how to eat more for weight training
angermouse
Posts: 102 Member
hi newbie here, not new to exercise but to looking at gaining more muscle and definition.
im currently eating in deficit to get body fat down from 25%, im pretty small (size 8 53kg) but quite wobbly, usual jelly thighs, clapping butt cheeks and got a grab of loose belly not sure if that's skin or fat
ive been trying to read up on building more muscle and tone but I need to be in surplus. cant do both! lose fat build muscle etc. im looking into it before I need to bulk and dive into eating more. i currently aim to eat 1530 cals a day and burn more, but getting that 1530 is tough enough so the thought of eating the 1800 odd just to maintain with out surplus seems daunting and impossible?
regarding macros - mine are made as such. protein 135g fat 38g carb 157g give or take a few grams either way. carbs and fats rack up quite quick but the protein is harder to get into the meals, i sometimes add whey protein shake if im struggling.
so after that long drawn out speech im asking how others do it? how to you eat so much of the right stuff, im also worried that i wont do enough weights or exercise to actually build muscle and gain fat from the extra cals?
from my info can any one help with putting me on the right track and if theres anything im doing wrong. If ive read right I need to get down to 20% body fat before bulking?
I have some food intolerances that make eating for macros tricky. my stomach doesn't like eggs, bananas, kale, avocado, beets and peanuts - although I can handle a bit of peanut butter?? probably others that I cant think of right now.
thanks for any advice.
im currently eating in deficit to get body fat down from 25%, im pretty small (size 8 53kg) but quite wobbly, usual jelly thighs, clapping butt cheeks and got a grab of loose belly not sure if that's skin or fat
ive been trying to read up on building more muscle and tone but I need to be in surplus. cant do both! lose fat build muscle etc. im looking into it before I need to bulk and dive into eating more. i currently aim to eat 1530 cals a day and burn more, but getting that 1530 is tough enough so the thought of eating the 1800 odd just to maintain with out surplus seems daunting and impossible?
regarding macros - mine are made as such. protein 135g fat 38g carb 157g give or take a few grams either way. carbs and fats rack up quite quick but the protein is harder to get into the meals, i sometimes add whey protein shake if im struggling.
so after that long drawn out speech im asking how others do it? how to you eat so much of the right stuff, im also worried that i wont do enough weights or exercise to actually build muscle and gain fat from the extra cals?
from my info can any one help with putting me on the right track and if theres anything im doing wrong. If ive read right I need to get down to 20% body fat before bulking?
I have some food intolerances that make eating for macros tricky. my stomach doesn't like eggs, bananas, kale, avocado, beets and peanuts - although I can handle a bit of peanut butter?? probably others that I cant think of right now.
thanks for any advice.
1
Replies
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Most people are fine just eating maintenance and lifting with a good, well established program. Most people will build a good physique and build muscle over time doing that. Bulking is for packing it on and frankly a bit of a fad at the moment...but yes, you need to be fairly lean when you start an actual bulk because you are going to put on fat as well as muscle.
Most people I know who run bulking and cutting cycles don't rely solely on "the right stuff"...they eat pretty well and get good nutrition, but calories are what are needed so they don't shy away from some high calorie "junk" either. Arnold Schwarzenegger was notorious for eating a whole chicken and washing it down with a pitcher of beer after a training session.
ETA: you don't necessarily need to add volume to increase calories...full fat dairy, full fat salad dressings, nuts, avocados, saute or roast vegetables in good cooking oils, etc.0 -
Maybe I missed it, but do you still have weight to lose?
