Body Recomp & Hunger
ddsb1111
Posts: 928 Member
This post is mostly to get ideas based on what works for you. Advice is also welcome. My goal is to increase my fitness without creating a massive change in my hunger signals. Everyone is different, but I’m curious what workouts/activity you do that doesn’t make you feel constantly hungry and clearly improved your body composition?
I ran my TDEE through tdeecalculator.net and it is spot on with my data, I’m actually shocked tbh. I only need to add 200 calories for moderate activity, but my mind or body, whichever it is, tells me it’s way more than that. My data proves otherwise. 1 hour of Pilates= 1 Tbs of peanut butter. Yeah, tell that to my mind lol.
Any ideas how to eat the same calories to maintain weight and change my body comp without increasing my hunger signals? Those alarm bells going off all day long, no matter what my macros are, is pretty frustrating.
I wasn’t sure where to post this exactly. Under Fitness? Maintenance? Health & Weight loss? Hope it’s okay here or I can request it be moved.
I ran my TDEE through tdeecalculator.net and it is spot on with my data, I’m actually shocked tbh. I only need to add 200 calories for moderate activity, but my mind or body, whichever it is, tells me it’s way more than that. My data proves otherwise. 1 hour of Pilates= 1 Tbs of peanut butter. Yeah, tell that to my mind lol.
Any ideas how to eat the same calories to maintain weight and change my body comp without increasing my hunger signals? Those alarm bells going off all day long, no matter what my macros are, is pretty frustrating.
I wasn’t sure where to post this exactly. Under Fitness? Maintenance? Health & Weight loss? Hope it’s okay here or I can request it be moved.
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Replies
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My experience is the opposite to what you want - but hear me out. I lift weights and my appetite shot through the roof. But it turns out that I needed the extra calories just to maintain. I eat a lot for my height and build.
I found jogging never increases my appetite, but swimming did. Walking in the cold air increased my appetite, but walking in the summer heat didn’t. Steady state LISS probably had the least impact for me, but weights had the biggest impact.1 -
The only way to know is to eat that amount and experiment.
BUT but but - any time I lower calories I struggle for about a week...then the gnaw-my-arm-off hunger subsides. Stay the course.
AND and and - more protein and fiber are the key for me. Lots of vegetables and fruit. 4-6 servings a day. I also have to cut back on wheat and sugar when I cut calories or I tend to do nothing but worry about my next meal.2 -
claireychn074 wrote: »My experience is the opposite to what you want - but hear me out. I lift weights and my appetite shot through the roof. But it turns out that I needed the extra calories just to maintain. I eat a lot for my height and build.
I found jogging never increases my appetite, but swimming did. Walking in the cold air increased my appetite, but walking in the summer heat didn’t. Steady state LISS probably had the least impact for me, but weights had the biggest impact.
I hear ya. When I got a trainer and had a lifting regiment I constantly thought about food and was hungry. It really messed with my mind tbh. But I miss the endorphins and I don’t want to be skinny-fat either. Interesting about the temperature of the air effecting your hunger! Sometimes it’s hard to pinpoint the correlation. Ideally I want to find something that changes my body, doesn’t make me hungry, but that I also enjoy. I might be asking for a lot haha! Did the LISS change your body shape much?0 -
I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.1
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neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.0 -
neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.0 -
cmriverside wrote: »The only way to know is to eat that amount and experiment.
BUT but but - any time I lower calories I struggle for about a week...then the gnaw-my-arm-off hunger subsides. Stay the course.
AND and and - more protein and fiber are the key for me. Lots of vegetables and fruit. 4-6 servings a day. I also have to cut back on wheat and sugar when I cut calories or I tend to do nothing but worry about my next meal.
So adding protein + fiber to those extra activity calories is your solution. That makes perfect sense. I’m in maintenance so this is a new world to me. Trying to find that balance between changing my shape, eating maintenance calories (adding less than 200 calories per workout), and not increasing my hunger has been tricky for me.0 -
Well, if your changing your routine to include more activity then those 200 calories for a "recomp" would also need adjusting upward to facilitate that change, or am I missing something here.0
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neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. I’m trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.0 -
neanderthin wrote: »Well, if your changing your routine to include more activity then those 200 calories for a "recomp" would also need adjusting upward to facilitate that change, or am I missing something here.
