Well, I'll just get big bulky man muscles then!

FromHereOnOut

Sorry I didn't read through all the responses so maybe someone brought this up.
You say you have a problem not being able to eat at a deficit and at x amount of calories or x % below deficit. Have you tried slowly working down to that? It sounds like your major problem is the eating part which is totally mental, but if say you started at say a 5% deficit for 4 weeks and then went down to 7% or 10% or whatever until you got to where you needed to be. Maybe that will take a mental strain off of you since it is slowly working down instead of jumping in and out all the time.
The other thing that you can do is not buy those bad foods. I personally don't keep crap at my house because I know that if I am bored I will probably eat it. if its not there you can't eat it. Instead I keep good foods there and end up snacking on those. Just two ideas for ya. Good luck!

Thanks. I might need to consider the gradual step down. It seems doomed, since my cals are all over the place (1600 one day, 3000 the next, then 4 days of ~2400, etc etc).

As for not having bad foods: I hear ya! I have always been someone who diets at the supermarket, not at home. IOW, I prefer to not even buy that stuff! My husband on the other hand....ugh! He was out of town earlier this month for 10 days and I actually did pretty good for those days. The fridge was stocked with good stuff and I met my target for most of those days. But of course I also wasn't working out those days (no babysitter), so not really sure which was the cause.

JMoore221979

Sorry I didn't read through all the responses so maybe someone brought this up.
You say you have a problem not being able to eat at a deficit and at x amount of calories or x % below deficit. Have you tried slowly working down to that? It sounds like your major problem is the eating part which is totally mental, but if say you started at say a 5% deficit for 4 weeks and then went down to 7% or 10% or whatever until you got to where you needed to be. Maybe that will take a mental strain off of you since it is slowly working down instead of jumping in and out all the time.
The other thing that you can do is not buy those bad foods. I personally don't keep crap at my house because I know that if I am bored I will probably eat it. if its not there you can't eat it. Instead I keep good foods there and end up snacking on those. Just two ideas for ya. Good luck!

Thanks. I might need to consider the gradual step down. It seems doomed, since my cals are all over the place (1600 one day, 3000 the next, then 4 days of ~2400, etc etc).

As for not having bad foods: I hear ya! I have always been someone who diets at the supermarket, not at home. IOW, I prefer to not even buy that stuff! My husband on the other hand....ugh! He was out of town earlier this month for 10 days and I actually did pretty good for those days. The fridge was stocked with good stuff and I met my target for most of those days. But of course I also wasn't working out those days (no babysitter), so not really sure which was the cause.

Have you discussed this with him as far as it gets in the way of your physical goals?

FromHereOnOut

PERSONALLY I find that I want to continue eating once I've started,

Exactly! But for me it's on a much larger scale than just a meal. It's the reason that I can easily diet on 400cal/day (and did, in the past), but if I allow myself 1700, I find myself actually eating 2400. It's a slippery slope.

Have you tried some of the intermittent fasting protocols? Seems I remember one of them being a day at just a couple hundred cals, then a day well above TDEE for an average mild net loss. I wonder if that kind of plan would suit your natural tendencies. Sometimes it's best to work with your psyche rather than against it.

I haven't, but maybe I should. I do try to workout about 6days/week and am fairly active otherwise (live in a city with no car, so lots of walking and also lots of tot-carrying of my lazy but heavy daughter). I might be able to do something like that on my rest days, but even those days I'm busy running kids around and shopping, it'd be tough. When i used to diet the bad way (eating VLCD), I barely got out of bed. My life has changed so much since then. It'd be tough.

JoRocka

If you are already over weight- bulking is just going to make you bigger.

I'm not really sure why you would want to get much bigger if you feel you are already over weight (to an unsatisfactory level) I don't see the advantage or upside really- I mean I bulked when I was a little meaty- but I think it was for performance goals not just size gains so I was willing to take the hit.

A few thoughts
1.) bulking to put on weight is as hard if not harder than cutting/losing.

2.) self discipline can be developed- and it takes time to do so.

