Not noticing progress fat% loss wise. Any advice?
bfmv44mag
Posts: 8 Member
Hey all,
18 yrs old, 5'9 Male and currently sitting at 218.8 last weigh in on the 27th.
I started losing weight/working out on the 30th of November last month, yesterday marked one exact month of starting this change of life and the most amount of time concurrent that I've ever stuck to a "diet".
2 years ago I was over 300 pounds and decided that if I didn't stop and make the change then, I would never be able to go back.
I dropped to 235 over the next course of 2 years on very rocky on and off dieting up to 1 week at a time, for the most part repeating that cycle over and over again. I decided to finally make the change and commit to a lifestyle of healthy eating and committing myself to working out with a goal of becoming a bodybuilder within the next 6 months.
But what I have noticed throughout the past 4 and a half weeks of sticking to a nutritional, protein rich diet is that I have been dropping weight still, 233.7 was what I started on, now I am down to 218.8 but have not noticed any visible reduction of any kind with my waist, hips, thighs or glutes. They are all the same size just with muscle starting to form now. How can I go about specifically targeting fat loss instead of muscle loss and how can I go about noticing the changes that are being made by the progress I am putting in?
I will attach photos from Nov. 30th to Dec. 30th that show my waist about the same size even after losing that amount of weight and working out 5-6 times a week at high levels of intensity (elevated heartrate whole time, excessive sweating, fatigue/reps to failure).
Nov. 30th
Dec. 30th, yesterday
18 yrs old, 5'9 Male and currently sitting at 218.8 last weigh in on the 27th.
I started losing weight/working out on the 30th of November last month, yesterday marked one exact month of starting this change of life and the most amount of time concurrent that I've ever stuck to a "diet".
2 years ago I was over 300 pounds and decided that if I didn't stop and make the change then, I would never be able to go back.
I dropped to 235 over the next course of 2 years on very rocky on and off dieting up to 1 week at a time, for the most part repeating that cycle over and over again. I decided to finally make the change and commit to a lifestyle of healthy eating and committing myself to working out with a goal of becoming a bodybuilder within the next 6 months.
But what I have noticed throughout the past 4 and a half weeks of sticking to a nutritional, protein rich diet is that I have been dropping weight still, 233.7 was what I started on, now I am down to 218.8 but have not noticed any visible reduction of any kind with my waist, hips, thighs or glutes. They are all the same size just with muscle starting to form now. How can I go about specifically targeting fat loss instead of muscle loss and how can I go about noticing the changes that are being made by the progress I am putting in?
I will attach photos from Nov. 30th to Dec. 30th that show my waist about the same size even after losing that amount of weight and working out 5-6 times a week at high levels of intensity (elevated heartrate whole time, excessive sweating, fatigue/reps to failure).
Nov. 30th
Dec. 30th, yesterday
0
Replies
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Often belly is a little more stubborn and takes longer to go. Just keep at it, you've done an amazing job.3
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DUUUUUUDE, OK first of all, congrats on your progress so far!
For a LOT of people, fat around the midsection is the absolute last to come off (and first to come back on).
How aggressive is your deficit? What's your protein intake?
Keep taking progress photos & you may want to get a tape to measure on a regular basis as well. Not just your waist, but arms/forearms, chest, thighs, calves, etc etc. But bear in mind, those photos were "only" one month apart. I put "only" in quotations because, on one hand, in the grand scheme of things, it's the blink of an eye *BUT* on the other hand, in that time you made some very noticeable changes to your physique.
As far as bodybuilding goes, it's a long process. You have to be patient with yourself. As you start getting leaner, fat loss will slow down etc so just trust the process and you'll get there.1 -
DUUUUUUDE, OK first of all, congrats on your progress so far!
For a LOT of people, fat around the midsection is the absolute last to come off (and first to come back on).
How aggressive is your deficit? What's your protein intake?
Keep taking progress photos & you may want to get a tape to measure on a regular basis as well. Not just your waist, but arms/forearms, chest, thighs, calves, etc etc. But bear in mind, those photos were "only" one month apart. I put "only" in quotations because, on one hand, in the grand scheme of things, it's the blink of an eye *BUT* on the other hand, in that time you made some very noticeable changes to your physique.
As far as bodybuilding goes, it's a long process. You have to be patient with yourself. As you start getting leaner, fat loss will slow down etc so just trust the process and you'll get there.
Thanks a ton for responding and the helpful insight!
