Does lemon juice make my body more alkaline?
ThickMcRunFast
Posts: 22,511 Member
I have seen a bizarrely large number of people make the claim on this site that lemon juice in water will somehow lower body pH (and that, if this happened, that it would be a good thing). When asked for a reason why, the common response is that while lemon juice is acidic, lemons have ‘minerals’ in them that will neutralize the acid, and even alkalize a liquid. I thought I would use my friend chemistry to investigate just what mass of ‘minerals’ would be needed to accomplish this.
Lets say you, valiant MFP user, get up and start your day with some tasty lemon water. We shall say you squeeze 2 tablespoons into your water. For the sake of easy math, we will assume your water to be neutral pH, so all we have to worry about is the lemon juice.
Lemon juice has, on average a pH of 2-3. We’ll call it 2.5
pH = -log[H+]; or the negative logarithm of the concentration of hydrogen ions (in M, or moles per liter)
2.5 = -log x; x = 10^-2.5; or 0.0032 M (moles/L)
2 tablespoons is roughly 30ml of liquid. Converting this to liters, and multiplying by the concentration gives us a total of 9.6x10^-5 moles of H+ in our lemon juice.
In order to neutralize that, we will need a source of anions (negatively charged ions). Those that matter to alkalinity are mainly carbonates, with a few phosphates, borates, and a minor silicate. Unless you are eating drywall or 20 Mule Team Borax, chances are the most common mineral of this kind you are going to see is calcium carbonate (CaCO3; also known as limestone, or the active ingredient in Tums). This mineral will dissociate in the presence of a strong acid to Ca2+ and CO3--. Since the carbonate ion has a 2- charge, we need half the concentration of hydrogen ions, which only have a 1+ charge.
So, we will need 4.8x10^-5 moles of calcium carbonate. What does that work out to, weight-wise?
CaCO3 has a molar mass of 100g/mole (Ca = 40; C=12; O=16x3=48); easy to work with. Times the mass by the number of moles needed.
This yields 4.8x10^-3g; or 4.8 mg of calcium carbonate to neutralize the acid in two tablespoons of lemon juice.
This is a lot. Like, if you don’t see an actual pill of calcium carbonate chilling in your two tablespoons of lemon juice, you aren’t going to neutralize your water, let alone alkalize it.
But what about in your stomach? Lets say, for the sake of argument, that there is some alkaline mineral in your lemon juice, and that it is protected from dissolving in its highly acidic, lemony home environment. It has a casing around it designed by…oh, lets say Monsanto. That’s right, Monsanto is putting acid-resistant beads in your lemons. Monsanto also decides when these beads crack open to release the minerals. Once it hits your stomach, a Monsanto minion presses the button and poof, now you have alkaline minerals up in your system. How much would you need to neutralize your stomach acid (not even alkalize, just neutralize what is already there)?
The human stomach has a pH of, on average, 1.5-3.5. We’ll call it 2.5 again, so we can use some of our numbers from before.
so, our [H+] still = 0.0032M
The amount of acid in the human stomach varies, but it produces 1-3 liters of gastric juice a day. We will take the low end and go with 1L.
1L makes this easy. We have 0.0032 moles of hydrogen ions. We need 0.0016 moles of Calcium carbonate to neutralize it.
Multiply this by the molar weight of CaCO3 (100), and we would need 0.16g…..160mg of CaCO3 to neutralize the lowest end of stomach acid.
Now, this doesn’t even take into account that your stomach is a buffering system, or that it is constantly producing new acid. But aside from this…
LEMONS DO NOT HAVE 160mg OF TUMS CHILLING INSIDE THEM.
tl; dr version:
NO, because:
Lets say you, valiant MFP user, get up and start your day with some tasty lemon water. We shall say you squeeze 2 tablespoons into your water. For the sake of easy math, we will assume your water to be neutral pH, so all we have to worry about is the lemon juice.
Lemon juice has, on average a pH of 2-3. We’ll call it 2.5
pH = -log[H+]; or the negative logarithm of the concentration of hydrogen ions (in M, or moles per liter)
2.5 = -log x; x = 10^-2.5; or 0.0032 M (moles/L)
2 tablespoons is roughly 30ml of liquid. Converting this to liters, and multiplying by the concentration gives us a total of 9.6x10^-5 moles of H+ in our lemon juice.
