Can you eat out and not gain?
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thelastnightingale
Posts: 725 Member
This is hypothetical, because I don't plan to eat out again anytime soon. But it got me thinking.
Right now, my calorie allowance is 1,200, which I typically split evenly - 400 for breakfast, 400 for lunch and 400 for dinner. Maintenance is 1,900. If I up my dinner allowance to include maintenance, that gives me 1,100 calories. How do you eat out on 1,100 calories?
Is the whole point that you can't, and you need to reduce your intake on other days to compensate, so if you're eating out a lot, you're always going to gain weight?
Taking a chain burger joint as an example:
Cheeseburger = 835
Fries = 415
Total = 1,250 with no sauce, no drink and only one course. That's over 1,100. And of course, the more I lose, the more maintenance reduces. So the equation gets even harder to balance with time.
I used to live exclusively off takeaways and restaurant food. I've weaned myself off the takeaways by getting back into cooking during lockdown, but now I'm thinking about coping strategies when l go back into the real world.
I certainly don't have the energy to exercise in the morning, do a long day in the office and then go for a meal with friends or clients. Which makes me think that eating out is kinda unsustainable unless it's once in a blue moon.
Oh, this really is a lifestyle overhaul. I can't go back to regular dining out, can I?
What do you all do?
Right now, my calorie allowance is 1,200, which I typically split evenly - 400 for breakfast, 400 for lunch and 400 for dinner. Maintenance is 1,900. If I up my dinner allowance to include maintenance, that gives me 1,100 calories. How do you eat out on 1,100 calories?
Is the whole point that you can't, and you need to reduce your intake on other days to compensate, so if you're eating out a lot, you're always going to gain weight?
Taking a chain burger joint as an example:
Cheeseburger = 835
Fries = 415
Total = 1,250 with no sauce, no drink and only one course. That's over 1,100. And of course, the more I lose, the more maintenance reduces. So the equation gets even harder to balance with time.
I used to live exclusively off takeaways and restaurant food. I've weaned myself off the takeaways by getting back into cooking during lockdown, but now I'm thinking about coping strategies when l go back into the real world.
I certainly don't have the energy to exercise in the morning, do a long day in the office and then go for a meal with friends or clients. Which makes me think that eating out is kinda unsustainable unless it's once in a blue moon.
Oh, this really is a lifestyle overhaul. I can't go back to regular dining out, can I?
What do you all do?
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Replies
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I rarely eat at restaurants even when there isn't a highly contagious pandemic going on.
But, when I do (I do kind of miss fish and chips = 1300 calories) I just don't do it often. If it was necessary to go out on a regular basis, I'd have to special order. Like, "No dressing, no sauce, just meat and vegetables." I mean yeah, it's hard to fit in burgers and fries regularly if you don't have an active lifestyle and you aren't willing to exercise.6 -
cmriverside wrote: »I rarely eat at restaurants even when there isn't a highly contagious pandemic going on.
But, when I do (I do kind of miss fish and chips = 1300 calories) I just don't do it often. If it was necessary to go out on a regular basis, I'd have to special order. Like, "No dressing, no sauce, just meat and vegetables." I mean yeah, it's hard to fit in burgers and fries regularly if you don't have an active lifestyle and you aren't willing to exercise.
It's more my job doesn't really allow me to exercise during the week. The hours can be really long, and it just takes it out of me. My whole approach to weight loss has been about the numbers, and having thought about the numbers now, I just don't see how I can go back to my old lifestyle at all. I mean, I can fit in some exercise at the weekend if I'm feeling committed, but one run isn't going to undo multiple meals out during the week.
I've been looking at menus (TBH, it's really hard to find examples with nutritional info, hence picking a burger chain, it was one of the few places that disclosed calories) and having spent the last few months making my own food from scratch, everything other people make just seems to have more oil/fat than it needs to.
I love eating food and getting together with friends to eat food, but I feel like my social life needs as much of a change as my diet... The penny is only just dropping for me. It's not just my habits to food that need to change, it's the way I interact with people. Ugh.2 -
I've been maintaining for several years.
I eat out occasionally, but not on a regular basis. If you did want to eat out regularly, you could definitely do it, you'd just have to be more aware of your choices. If you go out multiple times a week, maybe you couldn't get the burger, fries, drinks, sauces, and desserts EVERY time you go out. Maybe you'd have to choose lean meats, more vegetables, less creamy sauces, and no-calorie drinks sometimes to keep your calorie count reasonable.
