Are heavy folks malnourished?

KimiSteinbach

Yeah, I heard that recently.

Thoughts?

Seems logical since we eat all sorts of what-have-you to get this way.

Shuuma

I'm kind of the opinion that heavy folks (like myself) are OVER nourished. Too much food. Malnourished implies lack of nourishment, which I personally have never had.

Dandman1990

I don't really think it's a question of your size, it's more a question of your eating habits. For example if I made sure to eat diversely but I ate 3x what I was supposed to each day I would be getting more than enough of the necessary nutrients. However, if I chose to eat simply pizza & other fast food I wouldn't be.

I'd say the significantly underweight are probably more likely to suffer from malnutrition simply because if most overweight people eat as much as I used to then you probably hit a decent variety of necessary stuff without trying to just because of the volume of food consumed.

MinnieInMaine

Maybe - that's a pretty wide sweeping statement. Some probably are malnourished due to the types of food they eat. But you can also become overweight/obese if you're eating healthy foods but far too many of them. What you eat impacts health, how much you eat impacts weight.

concordancia

It depends on what they eat to get overweight. There are people who get overweight with healthy foods and others who eat a healthy diet plus the junk. Those people are probably more misnourished than malnourished: they are getting everything they need, but also extra fats and sugars.

Another category is those who are overweight, but changing their habits. I am pretty well nourished at the moment, but I still have 80 lbs or so to lose.

WhiteRabbit1313

Yeah, I heard that recently.

Thoughts?

Seems logical since we eat all sorts of what-have-you to get this way.

It's certainly possible, but it has nothing to do with being heavy. It is directly dependent on the quality of the diet, itself.

WhiteRabbit1313

Maybe - that's a pretty wide sweeping statement. Some probably are malnourished due to the types of food they eat. But you can also become overweight/obese if you're eating healthy foods but far too many of them. What you eat impacts health, how much you eat impacts weight.

^^This.

TexasTopaz

No doubt SOME are!
I know that at the peak of my weight ( prior to 2006 I was 236+ pounds) I ate foods with plenty of calorific value, but little nutrition! My skin and hair were both lifeless, and I was always tired.

bumblebreezy91

I'm not sure for the general population, but in December, when I was about 20 pounds heavier and had bloodwork done, I had fantastic numbers except my iron was super low and I was/am considered anemic.

MoreBean13

It's possible but I wouldn't say it's probable in most cases. We live in a society where many food products are fortified to prevent malnourishment.

Certainly many people with poor eating habits would benefit from a better nutritional profile, but aren't actually malnutritioned.

bethanylaugh

I'm kind of the opinion that heavy folks (like myself) are OVER nourished. Too much food. Malnourished implies lack of nourishment, which I personally have never had.

Malnourishment is lack of nutrients, not lack of food. You could eat white bread all day every day and be quite malnourished.

erickirb

I'm kind of the opinion that heavy folks (like myself) are OVER nourished. Too much food. Malnourished implies lack of nourishment, which I personally have never had.

malnourished mean lack of enough essential vitamins and minerals. So if all you eat is cheesecake, even at a caloric surplus you can be malnourished.

bethanylaugh

"food toxins and malnutrition [are both] well attested as causes of obesity in animals:

The easiest way to induce obesity in animals is to feed them a carb toxin and a fat toxin – e.g. wheat, fructose, or alcohol with polyunsaturated fats or hydrogenated trans-fats.
Obesity in animals can also be induced by nutrient deficiencies, as in the “methionine-choline deficient diet.”
These causes also seem to be active in humans:

Intake of fructose and polyunsaturated fats is strongly associated with obesity in humans.
Famine studies show that those who experience a period of severe malnourishment are more likely to become obese."

KimiSteinbach

It's possible but I wouldn't say it's probable in most cases. We live in a society where many food products are fortified to prevent malnourishment.

Certainly many people with poor eating habits would benefit from a better nutritional profile, but aren't actually malnutritioned.

This makes sense. I suppose I'm trying to get at the fact that maybe we are "overnourished" then.

bethanylaugh

We fortify foods with 2 or 3 nutrients... and there's TONS of evidence that shows that, for example, folic acid in food is almost ineffective and borderline harmful compared to eating food that naturally has folate in it.

Here's a bunch of resources on the topic if anyone is interested in researching it! http://perfecthealthdiet.com/notes/#Ch17

pianolover2012

In my case, I was DEFINITELY malnourished. I have Celiac disease and was diagnosed a year ago as severely malnourished. I am around 197 pounds now after losing some 28 pounds! My weightloss is also VERY slow because my body is obsorbing the needed nutrients. So to answer your question, some ppl can be malnourished while overweight.