In order to neutralize that, we will need a source of anions (negatively charged ions). Those that matter to alkalinity are mainly carbonates, with a few phosphates, borates, and a minor silicate. Unless you are eating drywall or 20 Mule Team Borax, chances are the most common mineral of this kind you are going to see is calcium carbonate (CaCO3; also known as limestone, or the active ingredient in Tums). This mineral will dissociate in the presence of a strong acid to Ca2+ and CO3--. Since the carbonate ion has a 2- charge, we need half the concentration of hydrogen ions, which only have a 1+ charge.
So, we will need 4.8x10^-5 moles of calcium carbonate. What does that work out to, weight-wise?
CaCO3 has a molar mass of 100g/mole (Ca = 40; C=12; O=16x3=48); easy to work with. Times the mass by the number of moles needed.
This yields 4.8x10^-3g; or 4.8 mg of calcium carbonate to neutralize the acid in two tablespoons of lemon juice.
This is a lot. Like, if you don’t see an actual pill of calcium carbonate chilling in your two tablespoons of lemon juice, you aren’t going to neutralize your water, let alone alkalize it.
But what about in your stomach? Lets say, for the sake of argument, that there is some alkaline mineral in your lemon juice, and that it is protected from dissolving in its highly acidic, lemony home environment. It has a casing around it designed by…oh, lets say Monsanto. That’s right, Monsanto is putting acid-resistant beads in your lemons. Monsanto also decides when these beads crack open to release the minerals. Once it hits your stomach, a Monsanto minion presses the button and poof, now you have alkaline minerals up in your system. How much would you need to neutralize your stomach acid (not even alkalize, just neutralize what is already there)?
The human stomach has a pH of, on average, 1.5-3.5. We’ll call it 2.5 again, so we can use some of our numbers from before.
so, our [H+] still = 0.0032M
The amount of acid in the human stomach varies, but it produces 1-3 liters of gastric juice a day. We will take the low end and go with 1L.
1L makes this easy. We have 0.0032 moles of hydrogen ions. We need 0.0016 moles of Calcium carbonate to neutralize it.
Multiply this by the molar weight of CaCO3 (100), and we would need 0.16g…..160mg of CaCO3 to neutralize the lowest end of stomach acid.
Now, this doesn’t even take into account that your stomach is a buffering system, or that it is constantly producing new acid. But aside from this…
LEMONS DO NOT HAVE 160mg OF TUMS CHILLING INSIDE THEM.
tl; dr version:
NO, because:
0
Replies
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Bill Nye approves this message.0 -
but but but but WADDABOUT MAGIC?!?!?!?
OR - maybe all of these people are really chowing down on Tums in the shape of lemons?0 -
I can't get rid of the image of moles crammed into a one liter bottle.
I also read that as 20 Mole Team Borax. Which would be a ridiculous team. Unless maybe they were Morocco Moles.
Other than those two things I found this post to be both fascinating and thought provocative.0 -
0
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I can't get rid of the image of moles crammed into a one liter bottle.
I also read that as 20 Mole Team Borax. Which would be a ridiculous team. Unless maybe they were Morocco Moles.
Other than those two things I found this post to be both fascinating and thought provocative.
:laugh:0 -
I think I love you :blushing:0
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I can't get rid of the image of moles crammed into a one liter bottle.
I also read that as 20 Mole Team Borax. Which would be a ridiculous team. Unless maybe they were Morocco Moles.
Other than those two things I found this post to be both fascinating and thought provocative.
I think you would enjoy this
http://what-if.xkcd.com/4/0 -
:drinker: :drinker: :drinker:0
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I can't get rid of the image of moles crammed into a one liter bottle.
I also read that as 20 Mole Team Borax. Which would be a ridiculous team. Unless maybe they were Morocco Moles.
Other than those two things I found this post to be both fascinating and thought provocative.
