Bench press just seems pointless to me

Alehmer

...unless you are just going for looks or training specifically to have a big bench press IMHO.

I have only done a bench press once since high school, and I have to say I have a really, really hard time seeing how it is a useful exercise outside of bodybuilding and powerlifting. Even in the very, very few sports where you need Maximal strength from your pectorals, outside of specifically training in powerlifting for the bench press I have a hard time seeing where other lifts wouldn't be much more useful.

Anytime (I can think of) you are on your feet in sports or trying to move something heavy, if you are pushing with your pecs you are doing it wrong. All that power is coming from your legs, and core, or at least should be. Even while laying on the ground, where I am all the time in my sport of submission wrestling, if you are bench-pressing someone you are wasting energy and begging to get submitted at the same time. The gym I attend is run by a professional MMA fighter and has a stable of amateur MMA fighters, yet you won't find a bench press setup anywhere.

To be clear again, yeah, pecs look good, and if that's what you care about then god bless and this isn't directed at you. If you like doing it or want to powerlift, then you're in the same boat.

For everyone else, what's the obsession? What can you get out of a bench press that you can't functionally get better out of pushups (any variation), ring work, or functional sports practice?

I know it may be a little inflammatory, but please don't take it as me trying to pick a fight or anything. I don't understand why people put it in such a lofty position or see it as necessary and I am hoping someone can illustrate me as to why.

Alehmer

Wrong forum, mods please move to exercise.

ninerbuff

I'll have to disagree. Even in MMA there are times you have to push an opponent away while on your back. You'd need some function from the pecs here to do that, unless one has humongous triceps of course, but still there is pectoral activation to achieve this. In fact any pushing away from the front of the body will require pectoral use. I won't disagree that the majority of people that do it though are because of looks and gauging of strength.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

contingencyplan

Maybe it's just me, but I feel the pecs working harder doing suspended dips than I do the bench press.

bumblebums

OP, I think you are confused about the muscles involved in a bench press. It's not just a "pecs exercise".

Frank_Just_Frank

Reminds me of Mark Rippetoe. He once wrote an article saying you're better off concentrating on the overhead press for strength, implying the bench is more for growing man boobs LOL!

rassha01

So that would make push ups worthless as well? I don't know after working my chest I can feel it my entire day, this tells me that I must use them for more than just throwing that weight around.

ItsCasey

OP, I refer you to this T-Nation article, assuming you are actually looking for reasons to DO the bench press, rather than reasons NOT to do it: http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/why_the_bench_press_is_the_best_exercise&cr=

HeidiMightyRawr

I'll have to disagree. Even in MMA there are times you have to push an opponent away while on your back. You'd need some function from the pecs here to do that, unless one has humongous triceps of course, but still there is pectoral activation to achieve this. In fact any pushing away from the front of the body will require pectoral use. I won't disagree that the majority of people that do it though are because of looks and gauging of strength.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

I agree with this. You may use your legs a lot in instances where you push something/someone away, I don't deny that. However, I still think that improving pectoral strength (especially if they're really weak) will help somewhat. Bench press is just one of the ways you can improve here, along with the other exercises you mentioned.

I do see many people (usually young men) use the bench press for looks or ego ("what do you bench?" being such a common phrase) and whether I agree or disagree with that, I won't let that influence my opinions on that particular exercise, or everyone who does it, who doesn't powerlift. I like variety.

BusyRaeNOTBusty

Bench works a lot more than just pecks, triceps, shoulders, core, even back. And isn't balance important? I want to do pushing exercises to balance the pulling. Chest exercises to balance the back.

And yeah, what is wrong with a little vanity. A nice man chest is my favorite. It's a good place to put my hands when I'm .... nevermind.

MrThickCut

Stop walking. Its pretty much useless. I mean, everyone else is driving a hoveround. Why not add yourself to the list?

Save all you energy for OHP and Squats

rybo

If you are going this route, then you should say all barbell movements are pointless as they all have alternatives not requiring the use of a bar. But to just pick out bench really doesnt make sense.

Plus, 100% of gyms have a bench press, I would guess very, very few have rings to work on.

bumblebums

Reminds me of Mark Rippetoe. He once wrote an article saying you're better off concentrating on the overhead press for strength, implying the bench is more for growing man boobs LOL!

Please point us to where he said this. I would be quite interested in seeing the original, because I've read a lot of his writing, and I've never seen him write anything that could be interpreted this way.

tomcornhole

Last session on DL I hit a 1RM PR and my left pec felt like it was going to explode. This has happened more than once on DL. That would imply that pecs are used in DL and everyone lifts stuff, right?

I think dumbbell flies are probably better for big man boobs, too.

