Mediterranean Diet
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French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
Okay from one particular day (I log at Cron):
Breakfast was an omelet with spinach, broccoli, and mushrooms with mango on the side. Lunch was a big salad on romaine with tomatoes, radishes, green and red bell peppers, onions, and half a cup of chickpeas, plus some pepitas, and dinner was a black bean based soup (cup of black beans, some carrots and butternut squash, tomatoes, peppers, cauliflower). 45 g fiber.3 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
Potatoes and legumes are vegetables.
The newer '10 a Day' recommendations counts sweet potatoes but other potatoes don't; legumes count as one serving, regardless of how many servings you have. The NIH's recommendations (DASH), puts potatoes in the vegetable column, but separates legumes into a different category. I've always mentally separated potatoes and legumes from other vegetables, just how my brain is wired
anyways, sorry OP I got us way off topic here!
I do this too, for the same reason I count cucumber as a veg, not a fruit. It's the role they play for me in a meal. Potatoes, corn, bread, pasta, rice, sweet potato would be interchangeable, and take the starch course role. I'd always have vegetables (or additional veg) too, which would be non starchy. Legumes would have the starch role or the protein role, depending. Just how I grew up thinking about meals.
Despite that, I think it's weird to count sweet potatoes, not potatoes, and only one serving of legumes, although I recall that from when some of us were doing the 10 a day thing here. I actually think it makes more sense to just treat them as different categories (since the difference to a large extent is calories). I think the potato/bean paranoia is that they don't want you eating a bunch of fries and baked beans and thinking you got in your veg.6 -
janejellyroll wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
I am just getting back into logging after quite a long while off, but here is a recent day. This is including grains too, but unless you are cutting them out completely, they are going to be there, making a contribution, as "background noise" at least.
Oatmeal--4 g
box raisins--2 g
.25 cup quinoia--1 g
1 c broccoli--4 g
1/2 c apple--2 g
Chipotle mild salsa--1 g
Chipotle chips (not a full bag)--2 g
2/3 Chipotle burrito white rice/mild salsa/corn salsa/black beans --10 g
3 clementines--4 g
1 oz popcorn--2 g
For a total of 32 g for a normal day with 8-ish servings.
A group of us have done a challenge from time to time involving 10+ servings of fruit and veg a day; when you get THAT much fiber (in addition to the "background noise" fiber from your run of mill diet, it does, let's say, interesting things to your deposits at the Brown & Company Fidelity Fiduciary Depository Corp. till you get things straightened out. (My secret weapon/nemesis/downfall is a full bag of dried blueberries--8 g fiber for 190 calories).
Reaching your fiber goal with the helps of chips and salsa, that's truly smart living!
Yes, but we were looking for examples of hitting it without grains, like oatmeal, rice, tortilla (I believe the Chipotle ones are wheat).1 -
concordancia wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
I am just getting back into logging after quite a long while off, but here is a recent day. This is including grains too, but unless you are cutting them out completely, they are going to be there, making a contribution, as "background noise" at least.
Oatmeal--4 g
box raisins--2 g
.25 cup quinoia--1 g
1 c broccoli--4 g
1/2 c apple--2 g
Chipotle mild salsa--1 g
Chipotle chips (not a full bag)--2 g
2/3 Chipotle burrito white rice/mild salsa/corn salsa/black beans --10 g
3 clementines--4 g
1 oz popcorn--2 g
For a total of 32 g for a normal day with 8-ish servings.
A group of us have done a challenge from time to time involving 10+ servings of fruit and veg a day; when you get THAT much fiber (in addition to the "background noise" fiber from your run of mill diet, it does, let's say, interesting things to your deposits at the Brown & Company Fidelity Fiduciary Depository Corp. till you get things straightened out. (My secret weapon/nemesis/downfall is a full bag of dried blueberries--8 g fiber for 190 calories).
Reaching your fiber goal with the helps of chips and salsa, that's truly smart living!
Yes, but we were looking for examples of hitting it without grains, like oatmeal, rice, tortilla (I believe the Chipotle ones are wheat).
