lowest price but you need a $25 minimum purchase to order from them. They do have a huge selection of products like essential oils, other carrier oils, and even bases that you just need to add a scent.
Other places are Mountain Rose Herbs, Brambleberry, and even Ebay, Etsy, or Amazon. If you just want to buy the oil. Ebay is often a good source.
Thank you!
You are welcome. I never had to deal with this until the big thing became to remove parabens from personal care products. The preservatives they use instead are the ones that release formaldehyde (the technical term is formaldehyde donors). They remove a potential carcinogen and replace it with something that breaks down into a known allergen that is also a potential carcinogen. Go figure. When i first found out about my allergy the only things I had to deal with was avoiding nail polish and pre-washing any clothing or sheets before using. Now, there are a lot of formaldehyde free nail polishes but I still have to wash all fabric items and read shampoo labels
@earlnabby - I have chemical sensitivities too. Do you know about soaking new fabric items in water and a few cups of ACV? I have found that to be more effective in getting the "new clothes smell" out than several washes. (There's a vinegar smell when the clothes are wet that goes away when they are dry.) I use the big plastic jugs of vinegar for this and save the Braggs for cooking.0 -
I have had eczema flareups for the last 13 years, which I think may be down to my cat, but i try to limit exposure to irritants. Have you tried the Eco Egg? Swear by mine! Washes clothes without the need for powder.0
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kshama2001 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I don't believe for one minute there is any such thing as sustainably harvested palm oil. I don't think there is oversight or accountability, and it's really too late for the orangs who have been burned up with their families in their own homes. We get all wound up over California wildfires, and yet this is comparable to genocide.
But call me a cynic, @kshama2001 - and I'll own that label proudly. I'm friendly with an orangutan activist, I mean she's pretty much dedicated all her free time to that cause for 30ish years, and she has been to these countries and has horrible stories to tell.
It's just an unnecessary ingredient that helps with texture and shelf life and it is in everything. Don't get me started.
The woo button is right there next to the hug. Feel free.
The bold sentence gets closer to the reason that I think palm oil is so prevalent in foods: cooking at home from 'scratch' isn't as popular as it once was. I've never been in any kitchen that had a bottle of palm oil in the cupboard, and, I don't think I've ever once seen it for sale at the grocery store. (not to say it isn't out there for retail purchase, just that I've not run across it ).
I think the stuff adds an unpleasant aftertaste and I avoid it like the bubonic plague.
What is interesting is that there is an alternative to palm oil that is sustainably farmed in Brazil called Babassu oil. The babassu tree is a half sister to palm and coconut and the oil can be used interchangeably with either and is actually superior to both palm and coconut in personal care products because it is non pore clogging (comedogenic rating of 1 where both coconut and palm oil are rated 4 on a scale of 0-5). I make my own shampoo, conditioner, lotion, etc and stopped using palm oil decades ago (I need to avoid many of the preservatives you find in commercial personal care items because they release formaldehyde which I am allergic to)
Where do you get it? Is it something you order online?
Yes. I have several sources I buy from, depending on what else I need (I also use argan oil a lot and camellia seed oil in my conditioner)
https://www.camdengrey.com/essential-oils/Carrier-Oils/babassu-oil.html is the lowest price but you need a $25 minimum purchase to order from them. They do have a huge selection of products like essential oils, other carrier oils, and even bases that you just need to add a scent.
Other places are Mountain Rose Herbs, Brambleberry, and even Ebay, Etsy, or Amazon. If you just want to buy the oil. Ebay is often a good source.
Thank you!
You are welcome. I never had to deal with this until the big thing became to remove parabens from personal care products. The preservatives they use instead are the ones that release formaldehyde (the technical term is formaldehyde donors). They remove a potential carcinogen and replace it with something that breaks down into a known allergen that is also a potential carcinogen. Go figure. When i first found out about my allergy the only things I had to deal with was avoiding nail polish and pre-washing any clothing or sheets before using. Now, there are a lot of formaldehyde free nail polishes but I still have to wash all fabric items and read shampoo labels
@earlnabby - I have chemical sensitivities too. Do you know about soaking new fabric items in water and a few cups of ACV? I have found that to be more effective in getting the "new clothes smell" out than several washes. (There's a vinegar smell when the clothes are wet that goes away when they are dry.) I use the big plastic jugs of vinegar for this and save the Braggs for cooking.
The problem isn't the smell, it is skin contact. Formaldehyde washes out even without detergent. I have used vinegar in washes and I can still smell it a week later.0 -
Latest thing palm oil (well, palm fruit oil) is needlessly flipping in... rough Scottish oat cakes! Why Aldi, why? It's just oats! At least Nairns say theirs is sustainable.
Flipping easy to make though, aren't they, from what I recall?
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@wishusdonna Today I learned that the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007 is chiefly responsible for the explosion of oil palm cultivation in the tropics.
The political effort to get that repealed is going to be tremendous. However, 2007 was a time when no-one expected the fracking revolution in shale for oil and gas. The motivation for the Act was framed as a pursuit of U.S. energy independence. Well, we're there now and biofuels are no longer needed.
Do you want to lead that charge?1 -
Very interesting JeromeBarry1!0
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Was out last night so couldn't prep my food today, so M&S everything. No sandwiches or wraps, so just about managed!0
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Another big shop done. A couple of Christmas treats dropped in the trolley, but of course they were dear. And there was a pressie, and booze... and heritage carrots! Still spent twice as much as normal.
Managed to find a palm-free gravy powder- Bisto original. It's like 80s-style gravy, and requires actual cooking. It's basically just onion powder and potato starch.
I dunno, my US friends here might find our gravy quite strange...
Drinks were tricky too. Hubby wanted malted hot chocolate. We had to compromise with Ovaltine light instant.
And crackers and oatcakes for cheese! Forget them. I made some fresh rosemary crackers when I got home using a sprig from the bush in our garden.
Hubby was frustrated that he could not buy unicorn bubble bath (!!!) because it contained 2 palm-derived chemical constituents.0
This discussion has been closed.
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