MoreBean13

We fortify foods with 2 or 3 nutrients... and there's TONS of evidence that shows that, for example, folic acid in food is almost ineffective and borderline harmful compared to eating food that naturally has folate in it.

Here's a bunch of resources on the topic if anyone is interested in researching it! http://perfecthealthdiet.com/notes/#Ch17

Maybe 2 or 3 per food...

Milk---> vitamins D&A
Table salt ---> iodine
Bread ---> Niacin
Breakfast Cereal---> Calcium, zinc, iron, vitamin C, folic acid, B6, B2, B1, B12, Vitamin D

Just as a few examples

jonnythan

Malnourished means poorly nourished. Mal means bad or incorrect.

Obese people are, by definition, malnourished. They are improperly nourished. Excess of calories, perhaps a lack of certain things like fiber or potassium.

ValerieMartini2Olives

No doubt SOME are!
I know that at the peak of my weight ( prior to 2006 I was 236+ pounds) I ate foods with plenty of calorific value, but little nutrition! My skin and hair were both lifeless, and I was always tired.

Sounds like me when I was my heaviest. My skin always broke out and had a greyish hue to it. My hair and nails grew for crap. I waa tired all the time. Not anymore!

KimiSteinbach

No doubt SOME are!
I know that at the peak of my weight ( prior to 2006 I was 236+ pounds) I ate foods with plenty of calorific value, but little nutrition! My skin and hair were both lifeless, and I was always tired.

Sounds like me when I was my heaviest. My skin always broke out and had a greyish hue to it. My hair and nails grew for crap. I waa tired all the time. Not anymore!

This is how I feel and I'm 50 lbs overweight. I guess this is what I'm getting at. Thank you!

KimiSteinbach

Malnourished means poorly nourished. Mal means bad or incorrect.

Obese people are, by definition, malnourished. They are improperly nourished. Excess of calories, perhaps a lack of certain things like fiber or potassium.

Makes sense. Thanks

jayjay12345654321

They can be. It has to do with nutrition. You can live off 4000 calories worth of Twinkies daily and be 80 pounds overweight, but still be malnourished.

in_the_stars

They often are.

Ang108

I'm kind of the opinion that heavy folks (like myself) are OVER nourished. Too much food. Malnourished implies lack of nourishment, which I personally have never had.

There is a very big difference between being well fed and well nourished. According to WHO numbers 43% of the overweight-obese US population are actually well fed but malnourished.
Being well fed means that a person gets enough calories to sustain their energy needs, while being well nourished refers to their general state off health. Because of the specific food culture, a person in the US can easily eat over their calorie need, be well fed ( not suffering from hunger and cover more than their energy need for their activities in a given day ) and still be malnourished, because the food lacks nutritional value.
One should not confuse the two.....:o).

jwdieter

There are some folks who don't eat any vegetables in their 4000+/day calories. There are some who do.

stealthq

Like others have said - depends on the individual. Eat only Twinkies, be malnourished no matter your size. Eat a reasonably varied diet, be properly nourished no matter your size.

"food toxins and malnutrition [are both] well attested as causes of obesity in animals:

The easiest way to induce obesity in animals is to feed them a carb toxin and a fat toxin – e.g. wheat, fructose, or alcohol with polyunsaturated fats or hydrogenated trans-fats.
Obesity in animals can also be induced by nutrient deficiencies, as in the “methionine-choline deficient diet.”
These causes also seem to be active in humans:

Intake of fructose and polyunsaturated fats is strongly associated with obesity in humans.
Famine studies show that those who experience a period of severe malnourishment are more likely to become obese."

Err, I'm guessing you didn't provide a reference for this quote because you know it's garbage and the source is beyond questionable.

The easiest way to induce obesity is to feed an animal a lot of food and keep them immobile. Strong associations (i.e. correlations) are not very meaningful in human epidemiological studies - almost always, there's too many other unaccounted for factors involved.

About the only correct statement in there is about the famine studies. Duh. Starve someone and waste away their musculature, dropping their BMR into the toilet. Then re-feed without an effort to build back the lost musculature, and big surprise - they get fat on less calories than they did before. Has nothing to do with heavy folks being malnourished.

QuietBloom

IN for carb and fat toxins...

Akimajuktuq

Speaking from personal experience: ABSOLUTELY. When one isn't consuming enough of the micronutrients that a body needs, your body will fight to get those nutrients and the result is over-eating, and in my case, a diagnosis of binge eating disorder (and a very long list of health problems). And it's not all about vegetables; there are other foods that are vital to health as well.

