Are the poor fat?

arrseegee

People who are truly poor tend to come from a background of poverty. They have less education, are less receptive to public health messages and many of them do not know how to cook with basic ingredients. If you show a poor person how to cook good healthy meals they will often continue to feed their families the same crap, because they know that at least their kids eat the yummy unhealthy stuff whereas if they burn the vegetables or mess up the pasta their kids aren't going to eat that night. For people who have to make every dollar stretch it is scary to think of the thought that their families won't eat or like the food they make, then they'll go hungry.

At all levels of poverty these issues are prevalent, but particularly for the very poor. However many middle-class people also don't have the right tools to cook healthy meals, they get confused by health messages slapped on foods by advertising companies, and then we have a population that gains weight and has no idea why.

Of course there are many very poor people who do have this knowledge and successfully manage to feed their families relatively healthy meals on bugger all money, but it makes it much harder. God knows how many times I've burned dinner and known that I can just pull more ingredients out of the cupboard to start something new. That's a luxury some people don't have.

cardinalsfootball

If you are willing to cook your own food from scratch, eating healthy is NOT more expensive than unhealthy.

I can prepare an extremely healthy meal at home for less than $2-3 per person in a family of 4.

However, if you want to buy pre-made foods, whole plates of just cooked food (eating out), etc., then it is a LOT more expensive.

So... people are to blame for their own weight, whether rich or poor. It's a choice.

But poor people can't just buy their way into healthy eating the way rich people CAN, but only sometimes DO.

coconutbuNZ

I hear people complain about the price of fruit n veg but do u ever hear anyone complain about the cost of junk food? In my "poorer days" there were times where all we had was a loaf of bread and homemade soup I would make for me and my family but it was nutritious and that with fruit was all that was needed. The so-called "unhealthy carbs" in the form of scones or whatever else i could bake with such little ingredients also helped in feeding my kids but hey it's a hell of a lot better than going hungry or consuming large amounts of junk food in the form of say lollies!

Calliope610

The question should be "are the uneducated fat"?

The uneducated have lower earning potential and less knowledge of nutrition and other health related issues, thus, they don't know about healthier foods, habits, etc nor do they have the income to avail themselves to healthier options.

Cathalain

I live in Baltimore City (in Maryland) and can absolutely testify to the fact that "food deserts" exist. It is a severe problem in particular for the residents of this area. I, myself, can only reach the grocery store with a car - and many of our poorest residents here do not have access to anything but public transportation.

From the Baltimore City website:

Food Desert Map Key Demographic Findings (2012):
•1 in 5 Baltimore City residents live in food deserts. (Approximately 125,000 -or- 20%)
•Nearly 1 in 4 of Baltimore’s school aged children (0-17) live in a food desert. (approximately 31,000 -or- 23% of Baltimore’s population)
•1 in 4 of Baltimore’s African American population lives in a food desert. (approximately 105,000 -or- 26% of Baltimore’s population)
•In a food desert, 1 in 4 households receive Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP) benefits, twice the percentage of non-food desert households. (13,000 households or 24.5%)
•1 in 3 of Baltimore’s neighborhoods (36%) are located within a food desert. (100 out of 278)

Food deserts are defined as:
An area where the distance to a supermarket is more than ¼ mile, the median household income is at or below 185% of the Federal Poverty Level, over 40% of households have no vehicle available, and the average Healthy Food Availability Index score for supermarkets, convenience and corner stores is low (measured using the Nutrition Environment Measurement Survey).

http://www.baltimorecity.gov/Government/AgenciesDepartments/Planning/BaltimoreFoodPolicyInitiative/FoodDeserts.aspx

Thirty-six percent of a major city's neighborhoods are in a food desert???? I'd say that's a VERY serious issue.

No, there's no excuse for being fat/obese/whatever, but with statistics like this, I wouldn't be so quick to put ALL the blame on these people.

ETA: More information added.

carlalovescake

In Plymouth (UK) it is much much more expensive to eat healthily. Theres an article in the local paper today stating that 60% of Plymouth adults are obese/overweight.

I don't believe its a lack of education here though because the information is everywhere (sometimes too much so imho) by the government, in schools, health clubs everywhere, the media etc etc

Sadly unemployment here is high and food banks are busier then ever People have to make cuts and sometimes its the food bills which means less healthy stuff ><

My husband is lucky that he has a full time job but we still only bring home £18k a year for a family of 4 plus 2 cats and dog lol

I tend to visit the supermarkets late in the evening and try stock on reduced priced items now which helps a lot, also visiting more than one supermarket to buy the items on offer and cooking from scratch rather than anything processed helps

Our best investment was a slow cooker for healthy nutritious homemade soups and stews which don't break the bank.

kjo9692

I agree.