Tom

chrisdavey

The advantage it has over push ups are ease of changing loads quantitatively. Push ups let the scapula move freely however.

And yes it definitely works more than pecs, I had quad cramps today.

ninerbuff

Last session on DL I hit a 1RM PR and my left pec felt like it was going to explode. This has happened more than once on DL. That would imply that pecs are used in DL and everyone lifts stuff, right?

I think dumbbell flies are probably better for big man boobs, too.

Tom

Indirectly yes. Sounds like pectoral minor activation though.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

EmilyJackCO

I find that the strength I build from bench press assists in other movements that build strength as well. Also, I lift servers and hardware equipment a lot - without chest press, I couldn't rack a 6U unit without help. As it stands now, I can. And I can still only bench 55 pounds... It has developed a lot more than my chest and pectorals, as well.

I can attest to the vanity factor from a women's standpoint as well - delayed gravity onset, and that's no small reason why I continue to emphasize it.

_noob_

I think it's a great exercise, but would agree that it is VERY overrated as a metric of useful strength.

Alehmer

Let's address the Straw Man arguments right away, and hopefully we don't do them again.

A barbell is a tool that can be used in many many ways, I am just saying that this particular application doesn't seem to have a functional use.

If walking is a Maximal Strength exercise for you and you can only manage a few steps, please seek immediate medical attention.

I maintain that the maximal strength exercise of the heavy bench press has little to no application outside of doing the exercise itself or building mass in a specific muscle group, at least as far as my current understanding goes.

Anybody with a normal body and even marginal pressing strength will easily be able to face a wall and push themselves back over their heels with just 2-3 fingers if they maintain a vertical position. The only way to get to where you need maximal pressing strength standing requires a forward angle far beyond you would ever see in a bench press or one leg back, where it becomes obvious that the core and leg muscles can easily overwhelm your forward pressing power.

Having spent 5 years grappling, you never press anywhere near to extension unless you dearly want to get arm barred or you are totally new to the sport. It's all explosive pushes to make room for escapes or to set a structural frame for your arms.

Yet, clearly many people, including professional athletes like NFL players and the like do the exercise regularly. I am trying to understand why when I never see anybody actually use that movement in that way.

I think I could see it as a basis for other kinds of strength to supplement and improve speed, endurance, explosiveness, etc. But in that case, why is it such a huge part of many workout routines?

Frank_Just_Frank

Reminds me of Mark Rippetoe. He once wrote an article saying you're better off concentrating on the overhead press for strength, implying the bench is more for growing man boobs LOL!

Please point us to where he said this. I would be quite interested in seeing the original, because I've read a lot of his writing, and I've never seen him write anything that could be interpreted this way.

Oh wow, it's been too long it was probably one of his on T-Nation if you want to find it. He was calling them chesticles if that helps you.

Frank_Just_Frank

Reminds me of Mark Rippetoe. He once wrote an article saying you're better off concentrating on the overhead press for strength, implying the bench is more for growing man boobs LOL!

Please point us to where he said this. I would be quite interested in seeing the original, because I've read a lot of his writing, and I've never seen him write anything that could be interpreted this way.

Today's your lucky day. I found it.

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/get_your_press_up&cr=

crackur

OP knows nothing but then again.......common thing here.

SezxyStef

For everyone else, what's the obsession? What can you get out of a bench press that you can't functionally get better out of pushups (any variation), ring work, or functional sports practice?

for some it's not about what other exercises you "can" do...it's about what is preferred and or what their goal is or what is available or a combination of those things.

For me personally I prefer the bench press to pushups because at some point I plan on being able to bench more then my body weight...so what then?

Yes I could strap weight to myself but at home that would be difficult along with ring work etc...

As well it's not just for "Pecs"...last time I looked down at my chest pecs were there but covered with something else.

ETA: if you have maybe done 1 since high school your understanding of what they are good for is limited as well...so perhaps try doing a few months of them and see what happens...

DatMurse

Even while laying on the ground, where I am all the time in my sport of submission wrestling, if you are bench-pressing someone you are wasting energy and begging to get submitted at the same time. The gym I attend is run by a professional MMA fighter and has a stable of amateur MMA fighters, yet you won't find a bench press setup anywhere.

pushing them off you?
lineman push, combination of core and everything else
punching itself is a tricep and chest movement

Alehmer

OP knows nothing but then again.......common thing here.

Ah, quite the compelling and cogent argument. Thank you for using your knowledge to sways others.

ndj1979

Bench works a lot more than just pecks, triceps, shoulders, core, even back. And isn't balance important? I want to do pushing exercises to balance the pulling. Chest exercises to balance the back.