You can also "bank" calories on some days to account for higher-calorie days. I do this...I eat at a slight deficit Monday through Friday, and then eat over my maintenance calories on the weekend. That gives me the options of going out, having a few drinks, etc, without gaining weight. If you're planning a big night out, this could work for you. Just keep track of your weekly calorie total instead of eating the exact same amount every day. As long as it all averages out to your maintenance level, you're fine.6 -
Yes one can eat out and still lose weight. BUT that means you have to put some thought into what you order, how much you eat, and how often you do that sort of thing.
I ate lunch out last weekend w/ hubby and daughter. I had 3 grilled shrimp tacos and a limited # of tortilla chips with salsa. The easiest part: salsa. Its so low in calories that its not really an issue. I limited myself to 7 chips which for me is AMAZING. Compared to what I know of eyeballing it, I figured that was about 1/2 an ounce of chips for about 70 calories. I estimated the shrimp tacos at 560 based on a similarly sounding diary entry for grilled shrimp tacos, as this was a small chain and nutrition info not provided.
I did not eat breakfast that day as I slept in. I did get in a good walk on the treadmill in addition to normal weekend errands and a few trips walking back & forth between my house & a neighbor's house that day. I had TIGHT control of my dinner and even opted to have a few alcoholic beverages. It was a more active day than usual for me (12k steps compared to my normal of about 6-7k) so I also burned more. If not, then I would not have had the drinks.
In general for eating out: try to do some planning/research ahead of time to know what you intend to order. Block the calories into your day (prelog/preplan) so you'll know to make adjustments on other meals if needed.3 -
Ps-the chain burger joint would not be worth it for me, personally. I can make a burger at home, be more in control over the # of calories, and enjoy it for much less $. Eating out would mean food I can't easily make at home.
I passed up on a work lunch today at a local/small Asian themed place. Not worth the $ and calorie cost to me, especially since that would have been pretty tough to estimate accurately. At least for my shrimp tacos I could kind of deconstruct the contents and later look up data to see if my logging was probably close or not.
Seems like a lifetime ago but my go-tos for eating out... Stick to major established chains w/ nutrition provided. Can't be certain its 100% accurate but it is a starting point. Chicken, fish dishes where the entree is grilled rather than fried. Avoid glazes/sauces ON the food. If I have the bread, I limit it to 1 roll or 1 slice. (I could easily eat so much more!!) I normally would do veggies rather than a potato. AGain, the potato is something I can have at home and be in control of the calorie content AND use spray on low cal 'butter'.3 -
I rarely eat out because that has always been the case, but I do eat pretty high calorie meals at home sometimes. I don't find eating out or having a high calorie meal hard if I don't do it daily. I have a few options or a combination of options, whichever feels right that day.
- Bank calories. I keep a monthly spreadsheet of my calories. Sometimes I find I unintentionally accumulated enough calories to splurge, or I make a conscious effort to eat a little bit less or move a little bit more for a few days if I don't have enough extra.
- Move more that day to earn more calories
- Skip a meal
- Make my other meals much lighter
- Eat at maintenance
- Pick something lighter if a lighter option appeals to me
- Eat half and save half (and load up on veggies)
- Order a coffee and enjoy the company. I hate standing out or being "the dieting person", so I only use this option if I genuinely don't feel the meal is worth it that day, and since I do eat normally other times, people don't think much of it if I occasionally don't feel like it.
- Just eat and call it a day if it's very occasional
With that said, some people can afford to eat out often or even daily and pick higher calorie options without gaining. They're just more active and/or larger, like to skip meals, or just don't eat all that much for other meals.2 -
I typically don't eat out or get take-out very often. I would say at most once or every other week. Sometimes once a month. However hypothetically I could probably eat out daily by calorie cycling and balancing my calories for the day. I do have a very high allowance and my current dinners are usually average 1200-1500 cals . Now when I do eat out I tend to go for lighter options, grilled vs fried, baked vs crisped, fish, salads, seafood, lighter pasta, not as much wine, share dessert. If I were going to go crazy and eat everything and go for heavy fried dishes and huge portions then ya I guess that wouldn't be an option but there is no way I could do that daily anyhow as I would start to feel terrible.
