advice on petty work situation

whovian67 · May 2014

Agree

nitrospop · May 2014

The best thing to do, if she directly reports to you, is hold her accountable for the task that was assigned. It's ok if she wants to to B, but she has to know that A gets done as well. Direct reports do not get to dictate their work day. Period. Document the accountability conversation, and ask her questions that force her to provide the solution to getting done what she said she couldn't do. NEVER provide the solution for her. Once she identifies any obstacle and provides the solutions, she will have no option but to complete the task. See It, Own It, Do It! Make sure every assignment is clear and has a specific deadline. Action must be swift, just, documented, and compliance must be in full view of the other direct reports. If you don't fix it now, you're sunk. Her experiences over 12 years has her believing that she can get away with doing only what she wants. That belief has driven her action, or lack thereof and results were not met. YOU have to change her experience if you want those beliefs, actions, and results to change.

devil_in_a_blue_dress · May 2014

My guess is your boss didn't think you handled yourself well in the initial email, no matter what glowing reports you have received. If this person was your admin support person exclusively, it's likely you would be her boss too. My guess is she's probably admin staff for several people, which means even though her position is junior to you, you can't actually tell her to do things. I get it you asked her and tried to do so in a polite way, but she's also been there 12 years, so if you asked her something she's used to doing - or something that is new and she's not used to doing it --- it's probably going to be met with attitude and resistance. A lot of it is likely your attitude -- if you go in every day and act like you are the *kitten* and the golden child, even if you are --- you aren't going to make friends. .

My advice, ask your boss the best way to ask her something or as other have said, bounce.

gypsy_spirit · May 2014

I didn't read all the responses, so I apologize in advance if this has already been covered.

Perhaps, it is not as it appears. Maybe the supervisor handled her forwarding the e-mail in a way SHE didn't like. Perhaps telling her, "you are now reporting to OP and when he requests something of you, it is your job to follow up/complete the task". The supervisor may have considered this situation handled without bringing OP into the fray.

This would definitely explain the hostility she is exhibiting presently. She's been called on the carpet and you're getting the fall out.

NormInv · May 2014

I think that although I do not go into work pretending to be the golden boy, subconsciously my competitive nature might be coming across as arrogant to staff. And I realize that and work hard to manage that.

But in this situation, the dynamics between an aggressive subordinate and an insecure boss make this situation problematic for me. Especially, since after this incident, there was a lot of bonding among the staff.

I think I will talk to my boss on Monday in a subtle manner. My boss has explicitly told me that I can ask any admin staff to do anything for me.

Some things I said above were in response to what others had said. Someone said, maybe she is more valuable to the firm and that's why I gave the context why I believe I am more valuable.

I know I can come across as arrogant sometimes.

Thanks for your replies. Cheers!

MyChocolateDiet · May 2014

Well, I'm in agreement that you should probably look for new work and are probably stuck in a vice tighter than ....oops I am incapable of finishing this analogy without a strike....anyways I also think the suggested language was too weak and while not an outright apology was apologetic and should not be used.

The honest answer that came to my mind was that you COPY/PASTA your original instructions to her and resend them to both her and the boss via a "reply all" after her ridiculous lash out to you.

I beleive this reframes her behavior as childish and shows you will not be baited and yet will not accept being spoken to that way as changing your expectations. It will be a shocker to be clear but you don't have time to be bothered with drama from your support staff. Nobody does. If she has leftover issues from some other jerk off she is not strengthening whatever case she may have made to your mutual boss by taking it out on you.

The boss may be waiting to see how you handle it. She may be waiting for ANYONE to be able to take the "bull" (pun intended) by the horns and handle this reckless b!tch.

MyChocolateDiet · May 2014

I think that although I do not go into work pretending to be the golden boy, subconsciously my competitive nature might be coming across as arrogant to staff. And I realize that and work hard to manage that.

But in this situation, the dynamics between an aggressive subordinate and an insecure boss make this situation problematic for me. Especially, since after this incident, there was a lot of bonding among the staff.