Deficit wise I started a bit higher at 1200-1450 since I was heavier set than I currently am now but starting this next month I am bumping my caloric intake up and reducing my deficit by at least 500 calories as I realize now that I might not be supplying my body with enough nutrition as is the way I have been going about it as I get closer to a healthier weight so that I do not promote muscle loss.
I was doing 5 days a week (T, W, T, F, Sun) 1500 calories and 2 days (M, Sat) down to 1250 (lighter interval exercising) with normal protein intake being roughly 135g-155g throughout the course of 3-4 meals and a whey protein shake after my workout. I've definitely noticed my thighs/lower portion have been slimming down a lot more and becoming more muscle prominent than my abdomen and up to my chest in comparison, and it sort of got me down. I can see now that in reality a month hasn't been very long at all since I am trying to undo years of this unhealthy sabotage that I've been doing to myself.
I very much appreciate the advice and will adhere to it! I would much rather get this done steadily than do something that will cause me even more problems down the line once I get to the point of targeting muscle building. Thanks again!
1 -
I'm also 5'9 and didn't really see much muscle definition until I got down to about 175lbs.
And at that weight visible progress was quite patchy with stomach and love handles lagging behind the rest.
You still have a lot of fat to lose and fat is like wearing an overcoat - it is very effective at hiding what might be going on underneath. When you get closer to goal weight conversely small changes in fat, muscle and vascularity make a big visual difference.
Tape measurements and monthly progress photos can be very helpful in tracking changes that tend to go unnoticed just looking in the mirror.
Do that right things (sensible rate of weight loss that slows down as you get smaller, high protein diet, strength training) and be patient. The process works but takes time.
3 -
First, let me say that I think you're doing great: Huge results, excellent commitment, some smart strategies in there.
Second, let me say that I 100% and more endorse your idea of slowing down your loss rate, given your current status and goals.
If you've lost from 233.7 to 218.8 pounds between November 30 and December 30, that's nearly 3.5 pounds a week - aggressively fast, for someone not well over 300 pounds. I grant, if you're just getting started, some of that may be water weight, but parts of your scenario would tend to add some water weight, too, so I'm betting much/most is fat loss. I think you're getting away with losing this fast because you're 18 and resilient, plus working at good nutrition . . . but it's a risk factor, and a significant risk factor to your goal of muscle gain, even though you're at prime age to gain muscle.
That weight loss would math out to an estimated daily deficit over 1700 calories, i.e., it would suggest you've been eating 1700+ calories under your maintenance calories daily on average. That's a rough estimate, but it's also likely to be a more individualized estimate than the so-called calorie calculators. (They spit out population averages for similar people. You're an individual, not a population.)
Yeah, to support your stated goals, slow that bus down.
You also mention noticing that you've gained muscle, but not seeing that you're losing fat. Two things, about that:
1. Muscle gain, realistically, is fairly slow, though you're in the demographic where it can be fastest. Fat loss is fairly rapid, and most of what you've lost is fat, for certain. If you look more muscular rather than thinner, part of that appearance change is some fat being peeled off (maybe thin layers of it all over your body) so that muscles show more.
Personal anecdote: I'm a li'l ol' lady. I became very active, athletic even, in my 40s. I stayed overweight/obese for another decade plus, even though active. I looked totally doughy. When I started losing weight at age 59, without changing my exercise routine - a routine that's not lifting-centric at all - suddenly some surprising muscles started showing up. They'd been there, under the fat. They weren't much, if I were an 18-year-old guy, but they were kinda surprising in a 60-y/o woman.
That your muscles show more is in part a function of your having lost fat that would otherwise hide them. (You have more muscle mass than I do, even before lifting, because you're not a li'l ol' lady. 😆)
Fat loss can be like peeling an onion: The first layers you take off may not make the onion look much smaller, but as you keep going, each thin layer has more impact on the overall size.
2. For pretty much all of us - and I think that oddly this could be even more true for you as a younger person - it takes our brain some time to catch up to our change in appearance. We *know* what we look like, and that's what we see in photos, maybe even in the mirror: "It's me", the self-image. When I look at your photos, I see huge changes, and in only a month . . . like wowsers-level changes, in both fat and muscularity. The fat differences are over a lot of areas.
It wouldn't surprise me if you're looking at those same photos, and not seeing that same set of differences. In fact, it would surprise me if you did fully see them 😉: That would be kind of unusual, for a lot of humans.
