Squats - the bar hurts my shoulders

tolygal

That barbell is really starting to hurt my shoulders. They have a pad at the gym, which I use, but it's old and worn out in the middle (I asked them to get a new one - hopefully they will, and hopefully that will help). But - even with that pad, I'm having a hard time supporting the bar on my shoulders because it hurts. I pull my shoulder blades together to try to give the bar a nice "shelf" to sit on, but it is still just so heavy on my shoulders and it hurts. I'm still adding weight slowly (currently, I'm up to 110 lbs), but I always wonder if my shoulders will be able to continue supporting the weight as I add more.

Is this kind of like grip strength - that my shoulders will get better at supporting the weight as I increase it? Or is there something else that I should be doing?

andreae13

Mine always hurt the following day so I'm really interested to hear any ideas!

SophRW

I use a beach towel folded over a couple times.

BigDaddyBRC

Before pads....they rolled and duct taped towels.
Have you acomplished where you are by being a sissy? Suck it up Buttercups! You can do it!

elizabethblake

bump to see replies

shaj316

When I used to workout in college, I developed a bum shoulder which made it difficult to use a bar for squats or bench press. Have you thought about using dumbbells? Not sure if the weight of each dumbbell would be too much for you...

sportsforfun

Your shoulders should get more use to it as you lift more? It takes a bit of time for your shoulders to get used to the weight on it. The pad definitely helps. Also make sure that you are not resting the bar on your upper shoulders/neck area as this causes more pain. By shrugging up a bit the weight gets distributed to the outer parts of your shoulders. You can use dumbells as well but then you will have the same problem with your hands gripping large weight.

curvykatie

Are you definitely putting the bar on the right part of your shoulders? It shouldn't be directly on your shoulders. When you use the bar your elbows should go as far back and up as possible which creates a 'shelf' at the very top of you back, this is where you place the bar. (I learned in detail how to use a squat rack when i did my gym instruction)

Hope that helps the problem.

Katie
xx

ultimategar

if it is too uncomfortable try squatting with two dumbells held just above your chest, pay close attention to your form.

koosdel

Are you doing any shoulder/back excersises?

neva4saken

not a professional just sharing my encounter(s) at gym training, even with the pad the bar can still hurt your shoulders and bone in the back of your neck, for the ladies that trained with me i would bring an extra towel to wrap around the bar along with the pad to make sure it's not resting directly on their shoulders, also i had to make sure their hand grip was close enough that the weight was not resting directly on their necks, made sure they were not bouncing or jerking slow controlled movements because the slightest "bump" space between the bar and your shoulders/neck can become painful.. you are doing squats so technically the catch weight shouldn't be on your neck/shoulders .. for the ladies that couldn't do it for whatever reason we incorporated the squat press (which was safer) and than there are many different variations of leg routines with dumbbells that you can do, i made the switch with quite a few and they have enjoyed the results.. just in my experience

nessajk

My husband, who is in incredibly good shape, was told by his physical therapist that he shouldn't do that move anymore. It is apparently too hard on both the shoulders and the back. Instead, she told him to squat with weights by his side for the same effect without the shoulder and back injury risk/pain. I think she also said that using a hip sled was a good option, too, though that isn't free weights.

tolygal

I dont' think dumbells will work because they aren't heavy enough (and the ones that are heavy enough, I wouldn't be able to lift/hold correctly). I'm squatting 110# right now and have all intentions of increasing that.

I haven't paid much attention to wear my hands and elbows are - I'll pay attention to that tomorrow. And maybe I'll look up some videos and watch for that specifically. I do try to squeeze my shoulder blades together to make that shelf, but I'll try to pay attention for "shrugging" and where my elbows are.

I do other things, like forward and reverse lunges (with 20 lb dumbells right now - about to move up to 25), step ups (currently with barbell loaded to 65#) and ham curls with a ball, etc., so I know there are other options, but I really LOVE the squat rack - it's my favorite piece of excercise equipment - and I just don't want to give up my squats and deadlifts :-) The other thing about the squat is that it's more of a full body excercise - in addition to my lower body, it's also strengthening my upper body - it's seriously my favorite excercise :-)

I do back excercises too - specifically the lat pull down, a bent over row, a seated cable row. And I do lots of shoulder work also.