The country where I live in is a third world country, and national foods are cheaper, more accessible (you'll find them anywhere), and extremely unhealthy (lots of fatty oils, white rice, fried stuff, few whole foods like vegetables or fruits because they are ultra expensive). They are ultra high in calories and do not provide significant nutritional value. 40% of the population is considered to be poor and survive off less than $1 per day, they can only afford the cheapest there is. And if you take a look at them, you'll notice that most of them are overweight and some are even obese. It's a serious issue.

randomtai

This is NOT gonna end well. :noway: :noway:

neandermagnon

because of course the poor are a homogenous group and every poor person is the same as every other poor person.....

there are over 7 billion people in the world, spanning several continents and hundreds of countries.... a poor person in Burkina Faso has very little in common with a poor person in London.....

yep, I'm sure some people get fat because they're poor and it's hard to get healthy foods where they live so they eat too much very cheap foods that lack nutritional balance, because they can't get enough of better quality foods. Just as there are huge numbers of people who are underweight because they're poor and can't get enough of any kind of food. And there are huge numbers of poor people who get a very healthy diet because they can only eat locally produced fresh food, but miss out on other things, e.g. an education, because of their living situation.

So really, it's a question that is impossible to answer with anything other than "It depends...."

extra_medium

There are fat poor people and fat rich people. True, food with green labels cost more, and fast food is relatively cheap, but the choice to eat enough of either type of food to continuously gain weight is more about the individual than their economic situation.

elkahallick

The poor in American eat better than most thanks to Obama..

Sunbrooke

I used to work for dhs. I was a single mom and after paying the bills, I had very little left. I would have made too much for food stamps, but I wouldn't take something I didn't need anyways. . I used to budget for one turkey every few weeks, I'd cook it and freeze the meat in baggies. It lasted for weeks with careful rationing. We ate eggs, and I always had a big pot of beans and brown rice. I always had oatmeal and basic cereals. I didn't buy expensive out of season fruits and veggies, but I could afford frozen spinach, carrots, onions, broccoli, and things that were in season. Even before I stating working out, I was pretty trim and healthy.

Many of my clients looked at me like I was a freak when I'd suggest they cook some beans in a crock pot, or cut down on expensive steaks.

One time a client was telling me a horror story where something had gone wrong with her food stamps and she "had to eat rice and beans for two weeks!" ... I managed to keep my mouth shut, but it was hard.

People, rich and poor, don't always see that foods can be broken down to simple components of fiber, protein, vitamins, etc. you can buy 10 ramens for the price of one head of broccoli, but there is more nutrition in that one head of broccoli than in the ramen... Unless you are starving and you really need the fat and simple carbs, but that isn't often the case.

People also get caught up in ideas of what dinner should look like and feel like emotionally. Ultimately, It is fuel. Save the fancy meals for celebrations. Bond over something else. If your child won't eat veggies cooked, let them eat raw ones with some guacamole or peanut butter. There is nothing wrong with not having every nutritional component at every single meal.

Not everyone who is poor, or who uses assistance is so entitled (and ignorant about nutrition). I knew one guy to got very little in food stamps for his family, but went so far as to set up cold frames to have fresh baby greens and radishes year round.

elainecroft

If you are willing to cook your own food from scratch, eating healthy is NOT more expensive than unhealthy.

I can prepare an extremely healthy meal at home for less than $2-3 per person in a family of 4.

However, if you want to buy pre-made foods, whole plates of just cooked food (eating out), etc., then it is a LOT more expensive.

So... people are to blame for their own weight, whether rich or poor. It's a choice.

But poor people can't just buy their way into healthy eating the way rich people CAN, but only sometimes DO.

Your definition of "willing" includes "has the resources, knowledge, and time". Many poor work longer hours, have less access to kitchen equipment, and less knowledge/experience cooking.

Yes, they can CHOOSE to change these things, just like anyone can CHOOSE to become a gourmet french chef, learn to play the french horn, or get a college education. But there's a lot more that goes into making these things a reality than just making a CHOICE.

Cathalain

I was just thinking, too, that it could be the environment around you. For me, I grew up in a household where EVERYONE was fat. All of my family members - Mom, Dad, brothers, sisters, cousins, Grandma - literally, EVERYONE. So you learn from what you see. I saw my parents, grandparents, making really unhealthy things, going back for seconds and thirds, etc., etc., so naturally that's what you see every day and you're going to think that it's normal. It's when you get out in the world that you realize... "Oh, hey, uh, maybe this isn't quite right here?"