How can you see them? Hard question. For one, believe the scale, whether you see it visually or not, when it's plummeting downward in the way it has been. For two, photos are good: I hope you're regularly taking multi-angle photos - maybe once a month? - from front, side, back, lightly dressed (but in something that won't make you embarrassed to show the photos to us or your friends later), and in as close to the exact same poses and lighting each time as possible. For three, if you're not doing multi-point tape measurements, start. Think about it as you start, figure out how you're going to measure at the very same body points every time, and under similar conditions (before eating for the day, pumped from a workout or not, etc.) Maybe once a month for those, too?
Generate multiple types of data evidence: Sometimes one will progress, sometimes others. As long as something's moving in the right direction, you're good. It will still be hard to see, but as time goes on, you'll learn to trust the data more.
One last gratuitous cranky-granny comment that you didn't even ask for.
You write:. . . working out 5-6 times a week at high levels of intensity (elevated heartrate whole time, excessive sweating, fatigue/reps to failure).
That's great, and I'm sure you're doing a good job. Here's the thing: For exercise generally, and strength exercise especially, heart rate, sweating, fatigue/reps to failure, perceived intensity, muscle soreness after workouts . . . none of those are necessarily indications that workouts are optimally effective for any given set of goals. For your goals, make sure you're following a good program, in a smart way. I assume (hope) you're recording your progress in adding weight or reps, or some other similar indicator that strength is increasing.
Sweating, fatigue, elevated heart rate, etc. . . . signs that you're working hard, probably indications of will and work ethic - all good stuff. Strength progress is a better metric of effectiveness, and a good, smart program (with adequate recovery built in! because that's when the magic happens!) - that's a better indication of effectiveness. (Yes, measuring mass could be an indicator, too, but the relatively more accurate methods of doing that aren't super easy/cheap.)
You're doing great. Keep at it. Learn more about the process and its success factors. Make smart choices. Manage your expectations. Expect your visual feedback to lie to you. (😉) Continuing good results are ahead.
P.S. You're doing a wonderful thing, making this change at 18. You're at the perfect age to build muscle, the perfect age to find and groove in some long-term health-promoting habits. I wish I'd been that smart at 18. It would've saved me quite a bit of later trouble, improved my quality of life over many decades. Stay the course.4 -
First, let me say that I think you're doing great: Huge results, excellent commitment, some smart strategies in there.
Second, let me say that I 100% and more endorse your idea of slowing down your loss rate, given your current status and goals.
If you've lost from 233.7 to 218.8 pounds between November 30 and December 30, that's nearly 3.5 pounds a week - aggressively fast, for someone not well over 300 pounds. I grant, if you're just getting started, some of that may be water weight, but parts of your scenario would tend to add some water weight, too, so I'm betting much/most is fat loss. I think you're getting away with losing this fast because you're 18 and resilient, plus working at good nutrition . . . but it's a risk factor, and a significant risk factor to your goal of muscle gain, even though you're at prime age to gain muscle.
That weight loss would math out to an estimated daily deficit over 1700 calories, i.e., it would suggest you've been eating 1700+ calories under your maintenance calories daily on average. That's a rough estimate, but it's also likely to be a more individualized estimate than the so-called calorie calculators. (They spit out population averages for similar people. You're an individual, not a population.)
Yeah, to support your stated goals, slow that bus down.
You also mention noticing that you've gained muscle, but not seeing that you're losing fat. Two things, about that:
1. Muscle gain, realistically, is fairly slow, though you're in the demographic where it can be fastest. Fat loss is fairly rapid, and most of what you've lost is fat, for certain. If you look more muscular rather than thinner, part of that appearance change is some fat being peeled off (maybe thin layers of it all over your body) so that muscles show more.
Personal anecdote: I'm a li'l ol' lady. I became very active, athletic even, in my 40s. I stayed overweight/obese for another decade plus, even though active. I looked totally doughy. When I started losing weight at age 59, without changing my exercise routine - a routine that's not lifting-centric at all - suddenly some surprising muscles started showing up. They'd been there, under the fat. They weren't much, if I were an 18-year-old guy, but they were kinda surprising in a 60-y/o woman.
That your muscles show more is in part a function of your having lost fat that would otherwise hide them. (You have more muscle mass than I do, even before lifting, because you're not a li'l ol' lady. 😆)
Fat loss can be like peeling an onion: The first layers you take off may not make the onion look much smaller, but as you keep going, each thin layer has more impact on the overall size.
