I just don't care about the 'obesity epidemic'
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I gotta be honest guys, I have no idea where I'm going with this. I just read one too many articles on the 'horror' of obesity rates and snapped. My posts probably don't even make any sense because I have so many conflicting thoughts running through my head at the moment. But that's what internet forums are for sometimes. :glasses:
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While I see your point, posting it here is kinda like getting on cnn.com and ranting about how politics don't really matter.0
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Obese people cost 40% more a year in health care related expenses than a "normal" weight person. As a rule they do not pay more for health insurance than a "normal" size person, i.e., there is a cost that is spread to people who can push away from the table. Statistically obese people call in "sick" to work more often and file more workers comp claims (not to mention health care workers who are injured taking care of obese patients-happens all the time), so again, money.
It isn't about aesthetics, it's about money.
I'm morbidly obese, have been for 15 years, and I've been to the doctor twice, once for strep and once for a UTI. I'm not costing you a penny. And come to think of it, I was living in Canada at the time.
My skinny husband has been to the doctor far more than I have, and we've always paid out of pocket. So neither one of us are costing anyone anything.
(I know the argument to follow will be future based, but none of us are guaranteed a "future" so it is moot in this case.)0 -
SO HOW MUCH do you need to weight in Japan to pay extra tax?0
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You've been a member since 2011, so I presume you are not targeting your rant, if you will, to those who frequent MFP. Here I certainly have not seen any judgment toward people who have extra weight. In fact, it's quite the opposite.
What is your point?
I have to slightly disagree here. I have seen MANY people on these message boards with snarky, nasty attitudes towards obese people. I have been on this site on and off for a year or so and have tried to just skim thru boards instead of actually commenting because some of the extremely fit and healthy hold themselves on a pedestal and are hurtful. as much as there are helpful, caring, motivational people here, (just like everywhere else in the world) there are also...well...*kitten*.
And as it may be taken a little too personal, or maybe someones a bit too sensitive that's pretty common with weight issues big or small. Theres pretty much always a reason for weight problems and of course someone might be sensitive about it. We should be supporting each other, not attacking or belittling someones feelings. Everyone has a right to a rant.
and mines done. lol0 -
I'm constantly amazed at how upset people get about things they read/hear. I don't care about the obesity epidemic and I don't care if other people do. [shrugs]In fact, I'm sick of reading/hearing about it everywhere. I don't care if you weigh 100 pounds or 500 pounds. I don't care what you eat. I don't care how much you eat. I don't care how often you eat.0 -
BMI is a measure for populations, not individuals. As we are talking populations here, it applies.I kind of have an issue with hearing about the 'obesity epidepmic' is that BMI is used to determined who is obese and who isn't. Have a look at mybodygallery.com
I am 5ft2.5 for someone my height 75kg(165lbs) is obese.
You can enter those stats for comparison. There are clearly people in that size who look to have a lot of fat around their middles and look like they probably don't do exercise. But there are (quite a few) who are obviously fit and active and probably quite healthy.
So there should be a better measure that classifies people who are overweight to a point of compromising their health.There has also been a study recently showing that people who are overweight have a lower mortality rate than those with a healthy BMI and those who are underweight. (Mostly due to the preponderance of people who are overweight but fit). There are also studies showing that overweight people deal with stress better (and most of those who pay tax dollars would be put under a reasonable amount of stress in their workplaces.
The study you reference is no basis for argument. It is the basis for further study as to what is going on. Unfortunately the media likes to publish studies that generally have no meaning. You can find a multitude more studies that show being overweight/obese is worse.
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To the OP:
Everyone's life is affected by society as a whole. If those around you are unable to function, or function in a reduced capacity it affects you.0 -
I kind of have an issue with hearing about the 'obesity epidepmic' is that BMI is used to determined who is obese and who isn't. Have a look at mybodygallery.com
I am 5ft2.5 for someone my height 75kg(165lbs) is obese.
You can enter those stats for comparison. There are clearly people in that size who look to have a lot of fat around their middles and look like they probably don't do exercise. But there are (quite a few) who are obviously fit and active and probably quite healthy.
So there should be a better measure that classifies people who are overweight to a point of compromising their health.
There has also been a study recently showing that people who are overweight have a lower mortality rate than those with a healthy BMI and those who are underweight. (Mostly due to the preponderence of people who are overweight but fit). There are also studies showing that overweight people deal with stress better (and most of those who pay tax dollars would be put under a reasonable amount of stress in their workplaces.
I am not sure about the algorithms used, but are underweight individuals penalised as much by insurance companies as those who are obese?