And yeah, what is wrong with a little vanity. A nice man chest is my favorite. It's a good place to put my hands when I'm .... nevermind.

please continue with your thought...

cwolfman13

I don't see anything wrong with looking awesome and doing things that make you look more awesome. I'll continue to bench and do dips and push-ups...I look a lot better with some chest than I do all caved in and what not.

Stage14

Let's address the Straw Man arguments right away, and hopefully we don't do them again.

A barbell is a tool that can be used in many many ways, I am just saying that this particular application doesn't seem to have a functional use.

If walking is a Maximal Strength exercise for you and you can only manage a few steps, please seek immediate medical attention.

I maintain that the maximal strength exercise of the heavy bench press has little to no application outside of doing the exercise itself or building mass in a specific muscle group, at least as far as my current understanding goes.

Anybody with a normal body and even marginal pressing strength will easily be able to face a wall and push themselves back over their heels with just 2-3 fingers if they maintain a vertical position. The only way to get to where you need maximal pressing strength standing requires a forward angle far beyond you would ever see in a bench press or one leg back, where it becomes obvious that the core and leg muscles can easily overwhelm your forward pressing power.

Having spent 5 years grappling, you never press anywhere near to extension unless you dearly want to get arm barred or you are totally new to the sport. It's all explosive pushes to make room for escapes or to set a structural frame for your arms.

Yet, clearly many people, including professional athletes like NFL players and the like do the exercise regularly. I am trying to understand why when I never see anybody actually use that movement in that way.

I think I could see it as a basis for other kinds of strength to supplement and improve speed, endurance, explosiveness, etc. But in that case, why is it such a huge part of many workout routines?

I'm still trying to figure out why the premise that any time you push against something, you will either be standing or competing in submission wrestling just seems to be accepted as fact. Because, that's the crux of the argument, and if you don't accept it as true, then the entire rest of OP's argument crumbles.

Personally, I don't do that much pushing against things while standing up in my day to day life, and I do zero submission wrestling for sport. But i can think of multiple times in the last few weeks where I've needed to push something up or away while flat on my back.

Alehmer

OP, I refer you to this T-Nation article, assuming you are actually looking for reasons to DO the bench press, rather than reasons NOT to do it: http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/why_the_bench_press_is_the_best_exercise&cr=

That article seemed to focus on how all the other pressing exercises didn't seem to increase his bench press 1RM, which is the opposite of what I am going for here. He says at the end of the article that the push press is likely the better exercise for sports.

Bench works a lot more than just pecks, triceps, shoulders, core, even back. And isn't balance important? I want to do pushing exercises to balance the pulling. Chest exercises to balance the back.

And yeah, what is wrong with a little vanity. A nice man chest is my favorite. It's a good place to put my hands when I'm .... nevermind.

I can completely support this. But how many times have you seen people working hard on their barbell row 1RM?

Again, I am not against pressing strength in any way, shape, or form. I am just trying to understand the huge focus on the movement that seems to have the least application of any pressing exercises.

Alehmer

I'm still trying to figure out why the premise that any time you push against something, you will either be standing or competing in submission wrestling just seems to be accepted as fact. Because, that's the crux of the argument, and if you don't accept it as true, then the entire rest of OP's argument crumbles.

Personally, I don't do that much pushing against things while standing up in my day to day life, and I do zero submission wrestling for sport. But i can think of multiple times in the last few weeks where I've needed to push something up or away while flat on my back.

Then you misunderstand the premise.

How many of those times when you were pressing from your back were you anywhere near your maximal strength limit?
How often do people in their jobs or hobbies do this? If it's on the job, it certainly seems like an OSHA risk to be lifting something that unsecured and heavy by yourself.

I spoke about grappling, but I was clearly including all expressions of pressing strength while standing. I also included it because while it seems like it would be a strong application while lying on the ground, it is not.


I am for pressing strength, I am for having a strong push, I do not understand why this movement has so much focus on it where it seems to have far fewer applications.

jimmmer

Yet, clearly many people, including professional athletes like NFL players and the like do the exercise regularly. I am trying to understand why when I never see anybody actually use that movement in that way.

There's an argument that they'd be better of focusing on incline bench, when you consider that they are moving forward, at an angle and pushing parallel to the ground. Incline would seem to have more carry-over than flat bench for football (or hand-egg as we call it over here.....)

I'm personally of the school of thought that you should focus on the major movements:

Push
Pull
Squat
Hinge
Carry
Get-up/tumbling/everything else/?

How you cash those movements out then can be rotated. e.g for push: you can do a couple of weeks of flat bench, then switch out to incline, then rotate in military press, etc. Keeps you fresh, develops ways to apply force from different angles, etc.