Seriously?? Obesity and Child abuse questionable....

Saruman_w

Unless it's due to some kind of medical anomaly that're beyond the parent's control, then yea somebody needs to step in and do something about it. Letting your child go to that level of obesity without even so much as consulting a doctor or a nutritionist or somebody tends to show how much a parent cares about the health of their child.

ItsCasey

So I try not to respond to threads like this because they get really mean really quickly.

I didn't read a lot of the comments, only got to about page 2 because like I said, it just got really insulting.

My opinion however, is, if you aren't intelligent enough to know what's even relatively healthy for a child, you shouldn't have the right to raise one. My husband and I have been trying for years to have kids, and in my mind, if you have a child and neglect it to THAT extreme, let someone else who will actually take care of them take over.

But I don't think people who disagree with me are "dumb" or "stupid" by any means. We just have different opinions.

Should someone with a learning disability have kids?

Of course, if they can adequately care for the child. If they are not capable of caring for the child, then the child should be placed into a better environment, just like any other case of abuse or neglect.

I don't think this is what the other poster meant, however.

As a side note-- The label "learning disability" does not, in any way, make me think that someone would be an incompetent parent-- and I am confused as to why you think it would, actually.

Because, I have higher education and it took me 35+ years to figure out healthy eating. Indicating that someone has a lower intelligence if they do not understand proper nutrition and reaks of elitism to me. I am out of this conversation.

It's not about not understanding proper nutrition to the extent that you don't know exactly what foods your kids should be eating to get exactly the right amount of nutrients recommended for them. 99.9% of parents don't know that off the top of their heads.

This particular part of the argument is about the implication that some parents may not be aware that cheeseburgers and Twinkies make you fat when you eat them all the time. And that is a load of crap. People know that fruits and vegetables = good and junk food = bad. Don't even try to say there are mentally competent adults who don't know that.

Sasssy69

I worked in the field of child protection as a front line worker and a supervisor for over 5 years, and I saw this on many occasions, each case is so complex, so to give an answer about whether the practice itself is right or wrong is impossible.. HOWEVER...

If the child was placed in foster care, that means that social workers intervened far in advance. The mother was educated about what she needed to do. She was provided all of the resources necessary to help her child. She obviously did not follow through, and therefore the court system, which would have included the recommendations of medical professionals, deemed it necessary to remove the child from her care for the sake of his health and well-being.

Obviously, in THIS case it was the correct decision. The child has lost 250 lbs. Being taken from his mother, who obviously was unable or unwilling to appropriately care for him, may have literally saved his life.

The mother may have severe emotional and/or other issues of her own which rendered her incapable of assisting her child, so there is no reason to place judgment on her, however. That is why the social service system in in place.

Ahhh...a voice of reason. Thank you for sharing this. I wondered if the parents had been given any kind of education about proper nutrition. I also was questioning the mother's emotional health.

I do have to ask though...where is this child's father? Another one who walked away? So easy to do in our society. BOTH parents should be held accountable. This whole situation is just very sad.

JustJenn419

Jerri Gray, a woman charged with criminal neglect for allowing her 14-year-old son Alexander Draper to get to 555 pounds, tried her best to help the teen lose weight, her lawyer told USA Today.

In June, after her son tipped the scales at over a quarter of a ton, the Travelers Rest, South Carolina, resident was arrested for criminal neglect and Alexander was put into foster care. Her case has pushed the debate on whether to legislate childhood obesity into the national spotlight.

"If she's found guilty on those criminal charges, you have set a precedent that opens Pandora's box," Jerri's lawyer Grant Varner said. "Where do you go next?"

Last year's report from the Child Welfare League of America found that six other states, Texas, Pennsylvania, New York, New Mexico andCalifornia , have all considered the problem. Each one, save California, changed their state laws and made morbid obesity a form of medical neglect. Only two of those cases were criminal though, and no parents went to jail for either. For the case in New York, nutritional counseling, cooking classes and exercise were ordered for the 261-pound teen girl. Linda Spears, vice-president of policy and public affairs for the Child Welfare League of America told USA Today that criminal charges should be a last resort.

"I think I would draw the line at a place where there are serious health consequences for the child and efforts to work with the family have repeatedly failed," she said. Instead, a consistent regimen that the court can monitor is best, Linda said.

Alexander had been assigned a diet by the state Department of Social Services, but he was able to get food on his own when he was away from his mother, said Grant. Since the child has been in foster care, Grant has spoken to him.

"There's a strong likelihood that this kid is going to school and could eat whatever he wanted to at school, because you've got friends who will help him buy food or will give him their leftovers," Grant said. "The big question is: What is this kid doing when he's not in Mom's care, custody and control?" The school district that Alexander attends did not comment.

Jerri made an agreement with a film company for exclusive rights to her story, and she could not give comment for the story.