I only need to add 200 calories for moderate activity, but my mind or body, whichever it is, tells me it’s way more than that. My data proves otherwise. 1 hour of Pilates= 1 Tbs of peanut butter. Yeah, tell that to my mind lol.
This might have been confusing, but with a slight adjustment my alarm bells go off everyday.0 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.0 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.0 -
It's funny you say hard boiled eggs, because I'm much more satiated with hard boiled than eggs done any other way, and they're portable and have to admit I eat a lot of eggs over the course of a week.1
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neanderthin wrote: »It's funny you say hard boiled eggs, because I'm much more satiated with hard boiled than eggs done any other way, and they're portable and have to admit I eat a lot of eggs over the course of a week.
They should have a laugh button. I mean they’re pretty much perfect so I get it.0 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.1 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.0 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.
You need to compare say 1 egg to 1 tbsp of BP. Your link is comparing 1 cup of each and while the eggs have 211 calories for 1 cup the PB has 1520 calories, so not really applicable.3 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.
You need to compare say 1 egg to 1 tbsp of BP. Your link is comparing 1 cup of each and while the eggs have 211 calories for 1 cup the PB has 1520 calories, so not really applicable.
Yeah, 100g of peanut butter is kind of a silly comparison they made. Like, why even do that? Lol1 -
neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.
But peanut butter gets the majority of its calories from fat, not protein.
In my image below I added the food to my FOOD diary based on its protein only. I matched them by protein grams. That is 100g of whole egg (because we usually eat two eggs) and 50g of PB
Protein Egg 13g ____PB 13g
Calories Egg 147 ___PB 297
Fat Egg 10g _________PB 25g
Sat Fat Egg 3g ______PB 5g
Oranges. Apples.
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cmriverside wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »neanderthin wrote: »I don't count calories and basically eat to satiation. I'm low carb as well and at the moment in more of a ketogenic state and over the last 2 month as well as working out generally 3 times a week, I'm now playing hockey twice a week at a fairly high level, meaning I'm pretty much all out for those 2 hours. I've noticed I'm more hungry and I am eating more and if I had to guess I'd say I'm eating an extra 700-1000 on those days. So there you go, for me the extra exercise has induced hunger and my weight been stable at around 187 lbs, just checked and actually, went down 3 lbs.
That’s my goal pretty much. Somehow you’re adding an intense activity and at most only averaging an additional 142 calories a day and feeling satiated. My brother was/is a hockey player, that sport is no joke. Kuddos to that.
Are you saying your "alarm bells go off" with just a small increase in activity? I think that's what your saying.
Yeah, just jumping from light exercise to moderate exercise, less than a 200 calorie difference, makes me feel hungry everyday, even the days I’m not working out. Trying to find an activity that can help me maintain and recomp without the hunger spikes.
This could be diet related and more than likely is. Possibly add more protein in your dietary macro's without adding much of the other 2, basically a lean protein and then see what happens.
Yeah the peanut butter wasn’t cutting it. Maybe I’ll switch to hard boiled eggs. Oh wait, just looked… peanut butter has 91% more protein than a boiled egg. Didn’t know that.
My data is showing a large eggs has 6g's of protein and 60 calories where 1 tbsp of PB has 3g's of protein and 90 calories.
I just did a quick google search and read what was bolded. With more details it says “ Protein: Both boiled egg and peanut butter are high in protein. Peanut butter has 91% more protein than boiled egg - boiled egg has 12.6g of protein per 100 grams and peanut butter has 24.1g of protein.” Link: https://www.soupersage.com/compare-nutrition/peanut-butter-vs-boiled-egg
I’m definitely willing to give it a shot and experiment with different types of exercises to see which is less hunger inducing. Hoping for a cheat sheet to save time though 😊.
But peanut butter gets the majority of its calories from fat, not protein.
In my image below I added the food to my FOOD diary based on its protein only. I matched them by protein grams. That is 100g of whole egg and 50g of PB
Protein Egg 13g ____PB 13g
Calories Egg 147 ___PB 297
Fat Egg 10g _________PB 25g
Sat Fat Egg 3g ______PB 5g
Oranges. Apples.
You’d think they would compare a serving to a serving, but I was wrong 😂. My bad.0 -
A couple of things to consider.
The fact that the estimation says 200 Cal doesn't mean 200 Cal.