I have used the towel on top of the pad before (mostly because I'm sweaty though), but I'll try that again to see if it helps with this too.

bizco

Here's a video that might help you. The ladies are lifting HEAVY and they aren't using a pad or towel of any kind. Their elbows are pulled way back and the bar is resting on the "shelf" created by the back and shoulder blades, not the shoulders themselves. Good luck and don't risk injury.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEkpST0vSbg

kensky

I bet it's a matter of positioning/form/getting used to it. I'd stick with it. I remember the bar hurting my back (like the surface of my back, not muscle/body protesting pain) and then, suddenly, it didn't hurt.

Squats are worth the trouble of finding the way your body likes to do them, for sure.

JNick77

That barbell is really starting to hurt my shoulders. They have a pad at the gym, which I use, but it's old and worn out in the middle (I asked them to get a new one - hopefully they will, and hopefully that will help). But - even with that pad, I'm having a hard time supporting the bar on my shoulders because it hurts. I pull my shoulder blades together to try to give the bar a nice "shelf" to sit on, but it is still just so heavy on my shoulders and it hurts. I'm still adding weight slowly (currently, I'm up to 110 lbs), but I always wonder if my shoulders will be able to continue supporting the weight as I add more.

Is this kind of like grip strength - that my shoulders will get better at supporting the weight as I increase it? Or is there something else that I should be doing?

The back squat is a great leg and full body exercise, gratz for stepping forward and doing it. Secondly, there is no replacement for this movement. Not holding dumbbells at your side, not a leg press, nothing. The closest thing would be deadlifting with a Trap Bar.

This movement is uncomfortable for sure but worth it. Here's an exercept from Jim Wendler on Squat Form, which is applicable for your issue.

Proper bar placement depends on your body type and what’s most comfortable to you. Some people have shoulder problems and can’t carry the bar very low. Others just plain suck at high bar squatting. Place the bar where it allows you to reach depth with good form. It’s just that easy.
• I like taking a full grip on the bar, but I used a “thumbs-around” grip for the first half of my squatting life. I don’t see this as a deal-breaker.
• Keep your elbows down and try to force them under the bar. This will cause your hips to drive first out of the bottom of the squat. It’ll also keep your chest high and prevent you from squatting with your legs first instead of your back. The first thing to shoot up with many people is their *kitten*. Remedy this by pushing with your hips and keeping your elbows under the bar – or at least trying to.
• Arch your upper back hard for the entire lift. This will cause your lower back to arch, too.
• Grip the bar with the narrowest grip you can manage without hurting your shoulders. This will ensure that you remain tight throughout the lift.

Also, checkout YouTube for "So You Think You Can Squat" for any additional pointers that might help you. Lastly, just go to ****'s Sporting Goods, or any other Sporting Good store and get your own pad.

JNick77

Read my reply and I definitely forgot something. Try doing some upper back exercises and definitely do shoulder shrugs to help strengthen your Traps which will help support the bar.

soloral

The bar should not be on your shoulder, it should be placed more on the back then the shoulder

tolygal

Here's a video that might help you. The ladies are lifting HEAVY and they aren't using a pad or towel of any kind. Their elbows are pulled way back and the bar is resting on the "shelf" created by the back and shoulder blades, not the shoulders themselves. Good luck and don't risk injury.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEkpST0vSbg

OK, I watched the video, and I think it looks like how I hold the bar (I know I say 'shoulders' but I think I should be saying 'back' instead). I'm going to pay closer attention tomorrow to make sure, but the bar isn't really riding on my shoulders (I don't think) - I think it's sitting on the "shelf" I make when I squeeze my shoulder blades together (which is probably why I call it my shoulders LOL). Anyway - I'm going to double check my form tomorrow. I notice none of those girls use a pad or a towel - all I can think is OUCH!!! I wish I had a spotter. I'm always afraid to go too heavy in case I can't get back up...

tolygal

The back squat is a great leg and full body exercise, gratz for stepping forward and doing it. Secondly, there is no replacement for this movement. Not holding dumbbells at your side, not a leg press, nothing. The closest thing would be deadlifting with a Trap Bar.