I think I will talk to my boss on Monday in a subtle manner. My boss has explicitly told me that I can ask any admin staff to do anything for me.

Some things I said above were in response to what others had said. Someone said, maybe she is more valuable to the firm and that's why I gave the context why I believe I am more valuable.

I know I can come across as arrogant sometimes.

Thanks for your replies. Cheers!

Do NOT start second guessing yourself or your style b/c of HER out of line behavior. SHE is in the wrong and is the one that needs to change. NOT YOU. You got the job for a reason. Do not let yourself be bullied by a subordinate with a chip on her shoulder or past residue from others. If you are arrogant in your line of work perhaps it comes with the territory and if so she is the one that needs to get used to it or move on. I am in no way advocating bad treatment of subordinates but as your support staff it is inherent that you will have to tell her what to do and she will have to do it. If she wants to rely on her experience to inform you of a better or more practiced way that fits the culture of that office better it would be part of her position to inform you of that in a way that does not make her sound like an angry teenager and "assist" you in conforming to the corporate culture of the office you are new to. I say all this as someone who has past experience working as support staff. Also in dealing with personalities like you describe.

Peppah7 · May 2014

E-mail can cause so many problems! The tone you read into it... maybe the boss didn't see her e-mail... lots of potential for miscommunication, misinterpretation. Good luck!

seltzermint555 · May 2014

I think that although I do not go into work pretending to be the golden boy, subconsciously my competitive nature might be coming across as arrogant to staff. And I realize that and work hard to manage that.

But in this situation, the dynamics between an aggressive subordinate and an insecure boss make this situation problematic for me. Especially, since after this incident, there was a lot of bonding among the staff.

I think I will talk to my boss on Monday in a subtle manner. My boss has explicitly told me that I can ask any admin staff to do anything for me.

I think your boss needs to communicate that to the admin staff. It does not sound like you have won their respect at this point. I also think it sounds like you need to vastly improve your methods of delegating tasks to subordinates.

NormInv · May 2014

I think that although I do not go into work pretending to be the golden boy, subconsciously my competitive nature might be coming across as arrogant to staff. And I realize that and work hard to manage that.

But in this situation, the dynamics between an aggressive subordinate and an insecure boss make this situation problematic for me. Especially, since after this incident, there was a lot of bonding among the staff.

I think I will talk to my boss on Monday in a subtle manner. My boss has explicitly told me that I can ask any admin staff to do anything for me.

Some things I said above were in response to what others had said. Someone said, maybe she is more valuable to the firm and that's why I gave the context why I believe I am more valuable.

I know I can come across as arrogant sometimes.

Thanks for your replies. Cheers!

Do NOT start second guessing yourself or your style b/c of HER out of line behavior. SHE is in the wrong and is the one that needs to change. NOT YOU. You got the job for a reason. Do not let yourself be bullied by a subordinate with a chip on her shoulder or past residue from others. If you are arrogant in your line of work perhaps it comes with the territory and if so she is the one that needs to get used to it or move on. I am in no way advocating bad treatment of subordinates but as your support staff it is inherent that you will have to tell her what to do and she will have to do it. If she wants to rely on her experience to inform you of a better or more practiced way that fits the culture of that office better it would be part of her position to inform you of that in a way that does not make her sound like an angry teenager and "assist" you in conforming to the corporate culture of the office you are new to. I say all this as someone who has past experience working as support staff. Also in dealing with personalities like you describe.

Thanks for the support.

Madame_Goldbricker · May 2014

The context of the email is:

I asked her to do A, she went on to do B instead. I asked her why she didnt do A. She said she could not do A so she did B.

But if I had known I would have asked her to do C, not B.

Hence I sent my email.

Please note she is my admin staff. I am a highly credentialed, highly qualified person, not to toot my own horn. I am more qualified than my boss.

Ahh, I gotcha. Just make sure to clarify with her that if she cannot do task A in the future, to let you know in case you feel task C would be more beneficial.

You were definitely in the right here, but she probably felt like an *kitten* and got defensive.