Dynamic body is dynamic. Watch it because yes, for many of us on MFP we are much more dynamically opposed to deficits and much LESS to surplus. So the resistance to increase is less, perhaps, than resistance to decrease.
But you might be surprised as to how much you might be able to push calories up without long term energy storage (i.e. fat) increase.
Also you were recently losing, weren't you? How long was that process and how long has it been since then? I would expect multiples of several months before all hormonal perturbations settle. I don't want to say aloud the words at least "as long as you were losing or a year or two"... but it would definitely be more than a few months till you're settled down and your hunger signals are no longer influenced by your previous deficit.
So perhaps push up your intake a bit, but carefully.
The other thing is... the majoring in the minors bits for people who are just starting.... but which might make a difference where you're at.
It's 225 Cal, right? How about you "time" your boiled eggs (concur on fullness for calories bit myself too) before your exercise or have your boiled potatoes and eggs right after (or a combination of before after you experiment with)? I admit that I would probably have a snickers bar or a vanilla cone on my way to the class (~20 minutes for me I think), but you might be brave and have apples (probably ~30 minutes for me). This might both make your class more energetic and if you follow up with your eggs and potatoes still come within the calories
(Carbs/energy before; protein/fat/carbs or even just carbs soon after to keep going)
Please note the above come from personal experiments so I'm just throwing them out as ideas
Last but not least, if I remember your pics correctly, you've done an impressive job within normal weight to go lower in the range.
Recomp implies that you're reducing fat levels and using the energy in that fat to build muscle. In effect you're still eating at a small deficit.
But the fat level has to be available in excess to be tapped easily. In your case it may be harder to tap into and by that I mean that your hormones/hunger may act to prevent depletion.
If you fully eat at maintenance you would still build muscle which is very slow as covered. Your percentage fat will still go down. But the weight number would increase very slowly.
So I guess ... two kinds of recomp with one being essentially longer term deficit and the other closer to maintenance.
BTW for most of us this level of precision is too much and the reality is that the whole process is slow....
But, overall, me thinks that you have room perhaps to experiment with adding the calories and seeing how you're feeling and how the scale is behaving. Carefully given the holidays etc0 -
@PAV8888 Your post blew my mind in the best way. It examined the nuances that I had a feeling I was missing but wouldn’t be obvious to me as a newbie.
The fact that the estimation says 200 Cal doesn't mean 200 Cal.
Dynamic body is dynamic. Watch it because yes, for many of us on MFP we are much more dynamically opposed to deficits and much LESS to surplus. So the resistance to increase is less, perhaps, than resistance to decrease. But you might be surprised as to how much you might be able to push calories up without long term energy storage (i.e. fat) increase.
I was wondering about this. Recomp seems to be a different ballgame than losing weight, and so far what I “know” about calories and satiation isn’t exactly applying to what’s happening with me in recomp. If I don’t increase activity I’m fine, but I’m trying to tweak bf% now and remain satiated and the maths not mathing. This validates what I feel is happening.
Also you were recently losing, weren't you? How long was that process and how long has it been since then? I would expect multiples of several months before all hormonal perturbations settle. I don't want to say aloud the words at least "as long as you were losing or a year or two"... but it would definitely be more than a few months till you're settled down and your hunger signals are no longer influenced by your previous deficit.
I was zigzagging from May-June, making minimal progress. July-Sept I took it very seriously and lost pretty much all the weight or about 20 lbs in 3 months. I’ve been maintaining since Oct so not long. It’s very likely my hormones haven’t settled down or stabilized. This makes me wonder if I should maintain for a few months before starting a new fitness adventure if you will. Or just doing something so small where it doesn’t effect my maintenance routine too much.
It's 225 Cal, right? How about you "time" your boiled eggs (concur on fullness for calories bit myself too) before your exercise or have your boiled potatoes and eggs right after (or a combination of before after you experiment with)? I admit that I would probably have a snickers bar or a vanilla cone on my way to the class (~20 minutes for me I think), but you might be brave and have apples (probably ~30 minutes for me). This might both make your class more energetic and if you follow up with your eggs and potatoes still come within the calories
So this is where meal timing might actually matter?! Thanks for the suggestions, it’s a good place to start! I’ve changed none of my meal timing, just the speculated calorie increase and it’s pretty uncomfortable.
(Carbs/energy before; protein/fat/carbs or even just carbs soon after to keep going)
Another thing I didn’t know. Ty!