I think you would enjoy this
http://what-if.xkcd.com/4/
Sorry but your post is now the second best thing I've read today :flowerforyou:0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.0 -
that's what i was going to say
in a minute
yep
right0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
and this^^ is why people shouldn't learn chemistry from websites.0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Cool. Imma go eat a lemon and shut down my whole digestive system! As god is my witness I'll never poop again!0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
So it gets into my respiratory system how?0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
So it gets into my respiratory system how?
duh, rapidly shunted from the stomach to the lungs. Do you even biology?0 -
I just swallowed a mentos whole after guzzling some diet coke...0
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Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?0 -
So it gets into my respiratory system how?
In the citric acid cycle, it is broken down into ATP (energy) and molecular building blocks (i.e. your Vitamin C). ATP goes through a process called glycolysis that further breaks the molecule down to a chain containing CoEnzyme A (CoA) and an acetyl group. CoA is the waste product. It is oxidized, converting it to CO2, which is carbon dioxide. Every time you exhale, you expel the rudiments of the citric acid that your body discards as waste.
This process is more commonly known as the Krebs Cycle.0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?
And where do I send my money for even more "information"?0 -
So it gets into my respiratory system how?
In the citric acid cycle, it is broken down into ATP (energy) and molecular building blocks (i.e. your Vitamin C). ATP goes through a process called glycolysis that further breaks the molecule down to a chain containing CoEnzyme A (CoA) and an acetyl group. CoA is the waste product. It is oxidized, converting it to CO2, which is carbon dioxide. Every time you exhale, you expel the rudiments of the citric acid that your body discards as waste.
This process is more commonly known as the Krebs Cycle.
*amused*0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?
Sam Houston State University, BS in Food and Nutrition Science. Not my buddy's first-year chemistry book, Chapter 4, How to Calculate a Mole.0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?
Sam Houston State University, BS in Food and Nutrition Science. Not my buddy's first-year chemistry book, Chapter 4, How to Calculate a Mole.
Maybe you should check the OP's credentials again.0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?
Sam Houston State University, BS in Food and Nutrition Science. Not my buddy's first-year chemistry book, Chapter 4, How to Calculate a Mole.
:snort: I don't think you want to play that game.0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?
Sam Houston State University, BS in Food and Nutrition Science. Not my buddy's first-year chemistry book, Chapter 4, How to Calculate a Mole.
Ummm, sorry, but she didn't use her friend's chemistry book. In her OP it says "my friend chemistry" NOT "my friend's chemistry book".
Really and truly, you don't want to go head to head with the credentials on this one.0 -
Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
Where did you get this information?
Sam Houston State University, BS in Food and Nutrition Science. Not my buddy's first-year chemistry book, Chapter 4, How to Calculate a Mole.
U mad bro?:laugh:
The Krebs cycle goes on in our cells, all the time, whether or not lemon water is ingested.
so...congrats on describing respiration (also from what looks to be a beginners text book)? Not sure what that has to do with the wacky claim about blood pH and lemon water. Also not sure why you think common elements like calcium, magnesium, potassium, etc have anything to do with pH or alkalinity.0 -
In, because I have to see this beat down....0
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In, because I have to see this beat down....
IDK, everyone exposed the 'secret' of the OP's credentials so I'm not sure the beat down is gonna happen. It's so much better if you draw it out then come out swinging with the "BOOM, SCIENCE! This is what I do for a living!!!" on page 4 or 5.0 -
i
u... science.
I'm taking nutrition 320 this semester 0 -
First of all in order to maintain homeostasis your body maintains a strict blood oh (stupid spell check) of 7.35-7.45. Anything lower and you would start suffering from acidosis (to much CO2 or too like bicarbonate) or alkalosis(too little CO2 or too much bicarbonate). And secondly alkaline is another way of saying basic and lemons are acidic0
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Great job using your buddy's chemistry book, but you've entirely overlooked the human body's respiratory system. Lemon does not alkalize itself. The citric acid is expelled via the respiratory system as a person exhales, and also via the kidneys as uric acid. What is left after the body quickly does away with the citric acid is calcium, magnesium, potassium, and Selenium to name the largest quantities, also known as "alkaline ash." If someone said lemons alkalize the blood, they are wrong. But to say lemons do not have an alkalizing ash is equally wrong.
There is a reason dietitians don't take Chemistry 101 and get a degree handed to them their sophomore years.
So it gets into my respiratory system how?
duh, rapidly shunted from the stomach to the lungs. Do you even biology?
I was going to do a line of lemon juice0
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