How mfp works
Newfiedan
Posts: 1,517 Member
This post is for those whom seem to misunderstand how mfp works and need a reminder on it and the finer points of making it work for you.
1) When you joined and put in all your info mfp gave you a daily goal for calories. That goal already has the deficit needed to shed that weight built in right off the crack of the bat with no exercise built in, period end of story. For those whom do not know here is the breakdown on daily deficits based on mfp's goals. The daily deficit is what you need to shed the fat.
1/2 lb loss a week = 250 cal deficit/day BUILT IN.
1 lb/wk loss = 500/day
1.5 lb/wk loss =750/day
2 lb/wk loss - 1000/day.
2) Eating back the exercise calories:
Yes you eat them back unless you want to exceed the goal set forth by mfp every day, IF YOU LOG ACCURATELY EVERY DAY! This is the part that sooooo many seem to have trouble wrapping their heads around. If you log every day and log accurately for food intake and what you burn during exercise via a hrm (get a good one) then it will work without fail. It has done so for me and nearly every single person whom has befriended me on mfp.So lets give an example here:
Person X eats 1200 cals a day, works out and burns 300 cals a day leaving them with 900 net cals, refuses to eat back those exercise cals. They are dipping below starvation mode, give them 2 or 3 days like this and fat loss will stop dead in its tracks and the body will start to consume muscle for survival. So when mfp says eat those calories then that means eat them for a reason, you are not working out for nothing. Your working out to raise your BMR not to shed more fat, let the body shed the fat for you while you enjoy your meal and recover from your workout.
3) Having trouble eating what mfp says you should for caloric intake? You are not alone, many of us do or did not eat enough for fat loss, do not be alarmed. Eating right/more does work I am living proof of that and no I am not trying to sell you something or a fat loss program. I am trying to get you to understand that healthy fat loss is totally achievable without starving the body and it can be done in a way that makes you happy and full of energy. So society/tv/commercials and all those other crack heads/snake oil salesman have it wrong, starving yourself to lose fat is not the answer end of story.
4) Get used to the idea that there are going to be the naysayers out there saying that their "diet" is the best. What else is new, any diet that restricts good healthy foods like fruits, good fats, and healthy carbs is just that it is a diet, not a lifestyle change that will serve you better in the long run. We need to find what works for us and if you trust mfp, log accurately and religiously then it will work for you.
5) Why 1200/day as the minimum? Well this part is debated hotly around here, the reasoning behind that is that it is pretty hard to get the proper nutrition into your body on this low of an intake, so that is why they enforce it so strongly on the site. It is not an arbitrary number they pulled out of thin air, it has been proven several times over that 1200 or less a day is not advisable. Yes you can function on less but do you really want to be walking around starving the body and depleting muscle?
6) Starvation mode what is it? Well simply put starvation mode is not starving yourself from a hunger standpoint. The starvation mode they speak of is when the body is not being fed what it needs so in turn it will slow down the metabolic rate and effectively shut down fat loss. It happens daily on here and the number 1 reason for plateaus as ppl call them on here is that they are simply not eating enough. You can not expect to train like an olympian and eat like a mouse and expect fat loss, it is simple physics. The body need X amount of fuel to run, and X+more for effective fat loss, it is figuring out what amounts work for you to make fat loss a real thing.
So I hope this helps to clear up some misconceptions out there and if you have a question feel free to ask, I will do my best to answer it.
1) When you joined and put in all your info mfp gave you a daily goal for calories. That goal already has the deficit needed to shed that weight built in right off the crack of the bat with no exercise built in, period end of story. For those whom do not know here is the breakdown on daily deficits based on mfp's goals. The daily deficit is what you need to shed the fat.
1/2 lb loss a week = 250 cal deficit/day BUILT IN.
1 lb/wk loss = 500/day
1.5 lb/wk loss =750/day
2 lb/wk loss - 1000/day.
