School Dress Codes
Replies
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What I saw in the photos was no different that what I saw being worn when I went to high school. My senior year I got my belly button pierced and wore crop tops for a week. No one said a word. My friends wore halter tops, guys wore chains on their wallets. We were educated, we graduated, and many of us have become functioning members of society.
Funny how little our clothing had to do with our educational experience.
That said, rules are rules. As a parent, I will make sure my children are following the guidelines laid out by the school.0 -
My opinion - dress codes in school are necessary. Of course, the devil is always in the details so I'm not going to defend completely asinine dress codes.
Some kids complain that "school should be concerned with preparing me for life, not worrying about my clothes". Well, DUH, a dress code DOES prepare you for life! Hell, EVERY single job I've worked at had some sort of dress code. Even the most lenient ones (e.g. janitorial) would ban some of the stuff the kids in that article want to wear, and not a single one of them paid for my clothes (security job did loan me a badge).
As a child of the 70s-80s, the only complaint I had of our school system's dress code was that shorts and sweatpants for boys were not allowed except for gym class or special events. However, all the neighboring counties allowed them. The only reasoning I ever heard was this:
(1) Boys + shorts/sweats + puberty = *BOING*
(2) Many of the neighboring system school often had some class buildings that could only be accessed by going outdoors (e.g. trailers or multiple discrete buildings)
I still thought it was bull, but didn't feel that it violated my rights or anything.0 -
The school I went to had some reasonable dress code rules. Although a friend got in trouble once for wearing a necklace on her head (because no hats), that was sort of silly.0
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FROM THE LINKED ARTICLE
Some students have shared their frustrations with the fashion police on social media. “I didn’t go to public school to be told how ‘I’m allowed’ to express myself … I can respect myself 150% and still wear shorts and a tank top,” Katelyn wrote on Twitter. “Maybe instead of worrying about what I’m wearing, you should worry about the fact that I’m going to graduate high school with next to no life skills whatsoever.” Others have shared photos of their rule-breaking outfits that have led to detention.
Maybe Katelyn should be protesting her lack of adequate high school education instead of her frustrations with the "fashion police".
Of course if she were protesting her education, you probably wouldn't be reading about it...0 -
It is the rules we had in school and what my kids have now, except for the skinny jeans and tights. We have a problem here and it isn't the dress code. It is kids who don't respect authority, girls who don't know modesty, and boys who don't know how to respect and value young women. I have sons. My oldest is to dating age. If he wants to talk to a girl outside of school I check her social media sites. If she is dress poorly I tell him to move on. I tell my son don't seek or encourage behavior from a girl you like that you wouldn't want your sister doing as well.
So basically to teach your son that what a woman wears determines her worth as a human...
Wow! That's exactly what I said! How were you able to read between the lines so well?!
Um, seriously, if you can't see that telling your sons a woman is appropriate/inappropriate to date based on how she's dressed in photos on social media sites reduces her to her appearance and not at all respecting her as fully human....
Yeah, it's completely normal for young teens to try things and experiment in their free time. I think it's unfortunate to teach kids to judge the entire person on something like that. She could be an intelligent, well behaved young lady that is just experimenting with fashion choices (completely harmless).
Exactly. I am so glad that social media wasn't a thing when I was growing up. We were allowed to wear anything we wanted in summers or when we weren't in school. We weren't running around in thongs with nip hanging out, but cut offs and tub tops? Yes. Short sundresses? Yep. I probably would have had a bikini picture as my profile photo and people like this person would be judging me for it, not wanting her sons to date me because I obviously didn't respect myself.
This whole exchange makes me terrified to be the mother of a young girl.0 -
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It is the rules we had in school and what my kids have now, except for the skinny jeans and tights. We have a problem here and it isn't the dress code. It is kids who don't respect authority, girls who don't know modesty, and boys who don't know how to respect and value young women. I have sons. My oldest is to dating age. If he wants to talk to a girl outside of school I check her social media sites. If she is dress poorly I tell him to move on. I tell my son don't seek or encourage behavior from a girl you like that you wouldn't want your sister doing as well.
So basically to teach your son that what a woman wears determines her worth as a human...
Wow! That's exactly what I said! How were you able to read between the lines so well?!
Um, seriously, if you can't see that telling your sons a woman is appropriate/inappropriate to date based on how she's dressed in photos on social media sites reduces her to her appearance and not at all respecting her as fully human....