This movement is uncomfortable for sure but worth it. Here's an exercept from Jim Wendler on Squat Form, which is applicable for your issue.

Proper bar placement depends on your body type and what’s most comfortable to you. Some people have shoulder problems and can’t carry the bar very low. Others just plain suck at high bar squatting. Place the bar where it allows you to reach depth with good form. It’s just that easy.
• I like taking a full grip on the bar, but I used a “thumbs-around” grip for the first half of my squatting life. I don’t see this as a deal-breaker.
• Keep your elbows down and try to force them under the bar. This will cause your hips to drive first out of the bottom of the squat. It’ll also keep your chest high and prevent you from squatting with your legs first instead of your back. The first thing to shoot up with many people is their *kitten*. Remedy this by pushing with your hips and keeping your elbows under the bar – or at least trying to.
• Arch your upper back hard for the entire lift. This will cause your lower back to arch, too.
• Grip the bar with the narrowest grip you can manage without hurting your shoulders. This will ensure that you remain tight throughout the lift.

Also, checkout YouTube for "So You Think You Can Squat" for any additional pointers that might help you. Lastly, just go to ****'s Sporting Goods, or any other Sporting Good store and get your own pad.

Thanks - I printed that off to take with me tomorrow. Good idea to get my own pad. The one at the gym always seems nasty with other people's sweat anyway (*gag*).

I do lots of upper back and shoulder work, but I haven't ever done shoulder shrugs. I'll consider adding some of that in. I'm a little concerned about my upper traps looking too big for a girl though (the part up by my neck - am I saying that right - upper traps?)...

somigliana

OK, I watched the video, and I think it looks like how I hold the bar (I know I say 'shoulders' but I think I should be saying 'back' instead). I'm going to pay closer attention tomorrow to make sure, but the bar isn't really riding on my shoulders (I don't think) - I think it's sitting on the "shelf" I make when I squeeze my shoulder blades together (which is probably why I call it my shoulders LOL. Anyway - I'm going to double check my form tomorrow. I notice none of those girls use a pad or a towel - all I can think is OUCH!!! I wish I had a spotter. I'm always afraid to go too heavy in case I can't get back up...

I love squats and deadlifts too! It took me a while to get used to the weight, and sometimes I use the rolled up towel trick, but recently I've managed without it.

As far as being afraid of not getting back up without a spotter: I always make sure that the safety bars are in place on the sides of the squat rack. The other day I couldn't get back up and (after going a mild moment of panic) simply lowered the barbell to the safety bars, no problems.

8rules

Are you definitely putting the bar on the right part of your shoulders? It shouldn't be directly on your shoulders. When you use the bar your elbows should go as far back and up as possible which creates a 'shelf' at the very top of you back, this is where you place the bar. (I learned in detail how to use a squat rack when i did my gym instruction)

Hope that helps the problem.

Katie
xx

This!!!!

And yes there are very good alternatives that will provide a very similar level of benefit.

As an alternative, the front squat engages all the same muscles and is often considered a better movement by some body builders, this is a hot topic of debate, but nobody debates both or amazingly effective. The front squat is very popular with ladies as it is considered VERY glute enhancing...

As a further alternative, the overhead squat, where you hold the bar with arms fully extended above you, will not only go along way to improve your back squat form, but also turn your core into a powerful thing with the strength of iron.

Some rules on the back squat

-Bar should not touch your spine, EVER
-Forget the padding, it makes an unstable ledge
-Place your hands as close together on the bar as possible, this will squeeze your shoulder blades together, tighten up across your abs and chest and shoulders. IMAGINE bending the bar around your body like you are SUPERMAN!!! NOW you have a nice ledge for that heavy bar
-Always squat to or below parallel. Do not make me come back to this thread and explain the physics and why squatting short of parallel is BAD BAD for your knees. Cause I will
-Keep your ab and core tight all the way down, if you are bending forward at the bottom, you are using to much weight, use the overhead squat to teach your lower back muscles to activate at the bottom of the movement

I love heavy squats as it seems like you can set a new PR every week for a very long time once you start doing them

JNick77

Yes, the shoulder shrugs work the traps nicely in addition to any other shoulder work you do. I would worry about getting an over developed neck or anything.