2) Eating back the exercise calories:
Yes you eat them back unless you want to exceed the goal set forth by mfp every day, IF YOU LOG ACCURATELY EVERY DAY! This is the part that sooooo many seem to have trouble wrapping their heads around. If you log every day and log accurately for food intake and what you burn during exercise via a hrm (get a good one) then it will work without fail. It has done so for me and nearly every single person whom has befriended me on mfp.So lets give an example here:
Person X eats 1200 cals a day, works out and burns 300 cals a day leaving them with 900 net cals, refuses to eat back those exercise cals. They are dipping below starvation mode, give them 2 or 3 days like this and fat loss will stop dead in its tracks and the body will start to consume muscle for survival. So when mfp says eat those calories then that means eat them for a reason, you are not working out for nothing. Your working out to raise your BMR not to shed more fat, let the body shed the fat for you while you enjoy your meal and recover from your workout.
3) Having trouble eating what mfp says you should for caloric intake? You are not alone, many of us do or did not eat enough for fat loss, do not be alarmed. Eating right/more does work I am living proof of that and no I am not trying to sell you something or a fat loss program. I am trying to get you to understand that healthy fat loss is totally achievable without starving the body and it can be done in a way that makes you happy and full of energy. So society/tv/commercials and all those other crack heads/snake oil salesman have it wrong, starving yourself to lose fat is not the answer end of story.
4) Get used to the idea that there are going to be the naysayers out there saying that their "diet" is the best. What else is new, any diet that restricts good healthy foods like fruits, good fats, and healthy carbs is just that it is a diet, not a lifestyle change that will serve you better in the long run. We need to find what works for us and if you trust mfp, log accurately and religiously then it will work for you.
5) Why 1200/day as the minimum? Well this part is debated hotly around here, the reasoning behind that is that it is pretty hard to get the proper nutrition into your body on this low of an intake, so that is why they enforce it so strongly on the site. It is not an arbitrary number they pulled out of thin air, it has been proven several times over that 1200 or less a day is not advisable. Yes you can function on less but do you really want to be walking around starving the body and depleting muscle?
6) Starvation mode what is it? Well simply put starvation mode is not starving yourself from a hunger standpoint. The starvation mode they speak of is when the body is not being fed what it needs so in turn it will slow down the metabolic rate and effectively shut down fat loss. It happens daily on here and the number 1 reason for plateaus as ppl call them on here is that they are simply not eating enough. You can not expect to train like an olympian and eat like a mouse and expect fat loss, it is simple physics. The body need X amount of fuel to run, and X+more for effective fat loss, it is figuring out what amounts work for you to make fat loss a real thing.
So I hope this helps to clear up some misconceptions out there and if you have a question feel free to ask, I will do my best to answer it.
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Replies
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Well said! :drinker:0
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I return.
Do you think that if you work out constantly and 'eat like a mouse' for long term that you really wouldn't lose any fat?0 -
that is a no brainer, the answer is yes, you will stop losing fat I can 100% guarantee that. You see it here on mfp every single day, working out like mad, have not lost a single pound and eating only 1200 calories a day, if i had a dime for every one of those posts I would be rich.0
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*S* exactly how it's been working for me!
oh at first i had a hard time eating my full 1200, and i was losing slowly.. but once i got my body used to being fed in a healthy way, and as close to my full 1200 net per day, i started losing way more successfully. (ie, more consistently AND larger weekly losses)
Trust the system.. it DOES work0 -
I return.
Do you think that if you work out constantly and 'eat like a mouse' for long term that you really wouldn't lose any fat?
Oh, you'll lose fat, all right. And muscle, too. And then your body starts to eat your organs: liver & kidney, brain & heart... yikes.0 -
shelly is one of those ppl who befriended me and found a better path, she is dead on the money.0
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Okay, but how long were they doing that? A day? Two days?