Yes, you are obese and no you are not big boned. You are in denial and the reason studies show that larger people live longer is due to modern day medication, not because they are in any way, shape, or form healthy. It's only a matter of time before you have a some combination of diabetes, high cholesterol, and high blood pressure. Will you die from diabetes and high blood pressure? No, not as long as you visit the doctor enough times to manage your condition with medications and have 911 on speed dial.0 -
You're taking this way too personally. I don't care about specific people being obese (except about their health) but there are plenty of reasons to care about the bigger picture of such a big proportion of the population being obese.
I'm sorry, but what are those reasons exactly?
caring about the obesity epidemic, and caring about the feelings of people who are obese are not mutually exclusive. If you really care about other people, you care about their quality of life. That includes good physical and mental health. Obesity can be detrimental to both of them, it can also affect people's mobility and prevent them from doing things that they may enjoy and be beneficial to them. You can respect someone's humanity and feelings and treat them with respect, and care about their health and quality of life at the same time.
Just because someone wants to prevent and treat obesity, doesn't mean they want to kill off or ostracise obese people.... it usually means they want obese people to have the opportunity, knowledge and support to overcome obesity and have better health and a better quality of life. I don't want to be obese because I have better health and a better quality of life for not being obese (and yes I was obese in the past, so I'm comparing myself now with myself then). So surely wanting everyone to be able to make that choice is the compassionate thing to do, rather than not caring and not trying to do anything to help people avoid or treat obesity....?0 -
I think that an individual person's body is none of my business, but the fact that there has been an increase in obesity in recent times, especially in the US, is a public health issue.
Agreed. Shaming is bad, but it's important that we understand the causes of obesity (from a sociological standpoint, not the obvious) in order to help the individuals. Our culture is changing, and obesity is a part of that. We study culture and societies because it enhances our knowledge, helps prevent disease. I'm interested in the obesity epidemic just from that point of view, but I like trying to figure out what makes people tick.
TL;DR. Obesity is not just an individual problem but a cultural issue, not just in cost but in cause.0 -
Obese people cost 40% more a year in health care related expenses than a "normal" weight person. As a rule they do not pay more for health insurance than a "normal" size person, i.e., there is a cost that is spread to people who can push away from the table. Statistically obese people call in "sick" to work more often and file more workers comp claims (not to mention health care workers who are injured taking care of obese patients-happens all the time), so again, money.
It isn't about aesthetics, it's about money.
Old people are a real pain the a** too then.
Lets not forget the anorexics/bulimics/smokers/iv drug users and raging alcoholics lets talk about the drain these normal sized citizens have on your pocket...0 -
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again, where is the accountablitly.. Most (not all) of these people have no concern for the burden that they are placing on society. They drive around in their rascal scooters double fisting 3lb burritos and expect everyone to pat them on the back and say good job for just being you.. meanwhile everyone else has to work 14hr days to cover the rising taxes and increased healthcare because they have to buy heavy duty chairs for the waiting room, or extra strength gurneys for the hospital and replace the ambulances because they don't have enough capacity.. that's how we are affected by it, and it continues to other areas as well.
where's the social services investigating that 200lb kid because his parents don't feed him healthy or make sure he gets enough exercise. the problem is we've become so pc now, even the doctors can't tell these people "hey, your way heavy, you might want to lose some weight, it's not good for you" they get offended and run to the med board to complain.. seriously??
we've Pc'd ourselves into this problem. Not saying shame them, but when you can't tell someone the truth for thier own good, what have we become. the US is such a young country in comparison and we think we have the answers for everything. everyone is so damn sensitive now about everything, you can't even have a conversation without someone crying foul.
you have your rights to be how you want to be until it affects everyone else, and then i have my right not to agree with it.0 -
Obese people cost 40% more a year in health care related expenses than a "normal" weight person. As a rule they do not pay more for health insurance than a "normal" size person, i.e., there is a cost that is spread to people who can push away from the table. Statistically obese people call in "sick" to work more often and file more workers comp claims (not to mention health care workers who are injured taking care of obese patients-happens all the time), so again, money.
It isn't about aesthetics, it's about money.
Old people are a real pain the a** too then.
Except aging isn't preventable.. Unless you kill people off before they get old. Try again.
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meanwhile everyone else has to work 14hr days to cover the rising taxes and increased healthcare because they have to buy heavy duty chairs for the waiting room, or extra strength gurneys for the hospital and replace the ambulances because they don't have enough capacity.. that's how we are affected by it, and it continues to other areas as well.
It's easy to tell the people that get their information from the evening news...
Do you really think that taxes are going up as a result of the "obesity epidemic"? Do you know anything about geo-political economics?