Amazingly, as soon as I changed WHAT I eat, I automatically started to consume less calories and all of my health problems were resolved very quickly. Of course the weight loss is taking a bit longer but I am already in a healthy weight range.

QuietBloom

Like others have said - depends on the individual. Eat only Twinkies, be malnourished no matter your size. Eat a reasonably varied diet, be properly nourished no matter your size.

"food toxins and malnutrition [are both] well attested as causes of obesity in animals:

The easiest way to induce obesity in animals is to feed them a carb toxin and a fat toxin – e.g. wheat, fructose, or alcohol with polyunsaturated fats or hydrogenated trans-fats.
Obesity in animals can also be induced by nutrient deficiencies, as in the “methionine-choline deficient diet.”
These causes also seem to be active in humans:

Intake of fructose and polyunsaturated fats is strongly associated with obesity in humans.
Famine studies show that those who experience a period of severe malnourishment are more likely to become obese."

Err, I'm guessing you didn't provide a reference for this quote because you know it's garbage and the source is beyond questionable.

The easiest way to induce obesity is to feed an animal a lot of food and keep them immobile. Strong associations (i.e. correlations) are not very meaningful in human epidemiological studies - almost always, there's too many other unaccounted for factors involved.

About the only correct statement in there is about the famine studies. Duh. Starve someone and waste away their musculature, dropping their BMR into the toilet. Then re-feed without an effort to build back the lost musculature, and big surprise - they get fat on less calories than they did before. Has nothing to do with heavy folks being malnourished.

Yeah, it's garbage. http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2010/09/obesity-often-an-infectious-disease/

MoreBean13

Like others have said - depends on the individual. Eat only Twinkies, be malnourished no matter your size. Eat a reasonably varied diet, be properly nourished no matter your size.

"food toxins and malnutrition [are both] well attested as causes of obesity in animals:

The easiest way to induce obesity in animals is to feed them a carb toxin and a fat toxin – e.g. wheat, fructose, or alcohol with polyunsaturated fats or hydrogenated trans-fats.
Obesity in animals can also be induced by nutrient deficiencies, as in the “methionine-choline deficient diet.”
These causes also seem to be active in humans:

Intake of fructose and polyunsaturated fats is strongly associated with obesity in humans.
Famine studies show that those who experience a period of severe malnourishment are more likely to become obese."

Err, I'm guessing you didn't provide a reference for this quote because you know it's garbage and the source is beyond questionable.

The easiest way to induce obesity is to feed an animal a lot of food and keep them immobile. Strong associations (i.e. correlations) are not very meaningful in human epidemiological studies - almost always, there's too many other unaccounted for factors involved.

About the only correct statement in there is about the famine studies. Duh. Starve someone and waste away their musculature, dropping their BMR into the toilet. Then re-feed without an effort to build back the lost musculature, and big surprise - they get fat on less calories than they did before. Has nothing to do with heavy folks being malnourished.

I'm guessing it's from that perfect health diet book that she linked to the reference page of.

Can't confirm. Not buying the book to find out.

ETA: NVM, quietbloom is a better detective than me.

ETA2:

To Get Really Fat, You Need an Adenovirus Infection

A new study [4] has given us new information about the prevalence and effects of AD-36 in humans. The study found that 22% of obese children (that is, children in the top 5 percentiles of BMI), but only 7% of non-obese, have AD-36 antibodies. Moreover, among the obese children, those who were AD-36-antibody-positive were much fatter than the other obese children. It seems the top 0.1% of children in BMI are probably overwhelmingly made up of AD-36-infected children.

Strong deductive reasoning without testing hypothesis skills.

KimiSteinbach

Speaking from personal experience: ABSOLUTELY. When one isn't consuming enough of the micronutrients that a body needs, your body will fight to get those nutrients and the result is over-eating, and in my case, a diagnosis of binge eating disorder (and a very long list of health problems). And it's not all about vegetables; there are other foods that are vital to health as well.

Amazingly, as soon as I changed WHAT I eat, I automatically started to consume less calories and all of my health problems were resolved very quickly. Of course the weight loss is taking a bit longer but I am already in a healthy weight range.

I have a co-worker who did the same! As soon as he cut the junk food out of his diet and started eating healthy whole foods, the weight came off. It wasn't fast because he didn't incorporate exercise, but in about 6 months, he was of a normal and healthy BMI. He said it's very hard to pack in tons of calories when you cut out the junk food. I should also say he cut back on grains.