Cardio for weight loss is a waste of time??
Replies
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i think cardio is important on its own until u get to a weight u are comfortable with and then u start building muscle to tone up. its not fun to build muscle under fat.
Don't worry about building muscle under fat, it will not happen if you are in a caloric deficit, all the strength training will do is ensure you don't lose the muscle you do have, and help you become stronger. muscle needs a caloric surplus to actually increase, unless you are new to lifting you may gain 2-3 pounds of muscle even in a caloric deficit (beginners gains)
okay Eric i have a question for you then. My thighs, buttox and arms are tight, i mean i have defined muscle, and i have been told that i have a layer of fat over my abs but my abs are most definitely there. i can ffell them and my son and hubby can too. I do heavy lifting and i do HIIT training. I want to slim down these thighs and tighten these abs what do you suggest????????????
Oh yeah I work out 5-6 days a week! sunday is my off day!0 -
GREAT Post and string of replies.
I agree and I appreciate the feedback. It's motivating to hear of you all with such great results with primarily strength training. I really am clueless about the fitness part of the journey so I'm definitely learning as I go and this was eye opening for me. I kinda feel bad about calling the trainer a donkey now. Haha.....0 -
i think cardio is important on its own until u get to a weight u are comfortable with and then u start building muscle to tone up. its not fun to build muscle under fat.
Don't worry about building muscle under fat, it will not happen if you are in a caloric deficit, all the strength training will do is ensure you don't lose the muscle you do have, and help you become stronger. muscle needs a caloric surplus to actually increase, unless you are new to lifting you may gain 2-3 pounds of muscle even in a caloric deficit (beginners gains)
okay Eric i have a question for you then. My thighs, buttox and arms are tight, i mean i have defined muscle, and i have been told that i have a layer of fat over my abs but my abs are most definitely there. i can ffell them and my son and hubby can too. I do heavy lifting and i do HIIT training. I want to slim down these thighs and tighten these abs what do you suggest????????????
Oh yeah I work out 5-6 days a week! sunday is my off day!
caloric deficit, can't spot reduce0 -
That is what I was going to say as well.i think cardio is important on its own until u get to a weight u are comfortable with and then u start building muscle to tone up. its not fun to build muscle under fat.
Don't worry about building muscle under fat, it will not happen if you are in a caloric deficit, all the strength training will do is ensure you don't lose the muscle you do have, and help you become stronger. muscle needs a caloric surplus to actually increase, unless you are new to lifting you may gain 2-3 pounds of muscle even in a caloric deficit (beginners gains)
okay Eric i have a question for you then. My thighs, buttox and arms are tight, i mean i have defined muscle, and i have been told that i have a layer of fat over my abs but my abs are most definitely there. i can ffell them and my son and hubby can too. I do heavy lifting and i do HIIT training. I want to slim down these thighs and tighten these abs what do you suggest????????????
Oh yeah I work out 5-6 days a week! sunday is my off day!
caloric deficit, can't spot reduce0 -
bump0
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I am a trainer and I own a gym.
I don't believe cardio is any better for weight loss than weight -training can be for strength. If you want to sustain any weight loss you need to understand food. Carbs, fat and protein all have their rightful place in our busy day and when managed effectively your body responds naturally . Let's face it, in our industrialized society, 80% + of we humans live sedendary lifestyles. At this stage of our evolution we must purposefully exert ourselves to get exercise and move from A to B. Of the 168 hours spread across the days in a week... we may allot 5 hours to exercise. The remainder of the time (163 hours) we are working, sleeping or eating. What we eat accounts for 75 - 80% of our weight loss or gain.
I cannot back the idea that cardio be used as a primary means to losing weight Of course cardio burns calories which, when done enough, obviously translates in weight loss. But when you can''t get to a gym or track... there is no reason to put back on the weight you so diligently lost. Learning to eat the right foods at the right times for the circumstances of your daily existence will allow you to maintain or lose weight. It really is up to you. Exercise is a crutch that allows you to slip trip and gain. If you're eating to maintain a healthy weight there won't be the weight gain that comes from not being in the gym! Life will always provide moments that trip you up and keep you out of the gym but you'll probably have tons of opportunities to make good(or bad) eating choices. The benefits of eating the right mixes of nutrients and vitamins is priceless and goes a long way to keeping your weight where it needs to be.
