when people don't know what they're talking about...
Replies
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We share common interest lol and no need to ask for forgiveness... Your story had valid points
The *LOL* was there because I knew a story was coming...
I like talking too much... it's a character flaw right up there with my love of boobies. Forgive me ;-)0 -
I think it just boils down to one thing: Everyone's way is the RIGHT way to do things.
I totally appreciate the people who take some serious time to research key points before giving their own opinions in a forum or blog posting. As many others have indicated already, there is soooooo much conflicting "knowledge" out there. And it gets to be a bother when people begin arguing who's right and who's wrong. That's not the purpose of why any of us are here... at least I don't think.
I try to take everything with a grain of salt... I subscribe to Men's Health and I see a lot of the things they put in there. And even they will, in some form or another, indicate pros and cons of particular article subjects. I can remember seeing back in maybe 97 or 98 when Muscle Media first "introduced" the idea of HIIT... and now, it's pretty much the norm for losing bodyfat. Of course, before them there was probably someone else who emphasized the same principles under a different name. But point is, why is this the norm these days? Because people have done their RESEARCH.
So I would just say, before taking anything to heart in the forum, do some good research and look in to all POVs on the subject before taking it as gospel.
I think I totally went off on a tangent though. lol0 -
I think it just comes down to the adage "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing...."
Lots of posters on mfp has "a little knowledge" - and some choose to use it "dangerously", lol.0 -
I just don't understand WHY people feel knowledgeable enough to offer advice if INSIDE they know they have no real reason to believe what they're spewing.
People don't know that they don't know.0 -
I just don't understand WHY people feel knowledgeable enough to offer advice if INSIDE they know they have no real reason to believe what they're spewing.
People don't know that they don't know.
Well then thank GOD I know everything ;-P
I kid... I kid...0 -
Is this a trap? You're slamming people for offering advice, but asking opinions?
Okay. I'll bite.
The more life experience a person has, the more likely thay are to offer up what has worked for them or what they have experienced. It ain't all pearls of wisdom, but neither should it be dismissed if it doesn't come with documented argument or doesn't happen to coincide with your own opinions.
When all is said and done, you have to use a little common sense. It also helps if you are looking for actual advice or just someone to agree with your opinion.
^^Agree0 -
Seinfeld is on...."beep beep beep"....there's a Hot Pocket with my name on it0
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Yep, but probably not the support you are seeking
I think that most people that are on this site are much like me. I have no doctorate in medicine or any other health related field. I am here for motivation and support from others who are similar to me. I am looking for ideas, tips, and yes, if it takes them, tricks, to help me find what works for me.
AS far as someone offering advice that has no scientfically supported documentation, I take much of what I read here as inspiration to study and find answers that do have scientific validity. I do not read every post and take it to heart. I have something called discernment as part of my mental make-up. Therefore, I read many posts and then filter out the treasure from the trash (no matter how well-intended, we all make statements at one time or another without fully considering their validity.)
So, if this does not work for you or you can't overlook the simple things that people say, perhaps you should find a more credible source of information. I personally find some of the silly comments to be charming (and their authors as well) and if the posters are approached tactfully, maybe I can serve to help them understand the folly of the remarks that I feel are incorrect. This is just my humble opinion, of course.0 -
Thats what Im screaming! Just because people are offering advice doesnt mean you have to take it...if its the same thing you hear all the time and its cliche just ignore it....the thing is at least they are trying to help....they can take what you give them and go and research to see if it matches up to what experts say.....I cant stand when people get on here trying to be alll fancy shmancy just because they know more than the average joe0
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Is this a trap? You're slamming people for offering advice, but asking opinions?
Okay. I'll bite.
The more life experience a person has, the more likely thay are to offer up what has worked for them or what they have experienced. It ain't all pearls of wisdom, but neither should it be dismissed if it doesn't come with documented argument or doesn't happen to coincide with your own opinions.
When all is said and done, you have to use a little common sense. It also helps if you are looking for actual advice or just someone to agree with your opinion.
^^Agree
Hear hear!! Well said!0 -
http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-types-people-who-always-give-terrible-advice/
kind of funny and relevant--
#1 is "smart sounding people with experience"
problem is that here sometimes people don't even SOUND smart--which makes their bad advice even more transparent YET people still follow it. ((sigh))
#2 --Instigators
They're the kids gathered around the playground in a circle, chanting "FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT" while two other kids argue. The reason is because there's little to no entertainment value in a peaceful resolution. People want to see escalation, so why not give it a push in that direction to kill a little boredom?
#3--Faceless Crowds
It's physically impossible to respect and value the opinion of someone you've never met. You don't know if they have an agenda. Or if they were in a bad mood. Or if they have experience in the subject or in the actual field of writing. Or if they simply misunderstood something you wrote. Or, for that matter, if they even read something you wrote.