Yeah, it's completely normal for young teens to try things and experiment in their free time. I think it's unfortunate to teach kids to judge the entire person on something like that. She could be an intelligent, well behaved young lady that is just experimenting with fashion choices (completely harmless).
Exactly. I am so glad that social media wasn't a thing when I was growing up. We were allowed to wear anything we wanted in summers or when we weren't in school. We weren't running around in thongs with nip hanging out, but cut offs and tub tops? Yes. Short sundresses? Yep. I probably would have had a bikini picture as my profile photo and people like this person would be judging me for it, not wanting her sons to date me because I obviously didn't respect myself.
This whole exchange makes me terrified to be the mother of a young girl.
I would have had photos in my sequined dance leotards. And wearing black chokers, red lipstick, cut off shorts, midriff bearing tops, fishnet stockings, platform shoes.0 -
I'd be okay with this, and i'm still in high school(5th year senior)
Why?? because at my school you're not allowed to wear anything that doesn't fall below your knee, and sleeves have to be at the elbow.
i'd be happy with this dress code.0 -
The first image, where it mentions she was told her clothing was distracting...If an adult said that to her, it's most likely that they were sexualizing a child.https://www.yahoo.com/style/tottenville-high-school-dress-code-97658961343.html
Saw this article on Yahoo. Wanted to share and ask thoughts, especially on the tweets from the "protestors".
As a parent of a girl, I know that men started blatantly staring at her chest and her bottom literally turning around some times to do this when she was 11 years old. When she was 12 after a man walked up to her, looked her up and down with me watching his eyes I said, oh let me introduce you to my 12 year old daughter then I said her name. He looked at me and said "oh, sorry" So he knew what he was doing. Thing is he shouldn't have been doing it in the first place.
Women in porn magazine's get paid to be looked at and know their images will be used to be looked at sexually.
Women walking around in every day life, me included don't give consent to every guy to imagine what their boobs look like without their tops on, what their bottoms feel like etc. They haven't given consent for their bodies to be sexualized and they shouldn't bear the responsibility for men, women or society viewing their body that way. I am not black and white and saying that every man, woman or member of society does that. It does happen and the people that sexualize other people, should examine themselves and where they thought that they got permission to do that.
I have had my daughter have a rip in her pants by the knee before and she's been sent home because she was told she was showing too much skin. I had a problem with the wording on that and let the school know.
As far as the other tweets go I think that those are between the parents, the school and the kids who chooses to express themselves the way they want. So I don't have a opinion on those.0 -
In. 'Cause I haven't been in on anything in awhile.0
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Schools need dress codes, because attention seekers take things overboard.
As for sexist - that is a stupid argument. Case in point, swim class when I was in high school. I wore a "sport" bikini - huge bottoms, top that looks like a sport bra. I was pulled to the side - no bikinis. Meanwhile another girl was allowed to wear a tiny bikini. I protested, he explained: she has nothing to show, while the boys are staring at my chest. I thought it was bull. Until as an adult, I see the difference when a volumptuous woman wears revealing clothes. Skinny girl: cute, big busted girl: smokin hot. Boys don't have boobs and camel toes, and most are not trying to get away with wearing speedos down the hall (male equivalent of a tube top). Hence no sexism, just reality. I do think boys need to make sure their pants are pulled up so no underwear shows, and if wearing skinny jeans, the jewels shouldn't be visible.
I like uniforms for school kids - takes pressure off of people.0 -
I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.0
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I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.
Uhm. Sigh. Boys do not have breasts. Hence, boys can wear shorts only to the pool, and girls cannot. Turn it around - this is also why it is ok for women to wear a bikini bottom to swim whereas boys and mean tend to wear more modest, looser fitting bathing shorts. They have something private to cover up. Basic anatomy, not that the body is "wrong " and they're not "shaming" anyone. It is entirely about appropriateness.0 -
Schools need dress codes, because attention seekers take things overboard.