^^I agree with this. Plus she probably copied your boss into her response in case she was worried she'd get pulled up for not doing the original task asked of her.

In relation to your boss not saying anything to her. I'd probably ask myself well why would she? Your boss has already told you that it's up to you to access the support staff when needed. So she might view it as a dispute to be sorted between yourselves without her intervention.

Bry_Fitness70 · May 2014

Completely honest opinion?

You're screwed if your boss said nothing and allowed this to happen. Get your resume in order and start looking.

I wish that there was a way to fix this, but you're dealing with office politics, women politics, and a power play. The reason she felt free to do this is because she's been doing it for years.

I would take your boss aside (no emails, in person), and ask him his opinion on what he thinks you should have done and what you should do next time.

I'm not sure I would just leave a company based upon weak behavior from a boss - that is going to lead to jumping jobs perpetually and having a ragtag resume of short work experiences. Your bosses' wishy-washiness has probably been noticed by your bosses' boss, so keep working hard and you may have a shot at his job!

TamTastic · May 2014

Office politics is never fun. I'm dealing with that myself as I'm sure many people on this site are. Unfortunately with our communication being through email so much, there can be problems that arise simply because of how a person interprets said email. It can be written in a completely harmless, respectful frame of mind but if the person on the other end is already resentful of things and has had an attitude, you could type "you're great" and she'd probably still react the same way.

I think there is always an issue when a staff member who has been there a lot longer is being managed by someone with much less time. It's a sting. Your boss may have handled it already though she should mention it to you if she has so you know it is being taken care of. Or like others have said, it's not going to get better and you should tread lightly a bit. Observe. See what's going on. Focus on doing your job and rock at it and show why you got the position in the first place and let the drama stay with the others. Some thrive on it.

Good luck!

vmclach · May 2014

You're right, it is petty.

Do you like your job?
If yes, this is hardly a situation that should cause you to go looking for a new job.

I would let it go.

I agree. It doesn't sound like that big of a deal to me. Your boss probably doesn't think it's a big enough deal to "confront" your co-worker about. Looking for a new job sounds extreme unless this is a final straw kind of thing

ninerbuff · May 2014

A person in a much junior position and I report to the same boss. She is supposed to be my support staff, but she has been with the firm for 12 years and I have been with the firm 1 year.

I have felt some resentment from her as I have risen in prominence.

I requested her something to do in an email and said, please and thank you.

She replied back and copied our boss on the email to say, do not tell me what to do and what not to do, I know what to do.

I was like whaaaa.......

I kept waiting for my boss to say something but she didnt.

Total twilight zone.

Now i am tempted to let it go, but I am also considering if my not confronting her will be seen as weakness. If she can get away with this outburst, she would make a habit out of it. I really do not want to have to deal with her issues, and I really dont care, but my only concern is how it will be perceived if I shut up.

Thoughts?

Reconfirm with your boss the "pecking order" and make sure an email gets sent to your co worker. If you boss bags, then you're out of luck.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

vmclach · May 2014

The context of the email is:

I asked her to do A, she went on to do B instead. I asked her why she didnt do A. She said she could not do A so she did B.

But if I had known I would have asked her to do C, not B.

Hence I sent my email.

Please note she is my admin staff. I am a high credentialed, high qualified person, not to toot my own horn. I am more qualified than my boss.

Whoa again! Dial it back a bit. What you just typed to me, a highly credentialed, highly experienced, highly qualified professional, just made me feel bad about myself and makes me wonder if you don't think you should have your boss' job.

Umm no, The purpose was to give context of my perception of my value to the firm vs hers.

With all do respect SIR, if you have such high credentials, so highly qualified, shouldn't you know how to handle this already? Surely you have encountered a little office politics in your carreer

Unfortunately I do not. Because my modus operandi has been to get up and leave. I am not making this up. I certainly need to learn how to deal with politics but thus far I just up and leave if they are not fair to me. In return, I am extremely hard working and fair and polite.