It's not to put the BLAME on anyone, you know? Even when I eventually knew better (and we all find that out at one point), I still overate, still had bad habits, just didn't care to change. I have no one to blame but MYSELF for the way I am/was. I totally accept that.

But I do think that we learn by observation. If your parents don't know any better, how would they teach you better? And the cycle continues when those kids have kids, etc. That's why I really wish they'd teach nutrition in school - more than just the basic "5 food group" stuff. I can't recall EVER learning about nutrition and what a calorie was (other than a scientific term in physics class, etc.) and how too many calories can do this, that, the other to you, so on and so on. I think today's kids have a much better shot at keeping themselves healthy because there's so much more awareness now of the issue.

Food deserts exacerbate the problem. When you know there's better out there but you just can't seem to get to it, it makes it more frustrating. Some might say, "Take the bus there", and that's fine (I used to do that, actually), but when you're shopping for more than one - dragging all those bags on the bus is near an impossibility. (I used to do that, too!)

They're working on it here in Baltimore. They just opened a brand new market with an emphasis on vegetables and fruit right in the heart of one of the worst neighborhoods in the city - and did people come running for it? You BET they did. The owners are making hand over fist, beaucoup money!

We need more of that. :flowerforyou:

jonnyman41

I think that being poor certainly increases your likelihood of being fat for a myriad of reasons. It is a big public health concern in the UK.

The reasons are less to do with some misguided idea of lack of discipline (which is usually nothing more than a moral stick to beat the poor with) as opposed to access to more suitable food options, shops which supply them, transport to reach these places, education about how to construct a healthy and balanced diet and meals.

It's a skills, education and means problem as opposed to a "they just don't want it bad enough bro" problem.

Well said

bcattoes

I can grow ANYTHING.....until i put it in a container. I can murder the healthiest plants in two days in a stupid pot.

I'm not quite that bad, but container gardening is more difficult, at least for me. It's also much more expensive than planting in the ground. The initial setup is very expensive - pots, seeds, dirt. But pots also need fertilized more often because nutrients are depleted more quickly in the contained area.

I have been poor. Not dumpster diving poor, but near poverty level. I was a lot thinner then than I am now that I have money for whatever food I want. I was also younger then, had 2 young children to keep up with, and quite frankly we just could not afford a lot of junk. When one bag of potato chips costs as much as a bag of carrots AND a bag of apples, and you have only that much, only an idiot would buy the chips.

seamonster1203

Per national stats, the poor are less likely to have access to information / education, so not only are they more likely to be fat, they are more likely to be religious, use drugs, commit crime, abandon their children, etc.

nkovacs1954

Take a look sometime what is folks grocery carts. Frozen pizza, cookies, frozen waffles, soda, Pop Tarts, chips and ready to cook everything.

When was the last time you saw a cart filled with flour, eggs, milk, whole chicken, chicken broth, carrots, celery, onions, fresh fruit and just about any other "raw" ingredient.

We bake muffins..it's not hard and they are great. We know what goes into them. We make soup, use a slow cooker and buy "real food". Its not hard...

emmullins55

Hi Kimi:
I think this topic deserves a multi-perspective answer. I can not speak to the cost of healthy eating in third world countries from personal experience, but I know living in less developed countries is very difficult. It has been suggested that healthy eating is more costly; however, I think that those of a lower economic status in the US have a tendency to eat more processed food due more to convenience, than cost. If you really consider what fast food, or frozen processed foods cost, they are not less expensive. The fast food companies do use ingredients that cause addiction to them, the principal ones are fat and sugar. I think that the new term "eating clean," is just a way of saying the more additives and chemicals a food has the less healthy. I definitely recommend victory or patio gardens to everyone, because they can help save money. We have a pretty large one, and several different fruit trees. What it really comes down to is time.Planning helps. You can make very nutrious meals that are not costly if you use seasonal produce, beans, or other grains, herbs and spices. We eat WAY too much meat in this country. Stores like Aldi (if in your area) have great produce for low cost. Culture and education are other factors in food choices. Some cultures are known for health promoting eating habits ie: Mediterranean, or Asian cuisine. Most cultures favorite foods can be adapted to use healthier ingredients if lard or other unhealthy fats are normally used. I think most people are less concerned with their health or nutrition than what TV program they want to watch. There have been alot of good suggestions here. Slow cookers are an excellent investment because they can make the toughest meat incredibly delicious. Soups are also very cost effective and can also be a way of using up a bunch of you have in the frig so it doesn't spoil. I have enjoyed this topic, and of course we all have different beliefs.

