Macros or Calories
ayamourada92
Posts: 62 Member
Which one should I take care while losing weight and counting my calories, how many grams of carbs, fats and protein or calories burned and consumed overall?
I am somehow confused because sometimes I exceed the limit of protein or carbs grams but I am still within the calories limit so should I watch them or just look at the calories remaining?
Thanks a lot.
I am somehow confused because sometimes I exceed the limit of protein or carbs grams but I am still within the calories limit so should I watch them or just look at the calories remaining?
Thanks a lot.
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Replies
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Your weight is just a result of energy balance over time. Fat is just excess energy. You go into an energy deficit, your body uses fat as fuel, and you lose weight. Go into a surplus, you will put on weight. Stay neutral.. no change.
Personally, I only ever worry about my protein and calories. Protein is good for sustaining lean tissue, and calories are.. what I said above. I consistently go way over on carbs but my weight has remained stable for a long time now, because my overall energy intake is in check0 -
Calories are what have a direct effect on body fat gain/loss. Macros are about nutrition, which is important for general health. (Nutrition can indirectly affect weight loss: Poor nutrition may cause low energy, and dragging through the day burns fewer calories; poor nutrition may also increase appetite/cravings, making it hard to stick with reduced calories. But those things affect calories, and it's still the calories per se that affect weight management.)
That said, counting macros and counting calories get you to roughly the same place, because each macro has an approximate calorie level per gram: Carbohydrates and protein are about 4 calories per gram, fats are 9 calories per gram. (Alcohol is a separate thing that has calories, 7 per gram, but it isn't a nutrient . . . it's sort of like a pseudo-macronutrient, in my view.)
I think both calories and nutrition are important, and I have goals (minimums, in grams) for both fats and protein, as well as a calorie goal. I'd point out that even if you do want to be careful about nutrition, it's not necessary to be exactly exact every day on macros: Close is fine, especially if any given one is a little under on some days, a little over on others, so that it averages out around where you want to be over a few days. Humans are adaptive omnivores, so our bodies know how to juggle things a bit to come out OK over time.
Close is fine for calorie goal, too: Bodies don't reset at midnight, so if we average around the right amount, things will work out OK.
Sometimes people seem to think that if they don't hit all the macros precisely every day, or get below their calorie goal every day, that it's some kind of magic spell that will break their weight loss effort. Not so. Close is fine, and so is close on average.3 -
Calories are what have a direct effect on body fat gain/loss. Macros are about nutrition, which is important for general health. (Nutrition can indirectly affect weight loss: Poor nutrition may cause low energy, and dragging through the day burns fewer calories; poor nutrition may also increase appetite/cravings, making it hard to stick with reduced calories. But those things affect calories, and it's still the calories per se that affect weight management.)
That said, counting macros and counting calories get you to roughly the same place, because each macro has an approximate calorie level per gram: Carbohydrates and protein are about 4 calories per gram, fats are 9 calories per gram. (Alcohol is a separate thing that has calories, 7 per gram, but it isn't a nutrient . . . it's sort of like a pseudo-macronutrient, in my view.)
I think both calories and nutrition are important, and I have goals (minimums, in grams) for both fats and protein, as well as a calorie goal. I'd point out that even if you do want to be careful about nutrition, it's not necessary to be exactly exact every day on macros: Close is fine, especially if any given one is a little under on some days, a little over on others, so that it averages out around where you want to be over a few days. Humans are adaptive omnivores, so our bodies know how to juggle things a bit to come out OK over time.
Close is fine for calorie goal, too: Bodies don't reset at midnight, so if we average around the right amount, things will work out OK.
Sometimes people seem to think that if they don't hit all the macros precisely every day, or get below their calorie goal every day, that it's some kind of magic spell that will break their weight loss effort. Not so. Close is fine, and so is close on average.
Just wanted to second all of this.