You could try to calorie bank as mentioned, eat less that day to save for the one meal or go out less often or keep in mind that a small overage as long as you get back on track after will not lead to gain over time. Maintenance is a range so you might be up a few lbs here then the next few weeks down again. You might find extra calories might help you move more to balance out or increase your workout calorie burn. Or it could make you feel sluggish and burn less. Just make sure you don't let it slowly creep up and up and up and spiral out control over time.
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I usually travel for work and I eat out a lot- sometimes with clients and sometimes just alone. That said I am very careful and volume eat salads, no dressing/cheese/croutons, and order a small steak or chicken breast with it for dinner. (NOT a fish fan unfortunately) I also take food with me when I drive regionally or hit the grocery store if I fly- I buy my normal snacks like cheese sticks and celery, yogurt, etc. and eat that. I also always take my protein powder and can add it to coffee or water. I HAVE to plan ahead- when I don’t have a solid plan it is so easy to just say *kitten* it. When having working dinners I avoid the alcohol that seems to flow and stick to water or tea- usually is easy to say I have work to do when I get back to the hotel, etc.3
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I can find options at a number of fast food places that fit into my calorie goal. (I'd have more trouble doing it for every single meal every day, while getting adequate protein, but that's primarily because I'm vegetarian, so not so many calorie-efficient protein choices at fast food joints).
Most fast-food places will let you add & delete ingredients. Sometimes losing the cheese or mayo or something makes a meaningful calorie difference, for example.
Examples things I'd eat, for lunch or dinner, as a vegetarian eating at one of these places (if I have to
).
Subway: Chopped salad with guac & vinegar, and a protein (for me, usually eggs - I don't love their veggie patties).
Taco Bell: Veggie power bowl, minus rice, plus extra black beans.
McDonalds: Egg muffin (no meat), double egg.
Wendy's: Sour cream & chive baked potato, side salad.
I wouldn't like to eat those things all the time, but I enjoy them when I eat them now & then (some more than others).
At sit-down restaurants, I look at the menu online ahead (almost always available at user-review sites in photos even if not on the restaurant's site, IME) so I don't have to order spur of the moment, often take half home for another meal, and realize that these places, too, will often leave things off, serve sauces/dressings on the side, sometimes even use a different cooking method (grill or broil instead of fry, for example), or let you make a plate of side veggies plus a simple protein (beef patty, hard-boiled eggs, non-fried fish or chicken, cottage cheese - depending on what they have on hand). About the worst that can happen if you ask politely is that they'll say "no".
I typically drink unsweetened iced tea, water, hot tea, or skim latte (no sugar/flavor), depending on place and meal.
Maybe this seems like suffering or sacrificing, to you. It doesn't, to me. For sure, once in a while, I do have a more indulgent or celebratory meal, with bigger calories, that will require balancing out somehow in with my regular routine. But I perceive you to have been asking about routine meals at restaurants, not exceptional ones.
At Wendy's a junior cheeseburger is around 290 calories, smallest fries 250ish. Does smaller you need the big cheeseburger, *plus* the big fries, every time?
Mostly, one needs to think about food and menus a little differently, not just order what one always ordered (because we know what the result of that was, right? ) 3 -
The Short answer is Yes.
The long answer- as with everything it requires a plan. You can't go into the restaurant and freestyle. You have to decide where you're going, look at the menu and nutritional value, and plan what you will be ordering accordingly.
Along with this you can't just go out to eat because you're tired. It has to be part of the daily plan, so you can adjust breakfast and lunch accordingly.
I think from time to time it is good to go out to eat if it's something you like to do. It's okay to give yourself some grace if you know it won't derail you down a bad path. At least for me I know if I'm craving something from a restaurant it's okay to have it as long as it's not an everyday thing.
If it's an eat out everyday thing then that's when the special orders have to come in and modifying to fit in your goals.2 -
When I first came to the platform in 2012 I was working in a position with 80%+ travel which meant I was eating out at least four full days 3-4 weeks each month while away and then usually another few meals when home with my fiance, with whom I did not live at the time, and was still successful losing weight. I sporadically travel for work but my go-to's are Chick-Fil-A and Chipotle but can usually make do elsewhere if I have to. Prioritize protein, grilled>fried, etc.
