New, Old, and Confused. Warning: May get to be long post

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blooie1
blooie1 Posts: 10 Member
in Getting Started
Okay, I’ve had MFP for a week. Let me start off by saying that I consider myself an intelligent, articulate woman. I just turned 69 years old, I have circulatory and heart issues, and a failed hip replacement, but nothing I haven’t managed thus far. I am moderately overweight, weighing 151 pounds last week when I started MFP and am down to 148.6 pounds now. I haven’t been without my Fitbit for 3 years. I do not now, nor have I ever had, diabetes or high blood pressure. My heart problems are more inherited - I have lived the longest of any of my family. Most were gone by their early 40s. I fight inherited high cholesterol constantly. Whew! Now that that’s out of the way....

I did not get MFP to lose weight. I stay pretty steady, between 151 and 155, although a few months ago I was up to 168. It wouldn’t hurt to shed a few, but I’m not obsessing over it. I got this app because I just learned that I probably have Stage 4 kidney disease, and that scares me more than the heart stents and such. My GFR is 29 and falling, while my creatinine is rising. I just learned this on December 9, so I haven’t fully come to grips with it yet. My GP scheduled me with a nephrologist and I’ll see him on the 31st of this month. I held my sister’s hand when she left this earth after 4 years on dialysis following emergency surgery for a ruptured aortic aneurism. Kidney failure is terrifying me. I know I’m going to be put on a renal diet, but renal diets and cardio diets conflict in many ways. So I decided to get a head start on this major lifestyle change by logging my food, watching fats, cholesterol, proteins, potassium and sodium carefully. Phosphorus, the big kidney risk, isn’t listed for most foods. And I’ll meet with a dietician to see what he/she recommends in terms of following the cardio diet or the renal diet. With my sister it was a balancing act that we never did master.

MFP wants me to consume 1200 calories a day. I can’t. So I changed my calorie goal to 1000 and I can’t hit that, either. Despite my weight numbers, I’m not an eater. Never have been. I don’t like sweets. I can eat maybe half a hamburger (no fries) and I’m full. Today a 4” kids’ turkey sandwich at Subway was too much. My GP and gastroenterologist are aware of this. I have annual endoscopeies and there have been no abnormal findings. I don’t snack. Logging food is easy for me because sometimes there’s breakfast, (but usually just hot tea and a slice of wheat toast) then one thing for lunch, then a light dinner. That’s it! How am I ever going to hit 1000 calories for my health (and I know that’s not set in stone) when I average 790 to 850 calories? I’m not weak....I have an 8 year old Autistic granddaughter with Spina Bifida and I am not only her loving gramma, I’m her day care provider. I have to carry her a lot,band I can toss her wheelchair into the back of a van like I was born to it.

So do I need more calories if I’m still strong and active despite how few I take in? When I’m full, I’m full. I can’t force more in. I tried just grazing on quality foods throughout the day as my gastro recommended, but even half an apple at a time is perfectly satisfying. I’ve done the shake things, but it takes me all day to finish one bottle of Ensure. I’m not asking for medical advice here - my doctors have that covered. I just want to know about this calorie thing. I tried setting my daily goal to 800. MFP didn’t like that. I hit 1000 calories a few days ago, but I was forcing it and miserable. Can MFP even work for me with the combination of renal/cardio foods, or is the apps’ focus so strongly on weight loss that I will be one of the few that simply can’t benefit from it? Help? (I’ll worry about my absolute confusion over adding recipes another time. 🥴)
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  • PAV8888
    PAV8888 Posts: 13,925 Member
    edited January 2020
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    Your calories sound very low. Not sure what is on with that, a registered dietitian and a second chat with your doctor might be able to help.

    You might be able to get a reference to a registered dietitian if you raise the issue that the advice you will have received as a kidney patient comes into conflict with the advice you're receiving as a heart patient (if that's the case).

    MFP's database has several limits. Even with other logging tools and databases which may be more complete I would personally double check any entries I used or make my own given the potential impact of errors.

    I would also consider the potential for water retention in the body and how it may be associated / impacted by the mix of health issues that you have.

    Not all weight is associated with fat and energy reserves and some of the conditions you mention could involve edema and a significant amount of water weight retention. Are you legit top of normal weight/bottom overweight, or is a good part of that edema?