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You should care about both, particularly if you want to minimize muscle loss during your weight loss journey.0
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ayamourada92 wrote: »Which one should I take care while losing weight and counting my calories, how many grams of carbs, fats and protein or calories burned and consumed overall?
I am somehow confused because sometimes I exceed the limit of protein or carbs grams but I am still within the calories limit so should I watch them or just look at the calories remaining?
Thanks a lot.
Your macros don't directly have any impact on weight management. Calories are a unit of energy...when you consume less energy than your body requires you burn stored energy (body fat) to make up the difference. Your macros are what make up your calories. 4 calories per gram of carbohydrate, 4 calories per gram of protein, 9 calories per gram of dietary fat. Your macros have more to do with the nutrition of those calories.
Watching your macros can help ensure you are meeting nutritional needs at the high level and help avoid a lop sided diet or deficiencies in essential nutrients like protein and dietary fat. Also note that there is nothing magical about MFP's default macro ratios...they're just the default. Many people who actively track their macros customize them to meet their needs. There is no universally optimal macro ratio. A body builder for example is going to have a different optimal macro ratio than an endurance athlete.0 -
Mostly watch the calories and protein. There is no problem with going over on the protein, but it is important not to vo under on a regular basis because then you risk losing muscle mass. For carbs and fats just let them fall as they will, as long as they are from healthy sources. If you notice that you rent to run high on one, look into why and ask yourself whether it is a healthy reason. If you are high on carbs due to eating whole grains, beans and lentils, great. If you are high in carbs due to eating white bread and soda, not good.1
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Mostly watch the calories and protein. There is no problem with going over on the protein, but it is important not to vo under on a regular basis because then you risk losing muscle mass. For carbs and fats just let them fall as they will, as long as they are from healthy sources. If you notice that you rent to run high on one, look into why and ask yourself whether it is a healthy reason. If you are high on carbs due to eating whole grains, beans and lentils, great. If you are high in carbs due to eating white bread and soda, not good.
No carbs in diet soda. More carbs in two pieces of whole grain bread than in the two pieces of white bread I eat daily.
Just saying... 2 -
Fat is an essential nutrient (as is protein) in the sense that we need to eat a certain minimum of it regularly. It's particularly important for women, but it's important for everyone. Being consistently under a reasonable fat goal is not good, nutritionally.
It's true that many people, in developed countries, are over-eating fat, not under-eating it. However, some people under-eat it when trying to cut calories (because fats are calorie dense), and end up with problems because of that. (Constipation is the quickest one to show up, potentially . . . others like cellular health and hormonal balance are more subtle, longer term. It's kind of lucky, actually, when constipation shows up as a warning sign so that correction happens.)
Personally, I don't like the "only protein matters" message that's fairly common here. Anyone is free to ignore any nutritional item(s) they wish. Advising others to ignore them is a different matter, IMO.
/curmudgeon4 -
More carbs in two pieces of whole grain bread than in the two pieces of white bread I eat daily.
I think you may be joking, but if not, you're missing the point. Carbs aren't *bad*.
The point is to make sure the foods you're eating *with or without carbs* are nutrient dense.
Your white bread is lower carb, probably lower calorie, but also practically devoid of nutrients.
Whole grain breads use *whole* grains, which are full of nutrients. White bread is mostly air. It's not as filling and it's nowhere near as healthy.
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.1 -
Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »More carbs in two pieces of whole grain bread than in the two pieces of white bread I eat daily.
I think you may be joking, but if not, you're missing the point. Carbs aren't *bad*.
The point is to make sure the foods you're eating *with or without carbs* are nutrient dense.
Your white bread is lower carb, probably lower calorie, but also practically devoid of nutrients.
Whole grain breads use *whole* grains, which are full of nutrients. White bread is mostly air. It's not as filling and it's nowhere near as healthy.
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.
You think I think carbs are bad? LOL.