Lifting while in a deficit is still beneficial.5 -
hi im not sure how to tag someone in a reply, all new to this.
okay so im learning as im going along, im not planning on bulking large just so legs and arms have definition and not look like noodle arms and tree trunk legs! also once I can get bf down maybe abs as a bonus
ive read a lot of people saying bulking then cutting cycles - so it is ok when I get to where im happy just to maintain the muscles and weight. not cycle.
quicksilver. no I don't really want to loose weight just a bit more body fat but im aware I may loose weight, I do weights to try and gain some muscle weight instead.0 -
also in body type I am mesomorph so gain weight, loose weight muscle easy. so that's why I was asking about the foods during bulk to stop gaining too much fat.0
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angermouse wrote: »hi im not sure how to tag someone in a reply, all new to this.
okay so im learning as im going along, im not planning on bulking large just so legs and arms have definition and not look like noodle arms and tree trunk legs! also once I can get bf down maybe abs as a bonus
ive read a lot of people saying bulking then cutting cycles - so it is ok when I get to where im happy just to maintain the muscles and weight. not cycle.
quicksilver. no I don't really want to loose weight just a bit more body fat but im aware I may loose weight, I do weights to try and gain some muscle weight instead.
Most people in gyms aren't doing bulking and cutting cycles...they're working out and getting in shape. You need a surplus if you really want to pack the muscle on...ie body build. You will however put on muscle mass and can develop a good physique eating maintenance and having a solid lifting program...it's just much slower than deliberately bulking on muscle.
Losing fat is going to equate to losing weight. In regards to abs, you will likely need to be lower than 20% BF and even then, many women are not genetically predisposed to having visible abs. I know quite a few very lean and fit women and only one of them has visible abs and they are all around 17-18% BF...flat stomachs, but no striation.3 -
If you don’t have much weight to lose, you could work at recomping - eat at maintenance, lift weights and over time you WILL gain muscle and get rid of fat.
Or, keep working out while eating at a small deficit until you get to your weight/body fat goal. Small deficit as in: aim for 0.5 pounds loss per week.
No comment about bulking... see above.
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how do I do the tagging what someone said please to help with replies?
thanks its a relief to hear I don't need to eat as much as I feared. Im reading conflicting info about building muscle to fill out skin to stop the wobble to then reading I need to loose bf to reduce wobble and tone? so confusing. I guess id try my hand at gaining muscles as the more weight I loose I look more gaunt and skinny fat I am, not the look im going for!.
lower than 20% wow,ok I can live with a flat stomach abs would just be a bonus haha. I am quite slim and flattish stomach but the skin aint tight, can grab it and have side handles and lower pooch over trousers that really ags me! not sure whats needed to sort that. in short its not firm.0 -
At the bottom of each person’s post on the threat is the word “QUOTE
If you press quote, what that person said will be pasted in the comment post at the bottom. Then you just add to it.2 -
angermouse wrote: »how do I do the tagging what someone said please to help with replies?
thanks its a relief to hear I don't need to eat as much as I feared. Im reading conflicting info about building muscle to fill out skin to stop the wobble to then reading I need to loose bf to reduce wobble and tone? so confusing. I guess id try my hand at gaining muscles as the more weight I loose I look more gaunt and skinny fat I am, not the look im going for!.
lower than 20% wow,ok I can live with a flat stomach abs would just be a bonus haha. I am quite slim and flattish stomach but the skin aint tight, can grab it and have side handles and lower pooch over trousers that really ags me! not sure whats needed to sort that. in short its not firm.
Are you lifting weights now? You should be lifting weights now and doing so with an established program.1 -
I would recommend either eating in a small deficit (I don't know how tall you are), or recomp. I would not bulk right now unless you are underweight. You can still make progress eating at maintenance and recomping, building muscle and losing fat over time, it is slow but it sounds like a good fit for you right now. Again I don't know your full stats, but if you do have some weight to lose you can avoid muscle loss and "skinny fat" by following a progressive lifting program and getting adequate protein.
Once you are lean enough (I would say under 20%) and you are comfortable with your problem areas, then you can think about gaining if that is something you want to do. You don't have to though. It is very mentally and physically taxing for many, you will put on fat, it will go to your problem areas, it can be very difficult to go through.2 -
yes but probably not what will help. im working on my upper strength with dumbbell/kettle bells at home and the machines at the gym, im stronger in legs and quad dominant but also use the machines for legs. I came across a 6 compound moves to do so might try when next in the gym, though need to build strength to make sure my form is on point more than lifting too much.