3.) creating positive habits and keeping yourself occupied helps keeping the snacking down to a minimum.

4.) when I have large blocks of time- once I start eating I can't stop- I put off eating and drink coffee/water and keep myself busy mentally to not think about it- I can regularly at this point be up at 8 and not eat till 2- once I "break the food seal" it's over- I get hungry and can't stop eating.

5.) losing and gaining is a time consuming process- but not endless- set some time frames and goals- will help give you structure (not I want to lose 10 lbs by may- more like I want to work on eating a calorie deficit and running more- things you can 100% control)

6.) weight loss and gain is not linear

7.) try getting on an actual lifting program like Starting Strength, Strong Lifts, New Rules of Lifting.

You can do it- but you have to set some sort of frame work for yourself to succeed- don't just set arbitrary random endless goals. Be able to control them- people set the "lose weight" goal and there is only so much you can do- you have to give it time- but you can "move more and eat less" and have those be actual quantifiable things that you can 100% control.

FromHereOnOut

Sorry I didn't read through all the responses so maybe someone brought this up.
You say you have a problem not being able to eat at a deficit and at x amount of calories or x % below deficit. Have you tried slowly working down to that? It sounds like your major problem is the eating part which is totally mental, but if say you started at say a 5% deficit for 4 weeks and then went down to 7% or 10% or whatever until you got to where you needed to be. Maybe that will take a mental strain off of you since it is slowly working down instead of jumping in and out all the time.
The other thing that you can do is not buy those bad foods. I personally don't keep crap at my house because I know that if I am bored I will probably eat it. if its not there you can't eat it. Instead I keep good foods there and end up snacking on those. Just two ideas for ya. Good luck!

Thanks. I might need to consider the gradual step down. It seems doomed, since my cals are all over the place (1600 one day, 3000 the next, then 4 days of ~2400, etc etc).

As for not having bad foods: I hear ya! I have always been someone who diets at the supermarket, not at home. IOW, I prefer to not even buy that stuff! My husband on the other hand....ugh! He was out of town earlier this month for 10 days and I actually did pretty good for those days. The fridge was stocked with good stuff and I met my target for most of those days. But of course I also wasn't working out those days (no babysitter), so not really sure which was the cause.

Have you discussed this with him as far as it gets in the way of your physical goals?

Yes. I've begged him to not buy sodas, to keep his huge chocolate bars in his briefcase, etc. He thinks I should have will power. I think he should not buy 6 large chocolate bars and then leave them in the cabinet for a week without even touching them. grrrr. To his credit, since he got back from his trip this month, he's been buying salad stuff, vegetables, fish, chicken, and turkey breast. He's trying to trim up for Summer too. (btw, he does most of the shopping, usu b/c he has the cash)

FromHereOnOut

If you are already over weight- bulking is just going to make you bigger.

***I'm not really trying to bulk. I'm just looking for some silver lining to the fact that I'm already hopelessly overeating--trying to work it to my advantage somehow.

I'm not really sure why you would want to get much bigger if you feel you are already over weight (to an unsatisfactory level) I don't see the advantage or upside really- I mean I bulked when I was a little meaty- but I think it was for performance goals not just size gains so I was willing to take the hit.

***See above about not bulking. However, re: performance goals, i do eat to fuel workouts and will not reduce my pre-workout intake because I really do need the fuel. Without it, I'm a mess.


4.) when I have large blocks of time- once I start eating I can't stop- I put off eating and drink coffee/water and keep myself busy mentally to not think about it- I can regularly at this point be up at 8 and not eat till 2- once I "break the food seal" it's over- I get hungry and can't stop eating.

***yes, I already drink quite a bit of very watered-down coffee in the morning. But, I have to eat one good meal by 1pm b/c I leave home and am on the run with school pick-up, tutor drop-off and then straight to the gym or running and don't get home til ~5:30. So i usually eat once by 1pm and then not again until about 6:00 (although sometimes it's just a protein shake and something fairly light). The food seal is broken with our dinner around 9:30pm (after my son's martial arts class) and that's when it goes badly.