You're saying if I ran 10 miles everyday for 6 months and ate only 1000 calories a day, I wouldn't lose any weight, Newfiedan?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2016490?dopt=Abstract0 -
Thanks.0
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I firmly stand by my convictions that you will not shed any fat by doing that, what you will do is slow down your metabolic rate and consume muscle. Fat is the last thing the body turns to for energy. In order here is what the body consumes. Carbs, protein, fat. it will consume your muscles before it burns the fat if it is done in an unhealthy manner. I do not think you are ready to wrap your head around my message spacecoconaut and that is fine, in time you will come around and learn the right path.0
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Your body resorts to fat before resorting to muscles.
Also, if you were to do a VLCD and lose 3 lbs a week in the beginning, your metabolism would only slow down to make you lose 2 1/2 to 2 1/4 lbs a week. It would not come to a complete halt.
How about we test this for sure? I'll be the dummy and log my weight while on a restricted diet and while doing an intense exercise routine daily.0 -
Okay, but how long were they doing that? A day? Two days?
You're saying if I ran 10 miles everyday for 6 months and ate only 1000 calories a day, I wouldn't lose any weight, Newfiedan?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2016490?dopt=Abstract
I'm seriously trying to figure out how anyone would possibly have enough energy to run 10 miles a day if they're eating less than 1000 calories a day....seriously. I have met a number of serious runners in the past few months (both on MFP and "in real life") and all of them advocate eating to fuel your runs.
:huh:0 -
Exercising is more about willpower over stamina.0
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Be my guest, I was about to issue you such a challenge, to go on a vlcd and log everything accurately. I know what I preach works as I have done it myself and continue to do so for many on here by getting them off plateaus and eating better. You have much to learn about how real fat loss works and you are sorely uneducated about proper fat loss, so I absolutely will be in for this. Do it your way for 3 weeks to get some consistent results via not just the scale but by measurements as well so we get a bodyfat analysis. Then give it 3 weeks via my way and see the difference.0
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He said you wouldn't lose any FAT.....not that you woudln't lose any WEIGHT (i.e. muscle weight).You're saying if I ran 10 miles everyday for 6 months and ate only 1000 calories a day, I wouldn't lose any weight, Newfiedan?0 -
Alright, Newfiedan!
I will do this for 3 weeks. Maybe you're right, I really don't know but I'm the type to learn things the hard way, so I guess we'll see.
I might actually vlog this if I can figure out how to edit my videos and such.0 -
the problem with the results robinator is that for this to be a valid experiment there would need to be an impartial third party doing said analysis, which in this case would be rather difficult to do.0
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Yes, when you are eating enough calories.Your body resorts to fat before resorting to muscles.
No one will truly endorse this except to prove you wrong.How about we test this for sure? I'll be the dummy and log my weight while on a restricted diet and while doing an intense exercise routine daily.
Not if you want to exercise effectively. You'll see.Exercising is more about willpower over stamina.
Space Coconaut -- I think you need to get your head out of....well, space.
Please listen to these folks here who have learned the hard way, and are trying to save you the time and trouble of having to do the same thing yourself. This is a very helpful and cordial community here at MFP, and no one (who has a clue what they are talking about) would advocate that you do anything that isn't 100% good for you.
/therobinator steps off soapbox0 -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starvation_mode
Nice short read on starvation mode, but I'm a chemist and chemical names/processes make me smile. Here's the important bits in regular English.
0-12hrs after you stop eating, your body finishes off the glucose store from food you recently ate
2-3 days into fasting, you body burns stored fat for energy (so SpaceCoconaut is right on the short term)
after 2-3days, the fat isn't good enough b/c your brain is starved for glucose and eventually start breaking down the protein in muscle so that it can have glucose (so Newfiedan is right that you won't be shedding fat in the long run)
So yeah you could eat like a mouse and lose weight, but you are throwing out the good stuff with the bad. Y'know, baby & bath water. And yes, I realize I;m describing full fasting above, but starvation mode with not enough calories will be similar but more gradual.