    Is this chronic/expected kidney disease thus already fully explained as to why it is coming about? If your under-eating is as severe as you describe, I would also ask my doctor about other potential reasons for the lab results you got. If your body is breaking down because of chronic under-eating, would your labs look similar, or would they be very different? (genuine question, I don't know the answer)

    Which is why I would urge you to discuss these things with your doctor if you think that any of them might apply to your case.
  • blooie1
    blooie1 Posts: 10 Member
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    Thank you both for taking the time to answer my somewhat unusual question. Fluid retention may well be part of the problem, so I have been on Triamteterne/Hctz tablets for about 5 years now. My potassium runs low, so the trimaterne is the only effecticive medication which is considered a potassium sparing drug. The other diuretics leech potassium out of the body, leading to heart arrhythmias and other problems. I take a prescription potassium medication in addition to that, so watching dietary potassium is critical to maintaining a safe level of potassium in my body.

    I really want to walk into the nephrologist’s office well prepared, able to show him what I eat, when I eat it, and let him see that I do have a grasp on what will be expected of me and a tool to help me be successful. I’m familiar with wet weight/dry weight and mineral loss during dialysis. I helped Linda with meal preparation, shopping, weighing and measuring foods, and when to use her renal diet and when to use the cardio diet when choosing foods and drinks. But we didn’t have an app like this, and I want to be able to use it to its full potential, while understanding that it does have limitations. If nothing else it’s teaching me to log everything that goes into my mouth. While some folks are surprised by how much they are actually eating, my entries don’t contain any surprises. Half an apple, half an orange, half a burger, 1/4 cup Cheerios with a bit of whole milk, spinach salad with cucumbers and tomatoes, roasted squash, roasted asparagus or Brussels sprouts and a small pork chop are not difficut entries to make and fairly common daily meal examples. I don’t even log in that I didn’t eat it all, because I never do, so that might be lunch with the other half my dinner on nights when hubby’s away on Masonic business. I desperately want to find some way to get this app working successfully for me. So I absolutely appreciate any assistance or advice from those of you who are more familiar with it than I am. Maybe down the line we’ll be able to find a way to use MFP as an aid to people in my position - I can’t be the only one but I didn’t see any other posts needing such specialized dietary assistance. Thank you so both much.
  • Maxxitt
    Maxxitt Posts: 1,281 Member
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    Potassium values are often completely missing in the data base and as you've noted, other micronutrients aren't tracked even on food labels, so your nutritionist will be the guide here (and he/she might have a print-out or website with this kind of information that is accessible). What I wanted to address was the appetite issue. If you don't have much of one, nothing is more discouraging than a full plate of food. Planning small but frequent meals seems like the path, and noting what (if anything) actually tastes good. Taste/smell capacity is affected by a number of physical issues and really affects appetite.
  • annliz23
    annliz23 Posts: 3,470 Member
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    Do you have nuts to snack on or seeds am trying those as I have increased my food intake!
  • Diatonic12
    Diatonic12 Posts: 32,344 Member
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    @blooie1 Ooo, blooie1. Much love. From people you don't even know.

    Is it possible that you're retaining water and none of this has anything to do with calories or the amount of food you're eating. Only your doctor knows but I hope you find all of the answers you're looking for. <3
  • blooie1
    blooie1 Posts: 10 Member
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    annliz23 wrote: »
    Do you have nuts to snack on or seeds am trying those as I have increased my food intake!

    I always have access to them, but I don’t care for too many types. Love pecans, Brazil nuts, and peanuts. Hubby always has them around for snacks. But I don’t snack as a rule. I just don’t feel the need to. I’m simply not hungry. I never thought of them as a way to increase appetite! Thanks!
    Go_Deskercise wrote: »
    I have nothing really to add to this but I wanted to say: You sound like such an awesome person with a great sense of humor and attitude :)

    I wish you (and your hubby) nothing but the best!

    Thank you so very much! What a kind thing to read!
    Diatonic12 wrote: »
    @blooie1 Ooo, blooie1. Much love. From people you don't even know.

    Is it possible that you're retaining water and none of this has anything to do with calories or the amount of food you're eating. Only your doctor knows but I hope you find all of the answers you're looking for. <3

    Awww, thank you! Yes, I am probably retaining some fluid, there’s not much doubt. But I’ve been on a diuretic for 5 years now, so any ankle and hand edema have long been a ghost of the past. I can’t take a stronger one because my potassium is always low, and the one I’m on is considered “potassium sparing” because it doesn’t leech out potassium like the others do. I also take 3 prescription potassium pills a day just to keep me at around that 3.4 mark. I have also been on a regimen of self-cathing because of retention. Been doing that for 8 years. That was amusing....I’d been cathing a wiggly newborn with a 4 inch surgical site on her back for weeks (my granddaughter) and the urologist I saw told me it was time for me to think about self-cathing. I told him “I can hit a mark the size of a needle eye with a soda straw on a wiggling target....I’ve got this!” So I don’t doubt that my newly discovered kidney issues have really been a thing that has been creeping up for years. My job now is to deal with it.