But I'm not joking about what I said. I read the post . Googled carbs in the "healthier" bread. Looked at the nutrition label on the bread I eat and compared. Also, my bread only has 1 gram of sugar and 4 grams protein per serving so not that nutritionally void.
I don't believe in demonizing food which is why I pointed it out.😋
I'm also someone who believes there's some kind of value in all foods so eat what you want unless you're allergic or it'll kill you.
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The difference between similar white and whole wheat bread isn't that huge, honestly.
I looked this up for another thread a few months back. I'm not going to recheck to see if the nutrition has changed over those few months (laziness), I'm just pasting those results here. This is for a common brand in the US, similar bread, Pepperidge Farm Farmhouse White vs. Farmhouse Whole Wheat, per 49g slice, white numbers first:
Calories: 130, 130
Total Fat: 1g, 2.5g
Sodium: 230mg, 180mg
Total Carb: 26g, 23g
Protein: 4g, 5g
Fiber: 1g, 4g
Sugar: 4g, 4g (all added sugar in both cases)
Calcium: 40mg, 40mg
Iron: 1.7mg, 1.3mg
Potassium: 50mg, 125mg
Thiamin: 0.2mg, 0.1mg
Riboflavin: 0.2mg, 0.1mg
Niacin: 1.5mg, 2mg
Folate: 95mcg DFE/0 folic acid, 10mcg DFE/50mcg folic acid
That's not the best whole grain bread compared to the worst white, or vice-versa; it's an attempt at a fair comparison using a commonly available mainstream brand, and I didn't cherry pick a brand, it was just the first one that came to mind.
I'd give a slight edge to the whole wheat nutritionally, but it doesn't have the advantage all the way through the nutrient profile, and the differences are pretty small. If I really preferred white bread for enjoyment reasons, it wouldn't be enough difference to sway me, personally. (NB: I prefer whole wheat for taste, if I eat either.)
Source:
https://www.pepperidgefarm.com/product/farmhouse-hearty-white-bread/
https://www.pepperidgefarm.com/product/farmhouse-100-whole-wheat-bread/
It's actually possible that a high-quality white bread might have better nutrition than a low-quality whole wheat bread.
Question the shibboleths, folks, and decide whether they're meaningful in your personal overall dietary context.
If I liked white bread, I'd totally eat it instead of whole wheat. (I'm routinely waaaay over my fiber minimums daily, so the extra fiber - the biggest difference between the two above, IMO - is completely meaningless in my context. Ditto potassium.)3 -
The difference between similar white and whole wheat bread isn't that huge, honestly.
I looked this up for another thread a few months back. I'm not going to recheck to see if the nutrition has changed over those few months (laziness), I'm just pasting those results here. This is for a common brand in the US, similar bread, Pepperidge Farm Farmhouse White vs. Farmhouse Whole Wheat, per 49g slice, white numbers first:
Calories: 130, 130
Total Fat: 1g, 2.5g
Sodium: 230mg, 180mg
Total Carb: 26g, 23g
Protein: 4g, 5g
Fiber: 1g, 4g
Sugar: 4g, 4g (all added sugar in both cases)
Calcium: 40mg, 40mg
Iron: 1.7mg, 1.3mg
Potassium: 50mg, 125mg
Thiamin: 0.2mg, 0.1mg
Riboflavin: 0.2mg, 0.1mg
Niacin: 1.5mg, 2mg
Folate: 95mcg DFE/0 folic acid, 10mcg DFE/50mcg folic acid
That's not the best whole grain bread compared to the worst white, or vice-versa; it's an attempt at a fair comparison using a commonly available mainstream brand, and I didn't cherry pick a brand, it was just the first one that came to mind.
I'd give a slight edge to the whole wheat nutritionally, but it doesn't have the advantage all the way through the nutrient profile, and the differences are pretty small. If I really preferred white bread for enjoyment reasons, it wouldn't be enough difference to sway me, personally. (NB: I prefer whole wheat for taste, if I eat either.)