Trust me.. it aint bariatric healtcare equipment. Here is a little link for you, check it out http://www.usdebtclock.org/0 -
Just one problem is that you'll have to pay more for healthy care. If people keep getting fatter bus/plane seats will soon be too small and the new seats will be paid from the taxes that you pay. Obviously there are more reasons but I'm lazy and I'm pretty sure you can imagine now why you should care at least a bit.0
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nice link, ty.. medicare/aid top that as the largest debts.. and I agree it isn't the ONLY factor to rising costs but it is becoming a large part of it that has a visible direct impact on everyone else.
and yes, part of the news (more online than evening, don't have time to watch it) is where the information comes from..0 -
Our tax dollars do pay for welfare, food stamps, medical care and disability for the people who are so grossly overweight they can't get up and go to work anymore. It does fall on the rest of us...0
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I gotta be honest guys, I have no idea where I'm going with this. I just read one too many articles on the 'horror' of obesity rates and snapped. My posts probably don't even make any sense because I have so many conflicting thoughts running through my head at the moment. But that's what internet forums are for sometimes. :glasses:
You're right, you are not making sense.
You really don't have a point do you?
People are people no matter how much or how little weight they have on them.
Nope, no point. Just wild frustration with the world. Don't mind me. :drinker:
It's okay, OP, you're 20. Navigating the world is pretty frustrating sometimes. It will probably get more easy to manage over time. Life experience usually helps. 0 -
In the UK, we have the NHS which is free (Or tax funded).
If you were to look at it in a 'fat people cost more health wise' kind of way, then the same would go for people who smoke, or people who drink in excess, or do drugs. Or what about the people who live off benefits and don't contribute taxes? Or people with dangerous recreational hobbies?
Unfortunately we live in a world of excess, and if I had a problem with everyone that had the potential to cost the Government more money than 'normal', I'd be a very sad and unhappy person.0 -
It's a spiritual crisis in my book. It also says something about how we have changed over the last 100 years, both in our level of activity (hello television and internet ) and in our food (fast food, processed, etc).
Besides, caring is important. It's like caring that porn is at an all time high and many young kids are getting traffiked into hell because of it. Caring that our environment is changing... caring that our lifestyle impacts people around the world... caring that our neighbor may be hurting or lonely or in need.
Caring is different from judging, which is what many folks do. And frankly caring will change the world where judging will only perpetuate the issues...0 -
again, where is the accountablitly.. Most (not all) of these people have no concern for the burden that they are placing on society. They drive around in their rascal scooters double fisting 3lb burritos and expect everyone to pat them on the back and say good job for just being you.. meanwhile everyone else has to work 14hr days to cover the rising taxes and increased healthcare because they have to buy heavy duty chairs for the waiting room, or extra strength gurneys for the hospital and replace the ambulances because they don't have enough capacity.. that's how we are affected by it, and it continues to other areas as well.
These are your personal stereotypes and issues at work. Most people with a BMI over 30 are working, paying taxes, getting their kids off to school, trying to solve problems and attempting to enjoy life when possible. Interestingly, that about covers what most adults are doing on a daily basis around the world. Most adults, obese or not, are perfectly capable of walking and are not eating 3 lb burritos at any time of day.
Hospitals are replacing equipment to be able to deal with people getting larger. If you are in the US, let's be very clear...it is most likely that the hospital that is closest to you is owned by and insurance group, is affiliated with an educational institution, is paying no taxes and is running at millions in profit (see: University of Pittsburgh Medical Center). Affordable Healhcare as proposed in the US, is not a traditional National Healthcare System. Any implication that they are the same is fairy tale talking point math. NHS is funded completely by tax dollars, the US system is a for profit model with a number of loopholes allowing the parent companies to use the names of not for profit institutions to essentially turn hospital groups into tax shelters. The financial complications of making changes to facilities under these two systems are not the same. A traditional NHS has less money to upgrade facilities. Us hospitals are not in the same crunch.where's the social services investigating that 200lb kid because his parents don't feed him healthy or make sure he gets enough exercise. the problem is we've become so pc now, even the doctors can't tell these people "hey, your way heavy, you might want to lose some weight, it's not good for you" they get offended and run to the med board to complain.. seriously??
we've Pc'd ourselves into this problem. Not saying shame them, but when you can't tell someone the truth for thier own good, what have we become. the US is such a young country in comparison and we think we have the answers for everything. everyone is so damn sensitive now about everything, you can't even have a conversation without someone crying foul.
you have your rights to be how you want to be until it affects everyone else, and then i have my right not to agree with it.