"This is not a case of a mother force-feeding a child," said Grant. "If she had been holding him down and force-feeding him, sure, I can understand. But she doesn't have the means to do it. She doesn't have the money to buy the food to do it."

Is Obesity a Form of Abuse?

Jerri and Alexander's case highlights the way that some people have begun to think about childhood obesity.

Corporate wellness expert Ron Jones has a saying: "child obesity is child abuse." He told USA Today that Americans aren't ready to accept that concept.

"If you gave your child a drug, you'd be held in the court. But if you kill them with food, that seems to be acceptable," he said.

Part of the reason that state governments can't get behind Ron and others that agree with him is that child abuse is defined by putting a child in imminent danger and obesity, while it has been shown to lead to health problems, generally does not fit the bill, said University of Virgina School of Law professor Richard Balnave.

Jerri's arrest warrant stated that Alexander's weight was "serious and threatening to his health" and that she was putting him in "an unreasonable risk of harm."

The Department of Social Services' counsel said that Alexander was taken from Jerri "because of information from health care providers that he was at risk of serious harm because his mother was not meeting his medical needs," and that the department "would not take action based on a child's weight alone."

Jerri didn't show up to her family court hearing where her son was to be entered into foster court in May. She was later found in Baltimore County, Maryland, where she was arrested, taken back to South Carolina and released on $50,000 bond.

HOSED49

I have been in houses or trailers or apartments with little kids, cockroaches crawling all around, house is a wreck, clothes scattered all over the floor, no beds maybe just matresses, the animals seem to eat better than the kids...call social services...they do the best they can, educate the parents on cleaning, they do surprise inspections to make sure they are following the guidelines set forth to improve the home...

That being said I worked a case where the little boy went to the neighbors apartment and told them his mommy told him she was gonna kill him...So I make contact with her, the apartment is filled with cardboard boxes of garbage, cockroaches crawling all over thrown out food, two boxes full of dirty diapers...he is one of five kids there, they havent had a bath, one of them is eating discarded food from a box...she sits back down as i take all this in..on the internet in a chat room looking for daddy number six was my guess...three of the kids in diapers...i look in the fridge, theres no food, barely anything in the cabinets..a cockroach crawls over my boot...
I called social services , made contact with her family members then carted her off to jail for neglect...she said she ws just joking with him about killing him but she was busy on the computer...sadly I am sure she has those kids back today...

JustJenn419

Hmmm, mother already entered into a movie deal, skipped out of town for her court date (WHICH IS WHY SHE WAS ARRESTED), and claims innocence based on not having the "means" to "hold him down and force-feed him". Sounds like a real winner to me!

First of all, I had to check and make sure her lawyer (Grant) was not Jose Baez to come up with such mockery of parenting. Second of all, I don't care who this offends but I am a single mother, work a full time job AND a part time job, AND I am going to school to get my degree. More and more this is becoming the norm. I don't ask for pats on the back or hand-outs and I CERTANTLY wouldn't expect to be able to use the "I DIDN'T KNOW" excuse.

I am my child's mother first and foremost. And with that title comes RESPONSIBILITY!!! THAT is what is lacking, not just in this case but in today's society.

Dylanzmom

[[/quote]

I responded before I read your post, hun. Now that I have learned how the system works and that the mom did not comply, my feelings for the mother has changed, but I can't say that I in total agreeance with removing the kid. And maybe thats just the mommy in me.... My opinion may not be in your favor. Regardless, this is a sad situation on both ends. Could you imagine your kid being take from you?? Could you imagine as a kid being taken away from your mom? sad....
[/quote]

See this is sad. But not all parents care. I am a foster kid. My parents gladly gave me up for drugs. I am an A-B student in college now.

Some people would be completely heart broken to have their kids taken away. I have seen many and I mean MANY that do not care at all.
[/quote]

As a caseworker, i have seen many parents that do not care and many children that realize that they are better off without their bio parents. They have found homes with people that do love them and care for them better than their own bio parents did. Sometimes it is for the best interest that these parents rights are terminated.

Dylanzmom

Jerri Gray, a woman charged with criminal neglect for allowing her 14-year-old son Alexander Draper to get to 555 pounds, tried her best to help the teen lose weight, her lawyer told USA Today.

In June, after her son tipped the scales at over a quarter of a ton, the Travelers Rest, South Carolina, resident was arrested for criminal neglect and Alexander was put into foster care. Her case has pushed the debate on whether to legislate childhood obesity into the national spotlight.

"If she's found guilty on those criminal charges, you have set a precedent that opens Pandora's box," Jerri's lawyer Grant Varner said. "Where do you go next?"