Additionally, depending on how much you have to lose, 1200/day might be too aggressive of a loss rate for optimal sustainability, especially since you're seeking flexibility with eating out. Everyone always wants to lose as quickly as possible but losing 1 lb/week easily and sustainably might be a better option for you and your lifestyle. You are correct that your maintenance calories will drop as you lose weight but the difference between a 5'6" Woman at 185 and 135 (assumptions based on your other posts for where you are now for BMI) is only about 270 calories.
For reference, these are the commonly referenced guidelines for appropriate loss rate based on weight-to-lose ranges
If you have 75+ lbs to lose 2 lbs/week is ideal
If you have 40-75 lbs to lose 1.5 lbs/week is ideal
If you have 25-40 lbs to lose 1 lb/week is ideal
If you have 15-25 lbs to lose 0.5 to 1.0 lb/week is ideal
If you have less than 15 lbs to lose 0.5 lb/week is ideal1 -
thelastnightingale wrote: »This is hypothetical, because I don't plan to eat out again anytime soon. But it got me thinking.
Right now, my calorie allowance is 1,200, which I typically split evenly - 400 for breakfast, 400 for lunch and 400 for dinner. Maintenance is 1,900. If I up my dinner allowance to include maintenance, that gives me 1,100 calories. How do you eat out on 1,100 calories?cmriverside wrote: »I rarely eat at restaurants even when there isn't a highly contagious pandemic going on.
But, when I do (I do kind of miss fish and chips = 1300 calories) I just don't do it often. If it was necessary to go out on a regular basis, I'd have to special order. Like, "No dressing, no sauce, just meat and vegetables." I mean yeah, it's hard to fit in burgers and fries regularly if you don't have an active lifestyle and you aren't willing to exercise.
or even if you do and you're small and/or not an endurance athlete. (I've explained the math a few times to some of my larger-male fellow athletes when they were puzzled by my not getting the burger and fries.. needless to say most were surprised to learn [1] what that run we just did actually burned for someone of various weights, and [2] the typical calorie content of a plate of burger and fries). (and no, I promise you that slowly eating only 1/3 of it is so not an option that's going to happen in times of runger).
I DO go out regularly with my Monday night riding group (its something I look forward to). By my estimates, a 30 mile ride burns JUST enough to get an order of salt & vinegar chicken wings and a hard cider when added to the calories of the existing meal slot (and deducting off the Mini Clif bar/fruit snacks at ~mile 20).
I have formed the habit of ordering a diet soda or sparkling water when done with my beer/hard cider..it keeps me from ordering another drink or perusing the dessert menu.thelastnightingale wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I rarely eat at restaurants even when there isn't a highly contagious pandemic going on.
But, when I do (I do kind of miss fish and chips = 1300 calories) I just don't do it often. If it was necessary to go out on a regular basis, I'd have to special order. Like, "No dressing, no sauce, just meat and vegetables." I mean yeah, it's hard to fit in burgers and fries regularly if you don't have an active lifestyle and you aren't willing to exercise.
I've been looking at menus (TBH, it's really hard to find examples with nutritional info, hence picking a burger chain, it was one of the few places that disclosed calories) and having spent the last few months making my own food from scratch, everything other people make just seems to have more oil/fat than it needs to.
Yep.
Case in point: a band I love was playing an inn during dinner yesterday. I ordered the salmon. It was amazing..but.. much of that was due to the absolutely perfect crispy skin underneath (which meant it was cooked with A LOT of oil). It was amazing to get to dance again (outside, at least 6' away from any neighboring tables, and with masks on), however, with the COVID restrictions, one has to make reservations (rather than just hanging at the bar and getting a drink or 2) - which meant having to order dinner (and spend reasonably enough to not feel guilty tying up a table during a period of lowered occupancy). (Alas, timing meant I only managed a 10 mile ride & some tango to offset a miniscule portion of it).thelastnightingale wrote: »I love eating food and getting together with friends to eat food, but I feel like my social life needs as much of a change as my diet... The penny is only just dropping for me. It's not just my habits to food that need to change, it's the way I interact with people. Ugh.
This is a hard one. If much of your social circle is of the 'get-together-and-eat-as-a-hobby' type, then it can be hard to adjust around it. I've found I have largely lost touch with a lot of my sedentary acquaintances.
