Macros or Calories

AnnPT77

glassyo wrote: »

@AnnPT77 So, basically, you're saying sometimes it's healthier NOT to pick the "healthier" food choice? That's what I got out of that.

Anyway, there are also actual medical reasons. I stayed low fiber because I have UC and, even tho I probably didn't need to, it didn't hurt me any either. People with dysfunctional kidneys shouldn't eat a whole lot of protein. If you're celiac, you can't really eat all that healthy carb wheat, barley, and rye. Other than that, I can't think of any other reasons to watch your carbs. But I'm biased.

Should we move on to brown vs white rice? LOL.

Edited to add: Diabetic! You have to monitor carbs when you're diabetic! (And changed my wording on the celiac thing.)

That's a far reach, for interpretation of what I intended, the bolded.

I think it's not necessary to always make the technically most nutritious choice, because balance is important in life; that nutrition isn't the sole and exclusive important thing; that over-focusing on every small choice may distract from and risk one's overall nutrition/weight-management success; and generally that context always matters.

And yes, I was trying to move on. Please.

lemurcat2

Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »

Wheat bread is made with whole wheat flour.

Either are legally allowed to *say* "wheat flour" on the packaging, because both are made with wheat.

I get you are tired of this topic, but I want to respond because I found this, and the assumption that we didn't know this or know that color doesn't necessarily indicate whole wheat, you have to look at the label, to be a little condescending and unwarranted. I learned that fact in elementary school. Beyond that, this is a pretty knowledgeable place, at least among the regulars, and in particular I'm sure Ann was well-aware of that when she made her post. It doesn't change the fact that the nutritional difference between a serving of white vs whole wheat bread isn't that much (it's also true that packaged white bread is commonly "enriched").

Based on a "serving" each of two breads, the differences are small.

Yes, whole wheat bread has a sprinkling of other nutrients (as does white bread, depending on the specifics of the brand you choose). But it's unlikely to be stuff that the average person eating a good diet doesn't get already, IME (as someone who rarely eats bread and logs off and on at Cronometer).

You were able to show a someone larger difference by using a much larger -- unrealistic, in fact -- portion. But the fact is that for the most part people eat even whole grain bread more because they enjoy it, not because it is a huge nutritional powerhouse.

I get why there's an effort to encourage people to eat more whole grains (not specifically in bread form) and fewer refined grains -- as a broad dietary switch for many it could cause the diet to become somewhat more healthful (especially if like most Americans you don't eat a lot of veg and certain other more nutrient dense foods) and increasing the fiber a bit -- especially if one is quite low on it, which again is a problem for a decent number of people -- might lead some to eat less without thinking about it. It also could be true that the substitution causes one to be more mindful or to choose fewer foods one tends to overeat.

I also -- again -- agree with the statement you were originally agreeing with, that source of the carbs and fat are likely to be more significant (at the level of whether one has an overall healthy diet or an unhealthy one) than specific percentages or grams. In my view, one can have a very healthy or a very unhealthy low carb diet and the same with a moderate or very high carb diet, so long as one has a minimum of fat and protein (and outside of certain outliers or people following very specific diets or eating very low cal, I think most people probably eat within a reasonable range of fat-carbs-protein without much thinking about it). I acknowledge that some eating vegan may easily fail to get enough fat or protein without getting a little bit educated on it, and there are people (like Ann) who might naturally tend to eat low fat if she didn't have a goal -- and definitely some go down too low in protein when they cut back on cals for optimum results. But I would generally take the position that macros aren't nearly as important as many think they are on average (for some people they matter a lot for satiety), and that figuring out how to eat an enjoyable diet that is also healthy and calorie appropriate is a lot more important than grams of particular macros.

The place I disagreed with your original post is: "Whole grain breads use *whole* grains, which are full of nutrients. White bread is mostly air. It's not as filling and it's nowhere near as healthy." I do not think there's a big difference in the healthfulness of one (or even 2) pieces of one bread vs another. In the scheme of an overall healthy diet, it's not going to make much difference, so saying one piece of bread is healthy and another is not seems wrong to me -- it's like saying eating pasta is not healthy when in fact in addition to the sprinkling of nutrients and perhaps needed cals it provides me, it also is a delicious vehicle for halibut and olives and zucchini and spinach and lemon and garlic (and maybe I am planning my dinner for tonight!).

SuzanneC1l9zz

Cluelessmama1979 wrote: »

Oh for sanity's sake.

I didn't say there was anything wrong with white bread.

I said it's devoid of the nutrients found in whole wheat.

It is.

I didn't say there's no nutritional benefit in a slice of bread.

I said there is no nutritional benefit to choosing it over *whole wheat* ... which my post clearly outlines in *nutritional data*.

Nutrition labels are notoriously innacurate, but it is relatively easy to find accurate information, especially if you don't rely solely on the usda website, but on the ingredients listed on other countries' food regulation sites as well. I would go into *why*, but thst would dip into the realm of money and politics, which I am fairly certain are not allowed here.

You're all welcome to believe whatever you like.

And I have, as I said, no problem with white bread. I eat white bread. Frequently.

But there is no nutritional benefit to choosing it. The benefit (aka the bulk of nutrients) are in whole wheat.

Choosing white over wheat is not going to make your entire diet *unhealthy*.

But it also is in no way the healthier option.

But as @glassyo said: who cares

@sijomial I will speak the way I speak. If you need clarification it's the typical thing to ask for clarification. There was nothing inaccurate in my statement. I *am* sorry for passive aggressively snapping last night. It was a bad pain day, but that's no excuse. And I am sorry. But my point remains, and it's your choice to believe it or not. However you have chosen no evidence and personal attacks. I guarantee that will not change my mind. I did the same as you (in the reply you were quoting) and corrected what I saw as a factual inaccuracy. Without personal attacks.

I have nothing left to say to you.

@AnnPT77 everything in your latest reply was literally the point I was trying to make initially, before I apparently misspoke and *kittened* off the entire community. I don't disagree with a single point there. Thank you for settling it.

Since my point is available for anyone interested in the topic in the future to judge for themselves, and Ann has clarified the most important point... I am finished with this conversation.

Good day.

Words have meanings. Devoid means empty of. Completely without. So no, it isn't. Let's not perpetuate the myth.

glassyo

Did the op ever come back? Did he/she/they take one look and run for the hills?