Not feeling supported at all.

icemaiden17_uk

Totally agree with you there! My weightloss goal is a bit arbitrary! My main goal is size, BF% and fitness. You are obviously built differently to these other people with different goals. Stop judging yourself by them and do what you know is right! I think you sound like you have the right plan and your head on straight! I hate the BMI measurement and everyone uses it! It's rubbish! I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

funkycamper

" It's extremely hard to build muscle and can take many months for a man to build 20# of new muscle mass. A woman with lower testosterone levels would take even longer and needs more intense workouts lifting quite heavy than a man needs to achieve this. Frankly, I'm not sure I believe you because you are extrapolating expected body fat percentages at lower body weights that are quite inaccurate and show a misunderstanding of how our bodies work."

OK, thanks for being so extremely rude. You don't know how I test my bodyfat, or the timeframe I'm talking about, or my metabolism, or my workout regime.

I lost those 80lbs (and gained 20lbs of muscle mass) in over a year. Heavy lifting twice or three times a week. But I don't have to prove anything to you.

That was rude? Really? Something else we disagree on, I guess.

It is extremely difficult for a man who is lifting heavy to gain 20# of muscle in a year. Even more so for a woman with lower levels of testosterone. And the only true way to measure body fat is via autopsy which I'm sure you have not done. The varying methods done on living persons all have some degree of inaccuracy. What type of measurement technique are you using?

It's great that you're heavy lifting. I have recently become converted to making that type of workout the mainstay of my plan and am starting the work to get to the point where I can lift heavy. While I have been doing weights all along, it has been on machines so I'm switching to free weights to get my whole body into play instead of isolating the muscles being worked. It's a great program and I'm sure you've done well on it.

uberlaut

That is totally possible as well. I have had more than one friend who can't gain an ounce, no matter what they do.

TourThePast

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

nickssweetheart

“I want to wear a smaller pant.” does not equal “I want to lose weight.”

"I want to be healthier." does not always equal "I want to lose weight."

I worry about people who are so focused on the scale, because I wonder how many of them are fighting against their own body/health in striving for an unrealistic number on the scale.

My goal weight/size is much closer to yours than to people shooting for numbers in the 130s/120s/110s, but this sounds like evidence that you are not supportive of their goals rather than vice versa.

I'm not saying that I don't sometimes think that someone shooting for a weight at the very low end of their bmi range may not discover that they are unable to sustain it, or that it doesn't look like they pictured. Genetics being what they are and magazine models and movie stars looking like they do it is, sadly, inevitable that on a site dedicated to fitness, some people are going to have unrealistic expectations of how they can make their bodies look, or the weight they can maintain without sacrificing too much quality of life. But I'm not walking in their shoes. Unless they seem to be developing an eating disorder or beating themselves up to the point of self-hatred, I am going to root for their success just like I hope they will root for mine.

An incredibly beautiful, nice, and brainy friend of mine married a guy that is, imo nowhere near good enough for her. When theywere dating I kept thinking, what is she doing with this guy? (It was not appearance-related, he is very handsome.) But I supported her because he was what she wanted, whether I understood it or not. Unless someone I care about is making choices that endanger them, my role as a friend is to want them to achieve their dreams, whether or not they coincide with mine.

rml_16

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

I had to google this. I don't know where I would find a VERY reliable site for this info, but several report Brad Pitt as 5'11" and 160 pounds. That is a BMI of 22.3.

I think a lot of people have very unrealistic ideas about what they look like at a healthy BMI. Most of the people I see who say they're "too skinny" at the high end or who talk about it not taking body frame into account are people who have never actually been that thin.

To be in a healthy BMI, I can weigh anywhere from 103 to 141 pounds. I'd say that takes frame and muscle mass into account.

Perhaps pro athletes who do nothing but build muscle fall into the category of being an unhealthy BMI with low body fat, but most everyday, average people do not.

All that said, it's your body and your choice and if you're happy as you are, then that's wonderful and I support you.

UsedToBeHusky

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

I had to google this. I don't know where I would find a VERY reliable site for this info, but several report Brad Pitt as 5'11" and 160 pounds. That is a BMI of 22.3.