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I appreciate all the comments.Mostly, one needs to think about food and menus a little differently, not just order what one always ordered (because we know what the result of that was, right? )Along with this you can't just go out to eat because you're tired.This is a hard one. If much of your social circle is of the 'get-together-and-eat-as-a-hobby' type, then it can be hard to adjust around it. I've found I have largely lost touch with a lot of my sedentary acquaintances.
I think the above three points are the most damning, and perhaps the most astute. I've always seen going out for a meal after work as a way to fit in a catch up with a friend (I'm very time poor) whilst refuelling (so killing two birds with one stone), but this is just going to make me fat again.
My friends and I tend to get together and eat, but most of them are fairly skinny because they enjoy exercise, so they fit that in when we're not socialising together. My heart is sinking a little at the prospect of having to fall in love with exercise in order to keep up. I don't love it. Ugh. Maybe I'll find it easier/more enjoyable when I'm lighter.
On the plus side, I have time to reflect on today's revelation and make my peace with it. I guess what I'm looking at long-term is calorie banking and some pretty intensive exercise on my non-work days. Or I need to find new friends who don't like eating so much.
You know, I think this is going to be the hardest lifestyle change so far. I thought I'd done a really good job, with learning to cook healthier food at home and make normal portions for myself, but I think that was the easy part. Getting back into the real world where I have no idea how many calories the chef has put into the meal, and where my friends like to order two or three courses - I need to do some serious planning/thinking. There's a lot more work to be done.
Thank you all, as always. Sometimes you need to sound things out.4 -
Pre-Covid, I usually ate out at least 6 times a month and nutritional info is rarely available here. I did lots of playing around with numbers, studying menus, plugging meals in to MFP (best guess basis) to determine which were my best options. I'd keep a list in my diary and stick to choices that seemed the best fit depending on how many cals I had left for that evening. Soup starters, grilled meats or fish, salads with no dressing as a side and not eating all the rice or potatoes on my plate were useful guidelines to go by if I went to an unfamiliar restaurant. Some days would definitely end up more calorific than others but, as this wasn't a daily occurrence (or even a weekly one), I didn't worry about it. The overall impact to my end goal was that the extra cals would delay me reaching goal by a week or whatever.
If / when you find life returning to normal, I'd definitely consider slowing your rate of weight loss down; a smaller deficit would give you more cals. Going slower is often considered better and the idea isn't to torture yourself.
I'm maintaining on 1340 cals - I was losing, very very slowly, on 1200 - so I appreciate your problem. Some days I'm over with my cals, some days I'm a little under and some days I'm quite a bit under, especially if I do a long walk in the evening and hadn't factored it in in advance - but my weekly net average is usually pretty close to 1340.
Could you reduce your breakfast and lunchtime calories? That would leave more for dinner. Or you could just have lighter meals on the days that you're not eating out. Quite a few people don't worry too much about their daily number but focus on their weekly average (available via the app).2 -
This is why I run, well not the entire I reason I run but I enjoy food. I enjoy going out to eat. Living a more active lifestyle allows me to lose weight and still get to enjoy those parts of life. I usually plan what I’m going to eat in advance so I can plan out my day accordingly but I haven’t had to cut it out of my life.
I didn’t use to run or exercise at all. I always thought I didn’t have the time or energy but my life is a lot better when I’m more active.2 -
If your maintenance is 1900 and you're eating 1200 cals per day, that means your weekly deficit is 4900 cals, or 1.4lbs per week. If you allow yourself a maintenance day every week to allow for a restaurant meal, your weekly deficit would be 4200 cals per week, or 1.2 lbs per week. You could even allow another 500 cals on your restaurant day and still be in a 3700 cal deficit, or 1.06lbs per week.
So not only can you eat out and not gain, you can eat out and lose at a perfectly acceptable pace.
I get takeaway at least once, sometimes two or three times per week. You don't have to get sad food when you eat out, but you do have to make smart choices. Don't mindlessly waste calories on all the extra stuff, save it for the yummy food you really want. Checking out the menu ahead of time can really help - choose something that fits whatever calories you'll allow that sounds yummy while you aren't distracted by the smells and conversations and then stick to it once you're there and ordering.
