Wait, what? There is more than one way to progress?!
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Those "slim legs" won't hold the 140lbs of iron I squat. Pass.
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I dreadfully feel a can of worms has opened...
oh, you have no idea...
"Running" won't "develop" leg muscles...fyi. That's steady state cardio. Sprints, hills, etc.. will.
Weight lifting (at a caloric deficit) doesn't give you "muscle development" (I'll assume you mean increased muscle mass). It
maintains what muscle mass you have as well as helping to increase strength.
In the case I'm referring to I don't think there has been any increase in muscle mass, just maintaining muscle mass and lowering BF%. But this was enough to create nice muscle definition and an attractive pair of legs and hind quarters, without weightlifting.
I used 'muscle development' to avoid saying 'muscle tone' which I have learned is a big no no among a forum of exercise science majors. In the future I will avoid both.
Sadly I do stay at the gym long enough(45-60min lifting, 30-45min cardio, 30-45 min basketball) to outlast her entire workout so I know she is not lifting at the gym unless she comes in twice a day (very unlikely).
Why is it unlikely? How about you just go ask her next time you are at the gym.
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What I think is funny is how everyone on this forum encourages all women to lift weights, and lift heavy, and that this is the best way to get a smokin' bod and you won't get bulky from it. There is this girl at the gym I go to who never does anything except run on a treadmill and occasionally the stepper machine and she has an incredible pair of legs, low BF, great definition yet still very slim and feminine. Most women would love to have her figure, yet she doesn't lift weights at all.
She is more than likely doing more than you are seeing then.
That is certainly a possibility but if she does she isn't doing it at my gym. But it would seem strange that she comes to the gym at all if she is lifting at home. I think she is still in college as she only comes to the gym in the summertime. I have wondered if she is a competitive runner because of how much she runs but I don't see a competition runner doing treadmill runs all summer long, it just doesn't fit. I think she just has really low BF% and between the running and stepper her leg muscles have developed nicely, that along with genetics. Other than that she is just basically skinny like many girls want to be, even her legs are very slim, they just have nice shape and definition.
My point being that I don't feel that weights are essential to an attractive figure, and some women, many in fact, do not want to have that muscle development that weightlifting will give them, even if the big muscle-minded types at the gym don't consider it 'bulky.' The average woman thinks that muscle definition is too 'bulky' and they don't want it. There is nothing wrong with ladies being really strong and defined, but it shouldn't be considered the ideal that all women should strive for just because serious lifters and athletes think it looks good.
Have you asked about her workouts? Or are you at the gym 24/7 and just know she isn't doing it at your gym?
Also...skinny like girls want to be? Really? :laugh:
This. Those "slim legs" won't hold the 140lbs of iron I squat. Pass.
I appreciate that you can squat 140lbs, but that doesn't mean that your body type is more fit or ideal than skinny legs over there, or hers more than yours.
You perfectly illustrate my point that this forum is prejudiced in favor of the strong, defined women type. Lets say I post a pic of one of those cross-fit type ladies you see on youtube. Most on here will say that she's hot, but if that pic is shown to a non-fitness minded crowd, most will say she looks manly, or too muscular.
So your beef is that you prefer not so muscular women? I'm just trying to figure out what you are saying in a thread in which the topic is about progression in weight training.0 -
I like this article. I would like to feel just as proud when I meet a five km run record or demonstrate progress in balance, flexibility and agility as when I beat my dead lift PR. Weight training can help us progress in many areas, including strength. The times i executed a cramp roll turn and a pull back in tap class I considered that fantastic progress! How we measure our progress has to do with our personal goals rather than what someone else thinks our goals ought to be:)0
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Can't we all just get along?0
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Wow, this thread took a turn somewhere for the worse didn't it?
good advice op. I've been playing with these concepts a bit lately, even while eating a deficit. I'm doing some high reps low weight total body work out in the way of body pump, lifting heavy on other days as well, and some endurance cardio some days too. Some days I don't want to do endurance cardio, I only have half an hour. I do some HIIT. Some days I'm feeling lazy so I go for a bike ride and there is nothing wrong with that. Some days I'm anxious and I do a little yoga. When I lift heavy, sometimes I hold longer on the squat, sometimes I work on speed. Sometimes I just try to put myself in as much pain the next day as I can by way of muscle fatigue, and that is fine too.