mistress8956

I compleatly agree and disagree at the same time! I haven't found the my grocery bill has increased but I attribute this to eating proper portion size and no longer over eating. Before mfp taco night was 2 lbs of hamburger meat (5 people) now taco night is 4oz of chicken breast per person. A pack of chicken breast (6) was one dinner not it is a weeks worth. A 'side' of rice was 2 packages (2ppl) now a 'side' of rice is one package. Mac and cheese was 3+ boxes as a side, now I just don't eat it. If I baked a box of brownies the whole tray was gone by the end of the night, now everyone has one and I freeze the rest.My fridge used to only have drinks and condiments in it while my pantry was stocked up. Now my freezer is full of frozen veggies my fridge full of fruit/veggies/yogurts and such and I have only one cabinet for food storage not a whole pantry. I spend roughly 800 a month (5people,1 dog,3 cats, 1turtle) that includes EVERYTHING not just food. Imo it's a lot of money, BUT it's not anymore then I spent buying junk food or over eating. Eating healthier to me means more meal planing and making the effort to cook every night, not just pop something in the microwave. So is it easier to eat bady? Yes is it cheaper? Yes and no....

_Pseudonymous_

If you are willing to cook your own food from scratch, eating healthy is NOT more expensive than unhealthy.

I can prepare an extremely healthy meal at home for less than $2-3 per person in a family of 4.

However, if you want to buy pre-made foods, whole plates of just cooked food (eating out), etc., then it is a LOT more expensive.

So... people are to blame for their own weight, whether rich or poor. It's a choice.

But poor people can't just buy their way into healthy eating the way rich people CAN, but only sometimes DO.

Your definition of "willing" includes "has the resources, knowledge, and time". Many poor work longer hours, have less access to kitchen equipment, and less knowledge/experience cooking.

Yes, they can CHOOSE to change these things, just like anyone can CHOOSE to become a gourmet french chef, learn to play the french horn, or get a college education. But there's a lot more that goes into making these things a reality than just making a CHOICE.

I work 75 hours a week and am teaching myself to cook. I'm not going to school for a course in french cuisine. I have a teeny tiny kitchen with a barely functioning fridge that was passed down to us by some friends who upgraded their fridge. I'm just looking up recipes and resources on the internet and using them. I never used to cook, no idea how. Just trying to teach myself. Sometimes I fail sometimes I don't. I am not exactly rich (see post where I make under $20,000 a year). I have less knowledge and experience but that doesn't stop me.

So yeah, in my opinion, I would say that that is a choice.

emmullins55

sooo true!

rissyroo2002

Good job!!

jkestens63

I

Also-I tried the whole container garden thing and it cost a lot of money to set up, and then nothing grew (we got a grand total of three strawberries and one tomato from it ). Definitely cheaper to just go to the store and buy veggies/fruit on sale, or buy frozen.

I can grow ANYTHING.....until i put it in a container. I can murder the healthiest plants in two days in a stupid pot.

There is a foot of snow outside, not growing nothin'.

kennie2

I think its up to the person really,
I spend less money on food than my friends do and I have a healthy high raw diet filled with fruit and veggies in abundance and then back up options of rice potatoes and beans when I'm low on fruit.
And I can do that on about £25 a week easy!

avm1962

I am a Food Producer (top end luxury items) - I always believed that people need to get back into the kitchen, and learn to cook. I was having this rant one day during an interview with a journalist. Later that week, she tweeted me with a challenge. "Put your money where your mouth is Mrs xxxx". It was the "Live below the line" (google it) challenge. I had £5 to live on, for five days. (I raised money for Unicef in the process). I was not allowed to forage (which was my first thought), no fishing, snaring, shooting - and if I ate anything from the garden - I had to count man hours and costs.
I did complete the challenge successfully. TV got involved too - and that was good for raising my fund for charity.
It did however, give me a whole new perspective on people who do indeed "live below the poverty line".
I found I had to buy very cheap, very fatty foods. I bought sausages which were quite frankly disgusting, I used the fat from frying the sausage as stock for risotto. I bought cans of peas for 19p (there was more mush than peas) - I had peaches which were tinned and steeped in syrup - fresh fruit was totally way out of budget.
By the end of the five days my stomach ached - I could smell grease in my skin - I was bloated - I did gain weight - and my whole bodily functions ceased. I could not afford to buy the foods which cater for my allergies - again - resulting in massive stomach pain.
I felt sluggish - didnt sleep well - and no notion of exercise as I felt so weighed down by fat -
everything cheap - was low in nutrition - and high in fat.
It was an eye opener - poverty - real poverty - does not finance good nutrition.

jenifr818

Tagging to read later. It's gonna end so well :noway:

bennettinfinity

Food deserts are defined as:
An area where the distance to a supermarket is more than ¼ mile, the median household income is at or below 185% of the Federal Poverty Level, over 40% of households have no vehicle available, and the average Healthy Food Availability Index score for supermarkets, convenience and corner stores is low (measured using the Nutrition Environment Measurement Survey).

