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The myth of age and weightloss?

trixsterjl31
trixsterjl31 Posts: 86 Member
edited September 28 in Debate Club
I saw a post about being older and it being harder to lose weight and easier to gain. When you look it up it says a 20 year old man burns 10 - 15 percent more than a 50 year old all else being the same. My question... is all else the same:
When i was a kid I played games and sports all day.
When i was a teen I played games and sports some times but still rode a bike everywhere.
When i was late teen I got a car and most walking stopped and bike riding became for fun.
When I was 20 plus I exercised to try and stay in shape. Navy, but had I not been Navy the experience would have varied based on job or what I did. I very well could have go to college partied and did other stuff that burned less calories and then moved on to an office job that demanded no activity.
When i was 30 plus I pretty much started exercising in bursts when I noticed I was getting fat and then stopped and yoyo weighted. Work was mildly demanding but didn't keep up with calories from beer and pizza.
40 plus. Pretty much the same as 30 with ups and down in weight, downs forced by effort and habits completely driving gain.
50 plus. Same as 30 plus.

Here is what i'm thinking. Does a 50 year old that cycles for fun and does 10 k runs really have a lot harder time than a 20 year old that does the same losing weight? If they both do mild activity and eat sensibly every day with mild activity instead of the vigorous training will either likely be over weight. If both eat fast food and drink beer at the same by weight/height do you really think that a 20 year old gains weight 15 percent slower than a 50 year old or is it more likely other stuff they do because they are 20 that burns more calories and they dont wake up in traction after a pick up game of basketball?
Now to wonder if anyone will even read all that. lol.

Replies

  • AdahPotatah2024
    AdahPotatah2024 Posts: 2,022 Member
    In my opinion, calories in & calories out is the main factor with weight loss. However, our bodies are not that simple. There's a lot of other factors, as well, including hormonal fluctuations and muscle loss due to aging..for most of us, our bodies aren't quite as efficient, in general, as they were 25-30 years ago. So, to make a long story short, I think it's complex and not yet thoroughly researched enough.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,925 Member
    Hormones do count. There are several studies showing that lower testosterone levels directly affect things like muscle mass and how you burn fat. That said, it was so much easier for me to stay lean into my mid 40's versus now in my 60's. I have to do much more cardio than I've done before and focus on how much I'm eating. But I've grown accustomed to that crap now. :D

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 40 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,171 Member
    edited September 28
    Humans basically begin to cook from the minute we're born and when we're finish cooking we die. It's called glycation creating Advanced Glycation End products (AGE). Cartlidge in a child is white and in a 90 year old it's brown, basically. Slowing that down helps people live better and stay and look younger despite their age :)
  • Tilran
    Tilran Posts: 627 Member
    Metabolism slows as you age, so while the 50 year old and 20 year old in your scenario do the exact same as far as eating and exercise, the 50 year old will have a harder time burning those calories (especially from the hard to burn areas like lower abdomen) and therefore has to either eat less, or workout more to keep same pace as the 20 year old
  • sollyn23l2
    sollyn23l2 Posts: 1,738 Member
    I read it!

    I’ve just turned 50 and I’ve exercised my whole life, doing a series of different sports / activities from ice skating to martial arts to long distance swimming to my current fave, weightlifting.

    The ONLY difference I have personally found is that I need better recovery as a 50 year old. In my early 20s I could go clubbing 2-3 nights in a row, still turn up at uni or work and then exercise. But now if I stay up a couple of hours past my bedtime I feel rough as anything the next day. I have to prioritise sleep and nutrition to be able to exercise as hard as I want and live well . But calories-wise, I suspect I’m eating the most I ever have (only been tracking for 7-8 years so guessing at my intake before then). I certainly eat a lot for someone my size. I also have more muscle mass now than I ever have - which should help me stay independent as I get older.

    Hormones of course do affect metabolism slightly, but I’m going to go back to something I’ve said before: at ANY stage in life it’s hard to be consistently healthy and keep on track. Having a young family, caring for elderly parents, suffering from an autoimmune condition, going through personal stress - they all make it hard to bounce out of bed and choose the healthy lifestyle. But it is possible, and in my own experience, blaming age for slowing metabolism is just an excuse.

    Totally agree. I'm in better shape at 39 than I was at 21. Blaming metabolism is unhelpful, honestly. If you don't feel like you can change it, you won't.
  • SafariGalNYC
    SafariGalNYC Posts: 1,326 Member
    edited September 29
    Lots of cultural bias about aging and performance out there. I don’t think it’s one size fits all.

    How one treats their body over time is key, epigenetics will either boost someone’s performance or weaken it.

    Time to challenge what we think about perceptions of aging and what age “old” is.
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,171 Member
    edited September 29
    Lots of cultural bias about aging and performance out there. I don’t think it’s one size fits all.