I think a lot of people have very unrealistic ideas about what they look like at a healthy BMI. Most of the people I see who say they're "too skinny" at the high end or who talk about it not taking body frame into account are people who have never actually been that thin.

To be in a healthy BMI, I can weigh anywhere from 103 to 141 pounds. I'd say that takes frame and muscle mass into account.

Perhaps pro athletes who do nothing but build muscle fall into the category of being an unhealthy BMI with low body fat, but most everyday, average people do not.

All that said, it's your body and your choice and if you're happy as you are, then that's wonderful and I support you.

I disagree. I am 5'11 & 3/4" and a female. Also, my bone structure is slightly higher than average which makes me somewhat 'big-boned'. My healthy weight according to a healthy BMI is between 135 and 179.5 lbs. I have weighed 176 lbs and was told that I was too thin. Of course, my current goal weight is 170 lbs, but only because I know that I will gain a little back when I finally go to maintenance calories. I honestly think my body is going to fall somewhere around 180 lbs which would technically make me overweight, but I guarantee, no one will think that I am overweight.

rml_16

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

I had to google this. I don't know where I would find a VERY reliable site for this info, but several report Brad Pitt as 5'11" and 160 pounds. That is a BMI of 22.3.

I think a lot of people have very unrealistic ideas about what they look like at a healthy BMI. Most of the people I see who say they're "too skinny" at the high end or who talk about it not taking body frame into account are people who have never actually been that thin.

To be in a healthy BMI, I can weigh anywhere from 103 to 141 pounds. I'd say that takes frame and muscle mass into account.

Perhaps pro athletes who do nothing but build muscle fall into the category of being an unhealthy BMI with low body fat, but most everyday, average people do not.

All that said, it's your body and your choice and if you're happy as you are, then that's wonderful and I support you.

I disagree. I am 5'11 & 3/4" and a female. Also, my bone structure is slightly higher than average which makes me somewhat 'big-boned'. My healthy weight according to a healthy BMI is between 135 and 179.5 lbs. I have weighed 176 lbs and was told that I was too thin. Of course, my current goal weight is 170 lbs, but only because I know that I will gain a little back when I finally go to maintenance calories. I honestly think my body is going to fall somewhere around 180 lbs which would technically make me overweight, but I guarantee, no one will think that I am overweight.

You're talking about half a pound.

And people tell you you're "too thin" when you lose weight. All the time. My mother accused me of being anorexic at 132 pounds (I'm 5'3") because I'd been heavy for a couple years and she wasn't used to it. When I weighed 102, she didn't think I looked anorexic because at that time in my life I'd always been thin.

I don't LOOK overweight at 141 pounds. I don't LOOK overweight at 150 (what I am now) because clothing covers a lot. But there's definitely room to lose.

Did YOU think you looked too thin at 176?

My boss is 5'10". She was 180 at her highest weight and she looked great. She's since lost 40 pounds and looks fantastic. People in her family keep telling her she's too thin and accusing her of starving herself. She is not too thin. She looks and feels healthy. Still, people tell her she's too thin.

TourThePast

As a general point, in a society where the norm is to be overweight, I think people forget what "healthy" looks like.

Remember BMI isn't about whether you look fat or slim or attractive, it is about the ranges (for normal people not body builders) which have been proved again and again, by study after study, to be optimal for health. For a lot of people, that is far less body fat than they consider to be normal, or that they consider to look good.

Personally, I feel that I look at my best when I'm towards the upper range of my recommended BMI, but I'm not deluding myself that at that point I'm at the healthiest point I could be.

UsedToBeHusky

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

I had to google this. I don't know where I would find a VERY reliable site for this info, but several report Brad Pitt as 5'11" and 160 pounds. That is a BMI of 22.3.

I think a lot of people have very unrealistic ideas about what they look like at a healthy BMI. Most of the people I see who say they're "too skinny" at the high end or who talk about it not taking body frame into account are people who have never actually been that thin.

To be in a healthy BMI, I can weigh anywhere from 103 to 141 pounds. I'd say that takes frame and muscle mass into account.

Perhaps pro athletes who do nothing but build muscle fall into the category of being an unhealthy BMI with low body fat, but most everyday, average people do not.