Source:
https://www.pepperidgefarm.com/product/farmhouse-hearty-white-bread/
https://www.pepperidgefarm.com/product/farmhouse-100-whole-wheat-bread/
It's actually possible that a high-quality white bread might have better nutrition than a low-quality whole wheat bread.
Question the shibboleths, folks, and decide whether they're meaningful in your personal overall dietary context.
If I liked white bread, I'd totally eat it instead of whole wheat. (I'm routinely waaaay over my fiber minimums daily, so the extra fiber - the biggest difference between the two above, IMO - is completely meaningless in my context. Ditto potassium.)
Not gonna lie. I just saw this in the other carbs thread and willed it into this one.
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Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.
Maybe you should glance at the nutritional label on some different forms of white bread nest time you shop because your stance comes across as a belief rather than being based on fact.2 -
The difference between similar white and whole wheat bread isn't that huge, honestly.
I looked this up for another thread a few months back. I'm not going to recheck to see if the nutrition has changed over those few months (laziness), I'm just pasting those results here. This is for a common brand in the US, similar bread, Pepperidge Farm Farmhouse White vs. Farmhouse Whole Wheat, per 49g slice, white numbers first:
Calories: 130, 130
Total Fat: 1g, 2.5g
Sodium: 230mg, 180mg
Total Carb: 26g, 23g
Protein: 4g, 5g
Fiber: 1g, 4g
Sugar: 4g, 4g (all added sugar in both cases)
Calcium: 40mg, 40mg
Iron: 1.7mg, 1.3mg
Potassium: 50mg, 125mg
Thiamin: 0.2mg, 0.1mg
Riboflavin: 0.2mg, 0.1mg
Niacin: 1.5mg, 2mg
Folate: 95mcg DFE/0 folic acid, 10mcg DFE/50mcg folic acid
That's not the best whole grain bread compared to the worst white, or vice-versa; it's an attempt at a fair comparison using a commonly available mainstream brand, and I didn't cherry pick a brand, it was just the first one that came to mind.
I'd give a slight edge to the whole wheat nutritionally, but it doesn't have the advantage all the way through the nutrient profile, and the differences are pretty small. If I really preferred white bread for enjoyment reasons, it wouldn't be enough difference to sway me, personally. (NB: I prefer whole wheat for taste, if I eat either.)
Source:
https://www.pepperidgefarm.com/product/farmhouse-hearty-white-bread/
https://www.pepperidgefarm.com/product/farmhouse-100-whole-wheat-bread/
It's actually possible that a high-quality white bread might have better nutrition than a low-quality whole wheat bread.
Question the shibboleths, folks, and decide whether they're meaningful in your personal overall dietary context.
If I liked white bread, I'd totally eat it instead of whole wheat. (I'm routinely waaaay over my fiber minimums daily, so the extra fiber - the biggest difference between the two above, IMO - is completely meaningless in my context. Ditto potassium.)
All of this.
And as for filling or not, I don't find any bread filling. (I also don't like bread that much unless it's special bread, such as homemade or -- sure -- naan, so I don't worry about the nutrients in it given I rarely eat it.)
I do certainly agree with the point that the prior poster was making that it's more the food itself vs the macros in it that I focus on when thinking through whether it's a good addition to a healthy diet. Not that you need to exclude foods if they are not nutrient dense and they fit in, but there are more important factors in my choices than macros. But I generally get as much protein as I think I need or more without having to track these days, and I am not someone who is at risk of cutting fat too low.2 -
Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.
Maybe you should glance at the nutritional label on some different forms of white bread nest time you shop because your stance comes across as a belief rather than being based on fact.
Okay. See how everyone else in this thread is remaining cordial even with differences in opinion? Maybe you should glance at that, because your stance comes across as a childish attack on someone who isn't touting your own beliefs.
Let's not make this personal. I *much* prefer facts.
So...
Facts:
Wheat has three parts to it.