Last but not least, if I remember your pics correctly, you've done an impressive job within normal weight to go lower in the range.
Recomp implies that you're reducing fat levels and using the energy in that fat to build muscle. In effect you're still eating at a small deficit.
But the fat level has to be available in excess to be tapped easily. In your case it may be harder to tap into and by that I mean that your hormones/hunger may act to prevent depletion.
If you fully eat at maintenance you would still build muscle which is very slow as covered. Your percentage fat will still go down. But the weight number would increase very slowly.
So I guess ... two kinds of recomp with one being essentially longer term deficit and the other closer to maintenance.
BTW for most of us this level of precision is too much and the reality is that the whole process is slow....
You’re correct. I’m at the lower end of my BMI but not teetering my any means. It says I’m BMI 20 and I believe the end is something like 18.5. I honestly don’t know what my BF% is, but I can grab thick folds on my stomach and thighs, which is fine, but I’d just like to reduce that a little and replace it with endurance, strength, and a nicer shape overall. I’m curious if my hunger signals are trying to prevent depletion and it’s not something else, that’s a good point. I would be okay gaining a couple lbs in a year if it was replacing fat with muscle and I didn’t feel hungry all the time. That would actually be a win for me.I’d also be okay with being at a tiny deficit and building muscle to maintain my weight, but I didn’t think we could do that?
You’re right, this does seem to be more about precision and too much for most people. I figured if I’m going to maintain and focus on that, I might as well make some continued positive progress along the way. I think once the hiccups have been resolved it might actually be enjoyable. That’s the hope anyway.
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Are you assuming your exercise will increase your appetite, or experiencing that now? (I understand that your appetite went up when training in the past.) Expectations have power. Suggestion: Make a plan that you think will fuel/support your exercise, and invest some belief in it. (I know that's hard.)
Just personal experience: Lifting is more inclined to make me hungry, and rowing/biking really doesn't, even fairly intense paces of those. (Of course, if I bike for multiple hours, I may want a snack in there just for energy level).
From reading posts here for years, the appetite reactions to different exercise types tend to be quite individualized.
For myself, I experimented with eating around the lifting workouts, and found something that better helped manage appetite. For me, a little bit of fast-ish carbs right before the workout (dried fruit, for a while caramel green apple pop (basically sugar on on stick, not that many calories)); plus some extra protein after: That was helpful. It was just a redistribution of my daily calories, not more of them.
Heck, the effect could be as much psychological as physical, but I don't really care, as long as it works.
I suspect the details would vary for others, too . . . so I'm suggesting the experiment, not my specific routine. Try something for a few workouts in a row to let it settle in a bit, see what you think. (Riverside's right about changes in routine needing some time).
Couple of other points of agreement with others: Unless you're already high, it would be worth experimenting with increasing protein (across your day). Many people find that filling, and you want plenty anyway to provide the right substrate for fitness improvements. Veggies/fruits and so-called whole foods tend to be more filling for a lot of people, so if you have a fair fraction of refined or highly-processed foods in your eating, tweaking that might help.
I also agree with PAV that you may find your maintenance calorie needs increasing a bit over the next few weeks, if there's been some adaptive thermogenesis in the picture. You may gradually be able to eat a little more.claireychn074 wrote: »My experience is the opposite to what you want - but hear me out. I lift weights and my appetite shot through the roof. But it turns out that I needed the extra calories just to maintain. I eat a lot for my height and build.
I found jogging never increases my appetite, but swimming did. Walking in the cold air increased my appetite, but walking in the summer heat didn’t. Steady state LISS probably had the least impact for me, but weights had the biggest impact.
I hear ya. When I got a trainer and had a lifting regiment I constantly thought about food and was hungry. It really messed with my mind tbh. But I miss the endorphins and I don’t want to be skinny-fat either. Interesting about the temperature of the air effecting your hunger! Sometimes it’s hard to pinpoint the correlation. Ideally I want to find something that changes my body, doesn’t make me hungry, but that I also enjoy. I might be asking for a lot haha! Did the LISS change your body shape much?
If you don't want to be under-muscled ("skinny fat"), then you're going to need a strength challenge of some type in the mix.
Technically, LISS is not an exercise modality, it's a pace. Some so-called cardio things done at LISS pacing have little strength challenge, some have more. That matters to whether your body shape will be changed. Every form of "cardio" doesn't have the same body or fitness effect, whether LISS, MISS, HISS, or interval pacing. (Yes, HISS is a thing, a short thing; it doesn't get much press.)