My comment was meant in a joking manner, but the chips and salsa only provided 3 grams of fiber for the overall day. It could easily be replaced with a non-wheat item . . . just have an apple (4 grams of fiber) instead. It wasn't really a critical part of the plan.2 -
Looks like I get the most fiber for the least calories from raspberries, which I buy frozen this time of year. No spoilage and only slightly less yummy than fresh in season, and they are perfectly fine in overnight oats.3
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French_Peasant wrote: »
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
Yep, I am on that thread, hence the hedging above to "keep the frickin' peels on, people!" and to actually CHECK WHAT YOU ARE EATING instead of assuming your peeled aubergines or whatnot are going to fit the bill.
I have never had a problem hitting 25+ grams of fiber when eating 8+ veg servings, personally, but I guess some people can get themselves into trouble.
I am in the school that includes potatoes as a veg, because I actually grow them and see how they work, as opposed to the school that regards them as Satanic White Foods That Are Of the Devil, so I don't call them out separately. But I happen to have a lot of thoughts on them! I would see them as an intrinsic part of the Mediterranean diet...however...they should be more along the lines of what you get in a Nicoise salad and not, say, gnocchi or pommes frites or pommes Anna. Fingerlings are especially good because they have a higher peel-to-flesh ratio, but even a big baked potato loaded up with Greek yougurt is amazingly delicious and nutritious.
I deliberately didn't share my thoughts on the whole grains...my grain of choice is good old Scottish oats slathered with lashings of heavy cream and brown sugar, so, yeah. Not very Mediterranean! I self-flagellated with other whole grain breads for a while, but they don't get you that much more fiber than white breads (unless you are eating the crazy ones) and I would rather enjoy a nice white baguette and eat extra veg. Or hummus!
Which reminds me that there's a gardening thread in the Food and Nutrition section that you should find and bump, since your voice would be great in that thread.
I found it, and pinged her, so bumped it 1 -
I'm on the Med diet for 32 yrs. I moved to Italy then. As for fiber, I don't track it. I didn't know the Med diet was recommended for it's fiber intake. It's not discussed very much on here because it's up for personal interpretation. The guidelines are very loose. Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.2
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I enjoy the variety of the Med diet. One Thomas Multigrain lite English Muffin gives me 8g or fiber for just 100 calories. Quinoa and beans, along with at least 3 cups of vegetables and 3 fruits gets my fiber intake up fast! Did a lot of research and now have the portion sizes and no. of servings per food group down pretty well with keeping my calorie intake to 1200/day by tracking. Hopefully this will produce good results!2
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snowflake954 wrote: »Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.
Why? The goal is to create a diet structure that works regardless of the individual dishes. Greece and Morocco might have flat bread, Spain uses more rice, Italy pasta, but the point is the portion of those, the types of protein, lots of fruit and veg, etc.
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concordancia wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.
Why? The goal is to create a diet structure that works regardless of the individual dishes. Greece and Morocco might have flat bread, Spain uses more rice, Italy pasta, but the point is the portion of those, the types of protein, lots of fruit and veg, etc.
Because...perhaps the OP doesn't like rice, or pasta, or prefers flat bread. I'd look at what different Med countries eat and choose the one that is closer to my likes. This in a context of overall diet.1 -
concordancia wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
I am just getting back into logging after quite a long while off, but here is a recent day. This is including grains too, but unless you are cutting them out completely, they are going to be there, making a contribution, as "background noise" at least.
Oatmeal--4 g
box raisins--2 g
.25 cup quinoia--1 g
1 c broccoli--4 g
1/2 c apple--2 g
Chipotle mild salsa--1 g
Chipotle chips (not a full bag)--2 g
2/3 Chipotle burrito white rice/mild salsa/corn salsa/black beans --10 g
3 clementines--4 g
1 oz popcorn--2 g
For a total of 32 g for a normal day with 8-ish servings.
A group of us have done a challenge from time to time involving 10+ servings of fruit and veg a day; when you get THAT much fiber (in addition to the "background noise" fiber from your run of mill diet, it does, let's say, interesting things to your deposits at the Brown & Company Fidelity Fiduciary Depository Corp. till you get things straightened out. (My secret weapon/nemesis/downfall is a full bag of dried blueberries--8 g fiber for 190 calories).
Reaching your fiber goal with the helps of chips and salsa, that's truly smart living!
Yes, but we were looking for examples of hitting it without grains, like oatmeal, rice, tortilla (I believe the Chipotle ones are wheat).
OK: One day's fiber from veg/fruit.