As for sexist - that is a stupid argument. Case in point, swim class when I was in high school. I wore a "sport" bikini - huge bottoms, top that looks like a sport bra. I was pulled to the side - no bikinis. Meanwhile another girl was allowed to wear a tiny bikini. I protested, he explained: she has nothing to show, while the boys are staring at my chest. I thought it was bull. Until as an adult, I see the difference when a volumptuous woman wears revealing clothes. Skinny girl: cute, big busted girl: smokin hot. Boys don't have boobs and camel toes, and most are not trying to get away with wearing speedos down the hall (male equivalent of a tube top). Hence no sexism, just reality. I do think boys need to make sure their pants are pulled up so no underwear shows, and if wearing skinny jeans, the jewels shouldn't be visible.
I like uniforms for school kids - takes pressure off of people.
ahhhh voluptuous not LUMP!!!!!!!
Sorry -- I know how tacky it is to point out spelling errors, but when spoken that is my all-time pet peeve and makes me feel sick!0 -
Schools need dress codes, because attention seekers take things overboard.
As for sexist - that is a stupid argument. Case in point, swim class when I was in high school. I wore a "sport" bikini - huge bottoms, top that looks like a sport bra. I was pulled to the side - no bikinis. Meanwhile another girl was allowed to wear a tiny bikini. I protested, he explained: she has nothing to show, while the boys are staring at my chest. I thought it was bull. Until as an adult, I see the difference when a volumptuous woman wears revealing clothes. Skinny girl: cute, big busted girl: smokin hot. Boys don't have boobs and camel toes, and most are not trying to get away with wearing speedos down the hall (male equivalent of a tube top). Hence no sexism, just reality. I do think boys need to make sure their pants are pulled up so no underwear shows, and if wearing skinny jeans, the jewels shouldn't be visible.
I like uniforms for school kids - takes pressure off of people.
ahhhh voluptuous not LUMP!!!!!!!
Sorry -- I know how tacky it is to point out spelling errors, but when spoken that is my all-time pet peeve and makes me feel sick!
Sounds like you need a chill pill if a spelling error makes you sick.0 -
I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.
Uhm. Sigh. Boys do not have breasts. Hence, boys can wear shorts only to the pool, and girls cannot. Turn it around - this is also why it is ok for women to wear a bikini bottom to swim whereas boys and mean tend to wear more modest, looser fitting bathing shorts. They have something private to cover up. Basic anatomy, not that the body is "wrong " and they're not "shaming" anyone. It is entirely about appropriateness.
You totally seem to miss that women's bodies are sexualized by our society in a way that men's are absolutely not.0 -
I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.
Uhm. Sigh. Boys do not have breasts. Hence, boys can wear shorts only to the pool, and girls cannot. Turn it around - this is also why it is ok for women to wear a bikini bottom to swim whereas boys and mean tend to wear more modest, looser fitting bathing shorts. They have something private to cover up. Basic anatomy, not that the body is "wrong " and they're not "shaming" anyone. It is entirely about appropriateness.
You totally seem to miss that women's bodies are sexualized by our society in a way that men's are absolutely not.
Because the conversation is about school dress codes for high school kids. Sometimes taking a broader political/social viewpoint on a localized, age specific issue unneccesarily burdens the topic at hand. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.0 -
I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.
Uhm. Sigh. Boys do not have breasts. Hence, boys can wear shorts only to the pool, and girls cannot. Turn it around - this is also why it is ok for women to wear a bikini bottom to swim whereas boys and mean tend to wear more modest, looser fitting bathing shorts. They have something private to cover up. Basic anatomy, not that the body is "wrong " and they're not "shaming" anyone. It is entirely about appropriateness.
You totally seem to miss that women's bodies are sexualized by our society in a way that men's are absolutely not.
Because the conversation is about school dress codes for high school kids. Sometimes taking a broader political/social viewpoint on a localized, age specific issue unneccesarily burdens the topic at hand. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
And your contribution to the conversation is that the rules don't need to be applied in a universal manner because some bodies are more alluring than others. It stands to reason the point I am making is extremely relevant.0 -
I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.
Uhm. Sigh. Boys do not have breasts. Hence, boys can wear shorts only to the pool, and girls cannot. Turn it around - this is also why it is ok for women to wear a bikini bottom to swim whereas boys and mean tend to wear more modest, looser fitting bathing shorts. They have something private to cover up. Basic anatomy, not that the body is "wrong " and they're not "shaming" anyone. It is entirely about appropriateness.
You totally seem to miss that women's bodies are sexualized by our society in a way that men's are absolutely not.