#4 --*kitten*-kissers
Their advice and your reception of it is self-serving on each of your parts. Make no mistake, your benefit is the furthest thing from their minds
#5--Zealots and advocates
Zealots and advocates are salesmen, and every conversation is a pitch. And that means that any advice coming from them is automatically predisposed to bias, based on that agenda.0 -
Why do they feel compelled to offer advice that's grounded in nothing more than some random "conventional wisdom" or "diet myth" that lacks any scientific validity?
I understand differing viewpoints--2 sides that both have support--but I'm talking about individuals who would respond with something like...
"Oh, so you're not losing--definitely stop eating at 7pm. Then you'll get result. Everything you eat turns to fat at night."
as opposed to...
"Studies demonstrate that individuals are more likely to consume EXCESS calories at night, however, this isn't a hard and fast rule because you can account for nighttime snacking in planning your day. It isn't the time of day, per se, that causes fat gain but merely consuming more calories than you expend. If you cut out nighttime eating you're more likely to maintain a calorie balance conducive to weight loss or weight maintenance."
Do you get what I'm saying? I just don't understand WHY people feel knowledgeable enough to offer advice if INSIDE they know they have no real reason to believe what they're spewing.
Thoughts?
While one of those is politer than the other, neither provides any actual evidence. Saying "studies show" while not actually providing any links doesn't make the second any more accurate than the first. The first one could be the accurate one, for all the information given.
I don't see the difference between the two. If either had named the study or the organization that did the study, I'd find that one more credible, if the source was one I considered credible.0 -
The *LOL* was there because I knew a story was coming...
I like talking too much... it's a character flaw right up there with my love of boobies. Forgive me ;-)
Loving boobies is a character flaw?!? Oh noes!0 -
studies demonstrate that it all turns to c0ck at night...0
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Why do they feel compelled to offer advice that's grounded in nothing more than some random "conventional wisdom" or "diet myth" that lacks any scientific validity?
I understand differing viewpoints--2 sides that both have support--but I'm talking about individuals who would respond with something like...
"Oh, so you're not losing--definitely stop eating at 7pm. Then you'll get result. Everything you eat turns to fat at night."
as opposed to...
"Studies demonstrate that individuals are more likely to consume EXCESS calories at night, however, this isn't a hard and fast rule because you can account for nighttime snacking in planning your day. It isn't the time of day, per se, that causes fat gain but merely consuming more calories than you expend. If you cut out nighttime eating you're more likely to maintain a calorie balance conducive to weight loss or weight maintenance."
Do you get what I'm saying? I just don't understand WHY people feel knowledgeable enough to offer advice if INSIDE they know they have no real reason to believe what they're spewing.
Thoughts?
I am more interested in what you said about the study. Is that true? How it has been demonstrated people have a tendency to eat more in the evening? If it is, it supports Ori Hofmeklers theory. He created the Warrior Diet it's an IF based diet. He claims we're nocturnal eaters. I do believe it to be so, yet there isn't any scientific evidence to support this. So if that study you say is true, then I guess that's the evidence right there.
Sure you can plan your day like you said, but is that natural? No.
In what way isn't planning natural? Furthermore, what about modern life IS natural? Living indoors, indoor plumbing, cars, eyeglasses, washing machines, ovens and stoves, computers,....all unnatural. You DO use some or all of those, don't you?
No studies I know of prove we're "nocturnal eaters." Some of the things we do in the evening might lead one to overeat--i.e. watching television, reading...0 -
studies demonstrate that it all turns to c0ck at night...
I missed you.0 -
Why do they feel compelled to offer advice that's grounded in nothing more than some random "conventional wisdom" or "diet myth" that lacks any scientific validity?
I understand differing viewpoints--2 sides that both have support--but I'm talking about individuals who would respond with something like...
"Oh, so you're not losing--definitely stop eating at 7pm. Then you'll get result. Everything you eat turns to fat at night."
as opposed to...
"Studies demonstrate that individuals are more likely to consume EXCESS calories at night, however, this isn't a hard and fast rule because you can account for nighttime snacking in planning your day. It isn't the time of day, per se, that causes fat gain but merely consuming more calories than you expend. If you cut out nighttime eating you're more likely to maintain a calorie balance conducive to weight loss or weight maintenance."
Do you get what I'm saying? I just don't understand WHY people feel knowledgeable enough to offer advice if INSIDE they know they have no real reason to believe what they're spewing.
Thoughts?
While one of those is politer than the other, neither provides any actual evidence. Saying "studies show" while not actually providing any links doesn't make the second any more accurate than the first. The first one could be the accurate one, for all the information given.
I don't see the difference between the two. If either had named the study or the organization that did the study, I'd find that one more credible, if the source was one I considered credible.
well, i wasn't going to go dig up the studies. one is blatantly bogus while the other IS actually true. It was the first example that popped into my head and I was just trying to make a point to start the discussion. ((bored in class..haha)) Here is some info for those interested though...