Cardiovascular exercise is a heart smart tool that delivers oxygen and nutrients to your tissues. There are other benefits too numerous to mention here
Strength or resistance training goes a long way in keeping bones strong and metabolisms active especially in women. It's a shame that none of these benefits are the catalyst reason for our workouts
. 0 -
He also did tell me to stay off the machines. I work a desk job so he said the last thing I want to do is sit while working out. THAT did make alot of sense to me. So it's free weights and kettlbell for me.
Up until recently, I ONLY used the machines to do any sort of "strength training". I have some physical issues that flare up when I try and do the weights. So, I was using the machines ONLY (issues are getting better, so I am trying to add back in the weights).
They've toned me up and I can see the muscle definition.0 -
i think cardio is important on its own until u get to a weight u are comfortable with and then u start building muscle to tone up. its not fun to build muscle under fat.
Don't worry about building muscle under fat, it will not happen if you are in a caloric deficit, all the strength training will do is ensure you don't lose the muscle you do have, and help you become stronger. muscle needs a caloric surplus to actually increase, unless you are new to lifting you may gain 2-3 pounds of muscle even in a caloric deficit (beginners gains)
okay Eric i have a question for you then. My thighs, buttox and arms are tight, i mean i have defined muscle, and i have been told that i have a layer of fat over my abs but my abs are most definitely there. i can ffell them and my son and hubby can too. I do heavy lifting and i do HIIT training. I want to slim down these thighs and tighten these abs what do you suggest????????????
Oh yeah I work out 5-6 days a week! sunday is my off day!
Ab definition comes from a decrease in bodyfat % . . . that's where the 80% diet comes into play.0 -
This is the philosphy the trainer at my gym tried to convince me of. Their ploy to get me to sign up for weekly sessions was to say that cardio would do nothing but burn fat and muscle and that basically I should focus more on the strength training for the weight loss and stick to cardio for the health aspects.
I argued the whole "calorie in - calorie out" benefits to the cardio exercise but he basically stated that I was burning muscle as well as fat causing my metabolism to crash even further. Again, I think he was really trying to sell personal training sessions but it was rubbing me the wrong way and NOT the best way to go about it.
I wasn't arguing that strength training wasn't crutial and in fact went to him for the sole purpose of getting a good strength training routine into my week to go along with my cardio but to come out and basically say that the cardio is doing nothing for my weight loss bothered me and went against everything I THOUGHT I knew....
Needless to say I didn't feel comfortable doing any further training with him. I'm going to continue with my daily cardio and 2-3x/week strength training on my own. I'm no professional but to me that seems like the best win-win plan for me to get to my goal for now.
I'm curious to hear your thoughts though. I know there are trainers on here and would love to get their opinions on his theory....
I can't even begin to describe the BS that's included in this trainer's argument. Unfortunately his attitude is part of a mass hysteria that is infecting large parts of the fitness community.
In some ways I can sympathize--being a full-time trainer can be tough work and doesn't allow a lot of time to keep up with research. And the pressure to market yourself and appear to be on the "cutting edge" makes it all too easy to be a windsock, chasing every fitness fad that comes by.
But it's a false argument in that it always assumes their has to be an "either/or" choice. Or it seems to be part of our modern need to always assume dominionist positions--it's not enough to prefer a certain (in this case) form of exercise; everyone must be made to accept that your ideas are superior to all others.
The "sprinter vs marathon runner" argument is disingenuous, if not completely dishonest. First of all, it takes two genetic extremes and purports to use them as examples of the "average person". Secondly, it takes extreme training methods that are specifically designed for performance, not health or weight loss per se, and again tries to extrapolate them to the average person's workout program. (Because running 150 miles a week is JUST LIKE doing 45 minutes on a elliptical). Elite marathon runners don't have scrawny physiques because of excessive cardio--it's because they don't do any significant muscle-building weight training. THEY DON'T WANT UPPER BODY MUSCLE--at the elite level it can be a detriment. It's not like they are sitting at home thinking, "darn I was really looking to build up my pecs, but this damn' cardio keeps getting in the way". Instead of always showing the picture of the scrawny white guy doctored to make it look like he just escaped from a concentration camp, try using the example of some top-level triathlete. These guys do tons of cardio, but seem to have no problem keeping all the muscle they want:
The literature is pretty clear on this issue: a combination of cardio and resistance training is better than either cardio alone or resistance training alone Doing cardio is not going to inhibit your weight loss unless you are doing a very high volume of high-intensity cardio combined with a low calorie intake--and even then, the problems won't be related to "muscle burning".