Wheat bran is fiber-packed.
Wheat endosperm (the largest part of the seed) is predominantly made up of starch.
Wheat germ is the nutrient-rich embryo of the wheat seed.
Facts:
White bread is made with white flour.
Wheat bread is made with whole wheat flour.
Either are legally allowed to *say* "wheat flour" on the packaging, because both are made with wheat.
Facts:
They are very different.
Whole wheat flour uses the *whole* wheat seed. All three parts.
White flour uses *only* the endosperm. No wheat bran. No wheat germ.
Just the large starchy endosperm.
Facts:
White flour is usually (but not always) milled on large industrial machines which are faster and cheaper. The lack of bran (fiber) also adds to the stable shelf life of the flour.
Whole wheat flour is usually (but not always) stone milled to preserve the bran. This gives it a shorter shelf life.
Facts:
Most breads people believe are whole wheat bread aren't. They are made with white flour which hasn't been bleached yet, and called simply "wheat bread". People believe it because it's brown.
White flour is naturally a soft golden brown.
Whole wheat flour is darker brown.
When you buy white flour at the store and it's *white*, it has been bleached.
If your white bread looks white, it's been made with bleached white flour.
If it's not, it's been msde with unbleached white flour.
In neither does it contain the germ or the bran which are the most nutrient dense parts of the wheat seed.
1 cup of whole wheat flour contains 3 grams of fat, 16 grams of protein.
1 cup of white, unbleached "wheat" flour contains 1.2 grams of fat, 13 grams of protein.
1 cup of whole wheat flour contains 86 grams of carbohydrates including 13 grams of dietary fiber.
1 cup of white, unbleached "wheat" flour contains 95 grams of carbohydrates with only 3.4 grams of dietary fiber.
1 cup of whole wheat flour contains 50% of the RDA of Vitamin B1 15% of the RDA of Vitamin B2 37% of the RDA of Vitamin B3
1 cup of white, unbleached "wheat" flour contains 12% of the RDA of Vitamin B1 4% of the RDA of Vitamin B2 10% of the RDA of Vitamin B3
Whole wheat flour has 14% of the RDA of Vitamin B5. White flour has 11%.
Whole wheat has 38% of the RDA of Vitamin B6, while white has only 3%!
Vitamin B9? Whole wheat wins again 13% to 8%
Vitamin E? Whole wheat: 0.85mg to white: 0.07mg
Vitamin K 2% in whole wheat, 0% in white.
How about some mineral Facts:
Whole wheat:
Calcium 3%; copper 54%; iron 24%; magnesium 41%; manganese 212%; phosphorous 61%; potassium 9%; selenium 135%; zinc 28%
White:
Calcium 1%; copper 20%; iron 8%; magnesium 7%; manganese 37%; phosphorus 19%; potassium 3%; selenium 77%; zinc 8%
I'd go on, going into the actual proteins and amino acids but frankly I'm tired of looking up and typing out statistics I am already aware of which are freely available to the public simply because you seem to believe anything which isn't spelled out in your pantry on a nutrition label is "opinion".
But I like math. Let's do some math.
Commercial bread loaves require around 3 cups of flour and have an average of 20 slices per loaf.1 cup of whole wheat flour contains 3 grams of fat, 16 grams of protein.
1 cup of white, unbleached "wheat" flour contains 1.2 grams of fat, 13 grams of protein.
That's a difference per loaf of 3 × (3-1.2) or 5.4 grams of fat, and 3 × (16-13) or 9 grams of protein.1 cup of whole wheat flour contains 86 grams of carbohydrates including 13 grams of dietary fiber.
1 cup of white, unbleached "wheat" flour contains 95 grams of carbohydrates with only 3.4 grams of dietary fiber.
That's a difference per loaf of 3 × (13-3.4) or 28.8 grams of dietary fiber. That dietary fiber is the good part of the carbohydrates. Yet the white bread has 3 × (95-86) or 27 grams more carbohydrates per loaf.