also see that im doing the training wrong? aparrently I shouldn't be doing splits like leg day, arm/back day etc I should be doing 3 x full body compound?0 -
I am ridiculous weak in the arms and back, cant do push ups and pull ups are a time away haha. I was going to invest in some paralette bars to pratice negative pull ups as I cant even get up to the gym bars to do negatives! though I do lat pull downs if that's a good thing?0
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Whatever you do, be sure to follow a program, see here
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
You don't have to do 3x full body, you can do an upper/lower split. I would recommend a program for beginners and one that has you working each body part at least 2x per week for best results. The bodybuilding splits are more for people with more experience trying to add that last bit to their physiques, not so much for beginners or intermediates.0 -
angermouse wrote: »yes but probably not what will help. im working on my upper strength with dumbbell/kettle bells at home and the machines at the gym, im stronger in legs and quad dominant but also use the machines for legs. I came across a 6 compound moves to do so might try when next in the gym, though need to build strength to make sure my form is on point more than lifting too much.
also see that im doing the training wrong? aparrently I shouldn't be doing splits like leg day, arm/back day etc I should be doing 3 x full body compound?
You can do a split or full body...if you do a split you want to make sure you're hitting the same muscles at least 2x per week on non consecutive days. A true full body program 3x per week is pretty optimal for beginners because you're hitting everything 3x per week and are in the best position for newb gains.
People doing body building splits or "bro splits" where they hit each muscle once per week, but with high volume are generally advanced lifters who have already developed impressive physiques...a bro split is far from optimal for a beginner because you're just not getting the stimulus you need for development.2 -
Whatever you do, be sure to follow a program, see here
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
You don't have to do 3x full body, you can do an upper/lower split. I would recommend a program for beginners and one that has you working each body part at least 2x per week for best results. The bodybuilding splits are more for people with more experience trying to add that last bit to their physiques, not so much for beginners or intermediates.
thanks, I guess im kind of doing the upper/lower split already?. I do legs on a Monday plus 30min abs class, weds I do arms and started to work on my back strength this week, then thurs or fri I do legs again and abs class. i'll have a look at the link thanks0 -
i also find that i cant burn enough calories by doing weights alone and need to do walking to burn off cals. i do steady state to not lose muscle mass. is this ok?0
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angermouse wrote: »Whatever you do, be sure to follow a program, see here
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
You don't have to do 3x full body, you can do an upper/lower split. I would recommend a program for beginners and one that has you working each body part at least 2x per week for best results. The bodybuilding splits are more for people with more experience trying to add that last bit to their physiques, not so much for beginners or intermediates.
thanks, I guess im kind of doing the upper/lower split already?. I do legs on a Monday plus 30min abs class, weds I do arms and started to work on my back strength this week, then thurs or fri I do legs again and abs class. i'll have a look at the link thanks
Don't just go and do exercises that hit those muscle... try following a program including what exercises, progression, and rest
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angermouse wrote: »Whatever you do, be sure to follow a program, see here
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
You don't have to do 3x full body, you can do an upper/lower split. I would recommend a program for beginners and one that has you working each body part at least 2x per week for best results. The bodybuilding splits are more for people with more experience trying to add that last bit to their physiques, not so much for beginners or intermediates.
thanks, I guess im kind of doing the upper/lower split already?. I do legs on a Monday plus 30min abs class, weds I do arms and started to work on my back strength this week, then thurs or fri I do legs again and abs class. i'll have a look at the link thanks
Don't just go and do exercises that hit those muscle... try following a program including what exercises, progression, and rest
can you explain a bit please, i do log the weights so i know to improve in the month?
legs for example ive been doing the machines, abductors, ham curl, quad machine not sure of all the names lol i also do bell swings, deadlift but i think its straight leg not the hinge?? bench step ups, glutes, kickbacks... am i doing it all wrong haha0 -
angermouse wrote: »angermouse wrote: »Whatever you do, be sure to follow a program, see here
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
You don't have to do 3x full body, you can do an upper/lower split. I would recommend a program for beginners and one that has you working each body part at least 2x per week for best results. The bodybuilding splits are more for people with more experience trying to add that last bit to their physiques, not so much for beginners or intermediates.
