Higher Protein than Fat on Low-Carb Days?

skeletalplatypi
skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
in Food and Nutrition
I flip between high-carb/low-fat days and low-carb/high-fat days. But I've been having an issue where I tend to have more protein than fats on my low-carb/high-fat days. Is that going to cause problems with my cycling?
I'm trying to get better at upping my fats without upping my protein intake, too, but it's so hard for some reason.

Replies

  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    I flip between high-carb/low-fat days and low-carb/high-fat days. But I've been having an issue where I tend to have more protein than fats on my low-carb/high-fat days. Is that going to cause problems with my cycling?
    I'm trying to get better at upping my fats without upping my protein intake, too, but it's so hard for some reason.

    What is it that you're actually trying to achieve with this? If it's some version of cyclical keto, it's the low carb bit that's important. You're actually far better off maximising protein than fats.

    I'm going to tag @psuLemon in here, he has more experience/knowledge with cyclical stuff.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    First, i would agree with @Nony_Mouse with protein being the most important thing, especially while dieting. But we need more information on what your goals are. And what you are trying to achieve.
  • skeletalplatypi
    skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    I flip between high-carb/low-fat days and low-carb/high-fat days. But I've been having an issue where I tend to have more protein than fats on my low-carb/high-fat days. Is that going to cause problems with my cycling?
    I'm trying to get better at upping my fats without upping my protein intake, too, but it's so hard for some reason.

    What is it that you're actually trying to achieve with this? If it's some version of cyclical keto, it's the low carb bit that's important. You're actually far better off maximising protein than fats.

    I'm going to tag @psuLemon in here, he has more experience/knowledge with cyclical stuff.

    Honestly, I'm not really sure. I feel awful if I don't eat carbs, so I was kind of hoping to just reduce it to really low a couple of times a week to see if it helped at all. But everything I read said to keep your fat content high on those days and protein in the mid-range, but my protein is always high on those days.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    I flip between high-carb/low-fat days and low-carb/high-fat days. But I've been having an issue where I tend to have more protein than fats on my low-carb/high-fat days. Is that going to cause problems with my cycling?
    I'm trying to get better at upping my fats without upping my protein intake, too, but it's so hard for some reason.

    What is it that you're actually trying to achieve with this? If it's some version of cyclical keto, it's the low carb bit that's important. You're actually far better off maximising protein than fats.

    I'm going to tag @psuLemon in here, he has more experience/knowledge with cyclical stuff.

    Honestly, I'm not really sure. I feel awful if I don't eat carbs, so I was kind of hoping to just reduce it to really low a couple of times a week to see if it helped at all. But everything I read said to keep your fat content high on those days and protein in the mid-range, but my protein is always high on those days.

    If carbs help your performance, then why are you cutting them?

    Let's take a step back. What are your goals? Weight loss, performance, muscle gains, etc?
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    Okay, it's sounding like you may have fallen down a woo (misinformation) rabbit hole.

    When you say 'see if it helped at all', what is it you're wanting it to help?
  • skeletalplatypi
    skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
    Weight loss is my goal, plus muscle building. I do high intensity cardio 3 times a week and then muscle group focus twice a week, using my weekends for walk/yoga/rest. So I have been doing high-carb/low-fat on my cardio days and low-carb/high-fat on my muscle group days. Weekends are mid-range, just shooting for mid-carb.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    Thanks for getting back to us. First, weight loss will come from a deficit, not so much carbs. I run a targeted ketogenic diet (TKD) for the appetite suppressing capabilities. I time 30g of carbs (gummy bears, jelly beans, etc..) around my workout for the insulin spike (prevents protein breakdown) and increase glycogen capacity.

    Having said that, I would keep it simple. I would probably run a higher protein number (about .8-1.2g/lb) and then put fats/carbs around where you feel comfortable. Running a cyclical diet is often too advanced for people newer to this game. I generally reserve that style of training for intermediate and advanced lifters.

    Next, if your goal is muscle gains, the thing that you should focus on is a solid progressive overload lifting program. If you are new, I would get on a structured routine like one of the ones in the link below.

    Do you have any focus areas (i.e., glutes or general muscle gains)? Most women prefer stuff like StorngCurves, NROL4W, TLS or something like Stephanie Buttermores programs.

    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
  • skeletalplatypi
    skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
    Okay, thank you very much for the response!

    I am a rock climber, so I would like overall muscle gains. My muscle focus days have been specifically arms/shoulders/back/core. With my cardio days, I get a lot of work on my legs, so those have been toning pretty well. I'm just wanting to see more of the fat come off. My core and arms seem to be holding onto it. I don't feel like I'm really seeing progress in that arena. I'm not sure if that's due to the diet or just not being on the right exercise program.

    Thank you for the links! I will absolutely check them out.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    Agreeing with what Psu said, keep it simple, focus on protein, position fats and carbs where you feel they work best for you (so satiety, enjoyment of meals, etc).

    Unfortunately, we can't choose when and where fat will come off. But if you stick with the deficit, it will come off eventually :)
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    Okay, thank you very much for the response!