3g - mixed berries
4g - winter squash
11g - brussels sprouts
2g - onions
1g - tomatoes
1g - cucumber
2g - avocado
2g - kumquats
Not quite 30, but 26. If I count the permissable 1 serving of legumes (lentils at 6.3g), that's 32. Total for the day, 51g. (Balance from more lentils and miscellaneous small contributors like nuts, seeds, spices, tofu; only 7g from grains (oatmeal for 3g, Ezekiel pita for 4g).
This is a high side of average day, I'd say. Around 40g is pretty normal, and that proportion from grains is pretty normal, too.snowflake954 wrote: »concordancia wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.
Why? The goal is to create a diet structure that works regardless of the individual dishes. Greece and Morocco might have flat bread, Spain uses more rice, Italy pasta, but the point is the portion of those, the types of protein, lots of fruit and veg, etc.
Because...perhaps the OP doesn't like rice, or pasta, or prefers flat bread. I'd look at what different Med countries eat and choose the one that is closer to my likes. This in a context of overall diet.
I think the point is: Why choose one? The so-called "Mediterranean diet" is an eating pattern. It allows for variations. It can include foods from multiple Mediterranean countries, and (I'd suggest) even completely non-Mediterranean countries. Are the same vegetables and grains suddenly not as healthy because we use South Asian or African or South American spices in them?8 -
concordancia wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
I am just getting back into logging after quite a long while off, but here is a recent day. This is including grains too, but unless you are cutting them out completely, they are going to be there, making a contribution, as "background noise" at least.
Oatmeal--4 g
box raisins--2 g
.25 cup quinoia--1 g
1 c broccoli--4 g
1/2 c apple--2 g
Chipotle mild salsa--1 g
Chipotle chips (not a full bag)--2 g
2/3 Chipotle burrito white rice/mild salsa/corn salsa/black beans --10 g
3 clementines--4 g
1 oz popcorn--2 g
For a total of 32 g for a normal day with 8-ish servings.
A group of us have done a challenge from time to time involving 10+ servings of fruit and veg a day; when you get THAT much fiber (in addition to the "background noise" fiber from your run of mill diet, it does, let's say, interesting things to your deposits at the Brown & Company Fidelity Fiduciary Depository Corp. till you get things straightened out. (My secret weapon/nemesis/downfall is a full bag of dried blueberries--8 g fiber for 190 calories).
Reaching your fiber goal with the helps of chips and salsa, that's truly smart living!
Yes, but we were looking for examples of hitting it without grains, like oatmeal, rice, tortilla (I believe the Chipotle ones are wheat).
OK: One day's fiber from veg/fruit.
3g - mixed berries
4g - winter squash
11g - brussels sprouts
2g - onions
1g - tomatoes
1g - cucumber
2g - avocado
2g - kumquats
Not quite 30, but 26. If I count the permissable 1 serving of legumes (lentils at 6.3g), that's 32. Total for the day, 51g. (Balance from more lentils and miscellaneous small contributors like nuts, seeds, spices, tofu; only 7g from grains (oatmeal for 3g, Ezekiel pita for 4g).
This is a high side of average day, I'd say. Around 40g is pretty normal, and that proportion from grains is pretty normal, too.snowflake954 wrote: »concordancia wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.
Why? The goal is to create a diet structure that works regardless of the individual dishes. Greece and Morocco might have flat bread, Spain uses more rice, Italy pasta, but the point is the portion of those, the types of protein, lots of fruit and veg, etc.
Because...perhaps the OP doesn't like rice, or pasta, or prefers flat bread. I'd look at what different Med countries eat and choose the one that is closer to my likes. This in a context of overall diet.
I think the point is: Why choose one? The so-called "Mediterranean diet" is an eating pattern. It allows for variations. It can include foods from multiple Mediterranean countries, and (I'd suggest) even completely non-Mediterranean countries. Are the same vegetables and grains suddenly not as healthy because we use South Asian or African or South American spices in them?