Personally, I wouldn't choose an exercise regimen based on how hungry it makes me feel (though I'd tweak my eating as needed to manage hunger, obviously, and maybe phase in the new activity's volume/frequency/intensity for the same reason).
Rationally, one ought to choose an exercise routine based on fitness goals and enjoyment (or at least tolerability/practicality). Realistically, I give too much weight to enjoyment over fitness goals, personally. I don't endorse my character faults, though.
**
Cranky afterthought: I don't like the calculator at Tdeecalculator.net. Five activity levels with vague descriptions? Ehhh. If you want to consider a different TDEE calculator, maybe take a look at Sailrabbit.com/bmr for more levels, better descriptions, multiple formulas. Just my bias, though . . . and it's got a crazy-ugly user interface at first glance.
I'd also observe that the type/intensity of exercise you do matters calorically. I burn probably at least twice as many calories via an hour of sustainable but energetic cycling or rowing, vs. a hour of yoga. I'm guessing that might affect appetite long term, and I do want to be eating every delicious exercise calorie I can.
There's nothing wrong with TDEE method: You can use an average number for mixed activities, but you may see differences in appetite or on the scale if you change your routine mix of them. Fuel/calorie demands probably aren't the only thing that can affect appetite with changes in activity, but it seems like that would be a factor in the mix.
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Since we are talking details, it sounds like your main goal is to reduce your body fat % a little? i.e. it's not to maintain your weight as is. Can you maintain this weight while building muscle and lowering fat, thus reducing your body fat %? Yes, in theory you can. The more of these boxes you tick, the more successful you'll be at it:I’d also be okay with being at a tiny deficit and building muscle to maintain my weight, but I didn’t think we could do that?
1. New lifter, i.e. beginner gains still to come.
2. Not close to lean. It sounds like you fail this check.
3. Very small deficit.
You could still get to your goal of same weight with lower body fat eventually, but it won't be a very time efficient path. It would be more time effective to focus on fat loss first to get your body fat % where you're happy with it. By all means, lift during this time. Just don't expect a lot of muscle growth. Once your body fat % is where you want, maingain from there, i.e. return to maintenance with a very small surplus (100-200) and focus on the lifting. If over time you feel your waist or hips etc. are gaining too much fat, go back to maintenance or a small deficit for a while.
Re your OP, IMO you should focus on zone 2 cardio. Brisk walks, low effort cycling, that sort of thing. In my experience, strenuous cardio or a really good weights session can produce not only more hunger, but also reduced NEAT for a portion of the remainder of the day. Thus when adding say 400 exercise calories burned into MFP and thinking you can eat 400 more, but your NEAT drops by say 200, if you actually eat back all those exercise calories you'll be in a surplus. OTOH, a lower effort cardio session is easier, and doesn't result in reduced NEAT or increased hunger.
As for food, focus on protein and fiber of course to feel satiated, and help with muscle building. With weights, I find it best to plan eating around the session time into my daily totals, e.g. a snack an hour before, and soon after, both with some protein.0 -
@AnnPT77
Are you assuming your exercise will increase your appetite, or experiencing that now? (I understand that your appetite went up when training in the past.) Expectations have power. Suggestion: Make a plan that you think will fuel/support your exercise, and invest some belief in it. (I know that's hard.)
It was the case before so I chose Pilates this time vs lifting and I’m having a similar reaction to ongoing hunger. It’s likely due to the combination of increased activity, macros, food timing, and my recent weight loss. Those are a lot of variables for me to figure out 🤦🏼♀️.
For me, a little bit of fast-ish carbs right before the workout (dried fruit, for a while caramel green apple pop (basically sugar on on stick, not that many calories)); plus some extra protein after: That was helpful. It was just a redistribution of my daily calories, not more of them.
This is a suggestion I haven’t tried and sounds simple enough. I never considered timing before and hopefully that would resolve some issues. I could play with my overall protein macros as well.
I also agree with PAV that you may find your maintenance calorie needs increasing a bit over the next few weeks, if there's been some adaptive thermogenesis in the picture. You may gradually be able to eat a little more.
I’ve been a little in denial about that but it might be the case. I might need to stabilize and get through the holidays before trying Recomp the way I was hoping to. Definitely not what I expected for some reason.
