Eating back exercise calories?
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wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Exercise to support eating. Doesn't seem that healthy to me.
Eating to support exercise is a very healthy mindset.
Exercise to support eating is a very unhealthy mindset.
There's a difference between exercising to eat more and eating more, panicking because you ate more, and then trying to exercise it off.
That's the difference in mindset.10 -
I usually eat my total caloric allotment in a day (at a deficit) and then I am in a double deficit after I do my biking. I will eat back calories when I feel hungry, but I keep in mind not to eat right back to my original deficit. When I eat them some of them back, I will use fruit, vegetables or something with protein and fiber. I never eat them all back -
I keep in mind that exercise will stimulate hunger but not necessarily mean it's there. I also drink 2L of water to make sure I'm not dehydrated and masking for hunger.
I've done this for the past 4 months and will lose around a pound more than my 1.5 pound weekly weight loss goal.
Why do you feel the need for that extra deficit? You picked the 1.5 lbs for a reason. Now you're just potentially undereating and that brings its own set of problems.7 -
I'm an approximate logger. I also exercise almost daily, adding 500-1000kcals per day. My only observation is that the exercise calorie estimates are not that accurate across the board. Things walking and running are pretty well handled by a fitness watch, but cycling, swimming, kayaking, paddle-boarding, inline skating, lawnmowing, snow blowing, and many other activities are very difficult to assess.
So, if you are intent on cutting, you might be a little conservative in eating calories back. It's not terrible to leave a few "on the table" (or in the fridge).0 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Exercise to support eating. Doesn't seem that healthy to me.
Eating to support exercise is a very healthy mindset.
Exercise to support eating is a very unhealthy mindset.
There's a difference between exercising to eat more and eating more, panicking because you ate more, and then trying to exercise it off.
That's the difference in mindset.
Uh, do you really see a difference in those two scenarios? How about if you lose the two gratuitous modifiers: (i) panicking, which has nothing to do with the issue, and (ii) "trying" as opposed to just doing it. Neither modifier is anywhere near what I posted or what the discussion mandated.
That leaves you with seeing a difference in exercising to eat more, which I hope everyone sees as an unhealthy mindset, and eating more and then exercising to try for it not to increase one's weight.
I guess it boils down to whether you would exercise before or after dinner?1 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Exercise to support eating. Doesn't seem that healthy to me.
Eating to support exercise is a very healthy mindset.
Exercise to support eating is a very unhealthy mindset.
There's a difference between exercising to eat more and eating more, panicking because you ate more, and then trying to exercise it off.
That's the difference in mindset.
Uh, do you really see a difference in those two scenarios? How about if you lose the two gratuitous modifiers: (i) panicking, which has nothing to do with the issue, and (ii) "trying" as opposed to just doing it. Neither modifier is anywhere near what I posted or what the discussion mandated.
That leaves you with seeing a difference in exercising to eat more, which I hope everyone sees as an unhealthy mindset, and eating more and then exercising to try for it not to increase one's weight.
I guess it boils down to whether you would exercise before or after dinner?
I do see a difference and I've been known to exercise DURING dinner (to save on time) so there ya go.6 -
The question about "eat to exercise" or "exercise to eat" is a good one. I guessing that big exercisers do a little of both.
There are tradeoffs to any lifestyle and a person has to regularly re-assess if their choices are really working for them and not against them. I've had people ask me how I have the time to do the modest training that I choose to do. My wife is sometimes exasperated with me when I tell her I want to do a 2 hour bike ride, but not with her!
I think that people (like me) who watch their weight and are in the habit of doing regular 500-1000kcal workouts do struggle when we miss a workout (or, worse, a week or more due to injury, illness, or travel). I like to anticipate the average and smooth out the eating as much as possible. If I miss a planned 1000kcal workout, I need to compensate by eating less for a day or two, and I think we have all experienced how hard that is!0 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Exercise to support eating. Doesn't seem that healthy to me.