Last year's report from the Child Welfare League of America found that six other states, Texas, Pennsylvania, New York, New Mexico andCalifornia , have all considered the problem. Each one, save California, changed their state laws and made morbid obesity a form of medical neglect. Only two of those cases were criminal though, and no parents went to jail for either. For the case in New York, nutritional counseling, cooking classes and exercise were ordered for the 261-pound teen girl. Linda Spears, vice-president of policy and public affairs for the Child Welfare League of America told USA Today that criminal charges should be a last resort.

"I think I would draw the line at a place where there are serious health consequences for the child and efforts to work with the family have repeatedly failed," she said. Instead, a consistent regimen that the court can monitor is best, Linda said.

Alexander had been assigned a diet by the state Department of Social Services, but he was able to get food on his own when he was away from his mother, said Grant. Since the child has been in foster care, Grant has spoken to him.

"There's a strong likelihood that this kid is going to school and could eat whatever he wanted to at school, because you've got friends who will help him buy food or will give him their leftovers," Grant said. "The big question is: What is this kid doing when he's not in Mom's care, custody and control?" The school district that Alexander attends did not comment.

Jerri made an agreement with a film company for exclusive rights to her story, and she could not give comment for the story.

"This is not a case of a mother force-feeding a child," said Grant. "If she had been holding him down and force-feeding him, sure, I can understand. But she doesn't have the means to do it. She doesn't have the money to buy the food to do it."

Is Obesity a Form of Abuse?

Jerri and Alexander's case highlights the way that some people have begun to think about childhood obesity.

Corporate wellness expert Ron Jones has a saying: "child obesity is child abuse." He told USA Today that Americans aren't ready to accept that concept.

"If you gave your child a drug, you'd be held in the court. But if you kill them with food, that seems to be acceptable," he said.

Part of the reason that state governments can't get behind Ron and others that agree with him is that child abuse is defined by putting a child in imminent danger and obesity, while it has been shown to lead to health problems, generally does not fit the bill, said University of Virgina School of Law professor Richard Balnave.

Jerri's arrest warrant stated that Alexander's weight was "serious and threatening to his health" and that she was putting him in "an unreasonable risk of harm."

The Department of Social Services' counsel said that Alexander was taken from Jerri "because of information from health care providers that he was at risk of serious harm because his mother was not meeting his medical needs," and that the department "would not take action based on a child's weight alone."

Jerri didn't show up to her family court hearing where her son was to be entered into foster court in May. She was later found in Baltimore County, Maryland, where she was arrested, taken back to South Carolina and released on $50,000 bond.

She didnt have money for food but she can get bail money? hmmm

NYCDutchess

I think that there should be some punishment for the parent, but taking the child into foster care is not the answer.
If you notice ALL of the people who "abuse" their child by over feeding are obese themselves.
They need help!! Just like there are parenting classes for other things, there should be nutrition classes!
AND IN SCHOOL there should be nutrition classes!

NYCDutchess

I think that there should be some punishment for the parent, but taking the child into foster care is not the answer.
If you notice ALL of the people who "abuse" their child by over feeding are obese themselves.
They need help!! Just like there are parenting classes for other things, there should be nutrition classes!
AND IN SCHOOL there should be nutrition classes!

JustJenn419

I think that there should be some punishment for the parent, but taking the child into foster care is not the answer.
If you notice ALL of the people who "abuse" their child by over feeding are obese themselves.
They need help!! Just like there are parenting classes for other things, there should be nutrition classes!
AND IN SCHOOL there should be nutrition classes!

Well if that's the case, then children that are physically abused shouldn't be taken away either. Their parents should just have to take "Discipline Classes" and the school should offer "Proper Behavior Classes".


THIS DOESN'T TAKE EDUCATION!!!

chedges9090

If this was the Mother that was show-cased on Dr Phil, it did show that she was trying to get help for her child. She was/is very poor and uneducated in what to do. She was working and going to school and trying to do her best. She did ask her doctor for help. It was a super sad story. I think the answer to "should a child be taken away" needs to be looked at on an individual case basis. The story on Dr Phil showed the son, with his weight loss.. talking about how he and his Mom have been working on things to eat and healthy eating. He is helping her too.. as she is overweight.

In general , it is too bad that a child can't be put into a healty eating program, where they have to check in once a week.. etc. And, at least given the opportunity to do better. Ofcourse, the parents have to go along with it.. they are buying the food. it is tough.
We all know how expensive healthy food can be.. especially if you are on the run all the time with no help from others.

joehempel

Edit pic didnt work

MrsFarrow

So I try not to respond to threads like this because they get really mean really quickly.

I didn't read a lot of the comments, only got to about page 2 because like I said, it just got really insulting.

My opinion however, is, if you aren't intelligent enough to know what's even relatively healthy for a child, you shouldn't have the right to raise one. My husband and I have been trying for years to have kids, and in my mind, if you have a child and neglect it to THAT extreme, let someone else who will actually take care of them take over.