All that said, it's your body and your choice and if you're happy as you are, then that's wonderful and I support you.

I disagree. I am 5'11 & 3/4" and a female. Also, my bone structure is slightly higher than average which makes me somewhat 'big-boned'. My healthy weight according to a healthy BMI is between 135 and 179.5 lbs. I have weighed 176 lbs and was told that I was too thin. Of course, my current goal weight is 170 lbs, but only because I know that I will gain a little back when I finally go to maintenance calories. I honestly think my body is going to fall somewhere around 180 lbs which would technically make me overweight, but I guarantee, no one will think that I am overweight.

You're talking about half a pound.

And people tell you you're "too thin" when you lose weight. All the time. My mother accused me of being anorexic at 132 pounds (I'm 5'3") because I'd been heavy for a couple years and she wasn't used to it. When I weighed 102, she didn't think I looked anorexic because at that time in my life I'd always been thin.

I don't LOOK overweight at 141 pounds. I don't LOOK overweight at 150 (what I am now) because clothing covers a lot. But there's definitely room to lose.

Did YOU think you looked too thin at 176?

My boss is 5'10". She was 180 at her highest weight and she looked great. She's since lost 40 pounds and looks fantastic. People in her family keep telling her she's too thin and accusing her of starving herself. She is not too thin. She looks and feels healthy. Still, people tell her she's too thin.

I can see your point about how people really don't know what is best for us based on looks, but at the same time, if I were to stop around 140 lbs, people would generally think I am sick, though I would be at a "healthy" weight. There is variations that the typical BMI scale does not take into consideration. Because I am slightly bigger boned, my bones themselves will actually weigh more than an average person's. This is not something that is factored into BMI. Remember that BMI only calculates the whole of one's body and not the weight of its varying composition. Body variation must be taken into consideration.

TourThePast

I can see your point about how people really don't know what is best for us based on looks, but at the same time, if I were to stop around 140 lbs, people would generally think I am sick, though I would be at a "healthy" weight. There is variations that the typical BMI scale does not take into consideration.

But BMI does take these variations into consideration, that 's why it does not give a single weight, but a very wide range of weights within which someone is most likely to be healthy.

For instance a healthy weight for me is anywhere between 91 and 119 pounds. That is a huge variation, of up to a third of my entire body weight!

If I dropped to 91 pounds in a sensible way, yes people would generally think I looked extremely sick. But the point is, I would actually be perfectly healthy, as the amount of body fat that is required to maintain good health is surprisingly low.

I cannot help thinking you are confusing the parameters for good health with the range of weights which you personally think looks good on you. While there is likely to be a good deal of overlap, the two are in fact very different issues.

kennethmgreen

I cannot help thinking you are confusing the parameters for good health with the range of weights which you personally think looks good on you. While there is likely to be a good deal of overlap, the two are in fact very different issues.

Yes. Yes. Yes. (at a healthy BMI, I would have used only two Yesses)

Reading over this thread I am sensitive to that desire to be right, that desire to have my choices validated, that desire for others to understand that I have made the right choices for me.

When I am happy and healthy and decide to eat in maintenance mode, I will consider my MFP Journey (Don't Stop Believin') a success. BMI is a guide for me - to be within the healthy range of BMI, I need to be under 174 lbs.

Of course when I started, 174 seemed like crazy talk. Even more outlandish was that the healthy range for my height (5'10") went all the way down to 129 lbs!! I don't remember ever weighing that much. The idea that weighing 155 would be about "normal" for me was so foreign, it just seemed stupid. I researched BMI and read lots of reports that showed how BMI was inaccurate, didn't take into account bone size, bone density, etc. I loved the examples of bodybuilders and athletes - the BMI tidbit that lots of people like to throw out: many professional athletes and bodybuilders with amazingly low bodyfat % would be considered obese using the BMI scale.

It was all very scientific and sounded like a great way to discredit the BMI scale and justify my goal weight of 180. I am big boned too (tested around my wrist) - that had to account for something. BMI might be good for some people. But it wasn't for me. Because it didn't measure enough. Because it was too general. Because it said bodybuilders were obese. Because hitting 180 sounds a lot less intimidating that hitting 155.