    I didn’t intend to turn this into my medical history. I apologize. We all have our own stories and we either deal or we fall apart. I was mostly concerned that if I’m not able to take in a recommended amount of calories, I wasn’t giving myself enough to fight back with and that would come back and bite me in the hiney! And I didn’t realize how critical good caloric intake was, I guess. I eat what I want, as much as I want, and I’m satisfied. But charts don’t see it that way. I really just want to know what the consensus is about how best to use this app in situations like mine where diet will be so restrictive and there’s really no appetite to speak of. You are all helping me a lot, thank you!

  • Diatonic12
    Diatonic12 Posts: 32,344 Member
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    We want nothing but the best for you. Let us know if there's anything we can do. I care.
  • Fuzzipeg
    Fuzzipeg Posts: 2,300 Member
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    I would like to wish you all the very best. It sounds as if you have a good medical team present and lined up to help you with your health issues ones who are well versed in your dietary habits and requirements. I'm sorry you are facing another challenge, one your sister did, together you learned so very much and you sound to be making best use of it now. Dealing with my dietary intolerances I used to keep a paper log for the less usual substances I needed to monitor. I found doing searches for levels timeconsuming but helpful. I'm sure you will receive the best guidance possible to help you balance your seemingly conflicting recommended diets. I used to use lists for both salicylate intolerance and histamine intolerance, these are diametrically oposed low SS usually equalled high histamine and vice versa though the age of food can increase histamine. In the end my safe foods were very few fortunately I found some very helpful people along the way. Seems you have your team too.

    Keep on enjoying your grandaughter, we have been minding 1 ggs 3 days a week, great fun seeing him learn. It can be a real conundrum to achieve better/good health in the first place, being able to enjoy children is the cherry on the cake they are all treasures. All the very best.
  • blooie1
    blooie1 Posts: 10 Member
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    I’m blushing here!!! [Don’t] STOP!! Teehee
  • StocktonSue
    StocktonSue Posts: 8 Member
    edited January 2020
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    I, too, want to wish you (and your hubby) the very best and offer up prayers for your medical condition. Please let us know how your next medical appointment goes. As far as the daily caloric intake, if you are eating balanced, healthy meals and your weight isn't plummeting, I wouldn't worry too much about it and just wait for nutritional guidance from your physicians.
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Do you log what you've eaten by weight and nutrition labels?

    Meaning you are likely eating more than you are logging.

    So while it appears you can't even hit 1000, you are really eating more than that. Still not much probably, but more.

    People do force their bodies to get by on a reduced eating level compared to what the numbers would suggest for healthy level.

    Sadly the body is merely adapting to it, you can't magically support a certain level of body and daily activity on fewer calories, the body merely slows something down.

    Those that practice it purposely are hoping to live longer as a few rat studies show promise with - they hope the body slows down something that causes aging.

    Sadly it will also slows down recovery and repair, immune system functions, and many other things to conserve calories, usually starting with just daily movement type things many rarely notice until they eat more and start moving more and feel the extra energy. And attempting to lose fat weight in such a state is to say the least, very interesting, because how low can you go before nutrition and body rebelling occurs.

    That could easily be part of it.
  • blooie1
    blooie1 Posts: 10 Member
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    And BAM!! Another light bulb gets turned on here! Okay, so I’m a nice old lady but not always the brightest crayon in the box! I’ve been doing a bit more board-perusing and had a “Duh, Blooie” moment. Bear with me while I try to sort it out. I’ll use being new as my excuse for not quite getting it all yet. Works for me!

    So let’s look at yesterday for an example. I took in in 841 calories. But I’m also doing my light cardio exercises that I’ve been doing since my mild heart attack in Feb 2016, as recommended by my cardiologist and cardio-therapist. So let’s say between that and housework (and lifts, getting Kendra in and out of places), my adjustment for exercise is 71. By “eating that back”, does that mean I am supposed to take in another 71 calories in addition to making up the deficit between 1000 and 841?
  • Go_Deskercise
    Go_Deskercise Posts: 1,630 Member
    edited January 2020
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    Can you maybe let others view your diary so they can help?

    https://support.myfitnesspal.com/hc/en-us/articles/360032273872-How-do-I-make-my-diary-visible-to-other-users-
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    blooie1 wrote: »
    And BAM!! Another light bulb gets turned on here! Okay, so I’m a nice old lady but not always the brightest crayon in the box! I’ve been doing a bit more board-perusing and had a “Duh, Blooie” moment. Bear with me while I try to sort it out. I’ll use being new as my excuse for not quite getting it all yet. Works for me!