Most "Qualifed candidates" do not just get up and quit a job when there is a little miscommunication/office politics going on

HerkMeOff · May 2014

The context of the email is:

I asked her to do A, she went on to do B instead. I asked her why she didnt do A. She said she could not do A so she did B.

But if I had known I would have asked her to do C, not B.

Hence I sent my email.

Please note she is my admin staff. I am a high credentialed, high qualified person, not to toot my own horn. I am more qualified than my boss.

Whoa again! Dial it back a bit. What you just typed to me, a highly credentialed, highly experienced, highly qualified professional, just made me feel bad about myself and makes me wonder if you don't think you should have your boss' job.

Umm no, The purpose was to give context of my perception of my value to the firm vs hers.

With all do respect SIR, if you have such high credentials, so highly qualified, shouldn't you know how to handle this already? Surely you have encountered a little office politics in your carreer

Unfortunately I do not. Because my modus operandi has been to get up and leave. I am not making this up. I certainly need to learn how to deal with politics but thus far I just up and leave if they are not fair to me. In return, I am extremely hard working and fair and polite.

Most "Qualifed candidates" do not just get up and quit a job when there is a little miscommunication/office politics going on

Right??!??!

vmclach · May 2014

The best thing to do, if she directly reports to you, is hold her accountable for the task that was assigned. It's ok if she wants to to B, but she has to know that A gets done as well. Direct reports do not get to dictate their work day. Period. Document the accountability conversation, and ask her questions that force her to provide the solution to getting done what she said she couldn't do. NEVER provide the solution for her. Once she identifies any obstacle and provides the solutions, she will have no option but to complete the task. See It, Own It, Do It! Make sure every assignment is clear and has a specific deadline. Action must be swift, just, documented, and compliance must be in full view of the other direct reports. If you don't fix it now, you're sunk. Her experiences over 12 years has her believing that she can get away with doing only what she wants. That belief has driven her action, or lack thereof and results were not met. YOU have to change her experience if you want those beliefs, actions, and results to change.

Can you be my boss?

Platform_Heels · May 2014

The context of the email is:

I asked her to do A, she went on to do B instead. I asked her why she didnt do A. She said she could not do A so she did B.

But if I had known I would have asked her to do C, not B.

Hence I sent my email.

Please note she is my admin staff. I am a highly credentialed, highly qualified person, not to toot my own horn. I am more qualified than my boss.

Okay so I'm guessing the way you worded your emails came off as being rude and in an "I am better than you" attitude, based on the fact that, well, you're pretty much saying you're better than her. When it was clear that you weren't getting the answers you were seeking through email you should have gone and spoke to her in person in a nice way.

If you're so "highly credentialed, highly qualified and more qualified than your boss" perhaps that is why he/she didn't respond to the email. I'm not sure what position your gunning for (from your response it seems like your boss') but perhaps you need to show that you have leadership capabilities by taking care of your own situations instead of expecting the boss to step in.

(And just because she is your admin staff does not make her any less worthy than you are).

NormInv · May 2014

The context of the email is:

I asked her to do A, she went on to do B instead. I asked her why she didnt do A. She said she could not do A so she did B.

But if I had known I would have asked her to do C, not B.

Hence I sent my email.

Please note she is my admin staff. I am a highly credentialed, highly qualified person, not to toot my own horn. I am more qualified than my boss.

Okay so I'm guessing the way you worded your emails came off as being rude and in an "I am better than you" attitude, based on the fact that, well, you're pretty much saying you're better than her. When it was clear that you weren't getting the answers you were seeking through email you should have gone and spoke to her in person in a nice way.

If you're so "highly credentialed, highly qualified and more qualified than your boss" perhaps that is why he/she didn't respond to the email. I'm not sure what position your gunning for (from your response it seems like your boss') but perhaps you need to show that you have leadership capabilities by taking care of your own situations instead of expecting the boss to step in.

(And just because she is your admin staff does not make her any less worthy than you are).

NormInv · May 2014

I talked to my boss. She told me that the person in question is a hot head and she didnt say anything because she wanted the situation to cool off. She told me that the problem person has reacted that way with her too in the past. She told me to keep delegating work to the problem person.