Success, to me, is related to happiness. I am happy for those that find happiness. When my friends post that they are happy with their weight loss, I am happy for them. Not because of the number of pounds, but because they are experiencing success and happiness. If my goal weight was 190, and I was happy at 190, who cares what the BMI scale says? If I am truly happy at 190, why would I need to argue with the BMI scale? For me, the truth is that I'm not really happy at 190. I might be happy at 175 - I don't know, it's been awhile since I've weighed that.

I know it probably burns more calories, but we really should stop talking out of both sides of our mouths. Preaching about not caring what others think and then spending a lot of time and energy arguing what others think isn't effective or productive or helpful.

I have to be accountable for reason. I have to know that I can seek out the responses I want to hear with a little effort. I have to know that people used to seeing me at 200 will likely consider me skinny - even unhealthy - at 160. I have to know that. And I have to be disciplined enough to not use that as a reason never try to get down to 160. There may be other reasons not to get down to 160 (I may feel great at 170).

I am successful on MFP when I feel successful. Sometimes that feeling is driven by a number on the scale, sometimes it's getting into pants that used that I couldn't wear in the past, sometimes it is influenced by other people's opinion. But I have to own my success. It is mine, after all. After a series of successes, I plan to go into maintenance mode and enjoy long-term steady success. I don't know exactly what that looks like today. My success will possibly be related to some numbers (BMI, weight on scale, waist in inches, etc.) but ultimately it will be based on how I feel about myself and how I feel generally.

servilia

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

I had to google this. I don't know where I would find a VERY reliable site for this info, but several report Brad Pitt as 5'11" and 160 pounds. That is a BMI of 22.3.

I think a lot of people have very unrealistic ideas about what they look like at a healthy BMI. Most of the people I see who say they're "too skinny" at the high end or who talk about it not taking body frame into account are people who have never actually been that thin.

To be in a healthy BMI, I can weigh anywhere from 103 to 141 pounds. I'd say that takes frame and muscle mass into account.

Perhaps pro athletes who do nothing but build muscle fall into the category of being an unhealthy BMI with low body fat, but most everyday, average people do not.

All that said, it's your body and your choice and if you're happy as you are, then that's wonderful and I support you.

I disagree. I am 5'11 & 3/4" and a female. Also, my bone structure is slightly higher than average which makes me somewhat 'big-boned'. My healthy weight according to a healthy BMI is between 135 and 179.5 lbs. I have weighed 176 lbs and was told that I was too thin. Of course, my current goal weight is 170 lbs, but only because I know that I will gain a little back when I finally go to maintenance calories. I honestly think my body is going to fall somewhere around 180 lbs which would technically make me overweight, but I guarantee, no one will think that I am overweight.

You're talking about half a pound.

And people tell you you're "too thin" when you lose weight. All the time. My mother accused me of being anorexic at 132 pounds (I'm 5'3") because I'd been heavy for a couple years and she wasn't used to it. When I weighed 102, she didn't think I looked anorexic because at that time in my life I'd always been thin.

I don't LOOK overweight at 141 pounds. I don't LOOK overweight at 150 (what I am now) because clothing covers a lot. But there's definitely room to lose.

Did YOU think you looked too thin at 176?

My boss is 5'10". She was 180 at her highest weight and she looked great. She's since lost 40 pounds and looks fantastic. People in her family keep telling her she's too thin and accusing her of starving herself. She is not too thin. She looks and feels healthy. Still, people tell her she's too thin.

I can see your point about how people really don't know what is best for us based on looks, but at the same time, if I were to stop around 140 lbs, people would generally think I am sick, though I would be at a "healthy" weight. There is variations that the typical BMI scale does not take into consideration. Because I am slightly bigger boned, my bones themselves will actually weigh more than an average person's. This is not something that is factored into BMI. Remember that BMI only calculates the whole of one's body and not the weight of its varying composition. Body variation must be taken into consideration.