I think, if you are going to be doing a lot of your own cooking, it would be helpful to get to know one country's cuisines and food practices/attitudes really well, and then to branch off from there. But it is certainly not mandatory. It just makes it easier at the grocery store, knowing which foods to buy and what to keep stocked in your pantry. I can cruise along pretty well with French, Italian and Greek, but if I suddenly had to switch to Israeli or Moroccan, I would be pretty lost and would have to do a lot of research and practice to prepare my meals. (This is beyond eating at restaurants or buying some hummus and pitas or veg). It's just helpful to have an intellectual framework of what flavors go together, what is the aromatic foundation of the cuisine, what herbs and spices work best together, etc.1 -
French_Peasant wrote: »concordancia wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
I am just getting back into logging after quite a long while off, but here is a recent day. This is including grains too, but unless you are cutting them out completely, they are going to be there, making a contribution, as "background noise" at least.
Oatmeal--4 g
box raisins--2 g
.25 cup quinoia--1 g
1 c broccoli--4 g
1/2 c apple--2 g
Chipotle mild salsa--1 g
Chipotle chips (not a full bag)--2 g
2/3 Chipotle burrito white rice/mild salsa/corn salsa/black beans --10 g
3 clementines--4 g
1 oz popcorn--2 g
For a total of 32 g for a normal day with 8-ish servings.
A group of us have done a challenge from time to time involving 10+ servings of fruit and veg a day; when you get THAT much fiber (in addition to the "background noise" fiber from your run of mill diet, it does, let's say, interesting things to your deposits at the Brown & Company Fidelity Fiduciary Depository Corp. till you get things straightened out. (My secret weapon/nemesis/downfall is a full bag of dried blueberries--8 g fiber for 190 calories).
Reaching your fiber goal with the helps of chips and salsa, that's truly smart living!
Yes, but we were looking for examples of hitting it without grains, like oatmeal, rice, tortilla (I believe the Chipotle ones are wheat).
OK: One day's fiber from veg/fruit.
3g - mixed berries
4g - winter squash
11g - brussels sprouts
2g - onions
1g - tomatoes
1g - cucumber
2g - avocado
2g - kumquats
Not quite 30, but 26. If I count the permissable 1 serving of legumes (lentils at 6.3g), that's 32. Total for the day, 51g. (Balance from more lentils and miscellaneous small contributors like nuts, seeds, spices, tofu; only 7g from grains (oatmeal for 3g, Ezekiel pita for 4g).
This is a high side of average day, I'd say. Around 40g is pretty normal, and that proportion from grains is pretty normal, too.snowflake954 wrote: »concordancia wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.
Why? The goal is to create a diet structure that works regardless of the individual dishes. Greece and Morocco might have flat bread, Spain uses more rice, Italy pasta, but the point is the portion of those, the types of protein, lots of fruit and veg, etc.
Because...perhaps the OP doesn't like rice, or pasta, or prefers flat bread. I'd look at what different Med countries eat and choose the one that is closer to my likes. This in a context of overall diet.
I think the point is: Why choose one? The so-called "Mediterranean diet" is an eating pattern. It allows for variations. It can include foods from multiple Mediterranean countries, and (I'd suggest) even completely non-Mediterranean countries. Are the same vegetables and grains suddenly not as healthy because we use South Asian or African or South American spices in them?
I think, if you are going to be doing a lot of your own cooking, it would be helpful to get to know one country's cuisines and food practices/attitudes really well, and then to branch off from there. But it is certainly not mandatory. It just makes it easier at the grocery store, knowing which foods to buy and what to keep stocked in your pantry. I can cruise along pretty well with French, Italian and Greek, but if I suddenly had to switch to Israeli or Moroccan, I would be pretty lost and would have to do a lot of research and practice to prepare my meals. (This is beyond eating at restaurants or buying some hummus and pitas or veg). It's just helpful to have an intellectual framework of what flavors go together, what is the aromatic foundation of the cuisine, what herbs and spices work best together, etc.
If someone's not used to cooking at all, they do need to learn to roast and steam veggies, cook grain, and that sort of basic thing. It doesn't need to be much more complicated than that.
Part of my reason for weighing in on this sub-thread is that (to some), I think it may sound daunting to research and master a particular country's cooking, then move on to the next. To the extent that the benefits of eating a so-called "Mediterranean Diet" are from the eating pattern, not specific dishes, then the eating pattern is the important thing to understand. It can be followed just with standard preps of the foods that people may be familiar with, but a few simple swaps (like less salt, more monounsaturated/polyunsaturated fats and less saturated fats, etc.).