Do yourself a huge favor and watch "So You Think You Can Squat" on YouTube. Dave Tate and his group are one of the best teachers of Squatting, Benching, and Deadlifting.

- I agree about the Pad, if you can do without you should.
-The Front Squat is a great exercise but is more technical than the Back Squat, recommend mastering the Back Squat first.
- Experts are starting to disagree about the core tightness and from what I've been seeing are teaching to push out with your belly as to not create any spine issues.

tolygal

OK, I watched the video, and I think it looks like how I hold the bar (I know I say 'shoulders' but I think I should be saying 'back' instead). I'm going to pay closer attention tomorrow to make sure, but the bar isn't really riding on my shoulders (I don't think) - I think it's sitting on the "shelf" I make when I squeeze my shoulder blades together (which is probably why I call it my shoulders LOL. Anyway - I'm going to double check my form tomorrow. I notice none of those girls use a pad or a towel - all I can think is OUCH!!! I wish I had a spotter. I'm always afraid to go too heavy in case I can't get back up...

I love squats and deadlifts too! It took me a while to get used to the weight, and sometimes I use the rolled up towel trick, but recently I've managed without it.

As far as being afraid of not getting back up without a spotter: I always make sure that the safety bars are in place on the sides of the squat rack. The other day I couldn't get back up and (after going a mild moment of panic) simply lowered the barbell to the safety bars, no problems.

ooohhhhhhh - how does that work? Are you talking about those slots on the side where those side bars can fit into? Do you set them to your lowest position of your squat then? I never realized that option!! I've never seen anyone use that before. A trainer told me not to put the clips on the bar so if I needed to drop weight I could, but nobody ever told me about "safety bars!!" Thanks!!

8rules

I forgot to add.

Start your downward movement by breaking at your hips, and then your knees. Consider it almost a two stage step if you break it down.

And have a friend watch you from the side to ensure your knees do not go past your toes. You should sit back into a squat. Put a weight bench behind you if you are concerned as you get the feel of this.

The most common mistake I see made is knees out past the toes. This is exactly how the stupid idea that squatting to proper depth is bad for your knees got started. Knees stay behind your toes, squat to depth. "*kitten* to the grass"

8rules

Yes, the shoulder shrugs work the traps nicely in addition to any other shoulder work you do. I would worry about getting an over developed neck or anything.

Do yourself a huge favor and watch "So You Think You Can Squat" on YouTube. Dave Tate and his group are one of the best teachers of Squatting, Benching, and Deadlifting.

- I agree about the Pad, if you can do without you should.
-The Front Squat is a great exercise but is more technical than the Back Squat, recommend mastering the Back Squat first.
- Experts are starting to disagree about the core tightness and from what I've been seeing are teaching to push out with your belly as to not create any spine issues.

I've honestly found the front squat to be very simple, and you usually do it with less weight, thus more reps and more practice. The weight being at the front also almost forces your knees to stay back behind your toes, and forces you back into a squat. I think working the back squat, without working the front squat and overhead squat is holding yourself back. I rotate them along with single legged squats which I truly suck at.

tolygal

I don't even know what a front squat is (I'll look it up though) - maybe I can incorporate both somehow. I was doing New Rules of Lifting for Women but got a shoulder injury and had to quit for a while. I'm now finally back up to where I left off and am looking forward to starting again. I'm curious to see if they do a front squat in NROLFW (I haven't gotten past phase 1 yet).