And again, let me be perfectly clear -- I am in no way minimizing the importance of resistance training--for weight loss, for health, for everyone. I am in no way advocating a "cardio only" approach to weight loss--I have been prescribing weight training for weight loss since long before most personal trainers even heard of the term.
My remarks are directed towards this trainer and others like him who insist on promoting the idea that more than 30 minutes of cardio--even when combined with a resistance training program (as the OP wanted to do) will inhibit fat loss by "burning muscle" or that cardio is "no good for fat loss".0 -
He also did tell me to stay off the machines. I work a desk job so he said the last thing I want to do is sit while working out. THAT did make alot of sense to me. So it's free weights and kettlbell for me.
Up until recently, I ONLY used the machines to do any sort of "strength training". I have some physical issues that flare up when I try and do the weights. So, I was using the machines ONLY (issues are getting better, so I am trying to add back in the weights).
They've toned me up and I can see the muscle definition.
I hate machines, and while they make the weight room less intimidating because anyone can walk up and use it relatively properly it is less efficient and effective than free weights and proper form (for which you have to work more of the positive and negative in the move and the small balances that help you keep control of those pesky weights.0 -
I am a trainer and I own a gym.
I don't believe cardio is any better for weight loss than weight -training can be for strength. If you want to sustain any weight loss you need to understand food. Carbs, fat and protein all have their rightful place in our busy day and when managed effectively your body responds naturally . Let's face it, in our industrialized society, 80% + of we humans live sedendary lifestyles. At this stage of our evolution we must purposefully exert ourselves to get exercise and move from A to B. Of the 168 hours spread across the days in a week... we may allot 5 hours to exercise. The remainder of the time (163 hours) we are working, sleeping or eating. What we eat accounts for 75 - 80% of our weight loss or gain.
I cannot back the idea that cardio be used as a primary means to losing weight Of course cardio burns calories which, when done enough, obviously translates in weight loss. But when you can''t get to a gym or track... there is no reason to put back on the weight you so diligently lost. Learning to eat the right foods at the right times for the circumstances of your daily existence will allow you to maintain or lose weight. It really is up to you. Exercise is a crutch that allows you to slip trip and gain. If you're eating to maintain a healthy weight there won't be the weight gain that comes from not being in the gym! Life will always provide moments that trip you up and keep you out of the gym but you'll probably have tons of opportunities to make good(or bad) eating choices. The benefits of eating the right mixes of nutrients and vitamins is priceless and goes a long way to keeping your weight where it needs to be.
Cardiovascular exercise is a heart smart tool that delivers oxygen and nutrients to your tissues. There are other benefits too numerous to mention here
Strength or resistance training goes a long way in keeping bones strong and metabolisms active especially in women. It's a shame that none of these benefits are the catalyst reason for our workouts.
I don't know--at our center, the resistance training programs--boot camp, extreme boot camp, TRX, kickboxing, cardio pump, etc--are about 95% female.0 -
Man... what did you do without him while you were losing 58 pounds?? HAHAHAHA!0
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GREAT Post and string of replies.
I agree and I appreciate the feedback. It's motivating to hear of you all with such great results with primarily strength training. I really am clueless about the fitness part of the journey so I'm definitely learning as I go and this was eye opening for me. I kinda feel bad about calling the trainer a donkey now. Haha.....
Don't feel bad--your reaction was exactly right.0 -
I would like to second rybo's and azdak's comments.
*Edit to add: It may seem contrary, but really, I think there is a grain of truth in what this guy at your gym said, but he overgeneralized. Your safest bet is just to realize that cardio and resistance training are both key for overall fitness.0 -
Thank you Azdak - I appreciate such a passionate response!