The Mayo Clinic's overview of the Mediterranean diet is as follows:The Mediterranean diet emphasizes:
Eating primarily plant-based foods, such as fruits and vegetables, whole grains, legumes and nuts
Replacing butter with healthy fats such as olive oil and canola oil
Using herbs and spices instead of salt to flavor foods
Limiting red meat to no more than a few times a month
Eating fish and poultry at least twice a week
Enjoying meals with family and friends
Drinking red wine in moderation (optional)
Getting plenty of exercise
It goes on with details (https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-healthy-eating/in-depth/mediterranean-diet/art-20047801), but it's about the pattern, not the specifics.
That kind of eating pattern can be accomplished incrementally, with gradual changes in how one cooks/eats - similar to gradually getting to a balanced diet generally, or to a satisfying eating style at low calories, or what-have-you. It can most manageably (IMO) be an eating evolution, rather than revolution.
I think the difference between you & me is that I'm much more of a flake/experimentalist. (From being on threads with you, I think you're a more disciplined gourmet/gourmand.) I've been cooking for decades, and rarely use recipes.
I've gone through phases of test-driving various cuisines (and I'm vegetarian, so mostly vegetable), and even so mostly look at recipes to understand unusual combinations of flavors, and characteristic seasoning profiles, then I wing it.
If it tastes good, and is nutritious, I'm happy, whether it's pure "Indian" or "Kenyan" or "Italian" or "Greek", or not. A pretty small range of pantry supplies and spices will cover quite a range of cuisines (if one is that structured) or varied flavors (if one isn't). Any of that, though, is just fancy stuff on top of the eating pattern.5 -
This is actually why I don't like the term "Med diet" for the healthy eating pattern described above. My cooking isn't particularly Mediterranean in style. If I cook in any style on a regular basis, it's something of a farm-to-table American style, pretty simple on a day to day basis, but with various dishes I've adopted/adapted from a variety of cultures (I like reading regionally-based cookbooks and experimenting with different ideas).
But it still fits the Mayo Clinic list in most respects.3 -
This is a website based on calorie counting for weight loss (or gain). Most of us find specific diets unnecessary for weight loss.6
-
jennifer_417 wrote: »This is a website based on calorie counting for weight loss (or gain). Most of us find specific diets unnecessary for weight loss.
Being on and off of these forums for a few years now I've seen differently, many here follow some sort of structured plan, either instead of calorie tracking, or in conjection with tracking. Weight management comes down to calorie balance but there's numerous ways to go about that.
But, the Mediterranean way of eating is not a weight loss plan per se but a style of eating, which can be done along with straight calorie counting/tracking. It's not one or the other.8 -
French_Peasant wrote: »concordancia wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »French_Peasant wrote: »If I had to pick one official diet this is the one I would pick, because it's freakin' delicious and I have found the closer I adhere to its tenets, the easier it was to lose and then maintain my weight. It also covers a very wide variety of cuisines.
For high fiber, you should be nailing it if you eat 8-10 servings of fruit and veg a day (keep the peels on and make sure you are picking higher fiber selections), with at least one serving being fiber-rich legumes.
Be careful, because there are plenty of Mediterranean foods that can get you in trouble--olive oil in particular needs to be measured very carefully as it is calorie dense at 120 calories per tablespoon.
Also, I tend to give myself a fairly liberal interpretation of the region, but things that are traditionally French like quiche Lorraine or Brie and Camembert are actually very Northern, dairy-based, and in the case of the Lorraine region actually were German for long stretches of time. So, if you are looking at every last calorie, you would probably want to avoid heavy quiches and pick lighter cheeses like feta or parmesan.
I think a really important aspect of the diet is (like the French and Italians and other guardians of traditional cuisines) to bring discernment, pride, and an emphasis on excellence to what you are putting on your plate. It should be simple and beautiful, with good quality ingredients, whether you can afford the high priced organic veg from Whole Foods or you are creating meals with more economical selections from the Birdseye frozen veg section. So many people are ashamed of their food, but it should be a source of pleasure, love and pride.
There's a thread in the debate section that goes into this a bit more, it's actually pretty hard to get the recommended fiber, 30+ grams a day, just from vegetables/fruit. A serving of legumes would help, but most likely you'll still come short unless you're also eating whole grains, potatoes etc.