I'm not questioning the veracity, but those definitional criteria seem awfully restrictive... essentially the following neighborhood could be defined as a food desert:
- a neighborhood where over half the people have cars (rides with friends or neighbors?)
- a neighborhood where half the people make a MINIMUM of nearly double the poverty rate (those earning less surely qualify for assistance)
- a neighborhood where the nearest supermarket is a mere 1321 feet away (even at a leisurely 2MPH pace a 1/4 mile is only 7.5 minutes; quicker than it takes to find a parking space)

I realize there are individuals that would fall into the extreme ends of all these criteria, but we'd be talking more about exceptions and not the rule. Surely not enough to explain a general trend.

rosebette

I can't believe how judgmental folks are toward poor people and poor people who are overweight and obese. I had many of the same assumptions until I became active with a community organizing group that works in urban areas. I also ended up teaching nontraditional students at night who were low income people with families on financial aid (scholarships). The food issue is not just about money and wise choices but about time; these students were often working, going to school to improve their economic status, and raising families. As many posters have said, there are "food deserts" in urban areas where it's hard to get to a grocery store without a car, so fresh food is not available, and there's no question that the processed food industry in both the U.S. and the U.K. have made it cheaper to eat junky processed foods than fresh foods. Also, people who have less education are often more susceptible to the aggressive marketing of these foods. Often these cheap processed foods are also what show up in food pantries and subsidy feeding programs. But another issue I have found with the working poor (and this number is growing in the U.S., as wages haven't adjusted for inflation since the 90s) is that many people with families are working 2 jobs or 40+ hours a week just to survive. One can't make a garden or spend time creating home-cooked meals under those conditions, or if there is a small amount of time, the person at the end of the day is so exhausted, he or she reaches for whatever is cheap and convenient -- yes, sometimes using food for comfort.

By the way, the school I work at provides snacks for the students: granola bars and fruit. When we looked at our budget and thought about what to cut, we found that buying granola bars (a General Mills product) in bulk was much cheaper than buying apples.

I do believe the food industry bears a large responsibility for the poor eating habits of low income people. If you think the food industry is not to blame, look at foreign countries where obesity was not a problem, but that are now having the problem. Often the problem is happening in areas where American style fast food and processed foods are making their way into those areas.

BeachGingerOnTheRocks

Food deserts are defined as:
An area where the distance to a supermarket is more than ¼ mile, the median household income is at or below 185% of the Federal Poverty Level, over 40% of households have no vehicle available, and the average Healthy Food Availability Index score for supermarkets, convenience and corner stores is low (measured using the Nutrition Environment Measurement Survey).

http://www.baltimorecity.gov/Government/AgenciesDepartments/Planning/BaltimoreFoodPolicyInitiative/FoodDeserts.aspx

A quarter mile?

Is the City of Baltimore saying that 1/4 mile is too far for someone to carry groceries?

I live 1.7 miles from my grocery store, and when I don't have the car, I put a backpack on and ride my bike. When I lived in an urban environment, I shoved the groceries in the bottom of the stroller and hoofed it. I had to make more trips, but that resulted in me losing weight, not gaining.

I've lived in poverty in urban areas and in rural areas. I much prefer to be poor in a rural area.

The part of the country where I live now grows a good portion of the produce that feeds the region. As a result, we can eat healthy on a shoestring budget. Fast food is far more expensive for us to consume than fresh. We are also lucky to have several chains of discount or "box" type grocers that are bare bones and offer nutritious foods for far cheaper. Nonetheless, we have one of the country's highest rates of obesity. And I think of my own extended family. A get together meal is loaded with fried foods, biscuits, and gravy. It costs pennies to make biscuits and gravy, and they're among the most calorie-dense foods a person can eat. The problem is education and a sense of caring. A good portion of my family simply doesn't care. There's no other way to put it. Life is crappy enough that indulging in fatty food is a pleasure they don't want to give up.

I don't offer nutrition advice to my family. It is information wasted on people who have no interest in it. I wouldn't doubt it is the same for many of the working poor.