Rationally, one ought to choose an exercise routine based on fitness goals and enjoyment (or at least tolerability/practicality). Realistically, I give too much weight to enjoyment over fitness goals, personally. I don't endorse my character faults, though.
Haha! I tend to agree. If I can’t have fun then I know for a fact I won’t stick to it so it’s pretty important. But I also want results. These muscles are going to build themselves.
If you don't want to be under-muscled ("skinny fat"), then you're going to need a strength challenge of some type in the mix.
I thought that was the case. So I can’t just walk on the treadmill to avoid hunger and expect my body to look much different. Total bummer but what can ya do 😆.
Cranky afterthought: I don't like the calculator at Tdeecalculator.net. Five activity levels with vague descriptions? Ehhh.
I know what you mean, I think our own data is the best calculator. I was surprised that their calculations accurately reflected my data. I wanted to see how much of an outlier I was and, according to them, I’m not even a little bit.
I'd also observe that the type/intensity of exercise you do matters calorically. I burn probably at least twice as many calories via an hour of sustainable but energetic cycling or rowing, vs. a hour of yoga. I'm guessing that might affect appetite long term, and I do want to be eating every delicious exercise calorie I can.
I just want the exercise that I like, provides recomp results, and doesn’t make me hungry after those calories have been replenished, know what I mean? If I burn 100 or 500, I don’t mind either one as long as it doesn’t come back to haunt me later. I want to eat it then forget it 🙏🏻. I also want it to be something I enjoy as well. Like Pru says, Is it #worththecalories?
Heck, the effect could be as much psychological as physical, but I don't really care, as long as it works.
💯!!!0 -
@Retroguy2000
Re your OP, IMO you should focus on zone 2 cardio. Brisk walks, low effort cycling, that sort of thing. In my experience, strenuous cardio or a really good weights session can produce not only more hunger, but also reduced NEAT for a portion of the remainder of the day. Thus when adding say 400 exercise calories burned into MFP and thinking you can eat 400 more, but your NEAT drops by say 200, if you actually eat back all those exercise calories you'll be in a surplus. OTOH, a lower effort cardio session is easier, and doesn't result in reduced NEAT or increased hunger.
Hmm, this is interesting. I have a feeling you’re right and this might be the best logical next step. My hunger and NEAT are greatly effected by intense workouts apparently. It seems I have such a small range to work with. If I continue to lose weight to reach my desired body fat % I’ll probably hit the underweight mark. Is that okay if I plan on returning to maintenance with a very small surplus (100-200) and focus on the lifting?0 -
Retroguy2000 wrote: »
Since we are talking details, it sounds like your main goal is to reduce your body fat % a little? i.e. it's not to maintain your weight as is. Can you maintain this weight while building muscle and lowering fat, thus reducing your body fat %? Yes, in theory you can. The more of these boxes you tick, the more successful you'll be at it:I’d also be okay with being at a tiny deficit and building muscle to maintain my weight, but I didn’t think we could do that?
1. New lifter, i.e. beginner gains still to come.
2. Not close to lean. It sounds like you fail this check.
3. Very small deficit.
You could still get to your goal of same weight with lower body fat eventually, but it won't be a very time efficient path. It would be more time effective to focus on fat loss first to get your body fat % where you're happy with it. By all means, lift during this time. Just don't expect a lot of muscle growth. Once your body fat % is where you want, maingain from there, i.e. return to maintenance with a very small surplus (100-200) and focus on the lifting. If over time you feel your waist or hips etc. are gaining too much fat, go back to maintenance or a small deficit for a while.
Re your OP, IMO you should focus on zone 2 cardio. Brisk walks, low effort cycling, that sort of thing. In my experience, strenuous cardio or a really good weights session can produce not only more hunger, but also reduced NEAT for a portion of the remainder of the day. Thus when adding say 400 exercise calories burned into MFP and thinking you can eat 400 more, but your NEAT drops by say 200, if you actually eat back all those exercise calories you'll be in a surplus. OTOH, a lower effort cardio session is easier, and doesn't result in reduced NEAT or increased hunger.
As for food, focus on protein and fiber of course to feel satiated, and help with muscle building. With weights, I find it best to plan eating around the session time into my daily totals, e.g. a snack an hour before, and soon after, both with some protein.
It's just a quibble, but I think that's situational (the bolded). The fitter a person becomes, the higher volume/intensity of cardio they can do routinely and not experience a noticeable NEAT penalty.