    How one treats their body over time is key, epigenetics will either boost someone’s performance or weaken it.

    Time to challenge what we think about perceptions of aging and what age “old” is.

    For sure, epigenetics are basically instructions for our genetic code that influences our gene expression. As far as diet goes, high sugar intake, processed foods and unhealthy fats can and do displace more nutrient rich foods when they represent a significant percentage of the foods we eat.

    The main problem with this diet, other than the obvious health issues is it effect the availability of methyl groups which are essential for methylation which results in undermethylation which leads to reduced enzyme activity affecting the conversion of homocysteine to methionine as well as a deficiency in B vitamins mostly B6 and B12, as well as magnesium and zinc which effect that methylation cycle and certain AA's like cysteine and methionine as well as elevated homocysteine levels which indicate a poor methylation balance and all of this is essential for our body to function properly, all the time, everyday.

    Undermethylation can lead to some usual suspects that people feel on a daily basis, like; fatigue, depression, insomnia, digestive issues, low serotonin, obsessive compulsive behavior, nervousness. AGE's which I mentioned effects oxidative stress and inflammation the most as well and the methyl cycle, which is all part of the puzzle for overall health and longevity and this all lead down the road to unhealth and the now prevalent non communicable diseases like obesity, diabetes and dementia and other brain functions that we find ourselves with. In other words it's more than just calories when it comes to health and weight loss, basically real food matters.

    for more info:

    https://eatfor.life/imbalances/undermethylation/#:~:text=Undermethylation%20%28also%20called%20histadelia%29%20is%20a%20condition%20that,an%20individual%20will%20feel%20depressed%2C%20anxious%2C%20and%20fatigued.



  • Adventurista
    Adventurista Posts: 1,330 Member
    edited September 29
    Interesting thoughtful discussion...

    When i was young, and older people mentioned fatigue, pain, or made reminder lists of things they wanted to get done that/next day. Their skin was wrinkly, they went to bed early instead of staying up later....

    Well, in my hubris, thought, pffftttt, they must be doing something wrong... i will stave off all those things...

    If only....

    Yes, we can slow, even improve some things, but time moves on, and all of us will in some ways or others experience physical and significant declines...

    I think the article(s) is an attempt to describe the possibilities and inevitables...

    Happy happywise, if we are alive, breathing, can put our smile on, enjoy life with family and friends another day, then all good. Each day is actually a bonus and a chance to embrace opportunity on a profound level... or even maybe to rest, just to be and enjoy. Life ought to be cherished. It ends too soon.
  • trixsterjl31
    trixsterjl31 Posts: 86 Member
    SueBarry1 wrote: »
    I am 72 years old- moderately active. I am a chronic yo-yo dieter. I have lost 19 pounds in the 9 weeks-my ldl went from 106 to 33. Have not found this any harder than when I was younger. I actually feel I have more disciple.

    I agree. I'm 53 and have realized that I have already cut years off my life with my past choices(most likely) I working now to maximize what I have left. Especially the quality part.
  • paperpudding
    paperpudding Posts: 9,234 Member
    N=1.

    I lost weight to goal in 2013 age 50. Have put back on couple of kg's up and down since then but basically stayed almost the same.

    In the following 11 years: have gone through menopause and also had a thyroid tumour removed, necessitating taking thyroid medication ( level periodically monitored and adjusted by blood test) and of course grown a decade older.
    Activity level about the same.

    Did not notice any difference in ability to maintain weight at BMI of 23
  • SafariGalNYC
    SafariGalNYC Posts: 1,326 Member
    edited October 2
    Lots of cultural bias about aging and performance out there. I don’t think it’s one size fits all.

    How one treats their body over time is key, epigenetics will either boost someone’s performance or weaken it.

    Time to challenge what we think about perceptions of aging and what age “old” is.

    For sure, epigenetics are basically instructions for our genetic code that influences our gene expression. As far as diet goes, high sugar intake, processed foods and unhealthy fats can and do displace more nutrient rich foods when they represent a significant percentage of the foods we eat.

    The main problem with this diet, other than the obvious health issues is it effect the availability of methyl groups which are essential for methylation which results in undermethylation which leads to reduced enzyme activity affecting the conversion of homocysteine to methionine as well as a deficiency in B vitamins mostly B6 and B12, as well as magnesium and zinc which effect that methylation cycle and certain AA's like cysteine and methionine as well as elevated homocysteine levels which indicate a poor methylation balance and all of this is essential for our body to function properly, all the time, everyday.