With 3 cups per loaf, 20 slices per loaf, 1 slice per serving, whole wheat bread is giving you *per serving* 7.5% of the RDA of Vitamin B1. White bread gives 1.8%
I'd go on, there's huge differences in nearly every nutrient contained in either, but as I said, I am tired of delving into the minutiae to save *you* time doing it yourself.
As I said before:Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.
There is no benefit. Nutritionally. To choosing white bread over whole wheat. Because whole wheat flour contains more of every single beneficial nutrient than white flour.
Based on facts which exist outside the clouded or overstated "nutritional data" which comes printed on the plastic wrap at the friendly neighborhood supermarket.
Yes, it's a belief. Based on things I know because I have done *more* than occasionally glance at a nutrition label.
So,
TLDR
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either.
Better?1 -
Oh my god.
Who cares????3 -
Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »
There's nothing wrong with eating white bread... I don't believe in labeling foods good or bad... but there's no nutritional benefit to it either. [/b]
Better?
@Cluelessmama1979
No not better or personal - just refuting what is a false, and demonstrably false, statement that your wall of text also directly contradicts.
You can't see the contradiction in listing nutritional information and then saying "There's no nutritional benefit"?
Where does the protein, carbs, fibre and vitamins listed go?
Do you think it evaporates or passes right through unused just because of the colour of the bread?
If your statement was true then white bread would have zero calories!
Sorry but it's a ridiculous exaggeration. Words have meanings. If you mean less say less.
If you mean some white bread has lower nutritional benefit (a little bit lower depending on the wide range of white breads available) then say lower not "no benefit". Don't be part of the diet culture than works on beliefs rather than facts.
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I'm a strong, strong believer in the importance of good overall nutrition.
The idea that we must always choose the very most nutritious option, every time, food by food . . . is very all or nothing, borders on orthorexia.
For best health, IMO we should pursue a combination of foods across a day or few that our day to average close to reasonable nutritional values. An obsession with choosing the very healthiest option in every single food choice is creating health risk - mental health risk.
I'm not saying it's dysfunctional to make healthier choices. In general, healthier choices are a great thing.
I'm saying that in a context of overall reasonable nutritional totals, strong insistence on food-by-food perfection can potentially be a slippery slope, just as an obsession with perfect calorie level can be. Guaranteed problem? No. Just a risk.
Taste preferences are a significant factor in compliance with calorie goal, over the long term, for many people. Consequently, I think it makes sense to balance getting good nutrition with taste preferences, to pursue decent overall nutrition at reasonable calories while eating food we actually like eating, plus find affordable and practical.
Being able to stick with a sound, nutritious way of eating (including proper calories) over the long haul - ideally permanently - is a great boon for quality of life, IME. If someone is getting decent overall nutrition, and prefers white bread, I cannot see why they should not choose white bread (even though I don't mostly prefer it myself - taste preference). It's not like we need extra credit to increase an already top grade.2 -
Oh for sanity's sake.
I didn't say there was anything wrong with white bread.
I said it's devoid of the nutrients found in whole wheat.
It is.
I didn't say there's no nutritional benefit in a slice of bread.
I said there is no nutritional benefit to choosing it over *whole wheat* ... which my post clearly outlines in *nutritional data*.
Nutrition labels are notoriously innacurate, but it is relatively easy to find accurate information, especially if you don't rely solely on the usda website, but on the ingredients listed on other countries' food regulation sites as well. I would go into *why*, but thst would dip into the realm of money and politics, which I am fairly certain are not allowed here.
You're all welcome to believe whatever you like.
And I have, as I said, no problem with white bread. I eat white bread. Frequently.
But there is no nutritional benefit to choosing it. The benefit (aka the bulk of nutrients) are in whole wheat.
Choosing white over wheat is not going to make your entire diet *unhealthy*.
But it also is in no way the healthier option.