Someone please go ahead and tell me I'm not doing my body any favors. My body does whatever I ask it to. I ask it to do many different things.
The outcome? I am fitter, stronger, have more endurance, better balance and on and on.
You wouldn't learn anything new by doing the same exercise in school over and over again.
Great article. Thanks for the link. It's given me some ideas on how to mix it up a bit more.0 -
Wow, this thread took a turn somewhere for the worse didn't it?
good advice op. I've been playing with these concepts a bit lately, even while eating a deficit. I'm doing some high reps low weight total body work out in the way of body pump, lifting heavy on other days as well, and some endurance cardio some days too. Some days I don't want to do endurance cardio, I only have half an hour. I do some HIIT. Some days I'm feeling lazy so I go for a bike ride and there is nothing wrong with that. Some days I'm anxious and I do a little yoga. When I lift heavy, sometimes I hold longer on the squat, sometimes I work on speed. Sometimes I just try to put myself in as much pain the next day as I can by way of muscle fatigue, and that is fine too.
Someone please go ahead and tell me I'm not doing my body any favors. My body does whatever I ask it to. I ask it to do many different things.
The outcome? I am fitter, stronger, have more endurance, better balance and on and on.
You wouldn't learn anything new by doing the same exercise in school over and over again.
Great article. Thanks for the link. It's given me some ideas on how to mix it up a bit more.
Thank you for this!0 -
I like this article. I would like to feel just as proud when I meet a five km run record or demonstrate progress in balance, flexibility and agility as when I beat my dead lift PR. Weight training can help us progress in many areas, including strength. The times i executed a cramp roll turn and a pull back in tap class I considered that fantastic progress! How we measure our progress has to do with our personal goals rather than what someone else thinks our goals ought to be:)
:flowerforyou:0 -
Seriously though, I agree to a certain degree with what someone here is saying. I too have read almost nothing but 'lift now, and lift heavy' on loads of boards on here (even before I joined a few lifting groups). Like cardio isn't good for you or at all necessary. Some people might just want to be slim and look like your common or garden celeb, or an athlete on the front of Health and Fitness mag, or just a smaller version of themselves. Not everyone wants to be able to see their own traps or feel their delts or bench 900lbs. I understand nobody is forcing women to lift anything at all, but it does seem to form the majority of the advice I read on this website. Of course it's helpful to getting a leaner, tighter, firmer body but not all women want to look like Serena Willams/Chyna/Jaime Easson. Some just want to look like Kim Kardashian, Beyonce, Kate Beckinsale or Angelina Jolie (ie toned but not necessarily with much muscle definition).
People do need to understand that one size might fit most but it doesn't fit all. I personally do lift, but I love the treadmill as much as anyone can love a treadmill (ie not much), I like doing actual cardio which will come in useful when running for a bus, and actually, maybe Running Woman with the Nice Legs only does cardio. My friend does no weights whatsoever, just runs or skates everywhere. She looks amazing (exactly like the sort of woman you see on the front of Health and Fitness magazine). Probably part genetics, part luck, part hard work, but no part weights. So it is possible to look good without lifting weights.
Anyway apologies if this is slightly off the original topic, or if this topic was in the wrong place in the first place.0 -
Seriously though, I agree to a certain degree with what someone here is saying. I too have read almost nothing but 'lift now, and lift heavy' on loads of boards on here (even before I joined a few lifting groups). Like cardio isn't good for you or at all necessary. Some people might just want to be slim and look like your common or garden celeb, or an athlete on the front of Health and Fitness mag, or just a smaller version of themselves. Not everyone wants to be able to see their own traps or feel their delts or bench 900lbs. I understand nobody is forcing women to lift anything at all, but it does seem to form the majority of the advice I read on this website. Of course it's helpful to getting a leaner, tighter, firmer body but not all women want to look like Serena Willams/Chyna/Jaime Easson. Some just want to look like Kim Kardashian, Beyonce, Kate Beckinsale or Angelina Jolie (ie toned but not necessarily with much muscle definition).