    Undermethylation can lead to some usual suspects that people feel on a daily basis, like; fatigue, depression, insomnia, digestive issues, low serotonin, obsessive compulsive behavior, nervousness. AGE's which I mentioned effects oxidative stress and inflammation the most as well and the methyl cycle, which is all part of the puzzle for overall health and longevity and this all lead down the road to unhealth and the now prevalent non communicable diseases like obesity, diabetes and dementia and other brain functions that we find ourselves with. In other words it's more than just calories when it comes to health and weight loss, basically real food matters.

    for more info:

    https://eatfor.life/imbalances/undermethylation/#:~:text=Undermethylation%20%28also%20called%20histadelia%29%20is%20a%20condition%20that,an%20individual%20will%20feel%20depressed%2C%20anxious%2C%20and%20fatigued.



    @neanderthin- agree about AGE’s - I’m surprised I’ve not heard more people on MFP talk about it over the years. A good friend ran a major study on AGEs at Mount Sinai in NYC. Ruined my affinity for Parmesan cheese. Lol

    I think it’s how we treat our bodies.. and I suspect also what we put in them for our chronological age.. rather than biological.

    • Yūichirō Miura was 80 years old when he climbed Mount Everest.

    •There was just a news article about Fauja Singh.. who is a marathon runner.. who still runs at 109 years old!

    Through the years, there are dozens of world class athletes aged 50 - 70 who have competed in the Olympics.

    Link here talking about age and sports :
    https://www.topendsports.com/events/summer/oldest-per-sport.htm

    Can everyone climb Mt. Everest at 80?.. maybe not.. but I think there is much we can do to optimize our health at every age. (There are also 20 year olds that can’t climb Mt. Everest. )



  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,171 Member
    edited October 5
    Lots of cultural bias about aging and performance out there. I don’t think it’s one size fits all.

    How one treats their body over time is key, epigenetics will either boost someone’s performance or weaken it.

    Time to challenge what we think about perceptions of aging and what age “old” is.

    For sure, epigenetics are basically instructions for our genetic code that influences our gene expression. As far as diet goes, high sugar intake, processed foods and unhealthy fats can and do displace more nutrient rich foods when they represent a significant percentage of the foods we eat.

    The main problem with this diet, other than the obvious health issues is it effect the availability of methyl groups which are essential for methylation which results in undermethylation which leads to reduced enzyme activity affecting the conversion of homocysteine to methionine as well as a deficiency in B vitamins mostly B6 and B12, as well as magnesium and zinc which effect that methylation cycle and certain AA's like cysteine and methionine as well as elevated homocysteine levels which indicate a poor methylation balance and all of this is essential for our body to function properly, all the time, everyday.

    Undermethylation can lead to some usual suspects that people feel on a daily basis, like; fatigue, depression, insomnia, digestive issues, low serotonin, obsessive compulsive behavior, nervousness. AGE's which I mentioned effects oxidative stress and inflammation the most as well and the methyl cycle, which is all part of the puzzle for overall health and longevity and this all lead down the road to unhealth and the now prevalent non communicable diseases like obesity, diabetes and dementia and other brain functions that we find ourselves with. In other words it's more than just calories when it comes to health and weight loss, basically real food matters.

    for more info:

    https://eatfor.life/imbalances/undermethylation/#:~:text=Undermethylation%20%28also%20called%20histadelia%29%20is%20a%20condition%20that,an%20individual%20will%20feel%20depressed%2C%20anxious%2C%20and%20fatigued.



    @neanderthin- agree about AGE’s - I’m surprised I’ve not heard more people on MFP talk about it over the years. A good friend ran a major study on AGEs at Mount Sinai in NYC. Ruined my affinity for Parmesan cheese. Lol

    I think it’s how we treat our bodies.. and I suspect also what we put in them for our chronological age.. rather than biological.

    • Yūichirō Miura was 80 years old when he climbed Mount Everest.

    •There was just a news article about Fauja Singh.. who is a marathon runner.. who still runs at 109 years old!

    Through the years, there are dozens of world class athletes aged 50 - 70 who have competed in the Olympics.

    Link here talking about age and sports :
    https://www.topendsports.com/events/summer/oldest-per-sport.htm

    Can everyone climb Mt. Everest at 80?.. maybe not.. but I think there is much we can do to optimize our health at every age. (There are also 20 year olds that can’t climb Mt. Everest. )



    Well, you could pick a 12 month instead of a 36 month parmigiana, lol.

    For sure, the more we try and consume a proper human diet, as in whole natural foods found mostly from the environment we live in addresses our biological needs more directly and minimizes glycation (AGE) for the most part while helping us extend our chronological life span.

    The example I like the most are the traditional shepherds of Ikaria who live in the mountainous region of that Island.
    They consumed foods they grow and raise including the milk, cheese and meat from goats and also consume chickens, ducks and some pork and a lot of legumes, greens, vegetables, potatoes but very little grain, almost none, it is mountainous after all. Their kids unfortunately that have moved away are like the rest of Greece for life expectancy and are around 35th compared to other countries which Canada is 20th and Italy is 9th for example. Even the inhabitants of the coastal and more urban regions of Ikaria don't live as long.