I watched the "So you think you can squat" videos (only up to part 3 so far) and it was really helpful. I do not think I've been tipping my head up so far or sticking my butt out so far. I also didn't realize that I was supposed to push my knees out - I know they aren't supposed to go over my knees and I do sit back into the squat, but today I'm going to focus on keeping my head up, my butt out, my chest out (so I have that arch in my back like he said) and my knees out (so they don't come in). I know that my knees have a tendency to fall in during a squat or lunge (from the therapist where I did PT for my shoulders) and I've been working on that. I might drop some weight today to focus more on my form. I hate to do that, but I know it's important. I'm off to go work on that now :-)

tolygal

Ok, so this morning, I dropped my load to 100# and focused on my form. I wish I had a spotter to help me confirm, but I don't... I think I did okay. I have been doing the "shelf" as instructed, but I may have had the bar sitting up too close to my neck, so I let it be down a little farther (which was harder on my shoulders/arms for having to be back so far to hold the bar - I assume that will improve over time). I also focused on keeping my butt up, chest out and my weight in my heels with my knees pressing out. And I did it without a pad. It wasn't awful, but it didn't feel great on my back - see, I'm not saying 'shoulders' anymore :-) I did step-ups with the bar and a 65# load and by the end of that, I was pretty sick of the bar!! I did notice with the step ups my knees really tend to come in. I’m going to have to lighten my load and work on my form there. I’ll watch Steps 4 and 5 of the So You Think You Can Squat series to learn what exercises I need to do to strengthen my hips (I believe he’s going to go there when he pushes the guy to fail – I just didn’t have time to watch the rest last night). So anyway – I just wanted to thank everyone for your feedback. I’ll continue to work on this – and I’ll try to do it without the pad if possible.

I have to share my proud moment - today I did the cable triceps pushdown with 40#!!! I started barely able to do 20# a few weeks ago (this is a new excercise I've added to my plan). I could barely get 8 reps with good form, but this is a big improvement!! I've very happy!!

mmtiernan

Bump to read later!

8rules

Ok, so this morning, I dropped my load to 100# and focused on my form. I wish I had a spotter to help me confirm, but I don't... I think I did okay. I have been doing the "shelf" as instructed, but I may have had the bar sitting up too close to my neck, so I let it be down a little farther (which was harder on my shoulders/arms for having to be back so far to hold the bar - I assume that will improve over time). I also focused on keeping my butt up, chest out and my weight in my heels with my knees pressing out. And I did it without a pad. It wasn't awful, but it didn't feel great on my back - see, I'm not saying 'shoulders' anymore :-) I did step-ups with the bar and a 65# load and by the end of that, I was pretty sick of the bar!! I did notice with the step ups my knees really tend to come in. I’m going to have to lighten my load and work on my form there. I’ll watch Steps 4 and 5 of the So You Think You Can Squat series to learn what exercises I need to do to strengthen my hips (I believe he’s going to go there when he pushes the guy to fail – I just didn’t have time to watch the rest last night). So anyway – I just wanted to thank everyone for your feedback. I’ll continue to work on this – and I’ll try to do it without the pad if possible.

I have to share my proud moment - today I did the cable triceps pushdown with 40#!!! I started barely able to do 20# a few weeks ago (this is a new excercise I've added to my plan). I could barely get 8 reps with good form, but this is a big improvement!! I've very happy!!

Congrats on your new personal record!

Good work working on your squat. You will not master form all at once. But you should definitely never use a weight you cannot squat with good form. I would say that if you can squat where your knees do not go out past your toes, your knees do not bend in, and your back stays stable, you can progress in weight.

Again, start the break at the hip, then the knees second. This will almost always lead to a much better squat.

Check out box squats for another excellent training drill.

somigliana

ooohhhhhhh - how does that work? Are you talking about those slots on the side where those side bars can fit into? Do you set them to your lowest position of your squat then? I never realized that option!! I've never seen anyone use that before. A trainer told me not to put the clips on the bar so if I needed to drop weight I could, but nobody ever told me about "safety bars!!" Thanks!!

Yes, exactly - the side bars. I set them to just below the lowest position of my squat, so when I'm "@ss to ground" the barbell is just above the side bar. It's only a couple of inches to lower it to the side bars if you feel you can't make it all the way up again.

Grin. My pleasure. It's always good to meet women who are fond of the barbell!