I disagree. I find that if I have a variety of veg and some fruit and a serving of legumes, I'll generally be over 30, even if I don't happen to eat grains or potatoes (which only have 2 g per 100) that day. I might pick up some from other foods, like nuts or seeds, of course.
I would be interested in seeing what veg/fruit combo, with a serving of legumes, would hit over 30g (genuinely interested). On a high veg/fruit day I hit around 20g from those, if I add a serving of beans I'd still be under a bit. Wondering what I could add to get my veg/fruit fiber numbers up
I am just getting back into logging after quite a long while off, but here is a recent day. This is including grains too, but unless you are cutting them out completely, they are going to be there, making a contribution, as "background noise" at least.
Oatmeal--4 g
box raisins--2 g
.25 cup quinoia--1 g
1 c broccoli--4 g
1/2 c apple--2 g
Chipotle mild salsa--1 g
Chipotle chips (not a full bag)--2 g
2/3 Chipotle burrito white rice/mild salsa/corn salsa/black beans --10 g
3 clementines--4 g
1 oz popcorn--2 g
For a total of 32 g for a normal day with 8-ish servings.
A group of us have done a challenge from time to time involving 10+ servings of fruit and veg a day; when you get THAT much fiber (in addition to the "background noise" fiber from your run of mill diet, it does, let's say, interesting things to your deposits at the Brown & Company Fidelity Fiduciary Depository Corp. till you get things straightened out. (My secret weapon/nemesis/downfall is a full bag of dried blueberries--8 g fiber for 190 calories).
Reaching your fiber goal with the helps of chips and salsa, that's truly smart living!
Yes, but we were looking for examples of hitting it without grains, like oatmeal, rice, tortilla (I believe the Chipotle ones are wheat).
OK: One day's fiber from veg/fruit.
3g - mixed berries
4g - winter squash
11g - brussels sprouts
2g - onions
1g - tomatoes
1g - cucumber
2g - avocado
2g - kumquats
Not quite 30, but 26. If I count the permissable 1 serving of legumes (lentils at 6.3g), that's 32. Total for the day, 51g. (Balance from more lentils and miscellaneous small contributors like nuts, seeds, spices, tofu; only 7g from grains (oatmeal for 3g, Ezekiel pita for 4g).
This is a high side of average day, I'd say. Around 40g is pretty normal, and that proportion from grains is pretty normal, too.snowflake954 wrote: »concordancia wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Also you need to choose which Med country you'd prefer to follow.
Why? The goal is to create a diet structure that works regardless of the individual dishes. Greece and Morocco might have flat bread, Spain uses more rice, Italy pasta, but the point is the portion of those, the types of protein, lots of fruit and veg, etc.
Because...perhaps the OP doesn't like rice, or pasta, or prefers flat bread. I'd look at what different Med countries eat and choose the one that is closer to my likes. This in a context of overall diet.
I think the point is: Why choose one? The so-called "Mediterranean diet" is an eating pattern. It allows for variations. It can include foods from multiple Mediterranean countries, and (I'd suggest) even completely non-Mediterranean countries. Are the same vegetables and grains suddenly not as healthy because we use South Asian or African or South American spices in them?
I think, if you are going to be doing a lot of your own cooking, it would be helpful to get to know one country's cuisines and food practices/attitudes really well, and then to branch off from there. But it is certainly not mandatory. It just makes it easier at the grocery store, knowing which foods to buy and what to keep stocked in your pantry. I can cruise along pretty well with French, Italian and Greek, but if I suddenly had to switch to Israeli or Moroccan, I would be pretty lost and would have to do a lot of research and practice to prepare my meals. (This is beyond eating at restaurants or buying some hummus and pitas or veg). It's just helpful to have an intellectual framework of what flavors go together, what is the aromatic foundation of the cuisine, what herbs and spices work best together, etc.
If someone's not used to cooking at all, they do need to learn to roast and steam veggies, cook grain, and that sort of basic thing. It doesn't need to be much more complicated than that.
Part of my reason for weighing in on this sub-thread is that (to some), I think it may sound daunting to research and master a particular country's cooking, then move on to the next. To the extent that the benefits of eating a so-called "Mediterranean Diet" are from the eating pattern, not specific dishes, then the eating pattern is the important thing to understand. It can be followed just with standard preps of the foods that people may be familiar with, but a few simple swaps (like less salt, more monounsaturated/polyunsaturated fats and less saturated fats, etc.).