It is, though. Regular exercise is the single most healthy thing you can do for yourself, and if eating more food motivates you to do it, that’s fine. Eating more and exercising enough to maintain at that calorie level is far healthier than being sedentary and eating less to maintain at that activity level.
This is a platitude that is rarely challenged. Why, I do not know. Most of the healthy populations of the World do exactly ZERO exercise. And, these are not populations of farmers and hunter/gatherers. They are civilized societies of persons who get enough exercise to keep limber and mobile by their every day activities of personal care, work, shopping and play. Of course shut-ins and recovery patients and truly sedentary persons need structured exercise, but that is about it.
When one considers that the average jogger has two debilitating injuries per year on average, and intense exercise almost always results in joint replacements and other orthopedic failures, it is hard to agree with the statement above. Genetically, we are not well equipped for intense exercise. But, then we don't really need it.
You know what happens when a jogger has a “debilitating” injury as defined by the study you linked? (Example injuries include blisters and iliotibial band irritation.)
That jogger temporarily is forced to become a non-jogger.
That’s it. Nothing else happens. The runner is just unable to run for a while until the overuse injury resolves. They have to suck it up for a while and become like normal people.
It is certainly true that one way to avoid overuse injuries is never to use your body. However, underuse injuries such as diabetes, fatty liver, and heart attacks are worse than having a blown Achilles’ tendon.
Regular exercise is the largest single shared factor among people who are on the weight loss registry studying people who have maintained a significant loss for more than a year. It’s the single most significant controllable factor in health, according to multiple studies.7 -
May I also take a moment to address the (dumb) argument that exercise causes injuries at some rate high enough not to offset the benefits of exercising?
The best way to prevent injury from activity is proper conditioning.
You know what that means?
It means you build stamina, strength, and proper muscle to support the activity you are doing.
You know who at least a good portion of those injury stats are coming from? People who don't do that, don't cross train, and/or do not have the base fitness level and then go way too hard, way too fast, without proper knowledge of safety or skill.
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As a non-jogger, I am fine to not have the injuries that send the average jogger to the doctor or missed work 2 times per year, and I get no Schadenfreude from my contemporaries who are almost universally getting knee and hip replacements. But those who think that the issue is settled are just deluded. As a libertarian, I welcome persons making their own decisions to do things which give them satisfaction even when they are not sensible in the public health context. Exercise to achieving cardio improvement levels is helpful for cardio recovery patients. An exercise bike or a treadmill is probably the safest, least destructive way to accomplish that. But, that is about it.0
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Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »The question about "eat to exercise" or "exercise to eat" is a good one. I guessing that big exercisers do a little of both.
There are tradeoffs to any lifestyle and a person has to regularly re-assess if their choices are really working for them and not against them. I've had people ask me how I have the time to do the modest training that I choose to do. My wife is sometimes exasperated with me when I tell her I want to do a 2 hour bike ride, but not with her!
I think that people (like me) who watch their weight and are in the habit of doing regular 500-1000kcal workouts do struggle when we miss a workout (or, worse, a week or more due to injury, illness, or travel). I like to anticipate the average and smooth out the eating as much as possible. If I miss a planned 1000kcal workout, I need to compensate by eating less for a day or two, and I think we have all experienced how hard that is!
Personally, my answer to this is "find an enjoyable life" and "eat to fuel it" . . . since I'm fortunate enough that I have choices of lifestyle (vs. struggling, maybe abusing my body physically at work, just to stay alive) and am fortunate enough to have food surplus as my challenge rather than food shortage.
Exercise is just one way to have fun. It has benefits other than fun. And some risks, sure.
*Not* getting any activity is life is also injurious . . . I see quite a few folks in doctors' offices who appear to have pursued something closer to that route, and know quite a few people my age who are very inactive, and need more doctoring more often than I do as a consistent exerciser.
If someone doesn't want to exercise, that's their choice. Whether that's a health-increasing or heath-depleting choice is quite situational.