thanks, I guess im kind of doing the upper/lower split already?. I do legs on a Monday plus 30min abs class, weds I do arms and started to work on my back strength this week, then thurs or fri I do legs again and abs class. i'll have a look at the link thanks
Don't just go and do exercises that hit those muscle... try following a program including what exercises, progression, and rest
can you explain a bit please, i do log the weights so i know to improve in the month?
legs for example ive been doing the machines, abductors, ham curl, quad machine not sure of all the names lol i also do bell swings, deadlift but i think its straight leg not the hinge?? bench step ups, glutes, kickbacks... am i doing it all wrong haha
As someone else posted, visit this site, and choose a program that fits your goals: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
these programs are designed by people that know what they are doing, from the rep range, sets, progression. There is no reason to try an reinvent the wheel, and most likely do a worse job at it, unless you have a background in physiology and personal training, etc.
possible your program will work, as most things will due to adherence, but most liekly what you are doing is not optimal or close to it the way those programs would be3 -
thanks, ive been trying to keep up with the replies and will visit all links in a bit, don't want to seem like im ignoring people. ive also noticed ive missed a few post so going to go quote and reply on those. im so grateful for your help and time to reply
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cwolfman13 wrote: »Most people are fine just eating maintenance and lifting with a good, well established program. Most people will build a good physique and build muscle over time doing that. Bulking is for packing it on and frankly a bit of a fad at the moment...but yes, you need to be fairly lean when you start an actual bulk because you are going to put on fat as well as muscle.
Most people I know who run bulking and cutting cycles don't rely solely on "the right stuff"...they eat pretty well and get good nutrition, but calories are what are needed so they don't shy away from some high calorie "junk" either. Arnold Schwarzenegger was notorious for eating a whole chicken and washing it down with a pitcher of beer after a training session.
ETA: you don't necessarily need to add volume to increase calories...full fat dairy, full fat salad dressings, nuts, avocados, saute or roast vegetables in good cooking oils, etc.
cwolfman im restricted to certain fats as i have genetic high cholesterol of 7.5! and told to stick to low fat and satfats. having to take statins to sort this issue. complicated human i make lol0 -
If you don’t have much weight to lose, you could work at recomping - eat at maintenance, lift weights and over time you WILL gain muscle and get rid of fat.
Or, keep working out while eating at a small deficit until you get to your weight/body fat goal. Small deficit as in: aim for 0.5 pounds loss per week.
No comment about bulking... see above.
no i don't really want to loose weight as im told theres nothing of me far too often. im eating around 250 - 300 deficit at the moment. so ill take it up more.0 -
I would recommend either eating in a small deficit (I don't know how tall you are), or recomp. I would not bulk right now unless you are underweight. You can still make progress eating at maintenance and recomping, building muscle and losing fat over time, it is slow but it sounds like a good fit for you right now. Again I don't know your full stats, but if you do have some weight to lose you can avoid muscle loss and "skinny fat" by following a progressive lifting program and getting adequate protein.
Once you are lean enough (I would say under 20%) and you are comfortable with your problem areas, then you can think about gaining if that is something you want to do. You don't have to though. It is very mentally and physically taxing for many, you will put on fat, it will go to your problem areas, it can be very difficult to go through.
im 5f 5 weigh 53kg. around 25% bf.
my macro currently 135 protein, fat 38 carb 157 there abouts. not sure if that's stat you mean?
yes the dreaded 'skinny fat' when losing weight i didn't think a id wobble at size 8 lol got so much to learn!
i don't really want to stay this low weight id like to be heavier but cant shift the bf and wobbly which ideally like to be muscle and gain weight from being more muscle.0 -
angermouse wrote: »I would recommend either eating in a small deficit (I don't know how tall you are), or recomp. I would not bulk right now unless you are underweight. You can still make progress eating at maintenance and recomping, building muscle and losing fat over time, it is slow but it sounds like a good fit for you right now. Again I don't know your full stats, but if you do have some weight to lose you can avoid muscle loss and "skinny fat" by following a progressive lifting program and getting adequate protein.