The Mayo Clinic's overview of the Mediterranean diet is as follows:The Mediterranean diet emphasizes:
Eating primarily plant-based foods, such as fruits and vegetables, whole grains, legumes and nuts
Replacing butter with healthy fats such as olive oil and canola oil
Using herbs and spices instead of salt to flavor foods
Limiting red meat to no more than a few times a month
Eating fish and poultry at least twice a week
Enjoying meals with family and friends
Drinking red wine in moderation (optional)
Getting plenty of exercise
It goes on with details (https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-healthy-eating/in-depth/mediterranean-diet/art-20047801), but it's about the pattern, not the specifics.
That kind of eating pattern can be accomplished incrementally, with gradual changes in how one cooks/eats - similar to gradually getting to a balanced diet generally, or to a satisfying eating style at low calories, or what-have-you. It can most manageably (IMO) be an eating evolution, rather than revolution.
I think the difference between you & me is that I'm much more of a flake/experimentalist. (From being on threads with you, I think you're a more disciplined gourmet/gourmand.) I've been cooking for decades, and rarely use recipes.
I've gone through phases of test-driving various cuisines (and I'm vegetarian, so mostly vegetable), and even so mostly look at recipes to understand unusual combinations of flavors, and characteristic seasoning profiles, then I wing it.
If it tastes good, and is nutritious, I'm happy, whether it's pure "Indian" or "Kenyan" or "Italian" or "Greek", or not. A pretty small range of pantry supplies and spices will cover quite a range of cuisines (if one is that structured) or varied flavors (if one isn't). Any of that, though, is just fancy stuff on top of the eating pattern.
I agree with you on everything except the part where you suggest I am a disciplined gourmet. I’m just a redneck Hoosier who learned to cook from free Julia Child mini books that came free with Dove soap. And of course my moms 1960s Betty Crocker. If I spent as much time actually cooking food as I do reading and thinking about food and how it relates to culture, I would probably be as brave and freewheeling as you. I always use recipes, sometimes comparing multiple recipes and working from all of them, sometimes following and disregarding the recipe at the same time, even for foods I know like the back of my hand.
At any rate, hopefully none of this strikes anyone as daunting...we ARE at least discussing it now.
6 -
Ya'll sound like gourmets compared to me - what's the healthiest, easiest, way to eat other than raw or frozen veggies, nuts, canned lentils, beans (can't stand canned foods but need to get over it), wholegrain cereals, the healthy Irish/Scottish oats (not the easiest to make), and the Trader Joe's frozen oatmeal is all flavored/sugared up I'd love to be able to eat strictly vegetarian but need more straight protein (unfortunately) like from meat. Any suggestions other than tofu and eggs? Chicken seems to be a staple but I try not to eat too much.
Would love to be able to eat the Okinawa diet or the Loma Linda, California (7th Day Adventists) diet. It's tough.1 -
OP- easy to get 50+ grams of fiber on the med WOE. The center of all meals should be leafy green and non starchy veg. Add in beans, rice, potatoes and lots of fruit. Then add meat/fish/eggs as a condiment. Depending on your calorie goal, keep nuts, oils, avocado, seeds and wine to a minimum.5
-
Ya'll sound like gourmets compared to me - what's the healthiest, easiest, way to eat other than raw or frozen veggies, nuts, canned lentils, beans (can't stand canned foods but need to get over it), wholegrain cereals, the healthy Irish/Scottish oats (not the easiest to make), and the Trader Joe's frozen oatmeal is all flavored/sugared up I'd love to be able to eat strictly vegetarian but need more straight protein (unfortunately) like from meat. Any suggestions other than tofu and eggs? Chicken seems to be a staple but I try not to eat too much.
Would love to be able to eat the Okinawa diet or the Loma Linda, California (7th Day Adventists) diet. It's tough.
In my experience, the best answers to protein questions are almost always in the thread below, which lists protein sources by protein efficiency, most protein for fewest calories. The vegetarian sources aren't at the top, mostly . . . but they're there. And I say that as a vegetarian (ovo-lacto, though - not strict: I don't eat many eggs, but I love my dairy, and my Northern European genes think that's just fine, too.
).
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10247171/carbs-and-fats-are-cheap-heres-a-guide-to-getting-your-proteins-worth-fiber-also
5
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