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Bump for later0
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GREAT Post and string of replies.
I agree and I appreciate the feedback. It's motivating to hear of you all with such great results with primarily strength training. I really am clueless about the fitness part of the journey so I'm definitely learning as I go and this was eye opening for me. I kinda feel bad about calling the trainer a donkey now. Haha.....
Don't feel bad--your reaction was exactly right.
Ditto this.. I've called my trainer that and then some during our sessions..0 -
Yes, the trainer is pretty much right. You need a combination of cardio and strength training, not just cardio. I'm a step instructor and avid cardio girl, but I didn't see the results I wanted until I added heavy lifting. I balance this out with moderate carbs and high protein to fuel both types of workouts. If I understand what he was saying, he wasn't saying that cardio is getting you no where, but that you desired physique is dependent on the strength training more, and your overall fitness is dependent on your cardio (which you can actually do less of at high intensity to get benefit). Your trainer is actually not an idiot, just not conforming to your preferences.
Actually, it sounds to me like the trainer was an ineffective communicator, because it sounds like what the original poster heard was "cardio is a wasted of time" not that you need a combination of cardio and strength.0 -
Yes, the trainer is pretty much right. You need a combination of cardio and strength training, not just cardio. I'm a step instructor and avid cardio girl, but I didn't see the results I wanted until I added heavy lifting. I balance this out with moderate carbs and high protein to fuel both types of workouts. If I understand what he was saying, he wasn't saying that cardio is getting you no where, but that you desired physique is dependent on the strength training more, and your overall fitness is dependent on your cardio (which you can actually do less of at high intensity to get benefit). Your trainer is actually not an idiot, just not conforming to your preferences.
Actually, it sounds to me like the trainer was an ineffective communicator, because it sounds like what the original poster heard was "cardio is a wasted of time" not that you need a combination of cardio and strength.
This is what I picked up on in her post: " . . . cardio would do nothing but burn fat and muscle and that basically I should focus more on the strength training for the weight loss and stick to cardio for the health aspects. "0 -
Correct - he started off the conversation asking what I had been doing for workout. My answer "brisk walking, running, arc trainer, etc" and he said that for the "results I want, I need to get off the cardio and focus on the resistance training because doing the cardio is doing nothing but burning muscle along with the fat which in turn was killing my metabolism and making it difficult to lose even on a low calorie diet". He said cardio is important for heart heath and important to build bone in his older female clients but given my age and my fitness goals, I wouldn't get there doing cardio and I needed to focus my energy on weight training.0
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I've been wondering about this a lot. I've been doing pretty much 100% cardio...elliptical, walking, Zumba. But maybe every other day I should work in some kettlebells?0
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Missy, thanks for posting the question....the EXACT thing happened to me yesterday at a new gym. It was obvious he was trying to sell his "trainer" package, he even admitted that's where they make their money!
Like you, I walked away frustrated even though I realize he was partially right as I know I need strength training. I've also heard more about Hiit recently and I'm going to give it a try. Best of luck to you and thanks again for asking the question!0 -
Unfortunately, the trainer is correct in a sense... If your doing only cardio, you will be losing muscle along with fat. If you don't retain some of that muscle mass, then you're going to look skinny fat. Plus muscle burns more calories then fat at rest.. so you are burning extra calories everyday, without even doing anything extra.
i agree with this ^^
and even though with cardio you might lose weight right away and see more instant results, over the long-haul, if you are losing muscle mass, then what is the point of losing all the weight? esp if over the age of 35, strength training/weights and walking on hard surfaces are great for building muscle as well as building strong bones.0 -
Well it's not a theory. And I don't say it because I'm a PT. I say it because scientifically it's proven. If you just do cardio alone for weight loss, you will lose lean muscle especially if the cardio tends to be long endurance training (over one hour in duration). Here's a great example:This is the philosphy the trainer at my gym tried to convince me of. Their ploy to get me to sign up for weekly sessions was to say that cardio would do nothing but burn fat and muscle and that basically I should focus more on the strength training for the weight loss and stick to cardio for the health aspects.