5.) losing and gaining is a time consuming process- but not endless- set some time frames and goals- will help give you structure (not I want to lose 10 lbs by may- more like I want to work on eating a calorie deficit and running more- things you can 100% control)

***good points

6.) weight loss and gain is not linear

***understood

7.) try getting on an actual lifting program like Starting Strength, Strong Lifts, New Rules of Lifting.

***I'm feeling pretty good about my workouts actually. I put alot of time into planning them and take into consideration my stupid packed gym, what equipment is available, what time I have, etc. I'm definitely not just messing around and have made good gains. I do wish I had a smartphone to track my workouts though b/c it's very hard to remember where I am (weight) on everything--might have to be a Mothers day pressie to myself.

You can do it- but you have to set some sort of frame work for yourself to succeed- don't just set arbitrary random endless goals. Be able to control them- people set the "lose weight" goal and there is only so much you can do- you have to give it time- but you can "move more and eat less" and have those be actual quantifiable things that you can 100% control.


***Understood, but most everything at this point has been a true lifestyle change for me. In that regard, I am VERY PLEASED, because I have been maintaining and I am so much faster, fitter, stronger, etc than perhaps I have ever been. :happy:

FromHereOnOut

Also, I'm 5'9", 155lbs and diet at 2000 calories a day plus I eat exercise calories.

Bravo you!! You are at the weight I expect to be my goal weight (won't know til I get there) and get to eat loads. Yay!

I am estimating (just looking over my graph) that I am eating on avg about 2400. My goal is 1670+exercise cals, which would normally be around 2000 total maybe, except on long run day. But that avg is like 2800 here, 1900 there, 3000 here, 1700 there, and then ~2400 for several days in a row, etc.

FromHereOnOut

oh youre very very lucky...came in looking for lots of derp but leaving unsatisfied


props to you, though :flowerforyou:

don't worry, you'll find derp--it's out there. it's ALWAYS out there.
have fun.

JoRocka

composition book- for tracking progress I have several variations of workout journals (filled)

- pen and paper are much more reliable and less likely to get stolen.

I love mine dearly.

FromHereOnOut

composition book- for tracking progress I have several variations of workout journals (filled)

- pen and paper are much more reliable and less likely to get stolen.

I love mine dearly.

Yeah, I started to get a calendar or notebook, but I've been coveting a smartphone so much and waiting that I might get one (long sigh)....alas, you're right. That's something I can do immediately, and will. Thanks.

Loralrose

What if you tried for a really small deficit? You're already eating at maintenance, is there a way you could just go for maybe a 100 calorie deficit? Then keep doing weight training and slowly slowly lose the fat.

FromHereOnOut

Thanks everyone.

I've gotten lots of great ideas and am starting a "to do" list, which I'll post later. But keep 'em coming. I really appreciate the help.

suremeansyes

If you are eating as a treat, or reward,

Possibly that is the case. I'm fairly active for half the day and I eat for hunger & to fuel workouts, but I rarely *enjoy* my food, even dinner, because I have kids right in my face all while I'm eating (they literally ONLY want to eat MY food). So at night, I get to EAT IN PEACE.

Maybe eat a snack while the kids eat dinner, then sit down to YOUR dinner after they are in bed? That way, you are full, they are in bed, and you can minimize your snacking during their dinner...because they won't let you snack that much. lol

FromHereOnOut

If you are eating as a treat, or reward,

Possibly that is the case. I'm fairly active for half the day and I eat for hunger & to fuel workouts, but I rarely *enjoy* my food, even dinner, because I have kids right in my face all while I'm eating (they literally ONLY want to eat MY food). So at night, I get to EAT IN PEACE.

Maybe eat a snack while the kids eat dinner, then sit down to YOUR dinner after they are in bed? That way, you are full, they are in bed, and you can minimize your snacking during their dinner...because they won't let you snack that much. lol

Ohmygerd, that's genius! And I'll bet it seemed obvious to you, right?! Seriously, genius! How did I NOT see that?!?!