P.S. I can't say that I struggle if I miss a workout, though 500+ calorie activity days aren't unusual for me. I like eating more, more than I like eating less, but I'm capable of eating less when necessary, without much drama. I admit, I don't have many 1000+ calorie exercise days, but I'm not a large human, which is part of that.1 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Exercise to support eating. Doesn't seem that healthy to me.
Eating to support exercise is a very healthy mindset.
Exercise to support eating is a very unhealthy mindset.
There's a difference between exercising to eat more and eating more, panicking because you ate more, and then trying to exercise it off.
That's the difference in mindset.wilson10102018 wrote: »Uh, do you really see a difference in those two scenarios? How about if you lose the two gratuitous modifiers: (i) panicking, which has nothing to do with the issue, and (ii) "trying" as opposed to just doing it. Neither modifier is anywhere near what I posted or what the discussion mandated.
That leaves you with seeing a difference in exercising to eat more, which I hope everyone sees as an unhealthy mindset, and eating more and then exercising to try for it not to increase one's weight.
I guess it boils down to whether you would exercise before or after dinner?
Yes, I see a huge difference in mindset between "exercising to eat more and eating more, panicking because you ate more, and then trying to exercise it off."
"Panicking" is an essential modifier because it encapsulates the unhealthy mindset.
I'd be hangry on 1500 calories, so my goal is to earn an extra 500 calories per day via exercise. I can't get this all in one session, so I plan to get exercise throughout the day, which often includes after dinner, as a scheduling issue.
Some years back, we had a notable thread by a poster with exercise bulimia or anorexia which I unfortunately cannot find as it clearly demonstrated the difference in mindset between us.
I used words like "goal, plan," and "schedule" and she used words like "panic" or otherwise describing a mental state.7 -
So, if your mental state is defined by someone else as a "panic" mode, your act of exercising to eat is unhealthy, but if you do it deliberately it is healthy?
Wow.1 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »So, if your mental state is defined by someone else as a "panic" mode, your act of exercising to eat is unhealthy, but if you do it deliberately it is healthy?
Wow.
Well, yeah, what defines a “healthy mindset” (your choice of words) is your mental state, not sure what the alternative would be there!
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wilson10102018 wrote: »As a non-jogger, I am fine to not have the injuries that send the average jogger to the doctor or missed work 2 times per year, and I get no Schadenfreude from my contemporaries who are almost universally getting knee and hip replacements. But those who think that the issue is settled are just deluded. As a libertarian, I welcome persons making their own decisions to do things which give them satisfaction even when they are not sensible in the public health context. Exercise to achieving cardio improvement levels is helpful for cardio recovery patients. An exercise bike or a treadmill is probably the safest, least destructive way to accomplish that. But, that is about it.
You’re going on bad data here. I said this before but will repeat it as often as you repeat your falsehood: multiple large long-term studies show that knee replacements and osteoarthritis are LOWER IN LONG TERM RUNNERS than in people who have never run. Same for hip replacements. The myth that running wears out your knees is just that, a myth.
I would rather not ever be a cardio recovery patient. The best way to avoid that is daily activity.
Not gonna search for studies since you literally can’t read the news ten seconds without tripping over a new study demonstrating the benefits of exercise. Read one yesterday which found that intense exercise and HIIT increases the length of telomeres which aid in repairing cellular structures, and one just a couple days ago about the benefits of strength training in preventing osteoporosis in post-menopausal women. That you are arguing something which is, in fact, settled within the scientific community, to me says either that you enjoy being a contrarian or that you have a dog in this fight. So, just so you know, I don’t personally care if you yourself are a sponge soaking up the UV rays from your monitor, but you shouldn’t repeat bad info.
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Just for the record, it seems to me that engaging in exercise to facilitate eating more calories than those desired or required in order to achieve the maintenance or loss of weight is an unhealthy mindset whether you know it or deny it.1
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wilson10102018 wrote: »Just for the record, it seems to me that engaging in exercise to facilitate eating more calories than those desired or required in order to achieve the maintenance or loss of weight is an unhealthy mindset whether you know it or deny it.