Because the conversation is about school dress codes for high school kids. Sometimes taking a broader political/social viewpoint on a localized, age specific issue unneccesarily burdens the topic at hand. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
And your contribution to the conversation is that the rules don't need to be applied in a universal manner because some bodies are more alluring than others. It stands to reason the point I am making is extremely relevant.
I just disagree. That is allowed, right? America, freedom of thought and speech, yes?
I suppose I just take a more pragmatic view of these things. To me, this is less of an equality issue and more of a common sense issue. If politicians and businessmen choose the color of their ties to pyschologically and subliminally influence their audience, how much more do you need to extrapolate that clothing choices matter when dealing with hormonal teens? This attitude - they should just control themselves extend both ways - including the one doing the dressing. Wearing tube tops and short shorts to school is not showing self control, nor is it showing an understanding of what is appropriate for time and place. For the adults around them to be arguing for their inclusion on a high school campus is really arguing for children's lives to be harder; placing MORE pressure to be thin, to be hot, to wear what "everyone else" is wearing. And for boys to struggle more with temptation. That girl he can't stop staring at in school, well, she's wearing a tube top, and her headlights are on. It really isn't a feminist issue. It's a human development issue. In my opinion.0 -
I have a relative in high school, and their dress codes aren't particularly strict, but they seem random. And I think it is sexist - the girls can't wear tank tops but the guys can? Have you seen those teenage boys wearing those sleeveless, sideless t-shirts? You can see nipple! No restrictions on those, but my sensible, A-student cousin can't wear anything that shows her shoulder? Boys can wear skinny jeans but girls can't? It's not about appropriateness, it's about teaching girls and women that the body shape that they have by virtue of their gender is automatically wrong, shameful, and unacceptably sexy.
Uhm. Sigh. Boys do not have breasts. Hence, boys can wear shorts only to the pool, and girls cannot. Turn it around - this is also why it is ok for women to wear a bikini bottom to swim whereas boys and mean tend to wear more modest, looser fitting bathing shorts. They have something private to cover up. Basic anatomy, not that the body is "wrong " and they're not "shaming" anyone. It is entirely about appropriateness.
You totally seem to miss that women's bodies are sexualized by our society in a way that men's are absolutely not.
Because the conversation is about school dress codes for high school kids. Sometimes taking a broader political/social viewpoint on a localized, age specific issue unneccesarily burdens the topic at hand. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
And your contribution to the conversation is that the rules don't need to be applied in a universal manner because some bodies are more alluring than others. It stands to reason the point I am making is extremely relevant.
I just disagree. That is allowed, right? America, freedom of thought and speech, yes?
I suppose I just take a more pragmatic view of these things. To me, this is less of an equality issue and more of a common sense issue. If politicians and businessmen choose the color of their ties to pyschologically and subliminally influence their audience, how much more do you need to extrapolate that clothing choices matter when dealing with hormonal teens? This attitude - they should just control themselves extend both ways - including the one doing the dressing. Wearing tube tops and short shorts to school is not showing self control, nor is it showing an understanding of what is appropriate for time and place. For the adults around them to be arguing for their inclusion on a high school campus is really arguing for children's lives to be harder; placing MORE pressure to be thin, to be hot, to wear what "everyone else" is wearing. And for boys to struggle more with temptation. That girl he can't stop staring at in school, well, she's wearing a tube top, and her headlights are on. It really isn't a feminist issue. It's a human development issue. In my opinion.
I am not sure were I argued anything about short, shorts or tubes being appropriate for school but I am certain you argued that voluptuous women were hotter than less voluptuous women, so they should have to wear more clothes and have the rules applied more strictly. And I said that nonsense and a direct result of a society that sexualizes women's bodies (breasts etc) to an extreme extent. You are talking about how boys don't got showing off in speedos, but in other countries speedos are the norm. Women of all shapes and sizes in bikinis is the norm. It's not considered showing off -- it's just bodies. America has a unique obsession with modesty.
Whatever thoughts a boy has - they are his. They aren't caused by what a girl wears, they are natural and would likely occur no matter what a girl has on - it's hormonal. When we act like there is something "wrong" with those thoughts, we seek solutions over something we can't control with things we can -- like how young women dress. That is sexist and pretty unfair to everyone.
Of course not all clothing is appropriate for school -- but the idea that the rules don't need to be applied the same to everyone based on their body shape IS sexist. That's what your initial post was about. It's really, really sad.0
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