Thank you.
(I kinda feel stupid now for not having thought of that. doh)

sassyjae21

What if you tried for a really small deficit? You're already eating at maintenance, is there a way you could just go for maybe a 100 calorie deficit? Then keep doing weight training and slowly slowly lose the fat.

I agree with this. Try a much smaller deficit. Do 100 calories starting out if you can't do any more than that. Your habits will improve over time. It just takes a while sometimes If you are able to do 100 calories for a few weeks, try lowering it a bit more. This slows things down, but you'll still be making progress. And in the process, you'll be learning healthier habits

nicbic123

well for me I am going to the gym and doing mostly cardio at the moment and have been losing 1lb per week on average for 2 months...i use the treadmill...walking fast for like say 3 min and then jog for 1.5-2 mins this keeps your heart rate raised a little continuously and the jogging pushes it up a little higher in short bursts as constant higher heart rate doesn't help burn the fat, so I am told at my gym...it seems to work as I am both nuilding muscle AND losing weight at a steady pace...hope this helps...feel free to add me if you like

FromHereOnOut

What if you tried for a really small deficit? You're already eating at maintenance, is there a way you could just go for maybe a 100 calorie deficit? Then keep doing weight training and slowly slowly lose the fat.

I agree with this. Try a much smaller deficit. Do 100 calories starting out if you can't do any more than that. Your habits will improve over time. It just takes a while sometimes If you are able to do 100 calories for a few weeks, try lowering it a bit more. This slows things down, but you'll still be making progress. And in the process, you'll be learning healthier habits

Again, this comes down to the fact that my eating has been ALL over the place, like 3000 here, 1700 there, 2400 here, 2000 there. I mean, I guess I'm saying that it's good advice and I'd do it if I could--but mentally or logistically or something isn't working.

FromHereOnOut

Here's the "to do" list that I've come up with so far, from the discussion here. Again, thank you ALL!

To do:

(1) get a workout calendar/journal for tracking weights: immediately!

(2) before trying any kind of eating change (IF, deficit stepdown, etc), simply log into the notes of my food journal what my daily calorie intake was BEFORE my kids went to bed. Reasons twofold: (a) to better see what's really going on before I make a major change to my eating habits (which are apparently excellent for maintaining, yay!) and (b) maybe seeing it in black & white will provide me with incentive to not totally blow it, thus helping with the mental aspect: start noting immediately! look back and assess after 1 month

(3) okay, still do #2, but also--eat a lighter version of dinner or snack (healthy but low volume & low calorie, and esp nothing that I wouldn't want my kids to have, since they'll probably steal it anyway, lol!) at dinnertime and then eat MY dinner after they're in bed! (brilliant!)

(4) go forward with my 3mo plan to walk more 3x/wk. Walking is fat-burning. I enjoy it. It gives me more wiggle-room with calories on those days. Starts in May.

(5) continue with very challenging and progressive weight training (obvs! but wanted to mention it so nobody else would need to)

neandermagnon

The problem is that I can't eat at 20% below (or anything below) for even 1 day, much less 4 weeks. sigh. I expect to hear someone say, "man up and just stop stuffing your face so much" and I deserve that, but every good day that I have, I either ruin it at night or the very next day or two. I'm happy with the muscles I've built (I can see them a little bit, under the fat), because I used to have twig arms and I love my biceps, etc nowadays. I just want to melt some of the fat away. It sounds like this might be one of those cases where it's advisable that I become a cardio queen, to spend lots of time burnburnburning all the calories I eat

---

as long as I continue with my weight training for keeping my muscles. Sound right?

have a 10% deficit and plan your meals to make compliance as easy as possible. As long as you insure your protein intake is high and you're continuing with the strength training then you'll keep your muscles while the fat melts off. Note that it'll be slow fat burning with only a 10% deficit, but if compliance is a bigger issue then you need to take that into account. Think tortoise and hare.... slow and steady but just keep on going you'll get there in the end.

don't become a cardio queen, it's not necessary. But you don't need a big deficit to lose fat... just a deficit. Think long term compliance.

FromHereOnOut

p.s.- I knew I'd get good ideas from the well-fed brains of all you bulking peeps.