I argued the whole "calorie in - calorie out" benefits to the cardio exercise but he basically stated that I was burning muscle as well as fat causing my metabolism to crash even further. Again, I think he was really trying to sell personal training sessions but it was rubbing me the wrong way and NOT the best way to go about it.
I wasn't arguing that strength training wasn't crutial and in fact went to him for the sole purpose of getting a good strength training routine into my week to go along with my cardio but to come out and basically say that the cardio is doing nothing for my weight loss bothered me and went against everything I THOUGHT I knew....
Needless to say I didn't feel comfortable doing any further training with him. I'm going to continue with my daily cardio and 2-3x/week strength training on my own. I'm no professional but to me that seems like the best win-win plan for me to get to my goal for now.
I'm curious to hear your thoughts though. I know there are trainers on here and would love to get their opinions on his theory....
Look at the physique of a long distance runner and that of a sprinter. Both are runners, but one trains aerobically and the other anaerobically. The long distance runner usually has no distinctly lean muscle to speak of with the possible exception of their legs. The sprinter has lean muscle that shows and usually lower body fat which is why the definition is much more pronounced.
The less lean muscle you have, the lower your metabolic rate. This isn't disputed. So the more you do cardio as your only source of exercise, then the eventuality of stalling is true since you're not taxing the muscle.
Having a program of strength training combined with cardio is good, but the strength training needs to be challenging since muscles adapt pretty quickly. And make sure you do it before cardio so you utilize the glycogen stores for lifting and not waste it on cardio.0 -
In her defense, she didn't say "build" but did say improve.Wow! What a stimulating discussion thread.
But there is some implied belief that cardio doesn't improve your muscles.
If you walk, jog, dance, step, or do jumping jacks, the muscles in your legs (and back) are lifting your body weight with each and every step.
With every beat of your heart, your heart muscle is flexed and worked.
With every breath, your diaphragm, rib, and back muscles are worked.
I think explicit strength training is a good thing, but to imply that cardio doesn't provide strength benefits is baloney.
Cardio does not build muscle at all, you need to overload the muscle to tear the muscle fiber then feed and rest them, it is during the rest and from the feeding that they grow, to overload a muscle you need strength training, the heavier the better.0 -
Here's a simple piece of all purpose advice: Don't take advice from people who are trying to sell you something.
Here's another: As much as the stories of individual weight loss and improved fitness by people on this site are inspiring, confidence building, and generally fun to read, even taken together they represent an unscientific sample that tells you very little about what is likely to help you achieve whatever results you seek.
Also, comparing the bodies of sprinters and distance athletes may tell you much more about what kind of person chooses to participate in those sports than it does about what participation does to your body. Perhaps the reason there are few marathon runners built like linebackers is that linebackers have crappy physiques for marathon running? There are very few 5'5" centers in the NBA, but it is not because playing center makes people tall. People self-select for sports based on their talents and body types.
Also, I have not seen anyone mention the difference between fast and slow twitch muscle and the effect that resistance training has on these different types of muscle fibers. As I understand it, fast and slow twitch muscles look different, and fast twitch types are more likely to be bulkier than slow twitch types.
Finally, endurance athletes tend to do perform a relatively narrow range of movements over extended periods of time: running, cycling, or swimming, mostly. Their muscles become acclimated to these narrow range of motions and acclimate accordingly. It is pretty difficult to vary a running or cycling style. People who are into resistance training, on the other hand, are probably like to vary their routines and are therefore less likely to become acclimated to a narrow routine. Just a regular free weight workout with 6-8 different motions is far more diverse than anything an endurance athlete is likely to do.