She made it sound like it was a reality we had to live with.

HerkMeOff · May 2014

I talked to my boss. She told me that the person in question is a hot head and she didnt say anything because she wanted the situation to cool off. She told me that the problem person has reacted that way with her too in the past. She told me to keep delegating work to the problem person.

She made it sound like it was a reality we had to live with.

The reality you have to live with is that these types of people exist in every workplace.

Either you can deal with it, or you can continue to run from it.

vmclach · May 2014

I talked to my boss. She told me that the person in question is a hot head and she didnt say anything because she wanted the situation to cool off. She told me that the problem person has reacted that way with her too in the past. She told me to keep delegating work to the problem person.

She made it sound like it was a reality we had to live with.

The reality you have to live with is that these types of people exist in every workplace.

Either you can deal with it, or you can continue to run from it.

This!

bodiva88 · May 2014

A qualified person who gets up and leaves may have some qualifications, but a qualification they lack is an ability to figure out how to work with others. Do it often enough and your work history shouts that the hiring manager will end up having to spend time, money, and energy finding your replacement sooner or later and will go with an equally credentialed person with a more stable history.

Patzycakes · May 2014

Just note the incident and if you have any part in the review process for raises and promotions, be sure to include it.

Train4Foodz · May 2014

Put it this way, if one of my team members said this to me... They would be going down the disciplinary route..
There has to be respect within a team, you have to show that you mean business. No need to be a 'grinch' but you have to be respected by the team at the same time.

Definitely not something I would stand for!

NormInv · May 2014

I talked to my boss. She told me that the person in question is a hot head and she didnt say anything because she wanted the situation to cool off. She told me that the problem person has reacted that way with her too in the past. She told me to keep delegating work to the problem person.

She made it sound like it was a reality we had to live with.

The reality you have to live with is that these types of people exist in every workplace.

Either you can deal with it, or you can continue to run from it.

Yep. I do not have the skill set to deal with confrontation. We are all highly qualified in our own ways.

embrace_the_darkside · May 2014

- Stop being wusses. Just because someone sends you a mean message doesn't mean you go crying on to the printer to get your resume. Deal with the situation
- Have a quick chat with your boss to understand the pecking order and what her expectations are regarding tasks and accountabilities
- If boss says that he expects the junior person to own these tasks, let them deal with it and park the issue with your boss
- If the boss says that its your responsibility to own these tasks, communicate your expectations in a tactful manner with the junior staffer (example provided).
- Move on and focus on stuff that matters rather than petty BS

Example of message to send if you're in charge and HAVE TO manage the junior staffer:

"<Name>,

I really appreciate your efforts regarding <tasks>. The previous email was intended to pass along instructions designed to preempt any questions or miscommunications regarding <task>.

Lets set up some time to better understand how we can work together and set expectations around <this task and any other things you both need to work together on>.

Best regards,
<The Big Swinging Richard>

embrace_the_darkside · May 2014

Put it this way, if one of my team members said this to me... They would be going down the disciplinary route..
There has to be respect within a team, you have to show that you mean business. No need to be a 'grinch' but you have to be respected by the team at the same time.

Definitely not something I would stand for!

That's fine if you already have the higher ground (i.e. management support). If you don't, you have to first establish where you stand, negotiate around pitfalls, and imply authority rather than assert it. Confronting this head on is likely to leave you bruised badly.

HerkMeOff · May 2014

I talked to my boss. She told me that the person in question is a hot head and she didnt say anything because she wanted the situation to cool off. She told me that the problem person has reacted that way with her too in the past. She told me to keep delegating work to the problem person.

She made it sound like it was a reality we had to live with.

The reality you have to live with is that these types of people exist in every workplace.

Either you can deal with it, or you can continue to run from it.

Yep. I do not have the skill set to deal with confrontation. We are all highly qualified in our own ways.

Okay.

This is certainly a skill set that you should have learned a long time ago.

Good luck though..

advice on petty work situation

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