:happy: The best way I can explain and motivate why anyone would eat back exercise calories is this:
Exercise is NOT meant to directly make you lose weight, your calorie deficit does that (HOME tab, click Goals, deficit # is in red on right side). Exercise is help you build muscle (toned or bulk, depends on how you workout) which **increases your metabolism** which helps you burn more calories EVEN when you aren't working out. In order to build those muscles, you got to feed your body.0 -
We still know it to be true, though.the problem with the results robinator is that for this to be a valid experiment there would need to be an impartial third party doing said analysis, which in this case would be rather difficult to do.
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for this to be a valid experiment with real results there needs to be a bodyfat analysis using caliper methods by someone who knows how to do it right. I am currently at 16.65% bodyfat from my last caliper measurements, and I drop that % every week I shed weight while I retain 99% of my muscle mass. So if you really want to do this we need real numbers to work from not just a scale number.Alright, Newfiedan!
I will do this for 3 weeks. Maybe you're right, I really don't know but I'm the type to learn things the hard way, so I guess we'll see.
I might actually vlog this if I can figure out how to edit my videos and such.0 -
I agree fully with Newfiedan. I may not eat all my exercise calories back but I do try. I am an example of not eating the calories needed everyday I was a one meal person and would splurge occasionally and had gotten up to 185 because of it. Now that I am trying to eat my net cals I am actually losing weight.0
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Be my guest, I was about to issue you such a challenge, to go on a vlcd and log everything accurately. I know what I preach works as I have done it myself and continue to do so for many on here by getting them off plateaus and eating better. You have much to learn about how real fat loss works and you are sorely uneducated about proper fat loss, so I absolutely will be in for this. Do it your way for 3 weeks to get some consistent results via not just the scale but by measurements as well so we get a bodyfat analysis. Then give it 3 weeks via my way and see the difference.
She will lose significant amounts of weight. I'm a chronic ED sufferer (not acute) and have had many experiences of VLCDs leading to weight and size loss NOT plateaus.
eg -
4 months at circa 500 calories a day resulted in weight loss from 113 pounds to 80 and a size UK10 to way below size UK6
2 months of fasting every other day and eating around 800 cals on the between days led to weight loss from 120 pounds to 105 pounds and a UK10 to a UK8.
The reason why your method is better (I think) is that the weight loss is healthy, you are not depriving your body of nutrients and you are less likely to gain the weight back.
I am pretty much exactly the same weight as I was 10 years ago but I have probably lost and gained 200+ pounds in that time - the same 30-40 pounds over and over again. NOT healthy or good.
But you do lose the weight. You can't exist on 700 calories for any length of time and not lose weight.
So, while I fully accept that MFP has the RIGHT approach it does not have the ONLY approach. 'Starvation mode' is called far too much for what would be very temporary plateaus if the individual continued to not eat.0 -
okay, this is where I get the most confused on this site (so thanks for clarifying). As long as my NET is around 1200 I should start seeing loss? My calories are goaled at 1330/day.. I eat some of my exercise cals back, but not all.. my net is usually between 900-1100/day and I only lost 1/2lb last week... I burn anywhere between 300-600 calories through exercise. i'm going to test it for myself though and work really hard to net myself at 1200 the rest of the week and see where I go.
thanks
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My scale measures body fat, but everyone tells me not to go by that because it's not accurate. Says I have 44% body fat.
I can get my doctor in on this. He was supposed to order calipers, but I don't know if he has them in yet or not. But I will do this under the supervision of my doctor.0 -
If you want to be slim like a concentration camp victim, don't eat back your calories. If you want to be slim like a well conditioned athlete, eat back your exercise calories. Get the picture?0
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Hopefully, your doctor isn't the kind that will truly recommend what you are suggesting.I can get my doctor in on this. He was supposed to order calipers, but I don't know if he has them in yet or not. But I will do this under the supervision of my doctor.0 -
bump0
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this would be very interesting to see.. im curious.. are you going to update here?0
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Bump - I want to read the results of this challenge!0
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Bump - I want to read the results of this challenge!
Me 2!!0
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