    To your point about activity, I've heard that the men of Ikaria live as long or a little longer than the women which can't be said anywhere from what I've gathered and suspect it's because the men walk several kilometers each day as they tend to their flocks and navigate the island’s mountainous terrain, makes sense. :)

  • SafariGalNYC
    SafariGalNYC Posts: 1,326 Member
    edited October 6


    @neanderthin- agree about AGE’s -

    The example I like the most are the traditional shepherds of Ikaria who live in the mountainous region of that Island.
    They consumed foods they grow and raise including the milk, cheese and meat from goats and also consume chickens, ducks and some pork and a lot of legumes, greens, vegetables, potatoes but very little grain, almost none, it is mountainous after all. Their kids unfortunately that have moved away are like the rest of Greece for life expectancy and are around 35th compared to other countries which Canada is 20th and Italy is 9th for example. Even the inhabitants of the coastal and more urban regions of Ikaria don't live as long.

    To your point about activity, I've heard that the men of Ikaria live as long or a little longer than the women which can't be said anywhere from what I've gathered and suspect it's because the men walk several kilometers each day as they tend to their flocks and navigate the island’s mountainous terrain, makes sense. :)



    @neanderthin - I just came back from Ikaria!!! Love it! ;)
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,171 Member


    @neanderthin- agree about AGE’s -

    The example I like the most are the traditional shepherds of Ikaria who live in the mountainous region of that Island.
    They consumed foods they grow and raise including the milk, cheese and meat from goats and also consume chickens, ducks and some pork and a lot of legumes, greens, vegetables, potatoes but very little grain, almost none, it is mountainous after all. Their kids unfortunately that have moved away are like the rest of Greece for life expectancy and are around 35th compared to other countries which Canada is 20th and Italy is 9th for example. Even the inhabitants of the coastal and more urban regions of Ikaria don't live as long.

    To your point about activity, I've heard that the men of Ikaria live as long or a little longer than the women which can't be said anywhere from what I've gathered and suspect it's because the men walk several kilometers each day as they tend to their flocks and navigate the island’s mountainous terrain, makes sense. :)



    @neanderthin - I just came back from Ikaria!!! Love it! ;)

    B)
  • HoneyBadger302
    HoneyBadger302 Posts: 2,055 Member
    I believe this is a very complicated subject. Mind you, I'm only in my mid 40's right now, but I believe the factors are much broader than just exercise+food+age.
    • As I've aged, I've gotten more professional positions, which also means a lot more sitting throughout my day (trying to counteract some of that with a walking pad and other "activity additions" but reality is, those will never make up for running around a retail store or barn with arms full of "stuff" for all my working hours).
    • Even in college classes, there was a lot of walking between classes/around campus. Now, you get to the the office or workplace and stay there.
    • Recovery from injuries was a bit faster - although now that I've start HRT I don't find that to be a massive difference, BUT...
    • Injuries accumulate over time, especially for those who've been a bit more extreme in their activity choices or got unlucky. One aching joint is now a bunch of aching joints, which all need to be managed when it comes to our on-going fitness and workouts
    • Genetics play a variety of roles that can affect us
    • SOCIETY. Society tends to dismiss us once we're middle aged+ - even if you're up to the challenge, you will face a ton of subliminal and some outright dissuasion of doing "active" things that "most" people don't do. So not only is it working with your own body, your own mind, your own life, you're also having to power through all the naysayers and people dismissing you just because of your age.
    • Small activity adds up, but the older you get, the more money you get, the more likely you are to have (and most people take) the slightly easier option. Ordering in dinner on that night after a long, super stressful week, whereas when you were young and broke, that might not have been an option, and you ate what you had at home, tired and exhausted or not.

    I firmly believe most of this can be overcome, or worked through, and while I have not successfully sustained weight loss since getting my first desk job 15 years ago, I also don't believe it has much to do with my age - but instead my overall activity level combined with an appetite that has never adjusted to lower activity levels. Ironically, my yo-yo'ing these 20-25 pounds the past decade has shown me that, overall, my appetite does not increase much (if at all, and often seems to go down) with significantly increased activity, but it does NOT go down with decreased activity.

    Therefore, for me, a key part for my weight is activity - which can be tough when you are having to "adult" but just a fact I can't ignore and have seen the proof of multiple times in my life. So finding ways where I'll be more likely to be "forced" to be active helps....(such as a physically demanding p/t job and a very active pet).
  • xbowhunter
    xbowhunter Posts: 1,134 Member
    I'm 55 and the power of positive thinking has changed my life forever.

    Don't say if say when and the when is now... :)