For someone interested in general fitness, it is probably hard to argue with the concept that doing lots of different types of exercise, and never becoming stuck in a routine, is best for building muscle and losing fat.0 -
love this thread! i was asking the same thing recently. this is the conclusion i got. cardio is good for you, esp your heart. does it burn fat and muscle, depends. like someone mentioned before, it does at a steady pace. so i recommend to do anything in intervals or HIIT. you can do that with a stationary machine or a body weight workout like FOR EXAMPLE the program INSANITY (not selling or promotting, i dont even sell beachbody products, but i am a firm believer in them!).... but getting on a treadmill and walking or running for straight an hour i dont believe is that great for you. bad on your knees and breaks down muscle.
as for me...i am trying to define and tone my muscle. i lift 3x a week so anything that will break my hard earned muscle down, i am not for it. i do strongly believe in strength training and interval cardio ONLY. yes cardio burns fat, but did you know strength training does too? and it strengthens muscles too! did you know you burn up to 48hrs after a strength training session where cardio is only 6-8hrs? the benefits of strength training outweights cardio TREMENDOUSLY. but it depends on your goals and what you want to achieve. sure i want to lose weight and be smaller...but do i want to be skinny with no muscle, NO. there have been MANY people, even a few trainers on here that look AMAZING that dont do cardio, they only do strength training. and with that, it doesnt have to strickly be lifting dumbells and getting on the weight machines. how about burpees? or push ups? those are all targeting multiple muscle groups, all using your body weight and getting your heart rate high (the point of burning calories) and yet it stays with you longer WAY after you leave the gym and strengthens and tones muscle, how could it get ANY BETTER!. to me i'd rather do pushups than get on that treadmill anyday! but to each their own.
eat less + burn calories=weight loss. but the finished product of reaching that goal has different factors of getting there.
so i agree with what he is saying in the basis that you dont need cardio to lose weight, but am i all for never doing it, of course not....but i will be doing high intense INTERVAL training to make sure it doesnt attack my muscle, and to burn more calories at the end of the day. who wants to walk on a treamill for more than an hour anyways! they say 30min is long enough to get a good, hard workout in and burn more than if you were there for an hour and a half! GOTTA LOVE IT!
good luck to you!0 -
love this thread! i was asking the same thing recently. this is the conclusion i got. cardio is good for you, esp your heart. does it burn fat and muscle, depends. like someone mentioned before, it does at a steady pace. so i recommend to do anything in intervals or HIIT. you can do that with a stationary machine or a body weight workout like FOR EXAMPLE the program INSANITY (not selling or promotting, i dont even sell beachbody products, but i am a firm believer in them!).... but getting on a treadmill and walking or running for straight an hour i dont believe is that great for you. bad on your knees and breaks down muscle.
as for me...i am trying to define and tone my muscle. i lift 3x a week so anything that will break my hard earned muscle down, i am not for it. i do strongly believe in strength training and interval cardio ONLY. yes cardio burns fat, but did you know strength training does too? and it strengthens muscles too! did you know you burn up to 48hrs after a strength training session where cardio is only 6-8hrs? the benefits of strength training outweights cardio TREMENDOUSLY. but it depends on your goals and what you want to achieve. sure i want to lose weight and be smaller...but do i want to be skinny with no muscle, NO. there have been MANY people, even a few trainers on here that look AMAZING that dont do cardio, they only do strength training. and with that, it doesnt have to strickly be lifting dumbells and getting on the weight machines. how about burpees? or push ups? those are all targeting multiple muscle groups, all using your body weight and getting your heart rate high (the point of burning calories) and yet it stays with you longer WAY after you leave the gym and strengthens and tones muscle, how could it get ANY BETTER!. to me i'd rather do pushups than get on that treadmill anyday! but to each their own.
eat less + burn calories=weight loss. but the finished product of reaching that goal has different factors of getting there.
so i agree with what he is saying in the basis that you dont need cardio to lose weight, but am i all for never doing it, of course not....but i will be doing high intense INTERVAL training to make sure it doesnt attack my muscle, and to burn more calories at the end of the day. who wants to walk on a treamill for more than an hour anyways! they say 30min is long enough to get a good, hard workout in and burn more than if you were there for an hour and a half! GOTTA LOVE IT!
good luck to you!
Just wanted to say, i think this is a great post xx0 -
A trainer should know better than to dismiss cardio entirely or call it a waste of time.
I mean, yes, he is correct in the strictest sense but some people enjoy doing cardio and you can certainly combine cardio with resistance training 3x/week.
For weight loss, people should do either only resistance training or both resistance and cardio.0 -
Thank you all! I'm going to look into that New Rules for LIfting Book. I've decided to devote 2 days to resistance training and 4 days of cardio to start and work up to 3 and 3. 0
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