But I don't think people who disagree with me are "dumb" or "stupid" by any means. We just have different opinions.

Should someone with a learning disability have kids?

Of course, if they can adequately care for the child. If they are not capable of caring for the child, then the child should be placed into a better environment, just like any other case of abuse or neglect.

I don't think this is what the other poster meant, however.

As a side note-- The label "learning disability" does not, in any way, make me think that someone would be an incompetent parent-- and I am confused as to why you think it would, actually.

Because, I have higher education and it took me 35+ years to figure out healthy eating. Indicating that someone has a lower intelligence if they do not understand proper nutrition and reaks of elitism to me. I am out of this conversation.

It's not about not understanding proper nutrition to the extent that you don't know exactly what foods your kids should be eating to get exactly the right amount of nutrients recommended for them. 99.9% of parents don't know that off the top of their heads.

This particular part of the argument is about the implication that some parents may not be aware that cheeseburgers and Twinkies make you fat when you eat them all the time. And that is a load of crap. People know that fruits and vegetables = good and junk food = bad. Don't even try to say there are mentally competent adults who don't know that.

Thank you. So much. I, too, have a higher education. And here's the issue that very few people seem to get; once you're an adult and are able to think to yourself "You know what, I know these 45 ho-hos are going straight to my backside, but I'm going to eat them anyway" then it becomes YOUR issue. When you are 4 years old, all you think it "THIS TASTES SO GOOD!" That's all.

And in reference to whoever made the crack about people with learning disabilities, my best friend has a learning disability and would put parents like this to shame. While she may not have known specifics, good carbs vs bad carbs etc, she knew enough to say no to her children when they wanted to eat a whole box of pop tarts.

karenjoy

Social services do not just take a child into care unless it's life is in imminent danger or there is sexual abuse, and even in those cases they sometimes get it wrong, this was not a case in which they pounced on this woman, she was offered help and support and in the end didn't even bother to show up in court when they finally took him away from her abysmal lack of care.

I see overweight and obese children in my work, I have never seen a morbidly obese child on this scale, thank god. I have yet however to see a fat child who does not have a fat parent, usually mother but not always, and I have yet to meet the parent of a fat child who will hold up their hands and say, yep I feed them too much and they do too little...they always mention that the child eats 'lots of vegetables and fruit and it really active, and they always say that they don't give them fast food often...People don't have to eat fast food to get fat, you can get fat eating too much of entirely healthy food, it's the TOO MUCH bit that is the clue here.

it is not about ignorance, nobody is THAT ignorant, really. You can SEE if your child is FOUR times the weight of all the other children their age, you can see if they can't walk properly, you can see if they have massive rolls of fat, not a smidge of puppy fat, massive great rolls that stop them doing stuff kids should do...like run and play and get some bloody joy from life.

I am too angry too post really, so am stopping now, but last thing, FOOD IS NOT LOVE

livnlite

I worked in the field of child protection as a front line worker and a supervisor for over 5 years, and I saw this on many occasions, each case is so complex, so to give an answer about whether the practice itself is right or wrong is impossible.. HOWEVER...

If the child was placed in foster care, that means that social workers intervened far in advance. The mother was educated about what she needed to do. She was provided all of the resources necessary to help her child. She obviously did not follow through, and therefore the court system, which would have included the recommendations of medical professionals, deemed it necessary to remove the child from her care for the sake of his health and well-being.

Obviously, in THIS case it was the correct decision. The child has lost 250 lbs. Being taken from his mother, who obviously was unable or unwilling to appropriately care for him, may have literally saved his life.

The mother may have severe emotional and/or other issues of her own which rendered her incapable of assisting her child, so there is no reason to place judgment on her, however. That is why the social service system in in place.

Good Post!

Jade_Butterfly

Why did they wait until he weighed 400 lbs to get him some help? Does it really help a kid to take him away from his family? Depression can make it harder to keep weight off long term.

^^^ This. . . . There is no way that a child should of ever reached 400lbs at that age. . . and nobody should weight that. . so if this is what it takes to save that childs life then let it be an eye opener to the parent.

Jade_Butterfly

Hey guys. I have a question... Should parents be arrested and lose custody of their kids because the kid(s) are over-weight/obese?

There was a story of a single woman who was arrested and lost custody of her 13 yr old son who was 400 (or more) pounds. The kid's school reported it to the authorities as physical child abuse/neglect. There are criminal chrgs pending against the mother and the kid was placed in foster care--he's lost 250 pounds so far, which is great to hear but was any of this madness neccessary?

Just curious to hear your opinion....

Found the info I was looking for~

Grokette

Yes, I think it was child abuse/neglect and the arrest was justified. Who would do that to their child? That is the equivalent of starving a child, in my opinion. She does not deserve to have him and I am glad he is getting down to a healthy weight. Poor baby.

I agree with this also.