Unlike the US hospital system, social service agencies are underfunded. Just like school sports, physical education, community centers, public parks, public pools and most truly non-profit institutions that serve to keep communities healthy, family service agncies have had their budgets slashed. Social service agencies in the last 20 to 30 years have been consistently having to have less people do more work. The statistics are clear all over the US. So in the context of this conversation if a caseworker is called to a school because of the numerous feeding issues in US society, he/she will be dealing with the 12 year-old with the low BMI. The undernourished child is at greater risk for illness, injury, cognitive disorientation and truancy. Point blank, a child with access to food is more likely to be awake in school than a child going without. Socialwork agencies have limited resources and most are at critical mass. Agencies tend to work with people closes to or at crisis point. Those are the choices that must be made when the agency does not have enough money to hire adequate staff to serve to the population.
The idea that doctors in the US can't tell people to lose weight is made up. Almost all major insurance providers require doctors to weigh their patients every time they are seen if the patient exceeds a normal range BMI. As most doctors like to get paid, they are fairly diligent about recording weight and letting people know that being overweight is an issue. Insurance companies started keeping these metrics to justify pre-existing condition claim denials, rate increases or outright coverage losses/denials.
The notion that political correctness has anything to do with the US healthcare system is frankly laughable. Political Correctness is a term born out of Soviet Russian cultural critique that became part of the study of identity politics in other nations. Somehow in the US people are unwittingly going back to the original Soviety pejorative usage without knowing it...basically parroting to rhetoric of those with political power so as to appear patriotic.0 -
Tax dollars. :grumble:
So you wouldn't have to pay taxes anymore if everyone were thin and healthy?
I don't think the poster meant that, exactly. But the obesity epidemic costs the US big bucks in health care costs.0 -
I care which is why I'm in a Wellness Center. Obesity never brings out the best person they could be nor helps them achieve goals they may long for. It's preventable and treatable which is why I help people overcome it for a living. And the gratitude you get from people would trump any feelings about not caring. That's my take on it anyway.
A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
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Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
Let me start by saying I am not judgemental of overweight people, and I am sure most would rather not be that way. I am posting objectively to avoid writing a book.
What kind of nation would we be if we didn't care about the health of our own population? There is no denying that obesity leads to health problems, and there is no denying that it has driving up the cost of healthcare, just like many other subsets of the population (substance abusers, smokers, ect.) I have seen hundreds of knee replacement patients, of which probably 95% (estimate) were obese and overweight patients. I have seen diabetics lose their limbs, eyesight, and ability to fight infection to type 2 diabetes, not to mention the heart disease.
I know I will probably get flammed for this, but the American obesity rate is embarrassing. It is a reflection of the overconsumption and wasteful, short-sighted culture we live in. As an above poster mentioned, I too have partly attributed this 'epidemic' to capitolism. This dawned on me when I decided to make healthier choices. I started counting how many times I ran into 'junk' in one day. Candy at the check out, Dr. Pepper billboards, an announcement at the grocery store that they now carry gelato in the deli, FOUR separate high schoolers knocking on my door to sell me cookie dough in one week. It is literally everywhere, and then some, because someone is trying to make a buck. Just because someone is selling it, doesn't mean we should buy it.0 -
Obese people cost 40% more a year in health care related expenses than a "normal" weight person. As a rule they do not pay more for health insurance than a "normal" size person, i.e., there is a cost that is spread to people who can push away from the table. Statistically obese people call in "sick" to work more often and file more workers comp claims (not to mention health care workers who are injured taking care of obese patients-happens all the time), so again, money.
It isn't about aesthetics, it's about money.
Old people are a real pain the a** too then.
There ya go...I'm a fat person and I am not costing more to anyone in health care releated expenses. I've been to the clinic sick a couple of times, but I cost no more in those instances that a "normal" weight person. And the sickness was not because of my weight. So that does not apply across the board.0 -
How does your curvy/chubby/fat/obese neighbor affect you?
If my curvy/chubby/fat/obese neighbor uses an excessive amount of healthcare services to treat their curvy/chubby/fat/obese related health problems, that affects everyone.
Plus the fattest person on the plane always sits directly next to me and spills into my personal space, which makes for a long and uncomfortable flight...0 -
It effects me by costing me more money on my insurance premiums.... I wouldn't care one bit if a person ate themselves into an oblivion if they didn't get type 2 diabetes and then not take their medicine or monitor it in anyway. Not to mention the costs of bariatric surgery and the slew of other health problems that inflict more obese people than reasonably weighted people. The company I work for's medical costs have gone up 3 million dollars per year to $28 million because people aren't taking care of themselves... obesity related issues included... it's costing me and the company I work for more money... money that could be used for raises instead of taking care of people too damn stubborn to go see a doctor and do what they say.0
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