But as @glassyo said: who cares
@sijomial I will speak the way I speak. If you need clarification it's the typical thing to ask for clarification. There was nothing inaccurate in my statement. I *am* sorry for passive aggressively snapping last night. It was a bad pain day, but that's no excuse. And I am sorry. But my point remains, and it's your choice to believe it or not. However you have chosen no evidence and personal attacks. I guarantee that will not change my mind. I did the same as you (in the reply you were quoting) and corrected what I saw as a factual inaccuracy. Without personal attacks.
I have nothing left to say to you.
@AnnPT77 everything in your latest reply was literally the point I was trying to make initially, before I apparently misspoke and *kittened* off the entire community. I don't disagree with a single point there. Thank you for settling it.
Since my point is available for anyone interested in the topic in the future to judge for themselves, and Ann has clarified the most important point... I am finished with this conversation.
Good day.
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@AnnPT77 So, basically, you're saying sometimes it's healthier NOT to pick the "healthier" food choice? That's what I got out of that.
Anyway, there are also actual medical reasons. I stayed low fiber because I have UC and, even tho I probably didn't need to, it didn't hurt me any either. People with dysfunctional kidneys shouldn't eat a whole lot of protein. If you're celiac, you can't really eat all that healthy carb wheat, barley, and rye. Other than that, I can't think of any other reasons to watch your carbs. But I'm biased.
Should we move on to brown vs white rice? LOL.
Edited to add: Diabetic! You have to monitor carbs when you're diabetic! (And changed my wording on the celiac thing.) 2 -
@AnnPT77 So, basically, you're saying sometimes it's healthier NOT to pick the "healthier" food choice? That's what I got out of that.
Anyway, there are also actual medical reasons. I stayed low fiber because I have UC and, even tho I probably didn't need to, it didn't hurt me any either. People with dysfunctional kidneys shouldn't eat a whole lot of protein. If you're celiac, you can't really eat all that healthy carb wheat, barley, and rye. Other than that, I can't think of any other reasons to watch your carbs. But I'm biased.
Should we move on to brown vs white rice? LOL.
Edited to add: Diabetic! You have to monitor carbs when you're diabetic! (And changed my wording on the celiac thing.)
That's a far reach, for interpretation of what I intended, the bolded.
I think it's not necessary to always make the technically most nutritious choice, because balance is important in life; that nutrition isn't the sole and exclusive important thing; that over-focusing on every small choice may distract from and risk one's overall nutrition/weight-management success; and generally that context always matters.
And yes, I was trying to move on. Please.0 -
Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »Wheat bread is made with whole wheat flour.
Either are legally allowed to *say* "wheat flour" on the packaging, because both are made with wheat.
I get you are tired of this topic, but I want to respond because I found this, and the assumption that we didn't know this or know that color doesn't necessarily indicate whole wheat, you have to look at the label, to be a little condescending and unwarranted. I learned that fact in elementary school. Beyond that, this is a pretty knowledgeable place, at least among the regulars, and in particular I'm sure Ann was well-aware of that when she made her post. It doesn't change the fact that the nutritional difference between a serving of white vs whole wheat bread isn't that much (it's also true that packaged white bread is commonly "enriched").
Based on a "serving" each of two breads, the differences are small.
Yes, whole wheat bread has a sprinkling of other nutrients (as does white bread, depending on the specifics of the brand you choose). But it's unlikely to be stuff that the average person eating a good diet doesn't get already, IME (as someone who rarely eats bread and logs off and on at Cronometer).
You were able to show a someone larger difference by using a much larger -- unrealistic, in fact -- portion. But the fact is that for the most part people eat even whole grain bread more because they enjoy it, not because it is a huge nutritional powerhouse.