It does take it into consideration, that's why it gives a large range for healthy weight. I don't think that variation in bone density is large enough to require an even larger range.
Also, what people "think" about a given weight is largely dependent on context and perspective. If they're used to you being at a higher weight, then yes, it will take them time to get used to the new weight and in the meantime, such a big weight difference might look alarming to them. Also, there are communities that tend to have a higher proportion of overweight/obese people so if that's what everyone is used to, it's not surprising that their perspective is skewed. Also, a lot of people that have lost weight on here have commented that once they lost the weight, they didn't seem so big boned after all.

UsedToBeHusky

I read somehwere once that Brad Pit had a BMI of 30something! He is so skinny but really musclular! That explains that one dosent it!

Well yes, but that's hardly news, and it's hardly relevant.

BMI has always been acknowledged as not being appropriate for use with those people who have a high muscle mass.

Frankly, having a high muscle mass is not the reason that the majority of members use this site.

I had to google this. I don't know where I would find a VERY reliable site for this info, but several report Brad Pitt as 5'11" and 160 pounds. That is a BMI of 22.3.

I think a lot of people have very unrealistic ideas about what they look like at a healthy BMI. Most of the people I see who say they're "too skinny" at the high end or who talk about it not taking body frame into account are people who have never actually been that thin.

To be in a healthy BMI, I can weigh anywhere from 103 to 141 pounds. I'd say that takes frame and muscle mass into account.

Perhaps pro athletes who do nothing but build muscle fall into the category of being an unhealthy BMI with low body fat, but most everyday, average people do not.

All that said, it's your body and your choice and if you're happy as you are, then that's wonderful and I support you.

I disagree. I am 5'11 & 3/4" and a female. Also, my bone structure is slightly higher than average which makes me somewhat 'big-boned'. My healthy weight according to a healthy BMI is between 135 and 179.5 lbs. I have weighed 176 lbs and was told that I was too thin. Of course, my current goal weight is 170 lbs, but only because I know that I will gain a little back when I finally go to maintenance calories. I honestly think my body is going to fall somewhere around 180 lbs which would technically make me overweight, but I guarantee, no one will think that I am overweight.

You're talking about half a pound.

And people tell you you're "too thin" when you lose weight. All the time. My mother accused me of being anorexic at 132 pounds (I'm 5'3") because I'd been heavy for a couple years and she wasn't used to it. When I weighed 102, she didn't think I looked anorexic because at that time in my life I'd always been thin.

I don't LOOK overweight at 141 pounds. I don't LOOK overweight at 150 (what I am now) because clothing covers a lot. But there's definitely room to lose.

Did YOU think you looked too thin at 176?

My boss is 5'10". She was 180 at her highest weight and she looked great. She's since lost 40 pounds and looks fantastic. People in her family keep telling her she's too thin and accusing her of starving herself. She is not too thin. She looks and feels healthy. Still, people tell her she's too thin.

I can see your point about how people really don't know what is best for us based on looks, but at the same time, if I were to stop around 140 lbs, people would generally think I am sick, though I would be at a "healthy" weight. There is variations that the typical BMI scale does not take into consideration. Because I am slightly bigger boned, my bones themselves will actually weigh more than an average person's. This is not something that is factored into BMI. Remember that BMI only calculates the whole of one's body and not the weight of its varying composition. Body variation must be taken into consideration.

It does take it into consideration, that's why it gives a large range for healthy weight. I don't think that variation in bone density is large enough to require an even larger range.
Also, what people "think" about a given weight is largely dependent on context and perspective. If they're used to you being at a higher weight, then yes, it will take them time to get used to the new weight and in the meantime, such a big weight difference might look alarming to them. Also, there are communities that tend to have a higher proportion of overweight/obese people so if that's what everyone is used to, it's not surprising that their perspective is skewed. Also, a lot of people that have lost weight on here have commented that once they lost the weight, they didn't seem so big boned after all.

Well no, I have actually had it tested. My skeletal frame is larger than average. Which means that I require more muscle to move around with and it is likely that some of my organs are larger than normal. I know for a fact that my lungs are larger than average. This additional mass adds up to more weight required to sustain my body. I'm not suggesting that BMI scale should be done away with. All I am saying is that it is not cut and dry and that it cannot possibly apply to everyone.