Once you are lean enough (I would say under 20%) and you are comfortable with your problem areas, then you can think about gaining if that is something you want to do. You don't have to though. It is very mentally and physically taxing for many, you will put on fat, it will go to your problem areas, it can be very difficult to go through.
im 5f 5 weigh 53kg. around 25% bf.
my macro currently 135 protein, fat 38 carb 157 there abouts. not sure if that's stat you mean?
yes the dreaded 'skinny fat' when losing weight i didn't think a id wobble at size 8 lol got so much to learn!
i don't really want to stay this low weight id like to be heavier but cant shift the bf and wobbly which ideally like to be muscle and gain weight from being more muscle.
I would highly recommend recomp then. Maintain your weight. Follow a program. Get 0.8-1g protein per lb bodyweight. And have lots of patience.2 -
angermouse wrote: »I would recommend either eating in a small deficit (I don't know how tall you are), or recomp. I would not bulk right now unless you are underweight. You can still make progress eating at maintenance and recomping, building muscle and losing fat over time, it is slow but it sounds like a good fit for you right now. Again I don't know your full stats, but if you do have some weight to lose you can avoid muscle loss and "skinny fat" by following a progressive lifting program and getting adequate protein.
Once you are lean enough (I would say under 20%) and you are comfortable with your problem areas, then you can think about gaining if that is something you want to do. You don't have to though. It is very mentally and physically taxing for many, you will put on fat, it will go to your problem areas, it can be very difficult to go through.
im 5f 5 weigh 53kg. around 25% bf.
my macro currently 135 protein, fat 38 carb 157 there abouts. not sure if that's stat you mean?
yes the dreaded 'skinny fat' when losing weight i didn't think a id wobble at size 8 lol got so much to learn!
i don't really want to stay this low weight id like to be heavier but cant shift the bf and wobbly which ideally like to be muscle and gain weight from being more muscle.
I would highly recommend recomp then. Maintain your weight. Follow a program. Get 0.8-1g protein per lb bodyweight. And have lots of patience.
thanks, need to tweek my macros then as i think im working out on 1.2g per lb.
should i be doing any steady state to help burn cals as im not getting there with weights alone.0 -
angermouse wrote: »angermouse wrote: »I would recommend either eating in a small deficit (I don't know how tall you are), or recomp. I would not bulk right now unless you are underweight. You can still make progress eating at maintenance and recomping, building muscle and losing fat over time, it is slow but it sounds like a good fit for you right now. Again I don't know your full stats, but if you do have some weight to lose you can avoid muscle loss and "skinny fat" by following a progressive lifting program and getting adequate protein.
Once you are lean enough (I would say under 20%) and you are comfortable with your problem areas, then you can think about gaining if that is something you want to do. You don't have to though. It is very mentally and physically taxing for many, you will put on fat, it will go to your problem areas, it can be very difficult to go through.
im 5f 5 weigh 53kg. around 25% bf.
my macro currently 135 protein, fat 38 carb 157 there abouts. not sure if that's stat you mean?
yes the dreaded 'skinny fat' when losing weight i didn't think a id wobble at size 8 lol got so much to learn!
i don't really want to stay this low weight id like to be heavier but cant shift the bf and wobbly which ideally like to be muscle and gain weight from being more muscle.
I would highly recommend recomp then. Maintain your weight. Follow a program. Get 0.8-1g protein per lb bodyweight. And have lots of patience.
thanks, need to tweek my macros then as i think im working out on 1.2g per lb.
should i be doing any steady state to help burn cals as im not getting there with weights alone.
You say you already have issues getting to maintenance cals, I would not overdo the cardio. Some is fine for heart health and extra cals.. if you need them. But your main focus should be lifting for body composition changes. Also lowering your protein, which is typically filling for many, and increasing your other macros can help get more food in.1 -
angermouse wrote: »angermouse wrote: »I would recommend either eating in a small deficit (I don't know how tall you are), or recomp. I would not bulk right now unless you are underweight. You can still make progress eating at maintenance and recomping, building muscle and losing fat over time, it is slow but it sounds like a good fit for you right now. Again I don't know your full stats, but if you do have some weight to lose you can avoid muscle loss and "skinny fat" by following a progressive lifting program and getting adequate protein.