I get why there's an effort to encourage people to eat more whole grains (not specifically in bread form) and fewer refined grains -- as a broad dietary switch for many it could cause the diet to become somewhat more healthful (especially if like most Americans you don't eat a lot of veg and certain other more nutrient dense foods) and increasing the fiber a bit -- especially if one is quite low on it, which again is a problem for a decent number of people -- might lead some to eat less without thinking about it. It also could be true that the substitution causes one to be more mindful or to choose fewer foods one tends to overeat.
I also -- again -- agree with the statement you were originally agreeing with, that source of the carbs and fat are likely to be more significant (at the level of whether one has an overall healthy diet or an unhealthy one) than specific percentages or grams. In my view, one can have a very healthy or a very unhealthy low carb diet and the same with a moderate or very high carb diet, so long as one has a minimum of fat and protein (and outside of certain outliers or people following very specific diets or eating very low cal, I think most people probably eat within a reasonable range of fat-carbs-protein without much thinking about it). I acknowledge that some eating vegan may easily fail to get enough fat or protein without getting a little bit educated on it, and there are people (like Ann) who might naturally tend to eat low fat if she didn't have a goal -- and definitely some go down too low in protein when they cut back on cals for optimum results. But I would generally take the position that macros aren't nearly as important as many think they are on average (for some people they matter a lot for satiety), and that figuring out how to eat an enjoyable diet that is also healthy and calorie appropriate is a lot more important than grams of particular macros.
The place I disagreed with your original post is: "Whole grain breads use *whole* grains, which are full of nutrients. White bread is mostly air. It's not as filling and it's nowhere near as healthy." I do not think there's a big difference in the healthfulness of one (or even 2) pieces of one bread vs another. In the scheme of an overall healthy diet, it's not going to make much difference, so saying one piece of bread is healthy and another is not seems wrong to me -- it's like saying eating pasta is not healthy when in fact in addition to the sprinkling of nutrients and perhaps needed cals it provides me, it also is a delicious vehicle for halibut and olives and zucchini and spinach and lemon and garlic (and maybe I am planning my dinner for tonight!).3 -
Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »Oh for sanity's sake.
I didn't say there was anything wrong with white bread.
I said it's devoid of the nutrients found in whole wheat.
It is.
I didn't say there's no nutritional benefit in a slice of bread.
I said there is no nutritional benefit to choosing it over *whole wheat* ... which my post clearly outlines in *nutritional data*.
Nutrition labels are notoriously innacurate, but it is relatively easy to find accurate information, especially if you don't rely solely on the usda website, but on the ingredients listed on other countries' food regulation sites as well. I would go into *why*, but thst would dip into the realm of money and politics, which I am fairly certain are not allowed here.
You're all welcome to believe whatever you like.
And I have, as I said, no problem with white bread. I eat white bread. Frequently.
But there is no nutritional benefit to choosing it. The benefit (aka the bulk of nutrients) are in whole wheat.
Choosing white over wheat is not going to make your entire diet *unhealthy*.
But it also is in no way the healthier option.
But as @glassyo said: who cares
@sijomial I will speak the way I speak. If you need clarification it's the typical thing to ask for clarification. There was nothing inaccurate in my statement. I *am* sorry for passive aggressively snapping last night. It was a bad pain day, but that's no excuse. And I am sorry. But my point remains, and it's your choice to believe it or not. However you have chosen no evidence and personal attacks. I guarantee that will not change my mind. I did the same as you (in the reply you were quoting) and corrected what I saw as a factual inaccuracy. Without personal attacks.
I have nothing left to say to you.
@AnnPT77 everything in your latest reply was literally the point I was trying to make initially, before I apparently misspoke and *kittened* off the entire community. I don't disagree with a single point there. Thank you for settling it.
Since my point is available for anyone interested in the topic in the future to judge for themselves, and Ann has clarified the most important point... I am finished with this conversation.
Good day.
Words have meanings. Devoid means empty of. Completely without. So no, it isn't. Let's not perpetuate the myth.4 -
Did the op ever come back? Did he/she/they take one look and run for the hills? 1
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