People do need to understand that one size might fit most but it doesn't fit all. I personally do lift, but I love the treadmill as much as anyone can love a treadmill (ie not much), I like doing actual cardio which will come in useful when running for a bus, and actually, maybe Running Woman with the Nice Legs only does cardio. My friend does no weights whatsoever, just runs or skates everywhere. She looks amazing (exactly like the sort of woman you see on the front of Health and Fitness magazine). Probably part genetics, part luck, part hard work, but no part weights. So it is possible to look good without lifting weights.
Anyway apologies if this is slightly off the original topic, or if this topic was in the wrong place in the first place.
To put out there - Angelina Jolie and Kate Beckinsale do include weight training/lifting and that's how they get that "toned" look. :flowerforyou:0 -
No, I actually appreciate the really 'ripped' women too, perhaps more than the skinny minnies, but every time a new girl makes a post on her about not wanting to get bulky there are loads of responses telling her to lift and lift heavy, and she won't get bulky. But really all she wants is to look like the girl I referred to.
Clearly I misunderstood the topic and took the opportunity to get way off track. Apologies to the 'OP' Original Poster? Too much lingo on these forums.
From my time spent on the forums I've mostly seen that heavy lifting is prescribed to women who are frustrated and post things along the lines of "I've been eating at a deficit and running 10 miles every day but my tummy's still flabby, what do I do!?!". They're confused because most women's magazines fill them with lies and tell them that if they run they'll look like a runner (like your lady at the gym), or if they do ballet they'll look like a ballerina, or if they do yoga they'll look like Jennifer Anniston. Whatever. But the truth is the people who are skilled in these fields have body types that suit the needs of that field. Ballet doesn't make a person "long and lean", the people that become ballerinas were already long and lean. It's like saying that if you become a model you'll grow 5 inches.
Anyhoo, my point is that heavy lifting is not the ONLY way to get the body you've always wanted. It's just often a tactic that most women haven't tried yet, and from which most women could greatly benefit.
And frankly, I can understand not wanting to be "bulky", but not wanting to be strong seems so silly to me. I like being able to pick stuff up and move bookshelves around by myself, or carry a heavy backpack, or climb a mountain... the possibilities are endless when you are strong.
OP: thank you for posting this information, and apologies for the deviation off topic!0 -
Thankyou VegasBaby for posting a really interesting and helpful link. Bodyweight strength routines use all of these approaches to good effect and prove that BW is every bit as good as weightlifting for maintaining and increasing strength.
It's a shame that very often, as soon as anyone offers an alternate approach to the mainstream on here they are generally met with the same unfriendly ridicule for no other reason than to put people down. Open your eyes people.0 -
Seriously though, I agree to a certain degree with what someone here is saying. I too have read almost nothing but 'lift now, and lift heavy' on loads of boards on here (even before I joined a few lifting groups). Like cardio isn't good for you or at all necessary. Some people might just want to be slim and look like your common or garden celeb, or an athlete on the front of Health and Fitness mag, or just a smaller version of themselves. Not everyone wants to be able to see their own traps or feel their delts or bench 900lbs. I understand nobody is forcing women to lift anything at all, but it does seem to form the majority of the advice I read on this website. Of course it's helpful to getting a leaner, tighter, firmer body but not all women want to look like Serena Willams/Chyna/Jaime Easson. Some just want to look like Kim Kardashian, Beyonce, Kate Beckinsale or Angelina Jolie (ie toned but not necessarily with much muscle definition).
People do need to understand that one size might fit most but it doesn't fit all. I personally do lift, but I love the treadmill as much as anyone can love a treadmill (ie not much), I like doing actual cardio which will come in useful when running for a bus, and actually, maybe Running Woman with the Nice Legs only does cardio. My friend does no weights whatsoever, just runs or skates everywhere. She looks amazing (exactly like the sort of woman you see on the front of Health and Fitness magazine). Probably part genetics, part luck, part hard work, but no part weights. So it is possible to look good without lifting weights.
Anyway apologies if this is slightly off the original topic, or if this topic was in the wrong place in the first place.