    I am a rock climber, so I would like overall muscle gains. My muscle focus days have been specifically arms/shoulders/back/core. With my cardio days, I get a lot of work on my legs, so those have been toning pretty well. I'm just wanting to see more of the fat come off. My core and arms seem to be holding onto it. I don't feel like I'm really seeing progress in that arena. I'm not sure if that's due to the diet or just not being on the right exercise program.

    Thank you for the links! I will absolutely check them out.

    So keep in mind that you legs are big muscles and that training them with loads will not only help burn some calories but will make you better at rock climbing.

    If you are going to train 2-3 days a week, something like stronglift or aworkoutroutine beginner is a great place to start if you have gym access. And then you could add additional volume to your upper body.
  • Retroguy2000
    Retroguy2000 Posts: 1,847 Member
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    Weight loss is my goal, plus muscle building. I do high intensity cardio 3 times a week and then muscle group focus twice a week, using my weekends for walk/yoga/rest. So I have been doing high-carb/low-fat on my cardio days and low-carb/high-fat on my muscle group days. Weekends are mid-range, just shooting for mid-carb.
    What is your calorie and protein intake like on the muscle days compared to cardio days? Because if your goal is to gain some muscle while also losing weight, you should make sure you're getting more protein and calories on the muscle days, with the protein spaced out during the day, or during however many hours you allow that isn't fasting. I understand you need enough energy for the cardio days too, however it should be easier to run a calorie deficit on those days since cardio burns so many more calories than weights. 0.8g protein per pound should be plenty, or if you're running a large calorie deficit you could aim a bit higher.
  • skeletalplatypi
    skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
    Just inputting my info into MFP has me consuming 1200c/day. My BMR is 1332 plus I try to aim for around 200-300 calories burned in workouts. I have a hard time hitting my macros most days (plus I've just been feeling full, probably due to my medication), but I try to go 93g fat|80g protein|33g carbs on muscle days and 50g fat|106g protein|156g carbs on cardio days. This week was my breakthrough because I've lost 3 pounds and 2 inches.

    I don't have gym access. I mean, I do, but the state I live in is in a lockdown. I have 15lb and 25lb dumbbells plus some exercise bands, so I just use those on my muscle build days.
  • Retroguy2000
    Retroguy2000 Posts: 1,847 Member
    What you're doing is obviously working so congrats, and that sounds like a good amount of protein. You're probably running a fairly similar calorie deficit most days despite a back of the envelope calc showing you're consuming 200 more on cardio days, because you're probably burning an extra 200 more those days. From your earlier comments I was anticipating a much larger disparity of protein and calorie deficits on weights vs cardio days, but this isn't really the case.

    You might get a small benefit in terms of muscle building by increasing the protein and calories a little bit on weights days, say for a round number example add 100 calories mostly protein, and consume 100 fewer on the cardio days to balance it out so your total deficit is the same, but that's probably min-maxing. If what you're already doing is sustainable for you, just keep doing that.

    This article about carb cycling says similar, basically that you should target more protein and carbs on the weights days, to help muscle recovery and growth.

    https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/carb-cycling-101#TOC_TITLE_HDR_2

    Btw since you mentioned you're a climber, I assume you've seen Free Solo? That was incredible. It's included in Disney+ and Hulu if you haven't.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    Just inputting my info into MFP has me consuming 1200c/day. My BMR is 1332 plus I try to aim for around 200-300 calories burned in workouts. I have a hard time hitting my macros most days (plus I've just been feeling full, probably due to my medication), but I try to go 93g fat|80g protein|33g carbs on muscle days and 50g fat|106g protein|156g carbs on cardio days. This week was my breakthrough because I've lost 3 pounds and 2 inches.

    I don't have gym access. I mean, I do, but the state I live in is in a lockdown. I have 15lb and 25lb dumbbells plus some exercise bands, so I just use those on my muscle build days.

    What do you have your weight loss set at? I would probably run a TDEE calculator and go for a small deficit (300-400 a day).

    There is plenty of body weight programs out there that can be beneficial.
  • skeletalplatypi
    skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
    Retroguy2000 wrote: »
    Btw since you mentioned you're a climber, I assume you've seen Free Solo? That was incredible. It's included in Disney+ and Hulu if you haven't.

    Thank you! Reading the article now.

    I have! I loved it because it really opened the world's eyes to the climbing community. I started when I was 2, so it's been cool to watch the world become more aware.

    To psuLemon:
    I have it set at 2 pounds/week. Okay, I'll do that. Thank you so much!
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    skeletalplatypi wrote: »
    Retroguy2000 wrote: »
    Btw since you mentioned you're a climber, I assume you've seen Free Solo? That was incredible. It's included in Disney+ and Hulu if you haven't.

    Thank you! Reading the article now.

    I have! I loved it because it really opened the world's eyes to the climbing community. I started when I was 2, so it's been cool to watch the world become more aware.

    To psuLemon:
    I have it set at 2 pounds/week. Okay, I'll do that. Thank you so much!

    Unless you ar morbidly obese, that should never be a target, especially if muscle gains are your primary goal.
  • skeletalplatypi
    skeletalplatypi Posts: 19 Member
    Ah, okay. I'll be adjusting it now. I did fall into the obese category with my weight, so I had it set to bring myself down to a normal range.

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