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2011-05-05/features/chi-night-time-eating-may-cause-weight-gain-20110505_1_sleepers-phyllis-zee-weight-gain
http://www.daveywaveyfitness.com/nutrition/myth-busted-should-you-not-eat-before-bed/0 -
Glad to have sane people as friends to give advice. If you don't agree just move on, everyone is different and you shouldn't discourage something that is working so well for many people. JS0
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Oooh! My favorite: "You have to eat at 1,800 calories a day and you have to eat 6 small meals a day and make sure you're eating every 2 hours."
Sorry but for me 1,800 calories is way too much and I've done the 6 small meals and gained weight doing that and I wasn't eating anything unhealthy -- 1/2 cup yogurt? 1/2 cup cottage cheese? Fruit? Veggies?! Yup. Gained weight doing that.
People just like to think they know what they're talking about because it's what they've heard or what the Omnipotent "THEY" have said.
Umm well this is EXACTLY what is working for me. Usually we respond with that advice to the people that are starving themselves on 1200 calories/ day (netting 600ish after exercise) and they're stuck in a starving/binging cycle asking for help. Well guess what? This has worked miracles for me and many other people so I'm going to offer it.
And that's awesome that it's working for you but my point is there is no blanket "You must eat this much to lose weight." As I stated in my post I have tried the small meals, eating more calories while continuing to exercise as hard as I do and I didn't drop any weight but found myself gaining. What works for you might not work for me or some one else.
When you state that it doesn't work (and insult the entire plan) that is just as offensive to me as if I stated it's the only way to lose weight. I would never say it's the only way, but if I see someone asking for help, and they appear to be in the same boat I was in, I will offer it. :flowerforyou: (no hard feelings just debating)
Generally I've come to believe there are various ways people can lose weight and people should experiment to see what works best for them. What works for me now probably wouldn't have worked for me 20 lbs ago. I also agree it's obnoxious when some dingbat tries to tell you avocados are fatty and you shouldn't eat them while they're eating a cheeseburger *eye roll*
I didn't think I was insulting the entire plan, I said it didn't work for me. I'm not saying it won't work for someone else but for me? Not so much. *shrug* And I have no hard feelings. I'm ok with debates
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Never mind.0
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Why do they feel compelled to offer advice that's grounded in nothing more than some random "conventional wisdom" or "diet myth" that lacks any scientific validity?
I understand differing viewpoints--2 sides that both have support--but I'm talking about individuals who would respond with something like...
"Oh, so you're not losing--definitely stop eating at 7pm. Then you'll get result. Everything you eat turns to fat at night."
as opposed to...
"Studies demonstrate that individuals are more likely to consume EXCESS calories at night, however, this isn't a hard and fast rule because you can account for nighttime snacking in planning your day. It isn't the time of day, per se, that causes fat gain but merely consuming more calories than you expend. If you cut out nighttime eating you're more likely to maintain a calorie balance conducive to weight loss or weight maintenance."
Do you get what I'm saying? I just don't understand WHY people feel knowledgeable enough to offer advice if INSIDE they know they have no real reason to believe what they're spewing.
Thoughts?
While one of those is politer than the other, neither provides any actual evidence. Saying "studies show" while not actually providing any links doesn't make the second any more accurate than the first. The first one could be the accurate one, for all the information given.
I don't see the difference between the two. If either had named the study or the organization that did the study, I'd find that one more credible, if the source was one I considered credible.
well, i wasn't going to go dig up the studies. one is blatantly bogus while the other IS actually true. It was the first example that popped into my head and I was just trying to make a point to start the discussion. ((bored in class..haha)) Here is some info for those interested though...
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2011-05-05/features/chi-night-time-eating-may-cause-weight-gain-20110505_1_sleepers-phyllis-zee-weight-gain
http://www.daveywaveyfitness.com/nutrition/myth-busted-should-you-not-eat-before-bed/
But you have missed my point. Your example had NO evidence. You placed a value judgment on one, but not the other, even though neither one had any evidence to back it up. BTW, neither of those "studies" prove what you're saying they prove, and neither is more "valid" than the other. One of them references a study, the other is a meta-analysis of a number of studies. Neither seems particularly less valid, both were done by medical researchers. They both find exactly the same thing: That a calorie is a calorie no matter what time you eat it, and sleep loss is correlated with weight gain. If either of them were cited as proof of the above, and I cared, I'd consider looking at the methodology to determine how much weight I'd give them. But as originally stated, neither of your positions seemed more valid to me.0 -
ooook. missed the point i guess.0
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ooook. missed the point i guess.
Yeah, I think I did too. :huh:0 -
I wasn't trying to make an argument for eating at night or not...my point was just that OFTEN times people pull *kitten* out of the thin air and offer it as advice--as if they KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT. I wasn't focusing on semantics but merely the POINT that individuals are trying to make and whether it is founded on actual research or just another myth.
Does that make sense? Sorry if it doesn't. Maybe it's just me--I'm pretty well read so every bit of advice doesn't require a citation to be valid...that wasn't what i was getting at in the slightest.0
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