Look at it this way. What's your tdee?
Mine is MAYBE 1300...1400 for maintenance if I'm lucky. This is without exercise. Food is good and I DESIRE and REQUIRE more. Hell if I'm gonna torture myself eating that little when I can be averaging 2,000 cal a day and not gain weight.4 -
That makes you a female 100 pounds more or less.1
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wilson10102018 wrote: »That makes you a female 100 pounds more or less.
Right around. Yup. Plus I'm old and plus I'm short. Doesn't mean I don't want more food. 😀7 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »Just for the record, it seems to me that engaging in exercise to facilitate eating more calories than those desired or required in order to achieve the maintenance or loss of weight is an unhealthy mindset whether you know it or deny it.
When I was a machine operator running around a machine all day or a full time yoga teacher I got more calories by virtue of my job. What's unhealthy about a person with a desk job getting those calories back via exercise?4 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »So, if your mental state is defined by someone else as a "panic" mode, your act of exercising to eat is unhealthy, but if you do it deliberately it is healthy?
Wow.rheddmobile wrote: »Well, yeah, what defines a “healthy mindset” (your choice of words) is your mental state, not sure what the alternative would be there!
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For those interested in the tangent this took, there is now a related thread in Debate: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10839925/eat-to-exercise-or-exercise-to-eat-which-describes-you1
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rheddmobile wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »As a non-jogger, I am fine to not have the injuries that send the average jogger to the doctor or missed work 2 times per year, and I get no Schadenfreude from my contemporaries who are almost universally getting knee and hip replacements. But those who think that the issue is settled are just deluded. As a libertarian, I welcome persons making their own decisions to do things which give them satisfaction even when they are not sensible in the public health context. Exercise to achieving cardio improvement levels is helpful for cardio recovery patients. An exercise bike or a treadmill is probably the safest, least destructive way to accomplish that. But, that is about it.
You’re going on bad data here. I said this before but will repeat it as often as you repeat your falsehood: multiple large long-term studies show that knee replacements and osteoarthritis are LOWER IN LONG TERM RUNNERS than in people who have never run. Same for hip replacements. The myth that running wears out your knees is just that, a myth.
I would rather not ever be a cardio recovery patient. The best way to avoid that is daily activity.
Not gonna search for studies since you literally can’t read the news ten seconds without tripping over a new study demonstrating the benefits of exercise. Read one yesterday which found that intense exercise and HIIT increases the length of telomeres which aid in repairing cellular structures, and one just a couple days ago about the benefits of strength training in preventing osteoporosis in post-menopausal women. That you are arguing something which is, in fact, settled within the scientific community, to me says either that you enjoy being a contrarian or that you have a dog in this fight. So, just so you know, I don’t personally care if you yourself are a sponge soaking up the UV rays from your monitor, but you shouldn’t repeat bad info.
Having watched my father recover from a triple bypass (in which excess weight and low activity were factors), I'd much rather face the injuries associated with an active lifestyle (especially since, as you point out, we don't have a higher rate of knee and hip replacements). I used to live in Tucson, where I had the ability to associate with many older people who had been running for decades.
None of us can guarantee our futures, but when I look at the quality of life of the bulk of older active people versus the bulk of older people who chose less active lifestyles, I know what I want for myself as I age.
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cheshirechic wrote: »Do you eat back your exercise calories? Why/why not?
There are probably thousands of threads on this but I couldn't find them.
For me, rn, I'm not. I usually burn (it's all an approximation anyway) 400 extra. Eating 1400 rn, without adding those back.
Thanks!
@cheshirechic - I don’t force myself to eat back exercise calories, especially if I’m not hungry.
If I’m really desiring more food.. sure I’ll eat em.. but most of the time I only eat back a portion or not at all.1 -
Ohhh wow ty for all of these responses!!0
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