Becoming generally more active during the day and adding an occasional short brisk walk can add a meaningful couple hundred calories to your day. You don't have to run yourself into the ground, just move more. I find occasional short brisk walks are energizing, not tiring. Maybe someone can post the thread about how to increase your NEAT, getting that daily habitual calorie burn up was one of the smartest things I ever did. Over the course of a year I got my non exercise maintenance cals up from barely 1600 to over 1700, and with exercise on the day's I can swing it I can eat what used to be my maintenance calories and lose half-a-lb per week. Goals 3 -
Yes, you can! I eat restaurant food about once a week. I usually choose from about 3 or 4 restaurants that I know well enough that I can go to that reasonable choices. I am short and normally keep my calories max at 1300 most days. I do go sometimes over my 1300 on days I eat out but still keep it pretty close. I eat drink water or coffee with my meal, and when the food comes I immediately ask for a to-go-box and eat only half of my meal. I eat slowly and concentrate on enjoying my dinner and dinner companions. I usually take my leftovers to work the next day. They taste good and I don't have to pack a lunch that day!0
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If your maintenance is 1900 and you're eating 1200 cals per day, that means your weekly deficit is 4900 cals, or 1.4lbs per week. If you allow yourself a maintenance day every week to allow for a restaurant meal, your weekly deficit would be 4200 cals per week, or 1.2 lbs per week. You could even allow another 500 cals on your restaurant day and still be in a 3700 cal deficit, or 1.06lbs per week.
So not only can you eat out and not gain, you can eat out and lose at a perfectly acceptable pace.
I get takeaway at least once, sometimes two or three times per week. You don't have to get sad food when you eat out, but you do have to make smart choices. Don't mindlessly waste calories on all the extra stuff, save it for the yummy food you really want. Checking out the menu ahead of time can really help - choose something that fits whatever calories you'll allow that sounds yummy while you aren't distracted by the smells and conversations and then stick to it once you're there and ordering.
Becoming generally more active during the day and adding an occasional short brisk walk can add a meaningful couple hundred calories to your day. You don't have to run yourself into the ground, just move more. I find occasional short brisk walks are energizing, not tiring. Maybe someone can post the thread about how to increase your NEAT, getting that daily habitual calorie burn up was one of the smartest things I ever did. Over the course of a year I got my non exercise maintenance cals up from barely 1600 to over 1700, and with exercise on the day's I can swing it I can eat what used to be my maintenance calories and lose half-a-lb per week. Goals
Like this one?
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10610953/neat-improvement-strategies-to-improve-weight-loss/p1 1 -
I have to plan ahead to eat out usually. My go to is Moes burrito bowl, with a side of chips its about 700 calories. Panera isn't bad just a lot of sodium. I try to go places that I know will fill me up.0
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If your maintenance is 1900 and you're eating 1200 cals per day, that means your weekly deficit is 4900 cals, or 1.4lbs per week. If you allow yourself a maintenance day every week to allow for a restaurant meal, your weekly deficit would be 4200 cals per week, or 1.2 lbs per week. You could even allow another 500 cals on your restaurant day and still be in a 3700 cal deficit, or 1.06lbs per week.
So not only can you eat out and not gain, you can eat out and lose at a perfectly acceptable pace.
I get takeaway at least once, sometimes two or three times per week. You don't have to get sad food when you eat out, but you do have to make smart choices. Don't mindlessly waste calories on all the extra stuff, save it for the yummy food you really want. Checking out the menu ahead of time can really help - choose something that fits whatever calories you'll allow that sounds yummy while you aren't distracted by the smells and conversations and then stick to it once you're there and ordering.
Becoming generally more active during the day and adding an occasional short brisk walk can add a meaningful couple hundred calories to your day. You don't have to run yourself into the ground, just move more. I find occasional short brisk walks are energizing, not tiring. Maybe someone can post the thread about how to increase your NEAT, getting that daily habitual calorie burn up was one of the smartest things I ever did. Over the course of a year I got my non exercise maintenance cals up from barely 1600 to over 1700, and with exercise on the day's I can swing it I can eat what used to be my maintenance calories and lose half-a-lb per week. Goals
Like this one?
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10610953/neat-improvement-strategies-to-improve-weight-loss/p1
Thank you :drinker:1
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