Once you are lean enough (I would say under 20%) and you are comfortable with your problem areas, then you can think about gaining if that is something you want to do. You don't have to though. It is very mentally and physically taxing for many, you will put on fat, it will go to your problem areas, it can be very difficult to go through.
im 5f 5 weigh 53kg. around 25% bf.
my macro currently 135 protein, fat 38 carb 157 there abouts. not sure if that's stat you mean?
yes the dreaded 'skinny fat' when losing weight i didn't think a id wobble at size 8 lol got so much to learn!
i don't really want to stay this low weight id like to be heavier but cant shift the bf and wobbly which ideally like to be muscle and gain weight from being more muscle.
I would highly recommend recomp then. Maintain your weight. Follow a program. Get 0.8-1g protein per lb bodyweight. And have lots of patience.
thanks, need to tweek my macros then as i think im working out on 1.2g per lb.
should i be doing any steady state to help burn cals as im not getting there with weights alone.
You say you already have issues getting to maintenance cals, I would not overdo the cardio. Some is fine for heart health and extra cals.. if you need them. But your main focus should be lifting for body composition changes. Also lowering your protein, which is typically filling for many, and increasing your other macros can help get more food in.
sorry went of to read link and was so much good info link after link lol
maybe im not getting it right with the cals in vs cals out? I read that I need to be in deficit for fat loss so my TDEE on maintenance is 1830 so I eat around 1530. but to get those 1530 worth is hard as im not a big eater so I was worrying how id ever fit in 1830 plus. so if im eating 1530 I need to be burning more than that. I wear a fit bit HR that tells me cals burned. or have I got this all wrong lol sound such a dumb question now thinking of it. its why im here haha....
so what I mean by not burning enough with out light cardio is that when I do weights its doesn't seem to burn much cals (according to fitbit) like cardio. for instance id go gym in the AM, its a 30min walk there, bus back. then say by evening ive only burned 1300 cals so I walk on my treadmill to bump it up.
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Did you use a TDEE calculation to get your maintenance cals? I don't know how Fitbit fits into it all I am not familiar with it and how it adds calories.
For example my maintenance is around 2500-2700 with activity exercise all included. If I eat less than that I lose, if I eat more I will start to gain.
What is going on with your weight? That will be the best indication whether you are eating at maintenance or deficit.3 -
Did you use a TDEE calculation to get your maintenance cals? I don't know how Fitbit fits into it all I am not familiar with it and how it adds calories.
For example my maintenance is around 2500-2700 with activity exercise all included. If I eat less than that I lose, if I eat more I will start to gain.
What is going on with your weight? That will be the best indication whether you are eating at maintenance or deficit.
the fit bit just tells me how many cals I burn during the day that's all, I was just saying instead on stopping at 1530 cals burned I was exercising up to 1900. so dropping 300 from the 1830 then more over the 1530. probably not explaining that well sorry.
I did use a TDEE yes one similar to mfp one. I might have the activity part wrong though?
10x53kg + 6.25 x 165 - 5 x 36 - 161 = 1220
then I chose moderate activity x 1.5 = 1830
minus 300 for fat lose = 1530
is it wrong? I thought the 1830 was a maintenance number.0 -
angermouse wrote: »Did you use a TDEE calculation to get your maintenance cals? I don't know how Fitbit fits into it all I am not familiar with it and how it adds calories.
For example my maintenance is around 2500-2700 with activity exercise all included. If I eat less than that I lose, if I eat more I will start to gain.
What is going on with your weight? That will be the best indication whether you are eating at maintenance or deficit.
the fit bit just tells me how many cals I burn during the day that's all, I was just saying instead on stopping at 1530 cals burned I was exercising up to 1900. so dropping 300 from the 1830 then more over the 1530. probably not explaining that well sorry.
I did use a TDEE yes one similar to mfp one. I might have the activity part wrong though?
10x53kg + 6.25 x 165 - 5 x 36 - 161 = 1220
then I chose moderate activity x 1.5 = 1830
minus 300 for fat lose = 1530
is it wrong? I thought the 1830 was a maintenance number.
That can be a starting number but like I mentioned what is going on with your weight will indicate if you are maintaining or losing.0
This discussion has been closed.
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