To put out there - Angelina Jolie and Kate Beckinsale do include weight training/lifting and that's how they get that "toned" look. :flowerforyou:
But that doesn't mean they are deadlifting a fire engine every week.0 -
^I agree with this. I've done HIIT and cardio and dance and pilates and yoga and heavy lifting. They all have their benefits. I'd like to get into more bodyweight stuff for convenience since I move around allot. What bothers me are the people who have a goal to try and get lean relatively efficiently and they are getting advice to run around while carrying purse weights...at first I think there well be progress in the LBM department, but then it's going to take a crap ton more effort and there's a point where you'll hit a wall when it comes to progressing. For example, when I do Spartacus (HIIT) there's no way in hell I could increase the weights over 20lbs. But I sure could run up a set of stares without getting winded. But then I was surprised when I couldn't lift heavier and heavier things even though Spartacus (HIIT) was taking the wind out of me. It's great for endurance, it all depends on your goal. Though I do think a lot of people throw the mobility and stability thing out the window when it's more important then I think people realize. I think those things help avoid tweaking various body parts during injuries as much as I think making those parts stronger help.i don't think anyone here argues against progressing but i guess i could be wrong. is there an example somewhere you could link to.
fwiw, all the methods suggested in the article are perfectly acceptable and i use each of them throughout different training periods. but if someone is going to try to do bodyweight squats or 4 lb dumbbells lunges and think TUT or destabilizing or anything else is going to work better than just increasing the weight they are going to be wasting a lot of time.0 -
Seriously though, I agree to a certain degree with what someone here is saying. I too have read almost nothing but 'lift now, and lift heavy' on loads of boards on here (even before I joined a few lifting groups). Like cardio isn't good for you or at all necessary. Some people might just want to be slim and look like your common or garden celeb, or an athlete on the front of Health and Fitness mag, or just a smaller version of themselves. Not everyone wants to be able to see their own traps or feel their delts or bench 900lbs. I understand nobody is forcing women to lift anything at all, but it does seem to form the majority of the advice I read on this website. Of course it's helpful to getting a leaner, tighter, firmer body but not all women want to look like Serena Willams/Chyna/Jaime Easson. Some just want to look like Kim Kardashian, Beyonce, Kate Beckinsale or Angelina Jolie (ie toned but not necessarily with much muscle definition).
People do need to understand that one size might fit most but it doesn't fit all. I personally do lift, but I love the treadmill as much as anyone can love a treadmill (ie not much), I like doing actual cardio which will come in useful when running for a bus, and actually, maybe Running Woman with the Nice Legs only does cardio. My friend does no weights whatsoever, just runs or skates everywhere. She looks amazing (exactly like the sort of woman you see on the front of Health and Fitness magazine). Probably part genetics, part luck, part hard work, but no part weights. So it is possible to look good without lifting weights.
Anyway apologies if this is slightly off the original topic, or if this topic was in the wrong place in the first place.
To put out there - Angelina Jolie and Kate Beckinsale do include weight training/lifting and that's how they get that "toned" look. :flowerforyou:
But that doesn't mean they are deadlifting a fire engine every week.
I dare say that no one here is suggestion anyone dead lift a fire engine, sooo
In fact all anyone ever says is lift heavy for *you* which means heavy for that individual. Heavy for me started with 15lb dumbbell squats, and went from there. No one is saying 'Heavy has to start with squatting your body weight'.0 -
No apologies necessary. I am very happy that the thread has opened some discussion and that, thanks to some great contributions, has gotten back on track :flowerforyou: 0
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i don't think anyone here argues against progressing but i guess i could be wrong. is there an example somewhere you could link to.
fwiw, all the methods suggested in the article are perfectly acceptable and i use each of them throughout different training periods. but if someone is going to try to do bodyweight squats or 4 lb dumbbells lunges and think TUT or destabilizing or anything else is going to work better than just increasing the weight they are going to be wasting a lot of time.
I broadly agree, but I do find introducing destabiliing does help in my specific strength needs because in yoga the balance is nearly always being challenged so using destabilizing movements works better than just increasing the weight. It all depends on what strength you are aiming to buld and what you aim to do with it.0
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