Elite endurance athletes need to eat huge levels of calories compared to us regular duffers, even reasonably fit/active regular duffers. Yeah, their zone 2 is arithmetically different from mine, but I'll guarantee they do a reasonable volume of Z3-4, and some Z5, routinely. But heck, even a cardio-frequent duffer like me can mix in Z3-4 and occasional Z5 without a noticeable NEAT calorie drop . . . or at least that's been my experience.
Managing volume and recovery is subtle, though, sure . . . and it matters for calorie reasons as well as fitness reasons.
And I agree on the general concept that overdoing exercise for current fitness level will likely have a NEAT calorie penalty. I just think the definition of "overdoing" is more nuanced.
I have a lot of respect for your opinions, Retro, but I think you sound more like a lifting guy than an experienced cardio guy - even though you probably do some cardio (I hope).
For sure we agree about timing eating around workouts as a potential strategy for managing appetite and performance. :flowerforyou:0 -
@Retroguy2000
Re your OP, IMO you should focus on zone 2 cardio. Brisk walks, low effort cycling, that sort of thing. In my experience, strenuous cardio or a really good weights session can produce not only more hunger, but also reduced NEAT for a portion of the remainder of the day. Thus when adding say 400 exercise calories burned into MFP and thinking you can eat 400 more, but your NEAT drops by say 200, if you actually eat back all those exercise calories you'll be in a surplus. OTOH, a lower effort cardio session is easier, and doesn't result in reduced NEAT or increased hunger.
Hmm, this is interesting. I have a feeling you’re right and this might be the best logical next step. My hunger and NEAT are greatly effected by intense workouts apparently. It seems I have such a small range to work with. If I continue to lose weight to reach my desired body fat % I’ll probably hit the underweight mark. Is that okay if I plan on returning to maintenance with a very small surplus (100-200) and focus on the lifting?
What body fat level are you trying to reach? Underweight even for women usually isn't a healthy thing, unless one's body configuration (skeletal dimensions, breast size) is statistically pretty unusual.
If it were me, I wouldn't go all the way to underweight to start maintaining (or a small surplus) for recomp. Underweight for women can also have undesirable hormonal-health consequences.
ETA a BTW: If you're fairly new to the type/amount of cardio you're considering, I agree with starting with Z2, and building volume before intensity, generally.0 -
You've probably experienced the same as myself after some workouts. You're wiped, you're taking it easy on the sofa for a while. You're not moving around as much, maybe doing fewer chores, subconsciously fidgeting less, that sort of thing. That can be a lot of NEAT calories not being burned that you usually would.@Retroguy2000
Hmm, this is interesting. I have a feeling you’re right and this might be the best logical next step. My hunger and NEAT are greatly effected by intense workouts apparently. It seems I have such a small range to work with. If I continue to lose weight to reach my desired body fat % I’ll probably hit the underweight mark. Is that okay if I plan on returning to maintenance with a very small surplus (100-200) and focus on the lifting?
Wrt your desired bf % being underweight, what do you mean by "underweight"? BMI? If so, yeah maybe that's going too far. It's harder to get an accurate body fat % reading, home scales are typically terrible at that.
Assuming you have a reliable body fat % reading, or you're estimating based on online pics showing side by sides of various bf% levels, if you're getting down to 10% for a guy, or 17% for a woman, that's getting quite low. You might experience more hunger, more fatigue, reduced sex drive, gaunt look, reduced ability to heal or fight infection, if female it could affect your period, etc. If in doubt, post pics for neutral opinions here.
Lift anyway. Progressive overload. Structured program. I'm just saying to have different expectations on muscle gain if doing that while trying to lose weight vs while maingaining.
EDIT: I may have misunderstood. No, don't overshoot going down. Get to a level you're comfortable with and maingain from there. It's fine for the weight on the scale to go up a little over time if your body composition is looking better.1 -
Here's a good example from a YouTuber I follow, Mark Lewis, with him and his wife talking about her fitness journey. This is why you don't aim to overshoot on the way down.
Key part at 15m-18m, should be time stamped. She was focused on her weight, the number on the scale, thinking she could only look better if that number went down. She started lifting and working out more. She gained 4.4 pounds while greatly improving body composition and posture, and she likes the way she looks here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUXjbINwTfA&t=900s 1
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