2. For pretty much all of us - and I think that oddly this could be even more true for you as a younger person - it takes our brain some time to catch up to our change in appearance. We *know* what we look like, and that's what we see in photos, maybe even in the mirror: "It's me", the self-image. When I look at your photos, I see huge changes, and in only a month . . . like wowsers-level changes, in both fat and muscularity. The fat differences are over a lot of areas.
It wouldn't surprise me if you're looking at those same photos, and not seeing that same set of differences. In fact, it would surprise me if you did fully see them 😉: That would be kind of unusual, for a lot of humans.
How can you see them? Hard question. For one, believe the scale, whether you see it visually or not, when it's plummeting downward in the way it has been. For two, photos are good: I hope you're regularly taking multi-angle photos - maybe once a month? - from front, side, back, lightly dressed (but in something that won't make you embarrassed to show the photos to us or your friends later), and in as close to the exact same poses and lighting each time as possible. For three, if you're not doing multi-point tape measurements, start. Think about it as you start, figure out how you're going to measure at the very same body points every time, and under similar conditions (before eating for the day, pumped from a workout or not, etc.) Maybe once a month for those, too?
Generate multiple types of data evidence: Sometimes one will progress, sometimes others. As long as something's moving in the right direction, you're good. It will still be hard to see, but as time goes on, you'll learn to trust the data more.
One last gratuitous cranky-granny comment that you didn't even ask for.
You write:. . . working out 5-6 times a week at high levels of intensity (elevated heartrate whole time, excessive sweating, fatigue/reps to failure).
That's great, and I'm sure you're doing a good job. Here's the thing: For exercise generally, and strength exercise especially, heart rate, sweating, fatigue/reps to failure, perceived intensity, muscle soreness after workouts . . . none of those are necessarily indications that workouts are optimally effective for any given set of goals. For your goals, make sure you're following a good program, in a smart way. I assume (hope) you're recording your progress in adding weight or reps, or some other similar indicator that strength is increasing.
Sweating, fatigue, elevated heart rate, etc. . . . signs that you're working hard, probably indications of will and work ethic - all good stuff. Strength progress is a better metric of effectiveness, and a good, smart program (with adequate recovery built in! because that's when the magic happens!) - that's a better indication of effectiveness. (Yes, measuring mass could be an indicator, too, but the relatively more accurate methods of doing that aren't super easy/cheap.)
You're doing great. Keep at it. Learn more about the process and its success factors. Make smart choices. Manage your expectations. Expect your visual feedback to lie to you. (😉) Continuing good results are ahead.
P.S. You're doing a wonderful thing, making this change at 18. You're at the perfect age to build muscle, the perfect age to find and groove in some long-term health-promoting habits. I wish I'd been that smart at 18. It would've saved me quite a bit of later trouble, improved my quality of life over many decades. Stay the course.
Sheesh! I didn't realize that losing more at once was actually worse off.. I figured that since I was overweight and still young the more weight you lost a week was better (so long as I kept nutritional levels up), I know adults over 21 are safely set to 1-2lbs maximum but I thought since I was way above a normal weight level and under 21 it would be fine, definitely will start eating more and readjust my nutritional levels to fit that. I was basing my calculations off of 2700 Calories per day but didn't realize I might be burning more than that maintenance wise, I couldn't find out whether or not activity level played a factor in more caloric consumption so I completely left it out and just focused my calorie deficit on eating level and a completely sedentary lifestyle.
Your words have been very knowledgeable and encouraging for me. It makes me excited knowing all of the information that I'm learning to become somebody in control of their life for once, and working towards having a body that I've always wanted will be the process and a trophy of my progress. Slow and steady definitely sounds like the way to go, and with your guys' help I feel fully motivated once again!
Thank you so much!5 -
Congratulations on your weight loss!
I'm not sure what schedule you're currently eating on, but you could look into intermittent fasting for more fat burn. After a certain number of hours without caloric intake, your body has no choice but to burn fat. And there's no danger of losing muscle by doing this, because your body prefers to burn fat for energy, so it would take days without eating to start burning muscle.0 -
Goddess_Atalanta wrote: »Congratulations on your weight loss!
I'm not sure what schedule you're currently eating on, but you could look into intermittent fasting for more fat burn. After a certain number of hours without caloric intake, your body has no choice but to burn fat. And there's no danger of losing muscle by doing this, because your body prefers to burn fat for energy, so it would take days without eating to start burning muscle.