    So let’s look at yesterday for an example. I took in in 841 calories. But I’m also doing my light cardio exercises that I’ve been doing since my mild heart attack in Feb 2016, as recommended by my cardiologist and cardio-therapist. So let’s say between that and housework (and lifts, getting Kendra in and out of places), my adjustment for exercise is 71. By “eating that back”, does that mean I am supposed to take in another 71 calories in addition to making up the deficit between 1000 and 841?

    That is the idea yes.

    You pick an activity level that should be correct match to what you do. Likely Lightly-Active for you from your description.

    You take a reasonable deficit for amount to lose - 1/2 lb weekly in your case.

    That base eating level given covers ONLY your daily activity with hopefully a reasonable level of calories to get in nutrition to cause body NOT to rebel but only lose fat. Some bodies are already under stress and reasonable can mean different things.

    But then when you do more than daily activity you accounted for - you eat more.
    Of course when you do less you'd eat less too - that's usually the direction that causes people problems.
    And the amount of deficit remains the same. Or if maintaining you eat around what you burned.

    So indeed if the exercise burned 71 calories, you'd eat that back over the base goal. Which you have yet to reach too.
    Maybe, depending on logging accuracy.

    How fast of weight loss did you select?
    What activity level did you select?
  • blooie1
    blooie1 Posts: 10 Member
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    Here’s the thing. I’m NOT even trying to lose weight. The only reason there is a number there under “goals” is because it asked for one. I’m perfectly happy right where I am, given a few pound fluctuation from time to time. So weight loss is absolutely not my priority. Maybe I should edit that weight goal to reflect my current weight and leave it right there, but I figured if I was going to be logging everything and using the app anyway it wouldn’t hurt to drop a couple of pounds, but it’s not critical to me.

    My main goal is to merge a safe - I emphasize safe - renal diet with the cardio diet I need. This is not “diet” in the weight loss sense - it’s diet as in restricted foods, foods to eat more of, sodium, potassium and phosphorus numbers. The calorie thing just sort of came up as a big red flag when I tried to complete my daily diary and got a message that I didn’t have enough calories, which is why I came here to ask. I was fine - have been fine with the small amounts I eat for years. If anything I may well be even more “under” because while I log what I eat, I rarely finish it all. Hubby likes McDonald’s crispy chicken sandwiches if we’re down in Cody. I’ll sometimes order one for lunch too. I eat maybe half. I bring the other half home and eat that for dinner. No fries, no shakes, no pop. The nearest fast food joint here is a 25 mile drive one way. The nearest McDonald’s is 50 miles one way. So we aren’t fast food eaters by nature. But until just recently I didn’t have a scale (which I do now) so I had no way to enter half a sandwich.

    I don’t see how I can be eating more than I think. I’m not a nibbler or a snacker, although I’ve been making a more conscious effort to fit in an orange, an apple, or a packet of a snack cheese and a couple of crackers now that I understand that my calorie count is considered too low. I had trouble figuring out this recipe thing - still do - but I’ll get it. Some days I don’t eat lunch or dinner at all. I’m not hungry and forcing myself to eat just doesn’t work. Every single thing that I have eaten has been logged, using the bar codes whenever possible. I can’t cheat on logging - I want and need to know where I am for those macros I mentioned. I can’t be honest with my doctor by being dishonest with myself.

    My activity level is set to “light”. I’m 69 years old and the parts that still work usually hurt when they’re doing it. <shrug>. That doesn’t mean I’m sedintary. I take care of my disabled granddaughter, which involves a lot of up-and-down on the floor, lifting, carrying, and wheelchair-ing. At 8 years old, she’s heavy for an old lady, but we get it done! My house has to be clean because she gets around inside mostly by crawling. If it’s on the floor, it’s on the hands and knees. So “light to moderate housework” figures into my daily activities.

    I don’t know about making my profile visible. Is that something a lot of people do here? I’m still pretty new do I don’t know yet what the usual practice is. I can see where it would help others help me, but what’s the norm?
  • Go_Deskercise
    Go_Deskercise Posts: 1,630 Member
    edited January 2020
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    blooie1 wrote: »
    I don’t know about making my profile visible. Is that something a lot of people do here? I’m still pretty new do I don’t know yet what the usual practice is. I can see where it would help others help me, but what’s the norm?

    Your profile wouldn't be visible to others unless you accept them as friends if it's set to private, just your diary of food would be visible. You can make your diary visible to ONLY your friends on here. Sometimes is easier for people to look at your diary of food and see if there are any logging errors that they can help you with but it is completely up to you what you do on here :)
  • annliz23
    annliz23 Posts: 3,470 Member
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    Sometimes by adding friends too you can see what they are eating too and the exercises they are doing it has helped me, good luck.

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