That is not my understanding.
Your body is burning both fat and carbs 24x7, in varied proportions, very generally speaking favoring fats when more nearly at rest, favoring glycogen when active at higher intensities. But it's not an on/off switch between fat and carbs, it's a mix of both, under common circumstances.
A body's muscular/liver storage of glycogen is sufficient to fuel something maybe 1-2 hours of very intense exercise, and the exercise has to be pretty intense in order to shift the mix toward glycogen fueling enough to deplete the glycogen that fast. The glycogen stores will last longer under less intense exercise, because fat is still a larger fraction of the fuel mix.
When the liver/muscle glycogen is depleted (or in practice a bit before), it isn't that some switch flips and the body just keeps rolling along happily using fat for fuel, without that person noticing. What happens when glycogen is depleted is extreme fatigue, at its most extreme, inability to keep activity going at normal pace.
When one is in a calorie deficit, in totality across a period of time, the body will tend to make up that deficit by burning stored body fat. That's when "it has no choice but to burn body fat". That fat may not burn in any particular time period (when exercising, asleep, fasting, eating, whatever), but it will do that eventually.
Yes, your body likes to burn carbs, and fats, more than it likes to burn muscle. It will still burn muscle under certain conditions, because there are limits on metabolizing any of the fuels.
There may be weight loss benefits to intermittent fasting, if it helps a person with appetite control. If there are any benefits beyond appetite control - and the research evidence is mixed IMO - the effect is not because of a simplified idea that in routine daily life the body burns carbs first, runs out of carbs, and has to burn fat.
Relevant quotes below from a somewhat nonspecialist-friendly paper on the role of fueling for an active person, but with some background on how fueling works more generally - a good read for those interested.
"Fundamentals of glycogen metabolism for coaches and athletes"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6019055/The fasting that occurs between meals, during sleep, or even during more extended periods of fasting has minimal effect on muscle glycogen concentration in resting individuals because muscle glycogen is not a major fuel substrate at rest.
(In context, "rest" is referring more generally to routine activities other than active training, not just to actual naps. The 50/50 mix of glycogen and fat as fuel is likely to occur somewhere in the range of moderate-intensity exercise. Below that, the mix is likely to be relatively more fat than glycogen as fuel. Above, glycogen contribution increases.)
More to the point of OP's goals, concerning carbohydrates specifically (and why one doesn't want to deeply deplete them):It is now widely accepted that consuming a diet sufficient in carbohydrates, along with ingesting carbohydrates during and following exercise, can improve performance and speed recovery.1,3,36 In fact, the ability of carbohydrates to improve exercise performance is not limited to ingesting carbohydrates; simply rinsing the mouth with carbohydrate solutions without swallowing has been shown to improve aspects of exercise performance such as endurance capacity and bench-press repetitions to failure.37–39 It is also well established that beginning exercise with ample muscle glycogen stores is an important contributor to improved exercise performance; further, restoration of glycogen stores is essential for complete recovery and the maintenance of subsequent exercise capacity.3,4
But, since fasting doesn't quickly deplete glycogen stores, fasting can still be done by active people, within limits. Most coaches wouldn't recommend a big bunch of it; timing nutrient intake around exercise is a more common recommendation, though that push to optimum fueling is probably more relevant to athletes trying to squeeze out the last 0.005% of improved performance. Nutrient timing is fairly far down the priority list for us recreational athletes, after appropriate total calorie intake and general good nutrition, at least.
There are some issues, in athletes, about how to train or bias the body to use relatively more fat as fuel at relatively higher exercise intensities, but that's really a different question, and the answer generally isn't simply "fasting".6 -
You're being hard on yourself and your perspective is blurred. You do look more fit right now than you did in November. What you are doing is working. I always say.. the one element they never mention in weight loss.. is time. It just takes time for the body to change. We can't fast track that with will and want.
You've done a great job. You are in control and you will achieve your goals. Keep up the great work..2 -
Goddess_Atalanta wrote: »Congratulations on your weight loss!
I'm not sure what schedule you're currently eating on, but you could look into intermittent fasting for more fat burn. After a certain number of hours without caloric intake, your body has no choice but to burn fat. And there's no danger of losing muscle by doing this, because your body prefers to burn fat for energy, so it would take days without eating to start burning muscle.
OK, "Goddess."
Please provide citations to peer-reviewed studies to substantiate these claims.
Oh, you can't?
Right. Because they're BS.3
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